OOTS #1035 - The Discussion Thread

[Plainsrunner]

i hope she is figuring on alternating use of the ring and not sacrificing herself for O-Chul

This. I'll be quite distressed otherwise.

One of the things I love about this comic is Giant's mastery of storytelling.

He doesn't paste a text box that says "hours later..." but instead shows us three views with the snowstorm slowly ending. A brilliant way of showing how much time has passed, without shoving it in your face like so many lesser artists would.

I had not even noticed that. Nice catch.

[Ron Miel]

Now, that's an ice trick.

[chrestomancy]

I liked that line "Trust me." "Always." It's nice to see how close they've gotten. Plus I like that trick trading the ring back and forth. Nice comic all around and a good way to target the bad guys biggest weakness. Their patience!

Edit: Hey, first page. Look at that.

I always am impressed with party problem solving, and this was awesome beyond words.

I think O'Chul is reasonably likely to put his faith in other paladins as a default, so I'm not going to read too much into his closeness with Lien. They're both clearly on the competent end of the chart even for the Sapphire Guard, so it's no surprise that they work well together. If either's preferences have been raised before, I don't remember them.

[Peelee]

That was quite brilliant.

Also, I wonder if the EEEEEEE was changed to be all same-size rather than growing because some people with absolutely no artistic sense thought it was a wall, or if it was always planned to be like that after the first shot.

[chrestomancy]

They'll be fine: it's water, not ice, so (assuming real-world physics) the temperature should be at least 0° C (32 °F? Non-SI units are not my strongest suit).

They'll be fine assuming Game-world physics. As a diver (and I've dived in glacial run-off in NZ during winter) I can promise you that water at zero will kill you far faster than air at -20. Of course, being wet in air at -20 would be pretty bad too. In reality, the armour would help keep a layer of water that would warm up close to the skin, so would actually keep you alive longer than just cloth, but only while underwater.

Divers can suffer hypothermia in relatively tropical environments. Sadly we don't get rings of water breathing with protection from cold enchantments.

[Ninja Dragon]

Trust me.

Always.

Have I mentioned I love O-Chul?

And that's a pretty cool plan from Lien.

[pendell]

Splendid. O-chul and Lien make an excellent team. The art is of course lovely, and it's a clever solution.

Still, humans freeze to death in water very quickly. I wonder if it's a feat or magic that will keep them alive under the ice? Of course, O-chul can survive in a vat of acid, so I guess that the cold won't bother him.

Respectfully,

Brian P.

[omnitricks]

What? Paladins aren't meant to be that smart!

I was actually expecting something like the both of them hiding underwater giving no ****s because paladins are expected to be tanky and have high cons. And lay on hands. They should be able to last a while.

[Quild]

That was quite brilliant.

Also, I wonder if the EEEEEEE was changed to be all same-size rather than growing because some people with absolutely no artistic sense thought it was a wall, or if it was always planned to be like that after the first shot.

There's already a non-growing EEEEEE on second panel of #1033 when O'Chul asks Lien if she hears something.

[aurilee]

Aww...poor masked yrthak rider. She was all ready to smash them!

I hope she or more of her kind come back...at least to satisfy my curiosity about who she is.

And as per usual O-Chul and Lien are awesome. Most lovable paladins ever.

The '"Trust me." "Always."' panel is very well done, and I found myself lingering on it for added suspense.

[Peelee]

There's already a non-growing EEEEEE on second panel of #1033 when O'Chul asks Lien if she hears something.

Hey. I already copped to having no artistic sense. Also, heyx there totally is!

[Griffincat]

Did the ythyk technically steal its rider's kill? As far as the rider knows.

[foobar1969]

And we finally have definitive size comparison. Scaling the edges of the ice hole to match...

...Princess Yrthaoke (Northernoke? Goblinoke?) is about 8' tall.

[Darth Tom]

I wasn't sure from the previous pages, but now it's pretty clear both Lien and O-Chul have a wound that shows up as black rather than red. Pretty sure Lien's is first visible after they get hit by the first EEEEEEEE and normal red ones only show up after the ice collapses on them. I don't think I've seen these before, but it looks a pretty cool way of portraying something like non-literal damage (sanity, or perhaps eardrums). Any thoughts?

[Tarqiup Inua]

There's a Ring of Water Breathing in the MIC (page 128) but it doesn't provide protection from cold.

There is a rule about adding extra enchantments on your stuff in DMG.

[joela]

That...was clever.

[KorvinStarmast]

Buddy breathing with a ring of underwater breathing.,
Nice

Yeah, that took me back to scuba class back in the 70's, and a few practice sessions my roomie and I had at the beach with buddy breathing off of one tank. (But the water wasn't that cold..)

[kenlund]

Awesome strip. I really like the plan to avoid the fight and the relationship between these two.

I wish this kind of out of the box thinking would work in actual D&D campaigns when I play. It seems like whenever I try this kind of solution instead of fighting the opponent directly, the DM subtly (or not subtly) sabotages what I am doing in order to make the fight continue.

[aurilee]

I wasn't sure from the previous pages, but now it's pretty clear both Lien and O-Chul have a wound that shows up as black rather than red. Pretty sure Lien's is first visible after they get hit by the first EEEEEEEE and normal red ones only show up after the ice collapses on them. I don't think I've seen these before, but it looks a pretty cool way of portraying something like non-literal damage (sanity, or perhaps eardrums). Any thoughts?

I took that to indicate sonic damage. Almost like it created cracks/rifts instead of gashes or standard wounds.

[hamishspence]

http://www.d20srd.org/srd/environment.htm

Cold Dangers
Extreme cold (below -20° F) deals 1d6 points of lethal damage per minute (no save). In addition, a character must make a Fortitude save (DC 15, +1 per previous check) or take 1d4 points of nonlethal damage. Those wearing metal armor or coming into contact with very cold metal are affected as if by a chill metal spell.

http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/chillMetal.htm

Water Dangers
Very cold water deals 1d6 points of nonlethal damage from hypothermia per minute of exposure.

As written, it would appear that, since the water itself is not -20° F, they don't take the Chill Metal effect.

[smuchmuch]

....That is a clever solution to avoid being mauled to death. Just die of hypothermia instead !

(But of course this being D&D, I expect she has some feat to resist it since she sems to be specialise in watery things (which also likely explain her impressive lung capacity), while O Chul has an insane fort score or they have some 'resist elements/cold' in store. so, gratuitous sarcasm aside, it is pretty clever all things considered)

[DigoDragon]

Reminds me of some of the clever thinking my wife pulled as a paladin. If you can't beat 'em, make it look like they won and then come back from behind with a rogue to backstab for you.

[Ron Miel]

They'll be fine: it's water, not ice, so (assuming real-world physics) the temperature should be at least 0° C (32 °F? Non-SI units are not my strongest suit).

Actually, about -2° C since it's salt water. In real world physics, that is cold enough to kill someone very quickly. Most of the Titanic fatalities froze to death in the water, they didn't drown.

Lucky D&D doesn't follow real world physics, isn't it?

[GreatWyrmGold]

I'm surprised the Giant went for that solution, but I'm not sure why.

I'm also surprised the rider just wandered off, and I know exactly why.

[LordRahl6]

Was there only one Ring of Water Breathing because I was under the impression there were two of them. (what Paladin wouldn't be prepared) Still, either way, gotta love those Rings of Water Breathing.

[KillingAScarab]

I wasn't sure from the previous pages, but now it's pretty clear both Lien and O-Chul have a wound that shows up as black rather than red. Pretty sure Lien's is first visible after they get hit by the first EEEEEEEE and normal red ones only show up after the ice collapses on them. I don't think I've seen these before, but it looks a pretty cool way of portraying something like non-literal damage (sanity, or perhaps eardrums). Any thoughts?

Check out the heads on both Roy and Durkon* in these comics.

[hamishspence]

Actually, about -2° C since it's salt water. In real world physics, that is cold enough to kill someone very quickly.

In-game its enough to kill a commoner very quickly - 2 minutes or so and then they fall unconscious/dying, and IMO fail their Swim checks automatically and sink.

[skaddix]

Nice Lawful Good not Lawful Stupid.

[KorvinStarmast]

Comic 1031 established that Lien's ring of water breathing also had protections against coldness as a feature. This makes some in story sense due to her riding her shark down deep to fight evil things ... water down deep tends to be cold.

I thus surmise that not only is water breathing being shared, but while either has the ring on the protection from cold is being shared. The monster's body language in the second to last frame was nice bit of drawing on Rich's part. I don't usually comment on the art, but his use of reverb visual effects are a nice touch, and that particular use of posture to convey a message was very nicely done.

With the time passage marked by the snow, the rider arrives at the conclusion that they went into the water, and will not be coming back up. A reasonable assessment for the rider to make, as she(??) does not know about the water breathing ring.

Good strip: two paladins thinking tactically and working as a team.

[Curupira]

Oh boy, the fanfiction sites must be having a fit with the ring-exchanging scene and the "always" line.