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2017-03-15, 03:41 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Feb 2013
Re: OOTS #1068 - The Discussion Thread
The point of this sexist behavior, Ganbatte, is that you will not earn anything no matter what you do. Which makes it the by far much easier course to just knuckle under. and accept that you will get jack squat no matter what you do.
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2017-03-15, 03:41 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Mar 2013
Re: OOTS #1068 - The Discussion Thread
The Giant's opponent is disarmed.
She could be hell on wheels. She could be full of unearned resentments.
We don't know.
Meanwhile, the joke was hilarious if you've lived in the appropriate RL social contexts.
Don't get why this is even a debate.
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2017-03-15, 03:42 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Mar 2007
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- Oregon, USA
Re: OOTS #1068 - The Discussion Thread
What if they do have a choice? Say, if they have enough influence with your commander to get you demoted/terminated, or if your commander is the one expecting you to conform to their expectations in the first place?
It's still an inefficient way for them to go about doing things, but it's often amazing how far people go to reinforce their own notions of how the world is.Last edited by Jasdoif; 2017-03-15 at 03:43 PM.
FeytouchedBanana eldritch disciple avatar by...me!
The Index of the Giant's Comments VI―Making Dogma from Zapped Bananas
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2017-03-15, 03:43 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Feb 2017
Re: OOTS #1068 - The Discussion Thread
That's what they want. You to earn nothing.
They're not going to be fair, nor to acknowledge you did a good job, nor that you're worthy of respect.
To put this in perspective: when sexist guys see a man outdone by a woman, do you think they'd go "ahaha, you were beaten by a girl" or "whoa, this woman is awesome"?
A woman succeeding isn't going to make sexist bigots stop talking about how inferior she is. Bigotry is not rational.
"I'm going to kill every single on of you to prove those jerks I'm awesome" while unleashing deadly force on an unarmed combatant is not directing her aggression toward the people on the Mechane?
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2017-03-15, 03:49 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Jun 2015
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Re: OOTS #1068 - The Discussion Thread
In addition to the other points being raised, a woman succeeding is not going to change their worldview. In a weird way, it's going to reinforce it: if she actually manages to gain the men's respect (and thus move beyond the "haha, you were beaten by a girl!" thing), that woman will be seen as praiseworthy, but also as exceptional, extraordinary, a manly woman. It takes a lot more momentum to change such a worldview.
Last edited by hroşila; 2017-03-15 at 03:49 PM.
ungelic is us
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2017-03-15, 03:50 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- May 2015
Re: OOTS #1068 - The Discussion Thread
Well... she is a frost giant, that is, not exactly big on the smarts department.
In a way it's actually a pretty realistic characterization overall. She has the means to change things but doesn't realize it, and takes it out venting on everything thus indirectly punching Roy harder.
Yeah no. There used to be a time when sexism made it impossible for women to vote, talk or even go out alone.
You do can change things, but first you have to act. Abiding the rules by playing the weakling while whining that things don't turn around by themselves magically isn't gonna work.
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2017-03-15, 03:50 PM (ISO 8601)
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- May 2015
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- Texas
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2017-03-15, 03:53 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Feb 2016
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- Canada
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Re: OOTS #1068 - The Discussion Thread
What?! A webcomic being wacky?! Say it ain't so!
That's the point. It's a joke.
She's describing a real situation that can happen when women are working with men, but applying it to a medieval fantasy elite giant fighting squad where it doesn't make a whole lot of sense (it makes a little sense, but it's a bit harder to apply it one-for-one here).
Contradictions = jokes = funny
*sigh*
EDIT: Just want to also point out here that as a woman who works in the technology sector in a technical capacity, I can vouch for this situation being very real and present in our society. Yes, the "right" thing to do can be to speak out and fight back, but it can be difficult when you have a family depending on you to bring home that paycheque and sometimes you just want to keep your head down and carry on carrying on. It's hard to fight back when you feel completely and utterly isolated (because there is literally no other woman in your department), so let's cut this giantess some slack here. Fighting back is great, but it's something that you have to work up to and not just a switch you turn on.
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2017-03-15, 04:01 PM (ISO 8601)
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- May 2015
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- Texas
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Re: OOTS #1068 - The Discussion Thread
Well described, not to mention Rich trolled the board beautifully with this strip ... some people bit.
I think that Shining Wrath made the best point in a single post in the back and forth bickering.
I am pretty sure Rich never served in the military, so I don't think the point he is making is based on that sub culture. I had the experience of serving while American military culture change from 1976 to 2015 ... and it changed a lot, which included a whole lot of progress for women getting to play a larger role in the line units. Culture change takes time, but change can happen if the leadership is willing to make it a priority.
Back on topic: I am not sure how motivated OoTSverse Frost Giant leadership is to change, nor how open they are to change. If she dies in this fight, which seems likely, the ruling council may only see this as "one more soldier lost" ... and never have appreciated what talent they had in the first place.Last edited by KorvinStarmast; 2017-03-15 at 04:04 PM.
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2017-03-15, 04:03 PM (ISO 8601)
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- May 2015
Re: OOTS #1068 - The Discussion Thread
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2017-03-15, 04:03 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Feb 2017
Re: OOTS #1068 - The Discussion Thread
And women acted for centuries, without much of a change. A major factor why the Western cultures are less sexist than before nowadays is because the successive World Wars resulted in a relative shift in power due to the sheer number of men who died, snowballing into cultural changes and eventually into societal changes.
There as been many great female rulers, and revolutionaries, and artists, and scientists. They didn't make sexist people see women as equal or deserving rights.Last edited by Unoriginal; 2017-03-15 at 04:09 PM.
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2017-03-15, 04:06 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Dec 2016
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- Belgium
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2017-03-15, 04:07 PM (ISO 8601)
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- May 2015
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- Texas
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Re: OOTS #1068 - The Discussion Thread
I will suggest to you that there is a correlation between today's strip and the following fact:
As a result of our efforts, the week of March 8th (International Women’s Day) was officially designated as National Women’s History Week.
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2017-03-15, 04:08 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Jan 2017
Re: OOTS #1068 - The Discussion Thread
That's implying that the Frost Giant society more merit based than political. It's entirely possible that her "colleague" was of a much higher social standing, possibly even the son of the elder. So exceeding expectations and making herself look good would come at the cost of making someone rather powerful and important look bad. Making those kinds of people look bad usually bodes ill for your life prospects. Kings, rulers, and elders like people who are very competent at what they do. You know what they hate? People who are so good at what they do they upset the social status quo and threaten their position either directly or indirectly.
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2017-03-15, 04:11 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Mar 2017
Re: OOTS #1068 - The Discussion Thread
Giant: "I'm going to write in a joke about real-world sexism, which will A: be funny in context, and B: piss off some people enough that they spend literal PAGES in the Discussion Thread arguing either that sexism in the workplace isn't a thing and they don't want to see it in their webcomic because it's their safe space and seeing things which imply dissenting views upsets them, or it is a thing and women are addressing it wrong, or it is a thing but they don't want to see it in their webcomic because it's their safe space and seeing things which make them uncomfortable upsets them."
B is probably incidental.Last edited by RogueCookie; 2017-03-15 at 04:15 PM.
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2017-03-15, 04:12 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Oct 2010
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- My own private Nogero
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Re: OOTS #1068 - The Discussion Thread
One female cleric, one female guard (the archer). You can tell the guard isn't a cleric because of her lack of holy symbol pendant.
And there were other females among the giants. I didn't do a census, but roughly half were female.Curated Thread: Gazetteer of the Stick
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2017-03-15, 04:15 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Feb 2017
Re: OOTS #1068 - The Discussion Thread
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2017-03-15, 04:17 PM (ISO 8601)
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- May 2015
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2017-03-15, 04:24 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Feb 2017
Re: OOTS #1068 - The Discussion Thread
Letting your rivals die in combat is a oft-used tactic.
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2017-03-15, 04:24 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Mar 2013
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- Yorkshire
Re: OOTS #1068 - The Discussion Thread
"I feel a great disturbance in the tumblrsphere, as if millions of bingo-wings slapped together in half-understood support and were instantly sighed at."
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2017-03-15, 04:25 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Aug 2009
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- Nowhere
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Re: OOTS #1068 - The Discussion Thread
Not sure if this will help the current overarching discussion about sexism parallels in the comic but I'll give it a whirl.
First, I can't find it for now, but a good example of this sort of thing comes in the form of the backstory of the stock barbarian character in the Pathfinder handbook. Can't remember her name but I barely recall that she has sort of a similar situation. Male dominated society, absurdly strong female character sent on a suicide mission she succeeds in, survives, finds out before she returns that she was sent to die in that mission and leaves her tribe to adventure... Hopefully if anybody here has a copy of that can proof read if I got all the important plot details correctly.
Second, prose, even in a brief manner, might just be a good place to put in parallels to things that cause problems in RL. Kinda like how comedy sometimes pokes fun at the flawed things that happen in RL as well. Good comedians poke fun at that and make the audience think, thereby facilitating a non-hostile way of instilling a conflicting idea over somebody's bias barrier.
Third... well, I don't really have a third. I just wish I could put a link on that first point. I really think that would be a good parallel. I guess my real third is that, acting up against injustice is fine and all, but is it economical? People aren't just symbols against oppression, inequality and injustice, they're just people too. Much like I don't expect Uncle Myrtok or Aarindarius to just drop everything and help the Order wholeheartedly if the Order were to ask for it because they're basically people with nuanced motivations and not just cardboard cutout deus ex machina's, It's also not that easy to just rise up against these injustices because situations and truth are always just very nuanced. RL gets in the way, families to feed, lives to get back to and all that.
edit:
Also, I'd like to assert that lady frost giant is not in fact whining but possibly expressing self confirming righteous indignation because if we were to buy in to the premise that she is under workplace bias duress, this is a great chance for her to succeed at her job with very little to no conflicting point to prove otherwise since the only other voice that can make assertions on what happened is dead... Unless her bosses comes back with the whole "maybe her partner softened them up for her" schtick though. Damn.
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2017-03-15, 04:28 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Sep 2011
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2017-03-15, 04:34 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Dec 2011
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- Broomfield CO
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Re: OOTS #1068 - The Discussion Thread
Now, Back to Lurking!
Originally Posted by The Giant
Belkar's Death Countdown best guess: 31/49 days used before Belkar is gone forever more! - updated to morning at 1190!
Hey, its the Blog where I write! Dice Roles
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2017-03-15, 04:36 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Nov 2013
Re: OOTS #1068 - The Discussion Thread
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2017-03-15, 04:38 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Feb 2017
Re: OOTS #1068 - The Discussion Thread
Please, it's not because an author bring up those issues that they're going the Sinfest road.
Beside, Rich actually seems informed about the issues at hand and is actually a coherent storyteller. There isn't going to be something to the level of "there is a slave market operating in the open in the middle of the city and none of the protagonists care or do much about it."
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2017-03-15, 04:40 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Jun 2015
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2017-03-15, 04:41 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Jan 2016
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- Aiur, low orbit
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Re: OOTS #1068 - The Discussion Thread
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2017-03-15, 04:42 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Jan 2017
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- England
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Re: OOTS #1068 - The Discussion Thread
I don't have any particular issues with our giantess's rant, though I do have to wonder what the point of it was narratively speaking. I don't think we'd get this tiny insight into giant culture if we weren't going to see more of it later, though I can't say I'm especially interested in following that train: as at least one other person has said, the order has enough on its plate right now that another subplot would be kind of silly at this stage. Still, you never know what might happen.
More than anything, I'm unjustifiably salty about the fact that Roy's sword apparently doesn't have the returning property: political discussion is all well and good, but a guy with a big sword laying waste to his enemies is what really hai yais my forces. Though admittedly I'm a person with very limited tastes, so this shouldn't reflect on what Rich does in the future.Currently daydreaming about: big giant swords.
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2017-03-15, 04:44 PM (ISO 8601)
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- May 2015
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- Texas
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Re: OOTS #1068 - The Discussion Thread
Last edited by KorvinStarmast; 2017-03-15 at 04:45 PM.
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2017-03-15, 04:45 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Aug 2009
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