Erfworld thread IV: In memory of King Saline

[Bird]

New one is up: Parson's lecture on grand strategy.

Also, from Rob's blog post:

Monday's comic may post on Tuesday, but there will still be 2 updates next week.

Also, we're at a point in the story where multiple turns need to pass, and characters need to have long conversations. So we'll be doing texts with half-page splashes for a while (probably for the next month or so).

When things start to be more action-y and tense again, it will go back to comic pages. I'm committed to writing the story the best way I can, and this is what the story needs to be right now. (One upside of this will be building back a buffer of pages that will help keep us on schedule for the rest of the book.) You can think of these pages as an intermission after Act I.

[Calemyr]

How is it that Stanley can be the character with the single largest bit of character growth (not counting Parson) yet still also be the little worm he's always been? It's really impressive.

[Porthos]

Now that's how a "Perfect Warlord" should act. I won't say 'about time', coz that's exceedingly unfair. But it is light years away from where Parson was at the start of Book II.

Love the way he handled Stanley at the end, as well.

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Do wonder about the Wanda-Ansom-FAQ/Jetstone stuff. That's actually pretty intriguing. Should be plenty of ore to mine later though, so I'm content on it being on the back burner for now.

[Welf]

How is it that Stanley can be the character with the single largest bit of character growth (not counting Parson) yet still also be the little worm he's always been? It's really impressive.

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I guess he is a pragmatic guy. Royals think the same, but use fancier words (see Haggard or Don's first heir). But since he wasn't popped a noble he won't be accepted as equal anyway, so why bother?

[Landis963]

Now that's how a "Perfect Warlord" should act. I won't say 'about time', coz that's exceedingly unfair. But it is light years away from where Parson was at the start of Book II.

Love the way he handled Stanley at the end, as well.

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Do wonder about the Wanda-Ansom-FAQ/Jetstone stuff. That's actually pretty intriguing. Should be plenty of ore to mine later though, so I'm content on it being on the back burner for now.

To be fair, Book 2 started with him in moral backlash-induced retirement, and Maggie pretty much had to kick him a few times to get him to work again.

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Faq could be on its way out though; Caesar wants to conquer it to keep it from being a drain on resources, and Translyvito could listen to Parson if Caesar wins. Jetstone is definitely a soft target, given Tramennis' inner monologue when poring over the Jetstone history book.

[Rogar Demonblud]

And Stanley is still The Tool.

[Fjolnir]

Remember, he's not petty because he's short, he's short because he's petty...

[Morty]

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Transylvito is definitely going to be a prime target for the new strategy. Don's position is very weak, and Caesar might be willing to talk business with Parson. Recent events are bound to have soured him to the idea of royalty even more.

[Legato Endless]

Definitely interested in the turn to diplomacy. Especially if it gets us to start seeing sides outside of the established players; things have been getting a bit stale. Also getting Decrypted Ansom to reunite with Vinne would be awesome. Tramannis and Jilliian have written him off, but his vampire best friend might see things very differently.

[Aquillion]

Definitely interested in the turn to diplomacy. Especially if it gets us to start seeing sides outside of the established players; things have been getting a bit stale. Also getting Decrypted Ansom to reunite with Vinne would be awesome. Tramannis and Jilliian have written him off, but his vampire best friend might see things very differently.

I suspect that part of this is that Tramannis and Jillian didn't really know him that well. But Vinne knows that the stick up his ass always had a stick up its ass, so I don't think he'll be as surprised to see how he is now.

[HalfTangible]

Definitely interested in the turn to diplomacy. Especially if it gets us to start seeing sides outside of the established players; things have been getting a bit stale. Also getting Decrypted Ansom to reunite with Vinne would be awesome. Tramannis and Jilliian have written him off, but his vampire best friend might see things very differently.

I see two major possibilities: GK allies with Transylvito after Caesar's coup, or GK allies with everyone EXCEPT Transylvito.

Hear me out.

GK + Transylvito: Faq is a huge enemy for GK right now, if only because of how dedicated Jillian is to fighting Stanley. Wiping her out is a good idea for Parson and Stanley, and Caesar wants Faq wiped out. Don would never approve, but if Caesar's coup is successful he'd make a strong ally for GK. In addition, from the wording of the contract I THINK GK can support Transylvito's efforts to destroy Faq by proxy - provide Schmuckers, that sorta thing.

GK allies with everyone:

From a narrative standpoint, I'd rather gain new villains than allies we've never even heard of. From a practical one... Traemennis wanted to ally with GK before the battle of Spacerock, and while his Dad's death probably put a damper on that plan, he's puts the blame on Charlie more than GK. We saw that in the between-book updates.

Jillian has said openly that she hates Stanley and can never abide him, so at first the idea of her allying with him seems insane. Except that Transylvito is about to try and wipe her off the map, so she's going to be pretty desperate in a few turns. And Ansom and Wanda are both part of GK, so there's a temptation at least. I can definitely see Faq and Caesar both trying to get GK on their side before the truce contract expires, I'm just not sure who they'd side with.

Now, Don would definitely still be an enemy of GK, and this whole idea centers around Caesar's coup failing. It would leave Transylvito alone against Faq (which needs to destroy them to survive), Jetstone (which T just abandoned, albeit against the ruler's wishes) and anyone else Parson manages to get on his side.

[halfeye]

Caesar's coup,

This is Erfworld. A coup isn't possible, if the king dies without an heir, the side ends, all the units vanish.

[NEO|Phyte]

This is Erfworld. A coup isn't possible, if the king dies without an heir, the side ends, all the units vanish.

I have vague recollection of an update somewhere mentioning sides splintering off, but I can't recall if the splinter rulers can do it themselves or if it's just a Ruler splits his side to combat upkeep costs thing.

[MReav]

This is Erfworld. A coup isn't possible, if the king dies without an heir, the side ends, all the units vanish.

Isn't Caesar the Heir?

[stsasser]

This is Erfworld. A coup isn't possible, if the king dies without an heir, the side ends, all the units vanish.

Looking at the thread title, isn't murdering King Saline how Stanley became Overlord?

[halfeye]

Looking at the thread title, isn't murdering King Saline how Stanley became Overlord?

Stanley, despite being non-royal was heir when Saline died, I don't remember exactly how Saline died, I'm not sure we've been told. IIRC, Caesar is not Don's heir, I'm not sure Don has one.

[Legato Endless]

Stanley, despite being non-royal was heir when Saline died, I don't remember exactly how Saline died, I'm not sure we've been told. IIRC, Caesar is not Don's heir, I'm not sure Don has one.

We don't know yet. What precisely happened when Saline was overthrown and when FAQ fell have not been entirely explained. Caesar is still the heir until the new royal pops. He was chosen after both of Don's children died. We've heard about Don's son making a play for the throne. The difficultly was how one could rebel since Rulers can kill their subjects with a thought. My guess would be, like prisoners, units that participate gain a circumstantial special. A rebel unit therefor can't be disbanded.

[HalfTangible]

Stanley, despite being non-royal was heir when Saline died, I don't remember exactly how Saline died, I'm not sure we've been told. IIRC, Caesar is not Don's heir, I'm not sure Don has one.

Caesar is Don's heir by designation (summer updates) and we have already established that Caesar is going behind Don's back to annex Faq.

[Rogar Demonblud]

We also know that Warlords can override their Ruler if they feel the side is at stake. cf Book 0 and the Crush and the So-Be-It Union arc.

[HandofShadows]

Looking at the thread title, isn't murdering King Saline how Stanley became Overlord?

We don't know the whole story behind Saline's death. All we know is that he headed out with all the casters and a large force and the Gobwins and HobGobwins rebeled and killed Saline. Stanley came back and put down te rebelion in a very bloody fashion. We don't know if Stanley planned it, Charlie had something to do with it or it was something else. Oddly, I don't think Stanley planned it. IIRC he still speaks with effection for King Saline.

[tomaO2]

After this latest update, with Stanley making the "backstabbing is my style" comment, I find myself a lot more willing to believe that he was behind this, or, at least, influenced by Wanda to do it. She might have arranged it herself as well, thinking it was Stanly's fate to rule the side so she better hurry it along.

I am less likely to think it was Charlie because it's been shown that, upon decryption, units break all existing contracts. Therefore, it's likely that some of the other gobwins and hobs would have mentioned this already.

It also allows a narrative conflict. Vurp was the very last living allied unit of GK that knows the truth. He now works for Charlie. Charlie gets the info from Vurp and then uses it to break up the alliances Parson is trying to create. No one would trust someone that was proven to be a backstabber of that level.

I think that would work as a good plot point. I'm sure Vurp is going to be important, sooner or later.

[Killer Angel]

I see two major possibilities: GK allies with Transylvito after Caesar's coup, or GK allies with everyone EXCEPT Transylvito.

I'd bet my money smuckers on the first one.

[Landis963]

After this latest update, with Stanley making the "backstabbing is my style" comment, I find myself a lot more willing to believe that he was behind this, or, at least, influenced by Wanda to do it. She might have arranged it herself as well, thinking it was Stanly's fate to rule the side so she better hurry it along.

I am less likely to think it was Charlie because it's been shown that, upon decryption, units break all existing contracts. Therefore, it's likely that some of the other gobwins and hobs would have mentioned this already.

It also allows a narrative conflict. Vurp was the very last living allied unit of GK that knows the truth. He now works for Charlie. Charlie gets the info from Vurp and then uses it to break up the alliances Parson is trying to create. No one would trust someone that was proven to be a backstabber of that level.

I think that would work as a good plot point. I'm sure Vurp is going to be important, sooner or later.

Did Wanda know about Stanley before he became overlord? The timing's a little weird.

[Divayth Fyr]

Did Wanda know about Stanley before he became overlord? The timing's a little weird.

She heard about him after he got the Arkenhammer, but was still a Warlord

[Welf]

Stanley, despite being non-royal was heir when Saline died, I don't remember exactly how Saline died, I'm not sure we've been told. IIRC, Caesar is not Don's heir, I'm not sure Don has one.

Caesar is the current heir, but Don is popping a new royal heir. That was on turn 54 after BoGK, the battle for Spacerock started on turn 72, the battle with Jillian was I think 4 turns later, and now the truce is for 30 days. So the truce ends on day 105 after BfGK, and the heir will be pooped on day 115 if a heir takes 60 turns to pop one.

After this latest update, with Stanley making the "backstabbing is my style" comment, I find myself a lot more willing to believe that he was behind this, or, at least, influenced by Wanda to do it. She might have arranged it herself as well, thinking it was Stanly's fate to rule the side so she better hurry it along.

I am less likely to think it was Charlie because it's been shown that, upon decryption, units break all existing contracts. Therefore, it's likely that some of the other gobwins and hobs would have mentioned this already.

It also allows a narrative conflict. Vurp was the very last living allied unit of GK that knows the truth. He now works for Charlie. Charlie gets the info from Vurp and then uses it to break up the alliances Parson is trying to create. No one would trust someone that was proven to be a backstabber of that level.

I think that would work as a good plot point. I'm sure Vurp is going to be important, sooner or later.

I doubt this would be a big reveal. The other sides already consider Stanley a usurper. Ansom says already in book 1 he became "overlord by regicide". Vinnie's comment "Well, kinda" implies that regicide by proxy isn't the only way to do this, or otherwise he wouldn't point out it's not exactly the definition.

[Morty]

Caesar is the current heir, but Don is popping a new royal heir. That was on turn 54 after BoGK, the battle for Spacerock started on turn 72, the battle with Jillian was I think 4 turns later, and now the truce is for 30 days. So the truce ends on day 105 after BfGK, and the heir will be pooped on day 115 if a heir takes 60 turns to pop one.

It's possible that after all the losses and setbacks Transylvito has suffered, they may not have enough Schmuckers to pop an heir anymore.

[NEO|Phyte]

Do we know if popping an heir takes money? I know designating one does, but given the massive turn cost of manually popping on, adding cash to the equation seems excessive.

[tomaO2]

I doubt this would be a big reveal. The other sides already consider Stanley a usurper. Ansom says already in book 1 he became "overlord by regicide". Vinnie's comment "Well, kinda" implies that regicide by proxy isn't the only way to do this, or otherwise he wouldn't point out it's not exactly the definition.

The hobs and gobwins committed the regicide. Stanley was simply the one that benefited when he made them become allied again. There is still plausible deniability that Stan was the cause of the whole thing though. Even Sizemore didn't outright state that he believed that Stanley was the cause of Saline's death. Having it confirmed will almost certainly cause ripple effects, or else why have this set up to begin with?

It might not be other nations either. Maybe Charlie messages Sizemore and this bit of info becomes the last straw and causes him to defect. He really hates his kingdom right now, so I could see him being pushed into turning traitor.

[Divayth Fyr]

Do we know if popping an heir takes money? I know designating one does, but given the massive turn cost of manually popping on, adding cash to the equation seems excessive.

The Erf wiki notes that you can either spend a lot of turns and pop a heir or spend a lot of shmuckers and designate one - which fits Jetstone being able to work on popping a new heir but unable to pay for designating Tramennis.

[Porthos]

Update time:

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Well.

Well, well, well.

What started out fairly mundane, though funny, turns out to be VERY interesting.

Who would have seen THAT possibity coming?