Personal Woes and Advice 2

[Asta Kask]

Last night I found out that my friend tried to kill herself the night before by trying to overdose on sleeping meds.

Her parents didn't even notice her attempt, she's been completely silent in her sessions with her therapist...
Should I just tell my teachers?
At this point I don't care if she hates me if I tell someone, I just want her to get help...

My 2 cents:
You should tell her parents. If they won't listen you should talk to a hospital and ask what to do. Maybe they know.

[fergo]

Hey guys, first time I’m posting on one of these advice threads on my own behalf.

For the first time since I was about fifteen, I’m having an argument with one of my friends (well, sort of). It’s just so… childish. I thought I’d left this crap behind me when I left secondary school. Any thoughts would be appreciated.

Spoilered for length. And how long it is… I don’t blame you if you can’t be bothered to read through it.

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Ok, so I have a friend, A. We met when we were in our first year of uni, and were flatmates last year. He is currently away from uni on a placement year, and will be back next year. We’ve met up a couple of times since he moved away, for gigs and things.

Now, me and A were both in the committee of a university society. Every year, around March, the society has elections to decide who’s going to be in the committee next year.

In March of our first year, all three committee members put themselves forward for the next year. While we didn’t exactly go out of our way to invite people to run against us, all of our members knew they could put themselves forward if they wanted, and no-one did.

In March of our second year, two of the committee were leaving—our president because he’d graduated, and A because he’d be on placement next year. I wasn’t planning to run for a position, but we could only find two other people to run, so again I stepped forward and put my name in. For the second time, there was only one person running for each position, so the results were all but guaranteed (in theory our members could reopen nominations if they didn’t like the candidate).

Roll around March this year. A had previously mentioned that he was interested in being in the committee again in what was to be his (as well as my) final year. I liked the thought of being on the committee with him again, so kept on mentioning to our members that he was planning to run. Importantly, he’d only came back a couple of times that year, so most of them didn’t know who he was, or had only met him once or twice (and he’s a pretty quiet guy, like myself). So I knew that if someone decided to run against him, there was a good chance this other person would win, simply because people will naturally vote for their friend instead of someone they’ve barely met. I told him I’d keep him updated if anyone mentioned they might be interested in running, so he could decide whether to nominate himself or not.
When the time comes that he can put his name forward, though, we hit a stumbling block. Only paid-up members can run for the committee (which is a requirement of our Students’ Union, not something we’d decided ourselves). And A refuses to pay.

We have a long conversation over text. He starts by saying that it’s unfair for him to pay, because he’s only been to one society event all year. He goes on to say that it’s unfair that only paid-up members can run for committee positions.

Now, I see where he’s coming from here. But this isn’t a rule that I made up, and it’s not something I have any control over. He can complain to me that it’s unfair until the cows come home, but I can’t change a damn thing.
But no, he refuses to acknowledge that. He makes wild, clearly untrue statements like, “No other organisation makes you pay to have a say in how it’s run,” and goes on tangents like, “What would it be like if you had to pay to become a Member of Parliament?”

This is a bloody university society with twenty to thirty members, not the running of a nation we’re talking about here. But of course I was too polite to say how stupid he was being; I just repeat again and again that it’s not up to me, these are the rules we’re given by the Students’ Union, it’s completely out of my control.

Oh, and this big fee that he’s refusing to pay? £3.50. Yep, that’s the massive sum that we’re trying to extort from him so he can exercise his democratic freedom, nay, his basic human right, to be in the committee of a university society.

A couple of weeks later, when the nominations period was closing, there were two people running for each of the committee positions (except the one I’m going for). We on the current committee were pleased with this—a bit of healthy competition is good, and a lot more interesting than the previous two years when we knew the results before people had even voted.

Against my better judgement, I send A a quick text telling him that he has until a certain time to become a paid-up member and put his name forward, and that he’d be competing against two other people.

He sent a text back a few hours later. Something along the lines of, “I can’t tell if you’re stupid enough to think that I have a chance [when people are going to vote for their friends instead of me] or you’re hoping that I am.”

I sent a text back saying, “Yeah, that’s right, be rude to the person who’s been going out of his way to make sure you have a chance of being on the committee next year.” A bit of a silly reply, I’m sure you’ll agree, and I should have just ignored him, but I was sick of this guy taking his anger out on me because of rules and circumstances I have no control over.

See, because it was never about him winning the election. Though he never explicitly asked for it, what he wanted was for us to rig the election, or call the whole thing off and say outright that we were choosing the committee for next year. He felt that, as someone with experience, we was naturally the right person for the job, and we should just say to all of our new members, “Sorry guys, you’re not allowed to be involved in the running of the society, you’re not allowed to vote, even, because I want my friend A to be in the committee.” Well, our members would have something to say about that, and so would our students’ union. It was a ridiculous request, which is why he never stated it outright, he just whined about how democratic elections were ‘unfair’ because people would just vote for who they know.

And we’ve barely talked since. Recently I asked him if he was still coming up for a pre-arranged event we’d talked about; he said that his car was playing up so he didn’t want to risk it. But he seemed friendly about it, so I hoped he’d gotten over the whole committee thing (not that, as far as I can see, there’s much to ‘get over’).

Ok, here’s another bit of background I didn’t want to distract you with at the top: for the last two years, me, A and another friend have went to a music festival over the summer. A, as the only one who can drive, drives us there, and we’re very grateful for him for doing that.

So, the other day I got a text from our mutual friend: “How are you getting to this festival?”

Hmm, I thought to myself. I sent a text back saying that I hoped A would give me a lift. It’s what we’ve done for the last two years, as far as I knew we were still friends (one extremely petty argument notwithstanding), I had no reason to think that it would change.

My friend texts back: “A’s car is full, but I’ll give you a lift if I can drive by then.” (He’s currently learning to drive, but I’m not holding my breath for him to pass any time soon).

Right. A has decided several months in advance that there wouldn’t be room in his car for me, despite us all fitting in quite comfortably for the last two years. Well, ain’t that a passive aggressive way of telling someone you’re not giving them a lift—and not even personally; he did it through someone else instead.

It’s not about the lift. I can get a bus or a train no bother. It just means, since our mutual friend is getting a lift with A (like I said, there’s not much chance of him passing his test before the festival), I’m now going by myself, a pretty crappy state of affairs.

Well, we’re both adults now. I decided to phone A, talk to him, ask him if something was wrong. Not shout at him or anything like that, just see what was up. It was ridiculous talking via our mutual friend.

I’ve phoned twice since then, and he hasn’t answered either time. I’ll try again tomorrow.

TL;DR: Friend has fallen out with me for the pettiest reason imaginable.
It’s ridiculous. It’s juvenile. It’s really, really, petty, and I seem to have lost a friend because of it.

I guess (as you can probably tell from the wall of text) I just needed to vent, but genuinely, I want to know that if (from my one-sided version of events) someone can explain why he thinks he’s justified in acting like he is.

If you’ve read all of the above, you have the patience of a saint. Thanks guys. This issue is nowhere as big as some other people are dealing with, it’s just kind of shaken me because, like I said, I thought I’d left this stuff behind me in secondary school.

[TaiLiu]

TL;DR: Friend has fallen out with me for the pettiest reason imaginable.
It’s ridiculous. It’s juvenile. It’s really, really, petty, and I seem to have lost a friend because of it.

I guess (as you can probably tell from the wall of text) I just needed to vent, but genuinely, I want to know that if (from my one-sided version of events) someone can explain why he thinks he’s justified in acting like he is.

Hm. That's rather unfortunate.

I don't know your friend at all, and the only information I have of him is from your story. However, reading through your story, it sounds like you've wrong him in some way - I don't know how - and he feels the need to be distant from you. Alternately, he suffered through some traumatic experience and took his anger and frustration out on you, and when you didn't comply with his unsaid desire, he felt that your betrayed him and your entire friendship.

Your friend's probably ranted about you to your mutual friend, so call him instead and see what he has to say.

Good luck.

[Logic]

TL;DR: Friend has fallen out with me for the pettiest reason imaginable.
It’s ridiculous. It’s juvenile. It’s really, really, petty, and I seem to have lost a friend because of it.

I guess (as you can probably tell from the wall of text) I just needed to vent, but genuinely, I want to know that if (from my one-sided version of events) someone can explain why he thinks he’s justified in acting like he is.

If you’ve read all of the above, you have the patience of a saint. Thanks guys. This issue is nowhere as big as some other people are dealing with, it’s just kind of shaken me because, like I said, I thought I’d left this stuff behind me in secondary school.

It's ok to rant sometimes. And I know how gratifying it is just to have someone listen to your rant. I wish I had better advice than just "Buck and, and wait for him to get over it" so I hope the playground has better ideas than I do. I do hope you get to your music festival. If I lived in the UK, you could probably count on me for a ride (unless this festival were to feature Modest Mouse, Niki Minaj, or Justin Bieber.)

[MonkeyBusiness]

Mindfreak,

How fortunate your friend is to have a friend like you.

I agree you should make sure her parents know about the attempt she made on her own life. You should also talk to your own parents, because it is not easy being friends with someone who is depressed or suicidal. You need support too!

I hope all turns out fell for you and your friend. Take care.

-Monkey

[fergo]

Hm. That's rather unfortunate.

I don't know your friend at all, and the only information I have of him is from your story. However, reading through your story, it sounds like you've wrong him in some way - I don't know how - and he feels the need to be distant from you. Alternately, he suffered through some traumatic experience and took his anger and frustration out on you, and when you didn't comply with his unsaid desire, he felt that your betrayed him and your entire friendship.

Your friend's probably ranted about you to your mutual friend, so call him instead and see what he has to say.

Good luck.

I've called A now. He said nothing was wrong. Not sure exactly how our conversation has helped, but at least I did the grown-up thing and actually talked to him about it .

I'm going to phone our mutual friend soon, thanks for the advise. We'll see what he has to say.

It's ok to rant sometimes. And I know how gratifying it is just to have someone listen to your rant. I wish I had better advice than just "Buck and, and wait for him to get over it" so I hope the playground has better ideas than I do. I do hope you get to your music festival. If I lived in the UK, you could probably count on me for a ride (unless this festival were to feature Modest Mouse, Niki Minaj, or Justin Bieber.)

Yeah, I think the best thing to do is just wait it out, to a certain extent, and see how things go .

And who on earth is Modest Mouse?

Thanks for the thoughts both of you .

[Logic]

And who on earth is Modest Mouse?

Thanks for the thoughts both of you .

A band that only got famous because they happened to be drinking buddies with a Seattle radio DJ. Also, their bandleader was taught to sing by dying cats.

[Coidzor]

A band that only got famous because they happened to be drinking buddies with a Seattle radio DJ. Also, their bandleader was taught to sing by dying cats.

That's Networking and the Pacific Norwest for ya.

[Logic]

That's Networking and the Pacific Norwest for ya.

As much as I love my home, things like these make me shudder.

[fergo]

A band that only got famous because they happened to be drinking buddies with a Seattle radio DJ. Also, their bandleader was taught to sing by dying cats.

Ah. Think I'll give them a miss then .

[INoKnowNames]

Delayed responses are delayed.

Is there any way to tell if I am suffering from any form of depression. n general I am happy, usually I distract myself with books and videogames. However sometimes I break down crying because of my poor performance at college and seemingly at my poor showing at life in general. I feel that I don't have any real friends, I know that I am on good terms with quite a few people but I don't really know how to approach them besides hello, how are you, etcetera. As I said I am doing poorly in college and I know it is entirely my fault (this is not being down on myself, it was mostly terrible choices and no real experience at studying). I have never had a proper gaming group because I have no idea of how to approach a group about something like that. I've realized that I am bored in my math class when that is about the only thing I feel I am at all good at. I doubt I will ever have a girlfriend because trying to talk to people about romantic intent is even worse than talking to them in general. Nobody has ever really approached me about any of that because I mostly keep to myself and doubt that I am often found attractive because I am somewhat overweight and just doubt I am that appealing. Mostly the main reason I am worried about myself is beacause in general I have done little of worth in my life and one of the few routes I see as leading to success in life is going poorly. Mostly I am posting this here is because I don't really want to talk about it with my family and doubt that anybody here would really know anything about me. Or really recognize my forum name because I doubt that I stand out from the few times I have posted.

To be entirely honest, you sound A LOT like how I -used- to be. And because of that, I can only emphatically recommend that you seek help.

However, without meeting you personally, I probably couldn't tell you exactly what it might be. However, having a problem at all, be it just not enjoying your standing in life, or that you actually could have a mental condition, be it depression or anxiety or what have you, isn't good, and you're definitely better off erring on the side of caution and going just to talk to someone whom could help than doing nothing at all.

And it is -frequently- the hardest step; making that first effort to seek help. Maybe you've made that first step in asking us what we think... though you probably need a more qualified opinion.

As I said myself, I've had similar issues to you; distracting myself with gaming, not having gotten much done with myself, not being good with girls or friends, being a bit overweight (technically obese), and prefering the obscurity of the internet than dealing initially with family.

I had a break down in school, and realized how I couldn't just go on without help. I suppose there might be a difference between you in me in that I've realized for a while that I've had problems, and have been coping with them my entire life. But you've probably understood that, too.

In any case, you risk wasting a little bit of time and a bit of nervousness trying to speak to, say, a mental health specialist. In return... well, I, on my own power, gained the courage to join a church group and gained a bunch of friends, lost 50+ lbs and several sizes, went from failing college to making As and Bs by taking it step by step, managed to ask out a very nice girl, and even gained the courage to speak to my birth mother for the first time in my life.

I hope you do go get help, and that you gain as much out of it as I did.

Last night I found out that my friend tried to kill herself the night before by trying to overdose on sleeping meds.

This is a completely crazy thing in regards to her. It came out of nowhere. She has been depressed for a bit but has never shown any signs of being suicidal.
I have no idea how I should handle this. She knows that I'm here for her and that I care for her, but how do I go about making sure she gets the help she needs?
Her parents didn't even notice her attempt, she's been completely silent in her sessions with her therapist...
Should I just tell my teachers?
At this point I don't care if she hates me if I tell someone, I just want her to get help...

You know the answer right there. Her life is worth more than her being mad at you. And anything is better than something worse happening. Be careful, but I hope everything goes well.

[WarKitty]

The following contains the letter I would really like to send to my family. Those of you who remember me will know some of what I'm talking about. Those who don't - let's just say my mother is after me for days on end every time I do something she doesn't like, and tends to be the master of the guilt-trip when she's doing it.

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Dear family:

I am done with "nice." See, I finally figured out that it was never about "niceness" at all. It's about control. I'm tired of being in a never-ending struggle to find a "nice" enough way to say things so that you'll actually, I don't know, listen to me instead of complaining about my phrasing. I'm pretty sure the only reason you think I'm not being "nice" is because you've confused niceness and spinelessness.

Mom, I know you're hurt, but take a look at your own behavior before you go complaining about how mean everyone is. You know what I think the truth is? You're threatened. You're threatened by the fact that your adult daughter sometimes disagrees with you, and even (horrors!) makes choices you don't approve of. And you're taking it out by saying I'm rude and disrespectful and not listening to you. That way you don't have to consider that I might have reasons for my decisions that might threaten your perfect little world. No, it's much more comfortable to keep on with the fantasy that I'm just a rebellious little kid who will come around the minute she starts listening to her mother.

Dad, you have been an adult for longer than I have been alive. You could have and should have stood up instead of trying so hard to keep the peace by giving in no matter what. Guess what? I'm an adult now too. Don't blame me for not wanting to tiptoe around my mother's temper anymore. And don't come running to me to apologize because she's upset. I don't appreciate being expected to put up with anything she wants to dish out because it upsets her to be called on it. She's a grown-up too.

Your daughter;
Kitty

[TaiLiu]

The following contains the letter I would really like to send to my family. Those of you who remember me will know some of what I'm talking about. Those who don't - let's just say my mother is after me for days on end every time I do something she doesn't like, and tends to be the master of the guilt-trip when she's doing it.

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Dear family:

I am done with "nice." See, I finally figured out that it was never about "niceness" at all. It's about control. I'm tired of being in a never-ending struggle to find a "nice" enough way to say things so that you'll actually, I don't know, listen to me instead of complaining about my phrasing. I'm pretty sure the only reason you think I'm not being "nice" is because you've confused niceness and spinelessness.

Mom, I know you're hurt, but take a look at your own behavior before you go complaining about how mean everyone is. You know what I think the truth is? You're threatened. You're threatened by the fact that your adult daughter sometimes disagrees with you, and even (horrors!) makes choices you don't approve of. And you're taking it out by saying I'm rude and disrespectful and not listening to you. That way you don't have to consider that I might have reasons for my decisions that might threaten your perfect little world. No, it's much more comfortable to keep on with the fantasy that I'm just a rebellious little kid who will come around the minute she starts listening to her mother.

Dad, you have been an adult for longer than I have been alive. You could have and should have stood up instead of trying so hard to keep the peace by giving in no matter what. Guess what? I'm an adult now too. Don't blame me for not wanting to tiptoe around my mother's temper anymore. And don't come running to me to apologize because she's upset. I don't appreciate being expected to put up with anything she wants to dish out because it upsets her to be called on it. She's a grown-up too.

Your daughter;
Kitty

Hm. That's definitely a brave thing to write. If you're asking for suggestions, I would consider changing "Dear Family" to "Dear Mother and Father," or something along those lines. Your problems seem to stem from your mother and father, but the positioning of the wording can make it seem like you have problems with your entire family, especially if your mother or father shows it to the rest of the household and twists the wording to make you the villain.

To clarify: look at the greeting and the first paragraph. If one were to chop off the other two paragraphs, the letter would read as if you had issues with your general family instead of two specific individuals. Considering how potentially shocking this letter is, the reader might only read it halfway and take the wrong message from it.

Good luck.

[WarKitty]

Clarification: I have no intention of actually sending the letter, simply because I know perfectly well that it would do nothing other than confirm their suspicions. But I wanted to get it out there so I'm not worrying myself constantly with what I "should" say and all that.

I'm an only child, though, and we're not in the area or terribly close with any of the extended family. So when I talk about my family, keep in mind that just is two individuals.

[TaiLiu]

Clarification: I have no intention of actually sending the letter, simply because I know perfectly well that it would do nothing other than confirm their suspicions. But I wanted to get it out there so I'm not worrying myself constantly with what I "should" say and all that.

I'm an only child, though, and we're not in the area or terribly close with any of the extended family. So when I talk about my family, keep in mind that just is two individuals.

Ah, I see. Well, it is well written, concise, and straight-to-the-point, so I think it's a good letter.

[Ceric]

Is there any way to tell if I am suffering from any form of depression. n general I am happy, usually I distract myself with books and videogames. However sometimes I break down crying because of my poor performance at college and seemingly at my poor showing at life in general. I feel that I don't have any real friends, I know that I am on good terms with quite a few people but I don't really know how to approach them besides hello, how are you, etcetera. As I said I am doing poorly in college and I know it is entirely my fault (this is not being down on myself, it was mostly terrible choices and no real experience at studying). I have never had a proper gaming group because I have no idea of how to approach a group about something like that. I've realized that I am bored in my math class when that is about the only thing I feel I am at all good at. I doubt I will ever have a girlfriend because trying to talk to people about romantic intent is even worse than talking to them in general. Nobody has ever really approached me about any of that because I mostly keep to myself and doubt that I am often found attractive because I am somewhat overweight and just doubt I am that appealing. Mostly the main reason I am worried about myself is beacause in general I have done little of worth in my life and one of the few routes I see as leading to success in life is going poorly. Mostly I am posting this here is because I don't really want to talk about it with my family and doubt that anybody here would really know anything about me. Or really recognize my forum name because I doubt that I stand out from the few times I have posted.

I don't know what the general process is, but I finally realized I might have depression when I realized I was sad almost all the time and that I didn't want to feel that way. By "sad" I mean I was always unhappy, hated my life and/or myself, dwelled on everything bad that happened to me even if there were also things that I knew were good but couldn't feel it (such as finishing homework assignments but only being miserable about all the new work I'm getting, or distracting myself with video games but returning to hating my life as soon as I stop), and had a lot of trouble building enough motivation to do small accomplishments (such as organizing my desk and doing laundry) (which also contributed to the previous problem).

(Although I didn't even get to that point until I failed both of my classes during summer quarter and cried every day for four days straight during/after finals, and I wish I'd been able to notice it sooner...)

I had a doctor appointment coming up at that time anyway so I told my doctor basically everything above and she prescribed me anti-depressants. And like I said when I started this response, I only MIGHT have depression afaik because I've never been actually diagnosed by a psychologist. But my medical record now states that I have depression so I guess I do.

I guess what I mean to say is that you don't have to wait to be officially "depressed" in order to seek help. If you're unhappy and your unhappiness is adversely affecting your life (as it appears to be), then I would certainly recommend talking to a professional and seeing if they can help you find a solution for your possible depression or for life in general. Good luck.

[Archpaladin Zousha]

Well, it's finally happened. I've been fired from one of my two jobs. I'd been on probation after failing to meet their professional standards of time usage (because of things like a sandwich taking too long to be delivered, or because I didn't think there was enough time to do something in between seeing students).

As you can imagine, my mother is not happy. I didn't tell her about the probation because I didn't want her to get upset at me, and now she's even more upset at me for lying to her about it (a lie of omission is still a lie). She didn't yell at me or anything, and she had to leave for work anyway, but shortly after she left she called and told me to schedule an appointment with my psychiatrist. I've done so.

I'm such a friggin' failure. Now I miss out on $5,500 towards the payment of my college loans, something my mom was very excited about, I'm a disgrace to the school I went to as a kid, and where my mom still works, I've broken my parents trust in me AGAIN, and my mom's now talking about getting guardianship or conservatorship at the meeting with my psychiatrist. I managed to keep it together since September to now, and now I'm ruined. I still have my other job, and can take hours there, even go full-time now. But now I'm ruined. Completely ruined. My mom will never trust me again. I'll never work in tutoring again. It's just another bridge burnt because I'm a lazy ******* who wants to waste all his time reading and surfing the web and playing RPGs (I never even played any tabletop games after starting this job, I didn't have time!)

I don't want to take my own life or anything. I've never felt that low. But I'm so angry and upset at myself for failing AGAIN. My parents said if I'd just told them they'd have helped me stay on track, but the whole reason I didn't tell them was because I thought if I told them I was failing at this job they'd be upset at me the same way they're upset with me now. People are telling me to move on, but how do you move on from utterly self-sabotaging your life?!

[Chen]

I don't want to take my own life or anything. I've never felt that low. But I'm so angry and upset at myself for failing AGAIN. My parents said if I'd just told them they'd have helped me stay on track, but the whole reason I didn't tell them was because I thought if I told them I was failing at this job they'd be upset at me the same way they're upset with me now. People are telling me to move on, but how do you move on from utterly self-sabotaging your life?!

People are right to tell you to move on. In situations like this, the only use in dwelling on the past is to ensure you don't repeat the same mistakes again. Going to speak with your psychiatrist is a good start. They are a professional and can certainly help work through a difficult situation like this.

I wouldn't assume things are worse than they are either. I doubt your mother will NEVER trust you again. She may be upset now, but she is still your mother. Never working in tutoring again is also an exaggeration. You probably won't be able to work for that company, but very few things in life are irrevocably blocked by mistakes such as this.

[Archpaladin Zousha]

Well, she spoke to me just a few minutes ago. Didn't yell. Didn't get upset. Just spoke in a calm, disappointed tone, though she was pleased that I did what she'd asked me to do in the meantime (scheduled an appointment with my psychiatrist and made preparations for a recruitment event at one of my old jobs which is hiring again, they're project-based so I wasn't fired or let go, the project I worked on was over and they didn't need me for the next one).

She wants my psychiatrist to do a full assessment at our meeting, to outline every possible problem I have about holding a job, and she noted that a big thing about that is honesty. I withheld information not just from her, but from my supervisors and coworkers about how I was struggling. They were willing to help me but I was too ashamed of myself to ask. And a part of me wonders if I deliberately WANTED to get fired because I was jealous of the other Reading Corps member there, or because I was bored with the job, or because I resented that working two jobs meant I had literally no time to do the things I enjoyed if I wanted to get a reasonable amount of sleep.

But the point is, that she's also wanting to look into guardianship or conservatorship (not sure which it's called) so that my parents would be put in control of things like insurance, legal decisions, and how my money is spent. Micromanaging my life, which is the last thing I want. I don't know what to do. She's not ANGRY like she was that time I didn't notice my phone go off. But now more than ever it seems clear that she thinks I'll never be able to take care of myself due to my Asperger's Syndrome, and that she was a fool for ever thinking she could teach me how to be a responsible, mature and independent adult.

[Spiryt]

But the point is, that she's also wanting to look into guardianship or conservatorship (not sure which it's called) so that my parents would be put in control of things like insurance, legal decisions, and how my money is spent. Micromanaging my life, which is the last thing I want. I don't know what to do. She's not ANGRY like she was that time I didn't notice my phone go off. But now more than ever it seems clear that she thinks I'll never be able to take care of myself due to my Asperger's Syndrome, and that she was a fool for ever thinking she could teach me how to be a responsible, mature and independent adult.

Urgh, I don't really know your situation, or legal system over there (not that it's allowed to discuss here), but how the hell can she do that?

If you're adult, and in fact have a job, I would be pretty sure that she would need some serious reason for taking away quite fundamental freedoms?

[Archpaladin Zousha]

I have a neurological disorder that impairs my ability to take care of myself. If it's that or turning me out on the street, she's not going to turn me out on the street. She's not THAT cruel.

[Spiryt]

I have a neurological disorder that impairs my ability to take care of myself. If it's that or turning me out on the street, she's not going to turn me out on the street. She's not THAT cruel.

Damn, that pretty harsh.

Still, it's even more harsh to demand such a thing, when you're actually taking said care.

Many perfectly healthy people have trouble holding a job, I wish I had one at this point.

So I don't see a reason to get that upset for losing one job out of 2...

I would concentrate on keeping said job and pointing out that failure to work at two places at the same time isn't exactly biggest failure out there.

[Archpaladin Zousha]

She's not MAD. She's disappointed. And from what she said recently it sounds more like the guardianship thing is a worst case scenario, what she REALLY wants from the assessments is to figure out every potential problem I have in holding a job so that they can be nipped in the bud at another job.

[WarKitty]

Well, she spoke to me just a few minutes ago. Didn't yell. Didn't get upset. Just spoke in a calm, disappointed tone, though she was pleased that I did what she'd asked me to do in the meantime (scheduled an appointment with my psychiatrist and made preparations for a recruitment event at one of my old jobs which is hiring again, they're project-based so I wasn't fired or let go, the project I worked on was over and they didn't need me for the next one).

Still sucks.

She wants my psychiatrist to do a full assessment at our meeting, to outline every possible problem I have about holding a job, and she noted that a big thing about that is honesty. I withheld information not just from her, but from my supervisors and coworkers about how I was struggling. They were willing to help me but I was too ashamed of myself to ask. And a part of me wonders if I deliberately WANTED to get fired because I was jealous of the other Reading Corps member there, or because I was bored with the job, or because I resented that working two jobs meant I had literally no time to do the things I enjoyed if I wanted to get a reasonable amount of sleep.

This? Sounds normal. Entirely normal. Nothing you've written there is at all unusual for young adults. Nothing at all sounds like it's indicating a serious or severe problem on its own. People hiding and being ashamed of mental illness is incredibly common

But the point is, that she's also wanting to look into guardianship or conservatorship (not sure which it's called) so that my parents would be put in control of things like insurance, legal decisions, and how my money is spent. Micromanaging my life, which is the last thing I want. I don't know what to do. She's not ANGRY like she was that time I didn't notice my phone go off. But now more than ever it seems clear that she thinks I'll never be able to take care of myself due to my Asperger's Syndrome, and that she was a fool for ever thinking she could teach me how to be a responsible, mature and independent adult.

It sounds like she has a habit of getting angry at you for things that aren't worth anger. Make sure you speak to the psychiatrist ALONE, and make sure you express these concerns as well. If what you're saying is true it sounds like she would NOT be a helpful guardian in any case.

[Archpaladin Zousha]

Still sucks.

You can say that again.

This? Sounds normal. Entirely normal. Nothing you've written there is at all unusual for young adults. Nothing at all sounds like it's indicating a serious or severe problem on its own. People hiding and being ashamed of mental illness is incredibly common

The thing is, I've made these same mistakes in previous jobs. It got me fired from my first work study in college, and that partially led to my downward spiral in sophomore year where I was missing assignments because I was too lazy to do them and would rather entertain myself with games and crap. That my mom pulled me out of, setting strict limits on what I could and couldn't have in my dorm, which prevented me from dropping out and allowed me to get back on track and complete my four-year degree in four years. What's frustrating to my mom isn't that these mistakes happen. It's that they keep happening over and over, and it's evident that the lessons I claimed to have learned about time management and honesty have never stuck, and that I'd rather wallow in self-pity instead of fixing things.

It sounds like she has a habit of getting angry at you for things that aren't worth anger. Make sure you speak to the psychiatrist ALONE, and make sure you express these concerns as well. If what you're saying is true it sounds like she would NOT be a helpful guardian in any case.

I already speak to my psychiatrist alone, and this makes her suspicious. What's to stop me from lying to him about how things are going? What's to stop me from misrepresenting her as the bad guy. I already feel like I've done a disservice to her by talking about her here. She's a good person. She volunteers her time and money to help nearly everyone she knows. She attends every one of my sister's and brother's performances. She drives me places because I don't have a license. She coaches Special Olympics, many of the athletes are her current or former students at school, and others are ones she's PCAd for. She cooks and bakes for nearly every occasion, all by herself. She gets up every morning and gives it her all despite her chronic pain from fibromyalgia and diabetes. She's sacrificed almost every aspect of her own life to make sure me and my brothers and sister have a happy life and a future to look forward to. And I've made her look like an abusive monster here.

[WarKitty]

You can say that again.

The thing is, I've made these same mistakes in previous jobs. It got me fired from my first work study in college, and that partially led to my downward spiral in sophomore year where I was missing assignments because I was too lazy to do them and would rather entertain myself with games and crap. That my mom pulled me out of, setting strict limits on what I could and couldn't have in my dorm, which prevented me from dropping out and allowed me to get back on track and complete my four-year degree in four years. What's frustrating to my mom isn't that these mistakes happen. It's that they keep happening over and over, and it's evident that the lessons I claimed to have learned about time management and honesty have never stuck, and that I'd rather wallow in self-pity instead of fixing things.

Have you been screened for depression? But seriously, I've both been through college (took me 5 and a half years) and am currently taking twice as long as expected to get my MA. I've also taught undergrads here. That really is normal. And lessons about time management take a long time to learn, plus working multiple jobs is hard on most people. It's a mistake to think because you didn't get it all right that the lessons "aren't sticking."

I already speak to my psychiatrist alone, and this makes her suspicious. What's to stop me from lying to him about how things are going? What's to stop me from misrepresenting her as the bad guy. I already feel like I've done a disservice to her by talking about her here. She's a good person. She volunteers her time and money to help nearly everyone she knows. She attends every one of my sister's and brother's performances. She drives me places because I don't have a license. She coaches Special Olympics, many of the athletes are her current or former students at school, and others are ones she's PCAd for. She cooks and bakes for nearly every occasion, all by herself. She gets up every morning and gives it her all despite her chronic pain from fibromyalgia and diabetes. She's sacrificed almost every aspect of her own life to make sure me and my brothers and sister have a happy life and a future to look forward to. And I've made her look like an abusive monster here.

This? This does not sound good. Are you, in fact, saying things you KNOW to be untrue, to the psychiatrist? Not things you worry might be untrue, or might not be the way she'd see them, or whatever? But, are you deliberately telling falsehoods? If not, don't worry about it. Don't worry what she "looks like" to the psychiatrist - he talks to you, he talks to her, he's presumably a smart well-trained individual.

She doesn't sound like an abusive monster, but she sounds like someone who's having a hard time letting go. She sounds like someone who wants to "fix everything" in a way that may not be helpful or even possible. And you don't sound like someone who's being "dishonest" - you sound like someone who doesn't want to have everything in his life on display and is struggling with who to trust with what. But not telling people things does not by itself constitute dishonesty - "lying by ommision" requires that you still be trying to deceive someone, and for it to be dishonest requires you to have some obligation to tell them the matter in the first place.

[Archpaladin Zousha]

Have you been screened for depression? But seriously, I've both been through college (took me 5 and a half years) and am currently taking twice as long as expected to get my MA. I've also taught undergrads here. That really is normal. And lessons about time management take a long time to learn, plus working multiple jobs is hard on most people. It's a mistake to think because you didn't get it all right that the lessons "aren't sticking."

No, I haven't been screened for depression. I do, however, have Asperger's Syndrome.

This? This does not sound good. Are you, in fact, saying things you KNOW to be untrue, to the psychiatrist? Not things you worry might be untrue, or might not be the way she'd see them, or whatever? But, are you deliberately telling falsehoods? If not, don't worry about it. Don't worry what she "looks like" to the psychiatrist - he talks to you, he talks to her, he's presumably a smart well-trained individual.

No, I'm worried I'm saying things in the heat of emotion that are exaggerations of things she actually said and did.

She doesn't sound like an abusive monster, but she sounds like someone who's having a hard time letting go. She sounds like someone who wants to "fix everything" in a way that may not be helpful or even possible. And you don't sound like someone who's being "dishonest" - you sound like someone who doesn't want to have everything in his life on display and is struggling with who to trust with what. But not telling people things does not by itself constitute dishonesty - "lying by ommision" requires that you still be trying to deceive someone, and for it to be dishonest requires you to have some obligation to tell them the matter in the first place.

I deliberately did not tell my parents about the probation I was on because I was afraid I would get in trouble if I did. I know, I know, "You're an adult, you make your own decisions, yadda yadda yadda." But I have to LIVE with them. I don't pay rent, buy groceries, pay taxes or even freakin' drive! I'm still very dependent on them. And my mom has said before that I don't respect her, that I'm all take and no give.

[WarKitty]

No, I haven't been screened for depression. I do, however, have Asperger's Syndrome.

No, I'm worried I'm saying things in the heat of emotion that are exaggerations of things she actually said and did.

(1) It might still be worth asking about depression. Worry, lack of motivation, etc. - these can all be symptoms. I don't think they're part of asperger's. And it can't hurt to inquire.

(2) That is part of their job. A good psychologist should be able to tell what's real from what you said, so long as you are not setting out to deceive them.

I deliberately did not tell my parents about the probation I was on because I was afraid I would get in trouble if I did. I know, I know, "You're an adult, you make your own decisions, yadda yadda yadda." But I have to LIVE with them. I don't pay rent, buy groceries, pay taxes or even freakin' drive! I'm still very dependent on them. And my mom has said before that I don't respect her, that I'm all take and no give.

My point is, I wouldn't consider it a major character flaw that you didn't tell her. It sounds like something that may have been inadvisable, a bad idea, even not the right thing to do - but it sounds normal. It doesn't sound like the sort of thing that you should say you're "not an honest person" over, simply because by that standard most people in the world aren't honest.

[Archpaladin Zousha]

But it's happened so many times. In college, in other jobs, and now here. It's getting to the point where my mom has to verify everything I've said from someone else because she can never tell if I'm being straight with her or lying to cover myself.

My disability coordinator back in college said I feel this way because I have a lot of personal integrity. That I know what I'm doing is wrong and the lying is only serving to make me feel worse than the actual problems I'm trying to avoid by lying, and that once everything's out on the table, I'll feel better and be able to move on. But I don't feel that way. I feel like I have a reputation, and that reputation has been permanently damaged every time I've done something like this. By this point no one should trust what I say, because I've proven time and again that I'll lie about how things are going, letting problems at work fester until I'm fired because I don't want to admit that I'm bored by my job and want to read fantasy books or play video games instead.

[rogueboy]

Long (spoilered) post incoming, since there's a lot of things I want to address.

Spoiler

Show

First off, disclaimer: I may not know exactly what you're going through, but I have also been diagnosed with Asperger's, so I can sympathize with how you're reacting to things. I understand the hyper-focus on small (often irrelevant, really) details, I understand being you're own harshest critic, and I understand being frustrated and upset by not being able to manage as easily as the people around you appear to be managing. (Note: appearances aren't everything, they're just what we see of what everyone else puts out to the world).

I have a neurological disorder that impairs my ability to take care of myself. If it's that or turning me out on the street, she's not going to turn me out on the street. She's not THAT cruel.

Yes, Asperger's can impair you in some ways. It also gives you ways of thinking that other people can only wonder at. It's not purely a negative thing, you just have to learn what your strengths are and use those (not specific to those with Asperger's, of course). Also, those aren't the only 2 options. There are miles of intermediate space between "I'm going to control everything you do" and "You're completely on your own, get out".

Well, she spoke to me just a few minutes ago. Didn't yell. Didn't get upset. Just spoke in a calm, disappointed tone, though she was pleased that I did what she'd asked me to do in the meantime (scheduled an appointment with my psychiatrist and made preparations for a recruitment event at one of my old jobs which is hiring again, they're project-based so I wasn't fired or let go, the project I worked on was over and they didn't need me for the next one).

Question: would you have thought to schedule an appointment on your own? In your first post, you talked repeatedly about being a complete failure, which isn't true. Everyone stumbles, things don't go right, etc. To me, it sounds like you're focusing on the negatives and inflating them FAR beyond the influence they should have (does failing suck? yes. but that doesn't have to be everything there is to it).

Aside from that, it sounds like you're responding well. You've thought of options for getting those hours back (increasing time at your other job, getting a new second job).

She wants my psychiatrist to do a full assessment at our meeting, to outline every possible problem I have about holding a job, and she noted that a big thing about that is honesty. I withheld information not just from her, but from my supervisors and coworkers about how I was struggling. They were willing to help me but I was too ashamed of myself to ask. And a part of me wonders if I deliberately WANTED to get fired because I was jealous of the other Reading Corps member there, or because I was bored with the job, or because I resented that working two jobs meant I had literally no time to do the things I enjoyed if I wanted to get a reasonable amount of sleep.

Wanting to get a full assessment (especially with your note later about wanting to identify the problems to be able to "nip them in the bud") is probably a good thing. If you're able to identify the problems and (more importantly) have a plan to counteract those problems, you'll be in a better place to keep and excel at a future job.

But the point is, that she's also wanting to look into guardianship or conservatorship (not sure which it's called) so that my parents would be put in control of things like insurance, legal decisions, and how my money is spent. Micromanaging my life, which is the last thing I want. I don't know what to do. She's not ANGRY like she was that time I didn't notice my phone go off. But now more than ever it seems clear that she thinks I'll never be able to take care of myself due to my Asperger's Syndrome, and that she was a fool for ever thinking she could teach me how to be a responsible, mature and independent adult.

Having someone as a resource for managing these things is a good thing. However, you will have to learn how to manage them on your own eventually. The best way to do that? Work together, have her help you sort out the issues and show you what the goal is, as well as the steps to get there. That might manage to keep both of you happy - she's involved, and can see that things are under control, but you don't relinquish control more than you're comfortable with.

The thing is, I've made these same mistakes in previous jobs. It got me fired from my first work study in college, and that partially led to my downward spiral in sophomore year where I was missing assignments because I was too lazy to do them and would rather entertain myself with games and crap. That my mom pulled me out of, setting strict limits on what I could and couldn't have in my dorm, which prevented me from dropping out and allowed me to get back on track and complete my four-year degree in four years. What's frustrating to my mom isn't that these mistakes happen. It's that they keep happening over and over, and it's evident that the lessons I claimed to have learned about time management and honesty have never stuck, and that I'd rather wallow in self-pity instead of fixing things.

To me, that sounds like figuring out what the problems are and how to solve them is absolutely critical. They're coming up again and again, and causing significant problems. Get them under control (going overly draconian on hobbies and such if necessary at first, and then relaxing to find a balance). It definitely sounds like she has your best interests at heart, and has effective ways of going about them. The only issue is whether your voice is being heard in determining which of the options is best.

I already speak to my psychiatrist alone, and this makes her suspicious. What's to stop me from lying to him about how things are going? What's to stop me from misrepresenting her as the bad guy. I already feel like I've done a disservice to her by talking about her here. [details.] And I've made her look like an abusive monster here.

To me, nothing you've said makes her sound abusive or monstrous. In fact, I'd say the opposite: caring and protective, at times to a fault. Which can cause problems, but is a much, much better place to be coming from.

Have you given her reasons to believe that you would lie to your psychiatrist? Not to her, or to anyone else, but to your psychiatrist, specifically. For me, I know I've told things to the counseling center group I go to that I haven't told anyone else, and it's precisely because I know that they won't judge me, it won't bleed into any other interaction I have (because there is no other interaction, basically), etc. My answer to "what's to stop you from lying to him?" The fact that you care about improving yourself, and your ability to function within society. That, and the fact that you want him to help you find answers to how to do that, are why you won't lie to him.

No, I haven't been screened for depression. I do, however, have Asperger's Syndrome.

To me, unless you're feeling sad a lot (in general, not about something like losing this job) and unmotivated to do anything, I probably wouldn't worry about depression screening. Probably wouldn't hurt, but what your saying sounds more like Asperger's responses to irritation, frustration, and (minor) failure. (Please remember that losing this job isn't as big as you're making it out to be - you can get a new job, you can get another job tutoring in the future, you just need to figure out how to prevent the missteps you took in this job).

No, I'm worried I'm saying things in the heat of emotion that are exaggerations of things she actually said and did.

Figuring out what you actually mean (and asking you to clarify, if necessary) vs what you say in the heat of the moment are part of his job. I wouldn't focus on that as a problem. If it's really eating you up, you can talk to him about that concern - the more comfortable you are with the process, the more productive it will be, even if that means taking a detour on the way.

I deliberately did not tell my parents about the probation I was on because I was afraid I would get in trouble if I did. I know, I know, "You're an adult, you make your own decisions, yadda yadda yadda." But I have to LIVE with them. I don't pay rent, buy groceries, pay taxes or even freakin' drive! I'm still very dependent on them. And my mom has said before that I don't respect her, that I'm all take and no give.

You made a judgement call, and things didn't go as you had hoped. That happens to everyone. Remember that everyone needs help with things from time to time, and ask for that help when you notice it's a problem. Whether you get that help from your supervisor, coworkers, psychiatrist, mother, friends, or someone else entirely is up to you. But if you think you need help managing something, it's worth getting that help.

Also, an article I saw recent that I found an interesting read on the advantages and challenges of hiring someone with Asperger's, from an employer's perspective.