OOTS #955 - The Discussion Thread

[Candorio]

Damn that was quick!

[137beth]

Hurray for V doing everything

Also, in the previous discussion thread, Kish was right: Belkar is sabotaging himself by showing that nothing High Priest of Hel does could possibly convince Belkar not to want to kill him.

[Phantom Thief]

I'm thinking the storm will escalate, V will have to polymorph Black wing resulting in a giant stone bird, and the title of the next panel will be "ROC me like a hurricane"

[otakuryoga]

oh that last panel
total awesomeness

[CoffeeIncluded]

Please show that, Giant. The world demands it!

[rman]

"Former master Thundershield"

What would True Seeing show you about who a person is when looking at a Vampire?

Did V have TS up in the temple?

[Dr. Gamera]

CANNOT WAIT FOR GARGANTUAN ROC.

Actually, you know, the mental image is enough. Either gargantuan roc or whatever superior plot development ensues is fine.

[Jay R]

Well lightning is an arc of electric current, and you can't just stop current midway through its path. Whatever arcane power thing is making the wall could be a voltage drain I guess.

That is correct in a world in which lightning is a discharge of electrons going mindlessly along the line of electric potential as negative charge attracts positive charge. But in such a world, people (and gods) cannot direct it to specific chosen targets.

Therefore, lightning doesn't work that way in D&D.

[Cicciograna]

I think that V is starting to figure that something is off. I'm sure he remembers what Durkon said after Miko smote Roy.
Now, the storm is clearly hampering the party, so according to Durkon's word, since Thor is his patron deity then the God of Storms does not want them to succeed: at that time, Durkon chose not to act, whereas now he's actively trying to go against his god's will, against a storm that is not only delaying them, but that's also apparently trying to kill them, since this is the second lightning directed straight towards the Mechane. One lightning is an accident, two are a clue, three make a proof, four and more are experimental evidence: Thor is against them.
V is smart. Something tells me that soon he'll be taken again into the IFCC's custody.

[UristMcRandom]

As far as Rocwing goes, I'm betting he'll be a mostly off-panel occurance, possibly seen when Control Weater finally takes full effect and V can return to the ship, though likely only briefly before Polymorph is dispelled/dismissed.

Oh, and great comic, can't wait for the next one!

[Finagle]

Eh, if I was DM there's no way I would have allowed that lightning blocking thing. That sort of thing just has "munchkin" written all over it, and as soon as players get the idea they can pull stunts like that they just go more munchkin the next time. It's lightning, it's literally at the speed of light. Even if it is a god throwing them.

[zimmerwald1915]

I want to see the giant Roc!!!

It's not Blackwing, and it's from before several art upgrades, but here you go.

[Keltest]

Eh, if I was DM there's no way I would have allowed that lightning blocking thing. That sort of thing just has "munchkin" written all over it, and as soon as players get the idea they can pull stunts like that they just go more munchkin the next time. It's lightning, it's literally at the speed of light. Even if it is a god throwing them.

It actually is possible to predict where lightning will strike, to a very VERY limited degree. I don't know about the "looking at the clouds" thing Blackwing did, but if you could see the start and finish points, it wouldn't be impossible to put something in between if you could react nearly instantly.

besides, the Giant went to art school.

[Zombimode]

I don't know the specifics of how a forcewall is supposed to work in terms of physics, but I'm doubtful as to the effectiveness of that blocking strategy. And a bit moreso about trying to put lighting in a forcecage. You might even say Im... shocked.

What V ought to do is fly above the clouds and case lightning bolt at an angle away from the ship towards the ground and discharge the cloud that way. But if Forcewall DOES work that way, kudos on some VERY good reaction times there.

Well, here is how it works on a mechanical level:

First, we have to establish that by conventional wisdom, that a lightning strike has a direction and thus travels from point A to point B along a line. This may not be the way it works in reality, but is how it works in most fiction (and for the entirety "lightning strike" type spells in D&D).

Blackwing observes the sky and readies and action to shout and point when it sees a strike forming.
V readies an action to cast Wall of Force at a point between the source of the lightning strike and the airship. Since most readied actions occur just before the action triggering them, the Wall of Force is cast just before the lightning actually strikes.

A Wall of Force (as well as the walls of a Force Cage) simply blocks Line-of-Effect. Since we already established that a lightning will travel from one point to another, its progression is stopped by the Wall of Forces since that is what blocking Line-of-Effect does.

[Psyren]

The wall of force thing is sort of possible by readying an action (which also happens basically at the speed of light.)

Rocwing as a feathery lightning umbrella most definitely would work though.

[HandofShadows]

Still liking how V looks (All the characters look) with the new art. And looking forward to a Roc soon.

[Ezekiel]

I'm thinking the storm will escalate, V will have to polymorph Black wing resulting in a giant stone bird, and the title of the next panel will be "ROC me like a hurricane"

Thanks, now I'm going to have that song in my head all day long.

[ellindsey]

It's lightning, it's literally at the speed of light. Even if it is a god throwing them.

Despite the name, lightning is not made of light, and does not travel anywhere close to the speed of light. You can actually see the propagation downwards from cloud to ground with a high speed camera. Of course, it should still be impossible to react quickly enough to block it under any reasonable conditions, but electricity in D&D doesn't follow the same physics as it does in our world.

[Lexible]

I LOVE the call out to Gene Wilder in The Producers!!!

[colanderman]

I think what y'all are forgetting is that lightning is literally thrown like a javelin by Thor.

Actual physics of lightning (which propagates downward slowly as a progressively lengthening ionized channel of air, followed by an rapid upward electric discharge along this channel) be damned!

[Gift Jeraff]

I can't help noticing how V calls Durkula 'the former Master Thundershield.' Suspicion? Nah...I am prolly reading too much into it.

I think V realizes that "Durkon" has changed so fundamentally that it would be inaccurate to still call him that, regardless of whether or not it's still technically Durkon in control. S/he did witness him uncharacteristically freak out about the staff.

[Peelee]

That required some.... lightning fast reflexes.

You, sir, made my day.

It's lightning, it's literally at the speed of light. Even if it is a god throwing them.

Lightning travels at 93,000 miles/second. Light travels at 186,000 miles/second. Lightning is electricity, not light. It travels at the speed of lightning. Literally. Even if it is a god throwing it.

[AutomatedTeller]

I think V realizes that "Durkon" has changed so fundamentally that it would be inaccurate to still call him that, regardless of whether or not it's still technically Durkon in control. S/he did witness him uncharacteristically freak out about the staff.

Funny comic. Unbelievably reflexes, but that's why V is a hero, after all.

[multilis]

The specifics are: Magic. I see no reason an impenetrable barrier would not stop a lightning strike.

Real life physics:

Problem 1 is lightning being a charge would normally go around any barrier it could not go through. (Still could work in making lightning miss the ship)
Problem 2 is having fast enough reflexes to stop something moving at nearly the speed of light.
Problem 3 is technically supposed to only allow vertical wall, rather than horizontal.

It takes cartoon physics to make this work.


Update: Lightning (air plasma bridge?) *might* travel as slow as 3,700 miles per second in air, still absurdly extreme.

It is a little complicated as first you have the bridge of plasma forming which will be comparatively low energy, then as soon as connection is made, more and more energy would flow which would widen the bridge between both ends... sort of like a river of water flowing through a sand dam.

Cut off the lightning when the bridge is forming, and the bridge finds a different route, the main energy pushing has not been released yet. Sort of like plugging a tiny hole in a sand dam, water will find another way, once a different hole forms it rapidly grows.

[Toper]

Nice! I didn't think Thor would give up that easily -- he's probably aiming for Durkula directly at this point. I also like the comic title.

Sadly, even Polymorph Any Object is restricted to max 15 HD creatures, and a Roc has 18 hit dice.

[Peelee]

Real life physics:

Problem 1 is lightning being a charge would normally go around any barrier it could not go through. (Still could work in making lightning miss the ship)
Problem 2 is having fast enough reflexes to stop something moving at nearly the speed of light.

It takes cartoon physics to make this work.

Half the speed of light is not nearly the speed of light. One (of the many) cool things about math is that the bigger the numbers get, the bigger difference fractions make. if you travel half a billion light years and your friend travels a billion light years, you guys are HOLY CRAP seriously you literally cannot actually conceptualize this distance REALLY far apart. Not "nearly as far as your friend traveled."

[ORione]

V is smart. Something tells me that soon he'll be taken again into the IFCC's custody.

To prevent them from warning the rest of the order about HPoH? Why would the IFCC care about that?

[Eloi]

I like how V is taking great pains to protect the rest of the crew; she's had a lot of character development since two arcs ago.

[Small note: Just noticed I said she instead of they; not sure what makes me think V is a lady elf, but yes.]

[Ave]

Can V cast two spells after spotting the second lightning? Shouldn't he start casting at least the protection spell?

[Kish]

There's no rule saying Vaarsuvius would have to change Blackwing into an adult roc.