Worf vs Solo

[GloatingSwine]

Probably the only starship job worse than being the lady who answers the phone. Dang, Kirk was lazy.

I dunno, it's a hard job beating Troi for useful work done. I mean "sit next to captain, occasionally state the obvious" was damn important.

[Gnoman]

Probably the only starship job worse than being the lady who answers the phone. Dang, Kirk was lazy.

Managing a ship's communication systems, deciding what needs to be routed where, and what needs to be sent directly to the captain, is an incredibly important job. It is also not something that makes for good TV, so we only see the radio operator Communications Officer when an important message comes in or the captain needs to use the radio hail a ship.

[The Glyphstone]

The engineer's job seemed to mainly consist of staring at the 'Reactor Power' dial set to 80%, then swearing over the communicator to Kirk that they were at 100% but he could give them 120%.

Managing a ship's communication systems, deciding what needs to be routed where, and what needs to be sent directly to the captain, is an incredibly important job. It is also not something that makes for good TV, so we only see the radio operator Communications Officer when an important message comes in or the captain needs to use the radio hail a ship.

Though this being Star Trek, all the important people were on the bridge anyways, so messages would only go there to begin with. The decorative meat-sacks that filled the rest of it could rarely even talk, let alone receive/send transmissions.

[Mando Knight]

Make the exhaust pipe kinked, so that a torpedo can't make it straight into the reactor? Have multiple smaller exhausts, or a grate that stops large objects but lets gas through? Place dedicated point defense/chaff systems on your station's one weakness? Just a thought.

The first two decrease the efficiency of the exhaust shaft, the grate less so. All of them have the issue that the Empire didn't foresee having to deal with gnats flitting about its nigh-invincible battle-station.

Trust me, worse engineering tradeoffs have been made IRL.

[GloatingSwine]

The engineer's job seemed to mainly consist of staring at the 'Reactor Power' dial set to 80%, then swearing over the communicator to Kirk that they were at 100% but he could give them 120%.

No, Scotty was cleverer than that. He changed the labels on the dial so that 80% said 100% but he could turn it up higher when he needed to.

[Fragenstein]

I dunno, it's a hard job beating Troi for useful work done. I mean "sit next to captain, occasionally state the obvious" was damn important.

Plus she had to listen to the crew whine at her about all their petty problems. Good point. At least Kirk ran a disciplined ship where people knew that life was hard and that's the way they liked it. Nothing that a good bar-fight couldn't cure.

[hamishspence]

Kirk still punishes Scotty for starting a bar fight though.

[Gnoman]

Plus she had to listen to the crew whine at her about all their petty problems. Good point. At least Kirk ran a disciplined ship where people knew that life was hard and that's the way they liked it. Nothing that a good bar-fight couldn't cure.

It makes a lot of sense to have a counselor on a ship? Why off earth they would consider making that a Bridge position is beyond me.

[Fragenstein]

Kirk still punishes Scotty for starting a bar fight though.

"Punished"?

Capt. Kirk: All right, Scotty. Dismissed. Oh... Scotty, you're restricted to quarters until further notice.

Scott: Yes, sir. Thank you, sir! That'll give me a chance to catch up on my technical journals!

It makes a lot of sense to have a counselor on a ship? Why off earth they would consider making that a Bridge position is beyond me.

Wasn't she supposed to offer insight into the psychology and mental state of people on the other side of that giant TV screen? I never really cared for her character anyway. Trade her to the Hutts for information on Solo's last known location.

[Flickerdart]

Probably the only starship job worse than being the lady who answers the phone. Dang, Kirk was lazy.

Reserve that judgment until you read the adventures of Chief O'Brien.

[Fragenstein]

Reserve that judgment until you read the adventures of Chief O'Brien.

heheh. Awesome. It occurs to me that O'Brien could have stolen anything he wanted from any planet they visited by beaming it into a pattern array. Then spit it back out into some designated bolthole that they passed by regularly. Retire to a fortune in jewels and fast ships.

Anyway, back to the showdown, I'm starting to think that the real advantage Worf would have is transporter tech, superior scanners, and cloaks. Never mind weapons, shields, and variable density armor plates. Solo could potentially be caught without a fight using only detective work and subtle scouting.

Find out where he's going to be. Get there first (the REAL challenge for the Defiant), track him, trace him, and transport him. It would more-or-less fall to Worf's ability to hunt criminals against Solo's natural paranoia and underworld ties. Chewie could be bypassed. Dogfights could be bypassed. Hyperspatial bypasses could be bypassed.

Deputize Odo and that's going to be a hard combination for Solo to avoid. Does Worf have the capability to be that devious?

[GloatingSwine]

Wasn't she supposed to offer insight into the psychology and mental state of people on the other side of that giant TV screen? I never really cared for her character anyway. Trade her to the Hutts for information on Solo's last known location.

Well yes, but her "insight" amounted to reporting that she "sensed aggression" from the person on the TV who was last seen attempting to bite his own nose off from sheer rage.

[hamishspence]

Wasn't that mostly only in the first season, with Troi's role expanding and insights proving more useful as time went by?

[Fragenstein]

Well yes, but her "insight" amounted to reporting that she "sensed aggression" from the person on the TV who was last seen attempting to bite his own nose off from sheer rage.

Worf: Captain. The adversary has just fired torpedoes.
Troi: Captain. I sense... hostility...
Worf: That's from me.

[lord_khaine]

Anyway, back to the showdown, I'm starting to think that the real advantage Worf would have is transporter tech, superior scanners, and cloaks. Never mind weapons, shields, and variable density armor plates. Solo could potentially be caught without a fight using only detective work and subtle scouting.

Find out where he's going to be. Get there first (the REAL challenge for the Defiant), track him, trace him, and transport him. It would more-or-less fall to Worf's ability to hunt criminals against Solo's natural paranoia and underworld ties. Chewie could be bypassed. Dogfights could be bypassed. Hyperspatial bypasses could be bypassed.

Again, considering how unpredictable Solo is this would mean a stakeout lasting several years, seeing as they need to wait somewhere for Solo to come back again.

By then Solo would have delivered several hundred cargoes, and won the contest hard.

[CarpeGuitarrem]

Okay, so here's my take.

The nature of Worf is to get beat up in order to make the antagonist look tough.
The nature of Han Solo is to look awesome.

Clearly, Han shoots first and beats up Worf to look tough and awesome.

[GloatingSwine]

Again, considering how unpredictable Solo is this would mean a stakeout lasting several years, seeing as they need to wait somewhere for Solo to come back again.

By then Solo would have saved the galaxy and shacked up with the princess

I think you'll find this version more accurate.

[Fragenstein]

The nature of Worf is to get beat up in order to make the antagonist look tough.
The nature of Han Solo is to look awesome.

No Worfing. Not even when it's Worf himself we're talking about. Otherwise we'll be forced to discuss how Solo blindly walked into Imperial death traps in all three movies.

Led the Death Star straight to a major rebel base, got most of the cast captured at Bespin and cost his friend a sweet Cloud City, got surrounded and shot on Endor and almost died.

Not so savvy, Solo.

[hamishspence]

He didn't get shot on Endor - Leia did though.

[Fragenstein]

He didn't get shot on Endor - Leia did though.

Dang my faulty memory. I could have swor'd it was him laying on the steps bleeding. She's still the one who started shooting from there, right?

Anyway. He walked into a trap on Endor and almost got the princess killed. That's not much better.

[Traab]

Dang my faulty memory. I could have swor'd it was him laying on the steps bleeding. She's still the one who started shooting from there, right?

Anyway. He walked into a trap on Endor and almost got the princess killed. That's not much better.

He also sucks under pressure. Remember when he tried to convince the rest of the death star full of clone troopers that the prison block he just shot up was fine? Yeah, he kinda stunk at thinking up a reasonable excuse to buy time. Best bet would be to gracefully agree they need a little help on cleanup then incapacitate the repair crew. Maybe claim they need a med crew due to a weapons misfire. That basically doubles the time available to escape before the entire station is aware there is a problem. Instead he freaked out which caused them to send a small army of guards to the prison block.

[hamishspence]

She's still the one who started shooting from there, right?

Yup. With the reversal of "I love you." "I know" first seen in TESB.

[Fragenstein]

He also sucks under pressure. Remember when he tried to convince the rest of the death star full of clone troopers that the prison block he just shot up was fine? Yeah, he kinda stunk at thinking up a reasonable excuse to buy time. Best bet would be to gracefully agree they need a little help on cleanup then incapacitate the repair crew. Maybe claim they need a med crew due to a weapons misfire. That basically doubles the time available to escape before the entire station is aware there is a problem. Instead he freaked out which caused them to send a small army of guards to the prison block.

Right. So we can't call out Worf on scripted inability, otherwise Han is going to start displaying some performance problems as well. We need to take both on a basis of competency.

Yup. With the reversal of "I love you." "I know" first seen in TESB.

The quotes I remembered. I just picture Han getting shot instead. Maybe because I wanted him to get shot so we could go back to the lightsabers.

[BWR]

Okay, new idea.

Pick whichever side you like better to win. They win.

If you don't like either better, assume M.A.D..

Isn't that what we've been doing all along?

[Bulldog Psion]

Isn't that what we've been doing all along?

Pretty much, though I think I'm the first one to suggest mutually assured destruction as a third option.

[Flickerdart]

Again, considering how unpredictable Solo is this would mean a stakeout lasting several years, seeing as they need to wait somewhere for Solo to come back again.

By then Solo would have delivered several hundred cargoes, and won the contest hard.

Is Solo all that unpredictable? The Hutts seemed to know where he was going to be, as did Vader and Palpatine (who are admittedly magic - though IIRC Vader doesn't really get premonitions in the way Sidious does).

[GloatingSwine]

Is Solo all that unpredictable? The Hutts seemed to know where he was going to be, as did Vader and Palpatine (who are admittedly magic - though IIRC Vader doesn't really get premonitions in the way Sidious does).

They didn't know where he was going to be, they could afford to pay to find out.

Solo was tracked down by a professional bounty hunter, rather than the Hutts or Empire directly.

[russdm]

Is Solo all that unpredictable?

Nope. He is surprisingly predictable as his actions mainly consist of 1) Shooting Greedo; 2) Running from everything; 3) Dumping water on Chewie; 4) Rarely, Han will fight back.

Han is also a smuggler and so Worf has Odo investigate because this is what Odo does.

Odo hitches a ride on the Falcon somehow and works to disable it. A day or two on board is enough time for Odo to figure out how disable the ship. He arranges with Worf to set a trap.

Option 2: Worf shows off replicators to people since it happens to be a major technical advancement that simply does not exist anywhere in SW. Both the Empire and Alliance want it, and Worf, being Worf, gives a few to the Alliance. Cue changes in the war. He helps them out, ignoring Han, who is a small fry compared to the Empire, and Worf puts Odo in charge of finding Han.

However long it takes, Odo finds him, given all of his skills. Odo being a shapeshifter the way he is means he can sneak in looking like a droid. That happens to be a great way to get around because nobody notices droids.

[Anteros]

All of these plans require an inordinate amount of time. Time in which Han will have spent shacking up with one of the most powerful people in known space and becoming best buds with the other. I'd say any plan that takes years to enact is a win for Solo unless you think Worf can take out a Jedi and the entirety of the new republic intent on protecting the person who is practically their ruler.

[Mando Knight]

Option 2: Worf shows off replicators to people since it happens to be a major technical advancement that simply does not exist anywhere in SW. Both the Empire and Alliance want it, and Worf, being Worf, gives a few to the Alliance. Cue changes in the war. He helps them out, ignoring Han, who is a small fry compared to the Empire, and Worf puts Odo in charge of finding Han.

At which point, Odo will drily remark that Worf wants him to arrest one of the heroes of the Rebellion he just helped.