Dreamscarred Press - Tzocatl, The First Language: Open Playtest

[stack]

I like advocate and knight-scholar better, but I'm already on record about the whole naming thing. I'd rather see the whole mayaincatec theme for a setting or adventure path than for a subsystem. I am all about refluffing, but names are a bigger conceptual barrier for some. The Akashic names I can get my head around, these not so much.

[JusticeZero]

Also going to agree with those who dislike the int on the Paladin for fluff mismatch reasons. As much as I'd like to see an Int Paladin, I don't see anything that sells it here. Changing to spoken instead of magic is big, and if that isn't enough, you can swap some other Paladin abilities to language based ones, or switch them from Lawful GOOD to LAWFUL Good, and maybe slap the whole fall garbage down. Maybe flip them to having a truth detection ability that is language dependent, and resistant to any effects with a spoken component.
As an aside, make sure that it translates well to antipaladin. Too many good align stuff makes it a bit hard to make villains.

[LordErebus12]

I wish there was an archetype that allows characters to scribe offensive words with this language on the battlefield from afar, acting similarly like landmines.
EDIT: Runechanter?

[Fax Celestis]

I wish there was an archetype that allows characters to scribe offensive words with this language on the battlefield from afar, acting similarly like landmines.
EDIT: Runechanter?

Actually making some paths for the Advocate currently. This might make it into one. I've got the one as-is now, one that binds the souls of outsiders (kind of like the demonbinder prestige class), and one that inscribes edicts and has Kabbalistic golem minions. This might slot into the latter nicely.

[Abithrios]

Actually making some paths for the Advocate currently. This might make it into one. I've got the one as-is now, one that binds the souls of outsiders (kind of like the demonbinder prestige class), and one that inscribes edicts and has Kabbalistic golem minions. This might slot into the latter nicely.

Those sound like cool ideas, but I sure hope you are not planning to make the outsider binding one always EEEVUUUL like the link provided. I am not sure if I could spend "damnation points" with a straight face. Also, "you sacrifice your immortal soul for the instant power of the Abyss" is already played out as a concept, especially considering making it overpowered in exchange for some fluff penalty after you die would be considered a bad thing.

[Ssalarn]

Those sound like cool ideas, but I sure hope you are not planning to make the outsider binding one always EEEVUUUL like the link provided. I am not sure if I could spend "damnation points" with a straight face. Also, "you sacrifice your immortal soul for the instant power of the Abyss" is already played out as a concept, especially considering making it overpowered in exchange for some fluff penalty after you die would be considered a bad thing.

I'd like to see more "Becoming a slave to the lawbound forces of heaven, you sell your soul for celestial might", and the chance to spend "redemption points"

[Fax Celestis]

Those sound like cool ideas, but I sure hope you are not planning to make the outsider binding one always EEEVUUUL like the link provided. I am not sure if I could spend "damnation points" with a straight face. Also, "you sacrifice your immortal soul for the instant power of the Abyss" is already played out as a concept, especially considering making it overpowered in exchange for some fluff penalty after you die would be considered a bad thing.

Well, here's a little bit of what I have planned:

Lecture of Sheltering (Sp): At first level, a concordat learns the lecture of sheltering as a bonus litany. She may use this litany even though she has no other litanies known and does not gain the litanies feature until fourth level.

This class feature replaces the advocate’s specialized lexicon class feature. A concordat never gains the specialized lexicon class feature.

Soulbinding (Su): Starting at second level, a concordat learns how to bind the souls of outsiders to their bodies by speaking an outsider’s true name, gaining some of their powers. Activating this ability requires a full-round action that provokes attacks of opportunity. As part of activating this ability, a concordat makes a special Tzocatl check and consults the below table:

Tzocatl Check Result	Soul Available
12 or less	Lemure
13	Lantern archon
14-15	Hell hound
16	Hound archon
17-18	Nightmare
19	Kyton
20-21	Succubus
22	Lillend
23-24	Vrock
25	Bebilith
26-27	Cauchemar
28	Barbed devil
29-30	Ghaele azata
31	Nalfeshnee demon
32-33	Astral deva
34	Planetar
35-36	Marilith
37	Balor
38-39	Pit fiend
40 or more	Solar

A concordat may select a lesser result if so desired.
When bound to a soul, the concordat gains several subtypes and abilities, per the below descriptions:

Astral Deva - placeholder for now, insert abilities
Balor
Barbed Devil
Bebilith
Cauchemar
Ghaele Azata
Hell Hound
Hound Archon
Kyton
Lantern Archon
Lemure
Lillend
Marilith
Nalfeshnee Demon
Nightmare
Pit Fiend
Planetar
Solar
Succubus
Vrock

This ability replaces the advocate’s esoterica class feature. A concordat never gains the esoterica class feature.

Lecture of Sheltering
Lexicon protection (litany) [see text]; Level apprentice (litany)
Casting Time 1 swift action
Range personal
Target you
Duration permanent until dispelled or until a new litany begins

While lecture of sheltering is active, you are treated as if under the effects of protection from evil, except the alignment it works against is any alignment more than two steps away from your own. For instance, if you are Lawful Good, lecture of sheltering only provides protection from evil’s benefits against Chaotic Evil, Chaotic Neutral, and Neutral Evil creatures, while if you are Chaotic Neutral, it only provides protection from Lawful Good and Lawful Evil creatures. This limitation is for all benefits of protection from evil, including the protection against mentally controlling effects protection from evil normally provides.

If you are True Neutral, lecture of sheltering instead provides these benefits against Lawful Good, Lawful Evil, Chaotic Good, and Chaotic Evil creatures.

This litany shares your alignment descriptors: if you are Lawful Good, for instance, it has both the lawful and good descriptors.

Esoterica: If you select this esoterica, lecture of sheltering also provides its protective benefits to any of your allies for as long as they remain within 10 ft. of you. Creatures that leave the area and come back are not protected.

[Abithrios]

Well, here's a little bit of what I have planned:

So far, so good.

Unrelated question, if a character gets Tzocatl Training from more than one class, do the levels stack or do they have different Tzocatl modifiers from the separate sources?

[Fax Celestis]

So far, so good.

Unrelated question, if a character gets Tzocatl Training from more than one class, do the levels stack or do they have different Tzocatl modifiers from the separate sources?

They stack. Most of them include "effective advocate level" casing, which should make that apparent, but probably not obvious. I'll be sure to slot that in.

[Milo v3]

I'm currently writing up a few Magic Schools for each Dreamscarred Press subsystem using Inner Sea Magic's school subsystem, but I'm unsure what to call the some of the school "types".

Anyone know a term that would be fitting for places of learning for Tzocatl?

[PsyBomb]

Been a while, but posting here for this is worth it.

I am opening up a MythWeavers Pathfinder game meant to be purely for playtesting. Anyone who wants to volunteer and play a Tsocatl user (especially an Advocate) can go ahead and sign up, the more the merrier. Anyone else who wants to keep tabs on it and to comment in the Spectator section is more than welcome to do so.

Game is at http://www.myth-weavers.com/forumdis...32485&tg=49954
Roll20 for the game will be at https://app.roll20.net/join/633729/luZnyg

[deuxhero]

Anyone know a term that would be fitting for places of learning for Tzocatl?

A (Roman) forum? Podium? Auditorium?

[Extra Anchovies]

Possibly an Odeon? They're more for singing, but whatever.

[Psyren]

Possibly an Odeon? They're more for singing, but whatever.

You could even get into one for 5 silvers! Get it? Get it? Please kill me.

[Extra Anchovies]

You could even get into one for 5 silvers! Get it? Get it? Please kill me.

Sorry, I'm missing the reference. Won't kill you until you explain, please

[Psyren]

Sorry, I'm missing the reference. Won't kill you until you explain, please

5 silvers = 5 cents = a nickel. Nickel + odeon...

*slinks away*

[Fallenreality]

5 silvers = 5 cents = a nickel. Nickel + odeon...

*slinks away*

I... I feel unclean after a pun like that.

[Milo v3]

5 silvers = 5 cents = a nickel. Nickel + odeon...

*slinks away*

Unfortunately, 1 gp = $20 according to d20 modern so 5 silvers would be $2. Twodollarodean? Sounds like a super cheap alien from MiB or something.

[Vhaidara]

Okay, I finally got around to reading through while making my advocate for PsyBomb's playtest. One thing I would request is a separation in the short list by Lexicon, which would make it much more easily searchable.

I'm going to try my hand at a blast-focus destruction advocate, with some creation backup.

[Vhaidara]

Question about the Esoterica for Recitation of Flame: Does it apply to the fire damage of RoF (making it 1d6+2xInt mod)?

EDIT: Also, I just realized how pointless it currently is, since it is the only source of fire damage I can see in Tzocatl aside from Dragonfire Litany...
Still might use it, just to have a default action that actually does a reasonable amount of damage.

[Fax Celestis]

Question about the Esoterica for Recitation of Flame: Does it apply to the fire damage of RoF (making it 1d6+2xInt mod)?

EDIT: Also, I just realized how pointless it currently is, since it is the only source of fire damage I can see in Tzocatl aside from Dragonfire Litany...
Still might use it, just to have a default action that actually does a reasonable amount of damage.

Yes, it does. The esoterica doesn't care about the source.

Just FYI: I'm not dead, still working on this. Got sick, parents took me and the kids to Disneyland for Christmas, holidays, regular job being, well, holiday season...you know, stuff. Teaser of things I'm going to add to the playtest soon: reasons to take Subvert Oath (AKA: "I manipulate your truename and now you have a monk vow or other oath for a duration. Oh, and the universe thinks you just violated your oath. Eat me.").

[Vhaidara]

Playtest has already raised a question:
War Cry provides an insight bonus. The name sounds more like something that would provide a morale bonus. Bug or Feature?

[Fax Celestis]

Playtest has already raised a question:
War Cry provides an insight bonus. The name sounds more like something that would provide a morale bonus. Bug or Feature?

Feature, otherwise it would play havoc with stuff like the Imperious Bloodline's Heroic Echo.

[Yue Ryong]

...I'm not sure how to feel about this. On one level, I love Truenaming (both as a roll-led mechanic & fluff-wise)... on the other I get all twitchy about any language magic that doesn't have at least some level of offensive naming. When I want to wizard (which is admittedly relatively rare), I want to Sparrowhawk it up.

[Zaq]

I'm glad that you took a lot of my suggestions into consideration, but I have to pipe up about Soliloquy of Hatred and Soliloquy of Risk. They have the old Truespeak DC problem: the Tzocatl DC goes up by 1 per level (10 + target's HD), but your Tzocatl mod only goes up by 1 per 2 levels. It gets harder and harder to succeed as you go up in level, and unlike with Truenaming, you can't just scrounge around for weird exotic bonuses to keep pace. (There's no Paratzocatl Assembly, after all.) You definitely need to do something to address that, whether it's fixing the DC, removing the Tzocatl check, or just scrapping those two litanies, because they just won't work as intended.

[Fax Celestis]

I'm glad that you took a lot of my suggestions into consideration, but I have to pipe up about Soliloquy of Hatred and Soliloquy of Risk. They have the old Truespeak DC problem: the Tzocatl DC goes up by 1 per level (10 + target's HD), but your Tzocatl mod only goes up by 1 per 2 levels. It gets harder and harder to succeed as you go up in level, and unlike with Truenaming, you can't just scrounge around for weird exotic bonuses to keep pace. (There's no Paratzocatl Assembly, after all.) You definitely need to do something to address that, whether it's fixing the DC, removing the Tzocatl check, or just scrapping those two litanies, because they just won't work as intended.

Yeah, I'm going to fix those. I just am not sure how I want to make those work. I don't want it to be an always-on effect, and I don't want it to be zomg-extra-rolls against a ridiculous DC.

[georgie_leech]

Yeah, I'm going to fix those. I just am not sure how I want to make those work. I don't want it to be an always-on effect, and I don't want it to be zomg-extra-rolls against a ridiculous DC.

It works for making the check itself; why not have it go up by 1/2 HD?

[Kaidinah]

Hi. New to this thread.

I was wondering if the Advocator, Knight Scholar, archetypes and future classes also have their names translated into the same language the edicts, words of power and such are.

[Axebird]

Is this project still alive? I haven't heard anything new for a long time.

[Doomeye56]

Not dead, just in a state of hibernation while Fax Celestis works things out.