Crusader Kings II Thread IV: Time to Create a New Title

[Rockphed]

More New Player first observation of funny combinations of traits:
Fortune builder, charitable, cruel, slothful, ambitious, has the Great Pox, is a lunatic, and wants to marry a ruler. Story checks out.

She doesn't know how to not spend money. She doesn't like to work, but wants to be something. She is crazy and casually insults people. On top of all that, she has managed to get a venereal disease. And she thinks some ruler is going to touch her with a ten foot pole.

Yeah, I think I've heard reports of that woman too.

[adamlevine]

oh...haha...thanks

[Thufir]

The annoying thing was when I had dynasts of different cultures inherit and I had to rebuild my cultural buildings. I hope they make cultural buildings take longer to evaporate in the next patch.

I had a panic a few characters back until I checked and found that Swedish culture still gets Housecarls same as Norse.
I feel like it might work better if the possible cultural buildings were based on the culture of the province rather than the culture of the ruler. At least it'd avoid issues like this.

[Flickerdart]

Really? Because in my current "exploit the satanic devotion mechanic to vassalise the world" game, I "convinced" the King of France to swear fealty to my Emperor of Brittania/Scandinavia, and I'm pretty sure that's outside of the de jure empire. Unless there's a restriction on players swearing fealty to AIs but not vice-versa?

An Emperor may demand fealty of a king (and contend with the -200 "I AM A KING!" penalty) but the king may not offer it.

[mythmonster2]

An Emperor may demand fealty of a king (and contend with the -200 "I AM A KING!" penalty) but the king may not offer it.

Are you sure about that? Me and my friends once did a game where we played as France, England, and Poland and all swore fealty to the HRE. Or did you mean the other way around?

[Rockphed]

Are you sure about that? Me and my friends once did a game where we played as France, England, and Poland and all swore fealty to the HRE. Or did you mean the other way around?

Kings can swear fealty to Emperors if they are either de jure vassals or border the empire. Every time I have tried to ask a king to become my vassal it always says "no, I AM KING!" with no other modifiers. If you want to vassalise a kingdom, you have to do it with a claim war.

[BannedInSchool]

More New Player Firsts and Confusions:

So the Kaiser wants to marry my grand-daughter. How do you say no to that? But nearly that same day I die, so as soon as I agree to the marriage I get the "You have a new heir. If you die you will play as Kaiserina <blahblah>" message. I had been more concerned about all the sons my hedonjst in love with his wife were having than if my first son had had a son yet, so I was REAL confused for several seconds there.

[Wardog]

If you win, just execute him (unless he has good stats). That kind of stupidity needs to be punished.

I'm a merchant republic, and that son was the only one that had a chance of being elected doge.

Jokes on him though - after beating him, I lived on into my 80s, by which time I had enough money and my second (better) son had enough prestige to be a viable candidate.


Question: do characters from certain origins thrive better in certain climates?

I'm playing as Ghana, and married several of my daughters to verious central-European nobles, only to have them die of illness shortly after.


Anyway, some amusing events:
One of my daugters has (so far) survived being married to a Croatian noble, who asked me help him in a war to become king of Croatia. So I sent my army (a 4k stack, mostly mercenaries and the West African holy order) over there to pillage any targets of opportunity assist my brother-in-law in his righteous quest for the throne. Croatia was, at the time, a mess of scrappy borders and various occupation colours (there was a peasant's revolt going on as well), which made me misjudge what actually belonged to who, and I ended up landing my troops on and besieging a Byzantine territory. Just as I was about to complete the siege, an 11k Byzantine stack appeared next to me, and I didn't notice it until it was almost on top of me. They attacked, I ordered a retreat to the boats, hoping at least somone would get away. Not only did almost my whole army escape - but in the fighting, I killed the Byzantine Emperor.

Then I landed further north, won the war for by brother-in-law (but upset him by not stopping looting quickly enough), and headed home. (Stopping on the way to sack Rome).

I also managed to fight off two simultaneous holy wars (by the Umayids and a minor Sunni power) and a subjegation war by the Abbasids (that was declared just as I beat the other two).

Question 2: has an update altered the AI warfighting tactics? In earlier games, the AI would rarely attack me if the odds weren't in ther favour. But having recently bought Charlemange and Horse Lords, I can put a 4k stack on a hill, and the AI keeps throwing <1k stacks at them.

I then declared a conquest war on the Umayids for one of their North African counties, and so badly trashed their armies (due to the aforementioned AI tactics and post-victory pillaging) that a Catholic Uprising occured, which I proceded to assist by wiping out any armies sent to oppose it. (They won, and established a big Catholic state in central Spain, but then got trashed by a peasant uprising that had also broken out, and then got re-conquored in a holy war by the Umayids).

[Rockphed]

I'm a merchant republic, and that son was the only one that had a chance of being elected doge.

Jokes on him though - after beating him, I lived on into my 80s, by which time I had enough money and my second (better) son had enough prestige to be a viable candidate.

Wait, you had a landed son who was your heir for the Doge-ship? That never seems to work for me.

I'm playing as Ghana, and married several of my daughters to verious central-European nobles, only to have them die of illness shortly after.


Anyway, some amusing events:
One of my daugters has (so far) survived being married to a Croatian noble, who asked me help him in a war to become king of Croatia. So I sent my army (a 4k stack, mostly mercenaries and the West African holy order) over there to pillage any targets of opportunity assist my brother-in-law in his righteous quest for the throne. Croatia was, at the time, a mess of scrappy borders and various occupation colours (there was a peasant's revolt going on as well), which made me misjudge what actually belonged to who, and I ended up landing my troops on and besieging a Byzantine territory. Just as I was about to complete the siege, an 11k Byzantine stack appeared next to me, and I didn't notice it until it was almost on top of me. They attacked, I ordered a retreat to the boats, hoping at least somone would get away. Not only did almost my whole army escape - but in the fighting, I killed the Byzantine Emperor.

I laugh at the misfortune of the Byzantine Emperor. Ha ha!

Question 2: has an update altered the AI warfighting tactics? In earlier games, the AI would rarely attack me if the odds weren't in ther favour. But having recently bought Charlemange and Horse Lords, I can put a 4k stack on a hill, and the AI keeps throwing <1k stacks at them.

I then declared a conquest war on the Umayids for one of their North African counties, and so badly trashed their armies (due to the aforementioned AI tactics and post-victory pillaging) that a Catholic Uprising occured, which I proceded to assist by wiping out any armies sent to oppose it. (They won, and established a big Catholic state in central Spain, but then got trashed by a peasant uprising that had also broken out, and then got re-conquored in a holy war by the Umayids).

I think the AI might over-estimate how troop quality interacts with troop quantity. An 8k stack of heavy infantry or pikes can take down a 10k stack of light infantry. A 1k stack of heavy infantry will be annihilated by a 4k stack of just about anything.

[Grytorm]

Well things are going well, mostly. Got ahold of Scotland and started trying to sculpt things to my will. Things arent going so great. The initial conquest went well and then I started trying to usurp titles. Got two counties under my control, and was in a war to take a duchy. Then my character died, and the duke died so I cant restart the war. Real shame because it almost worked and I really wanted to break up that massive duchy. Seven counties. Was going to give it to a merchant republic in the traditional Scottish capitol.

Of the two counties I had, one I gave to the only loyal duchess to shrink my demense. The second one, the Isle of Man was given to a brother to get rid of the Ducal title.

Also somewhat worrying, one of my dukes is heir to the Byzabtine Empire... but that wont last long. I hope. His father is thankfully losing against a revolt.

Also, I got two additional holding slots in my capitol, yay. Not going to build them for a little while. Or maybe soon? Not certain what to build though.

[Malimar]

Also, I got two additional holding slots in my capitol, yay. Not going to build them for a little while. Or maybe soon? Not certain what to build though.

I pretty much build exclusively cities, especially in coastal provinces where the additional money-making port building is an option. Money is more important than levies. All cities need is a little investment in the walls/markets/ports, and then they start making enough money that the mayors eventually take off and start investing in everything else themselves.

[Artanis]

Also, I got two additional holding slots in my capitol, yay. Not going to build them for a little while. Or maybe soon? Not certain what to build though.

When it comes to your capital, I'll have to disagree with Malimar and suggest Castles. Cities might be better elsewhere, but anything you put in your capital is probably going to be boosted by your Marshal and Steward.

I'd wait until you get your demesne sorted out and your Castle Town buildings up and running before building more holdings.

[TheStranger]

When it comes to your capital, I'll have to disagree with Malimar and suggest Castles. Cities might be better elsewhere, but anything you put in your capital is probably going to be boosted by your Marshal and Steward.

I'd wait until you get your demesne sorted out and your Castle Town buildings up and running before building more holdings.

I think it depends where you are with your demesne limit - vassal Cities pay high taxes, but you need to hold the Castles yourself to get the benefits. Usually I like to have as many counties as possible and only hold one Castle in each myself, so I can have more vassal Cities to pay taxes. Every once in a while, I'll decide to keep my demesne in a single duchy and I'll stack Castles. But mostly I think it's better to have Cities, because eventually you'll end up with a low-Stewardship ruler and have to give the Castles away, which defeats the point. You can always conquer new counties for your demesne when your limit is back up, but it's harder to get those Castles back once you've given them away.

But it's a small enough difference that it's mostly a matter of preferred playstyle, IMO.

[Grytorm]

I was thinking of going a castle and a city. Currently I have four county titles and two baronies.

[Leecros]

If I start out in a province with six subholdings or near enough to one to capture it and it doesn't have most of the subholdings filled out with garbage(I'm looking at you Rome and your tendency to build churches). Then i'll build my demense tall, build lots of castles and laugh maniacally atop my throne of gold coins.

The bonus from having your steward collecting taxes in a province influences all of the subholdings in that location and it's generally better to get 100% of the wealth from your own castle on top of the full levies rather than a partial tithe from your burghers and a partial levy(unless your laws are weird). There's also the added benefit of stacking your marshal bonus for training troops on top of that. Even if you can manage to squeak out enough money from your burghers owning your demense cities. The troops you get from them are rather lackluster.

However, my tactic changes completely when I can't grab a six subholding province early. I spread out and keep only the top holding of the provinces and try to hold as much land as possible. It's a good way to become fairly powerful while reducing your uppity vassals down a bit(especially in the Early Game). Barons, Mayors, and Priests don't rebel.

Frankly, I've had success with either tactic. Granted i'm not and never will be one to build churches or cities. Cities are too specialized and Churches are useless.

[Thufir]

Thus far I haven't been particularly strategic aout building extra holdings, I just went through a period of building a new castle every time I had an unlanded son and nothing else to give him. My inclination would be to improve the holdings you already have and try to expand your territory as a higher priority than building additional holdings.

[Grytorm]

Good to keep in mind. Two important things have happened, I have been able to set up marriage alliances so eventually if nothing goes pear shaped my grandchild will eventually inherit the kingdoms of Denmark and more importantly England allowing me create Brittania. And control Denmark. And maybe eventually push a relatives claim on Sweden and establish a vassal King.

And the other significant thing I have done is convert to Orthodoxy. It was somewhat arbitrary decision, but it means I will no longer need to worry about competing with the Pope for money. The Duchy of Ulster has been a long standing Orthodox enclave and I was able to get one other Duke to convert right away along with my son's family. I think it will give the faith a much needed shot in the arm, Byzantium has fallen to the Mongold and Catholicism has spread into North Africa so its not like the Pope needs my money.

[BannedInSchool]

Okay, I guess I have to make my Ambitious wife spymaster or she'll keep trying to murder mine.

[BannedInSchool]

Another Installment in New Player Woes and Confusion:

After my almost-an-empire fractured into six kingdoms on succession I don't even know what's going on anymore. When I was building it there wasn't much independent action below the kingdom level that I really noticed, but now it's all over the place. I ended up with counties in another kingdom still part of that realm, and now there's a duke in a war against a count for trying to revoke the duchy when the count was a king because the duchy contains none of its de-jure counties.

[Grytorm]

Well the danes are primitive and follow gavelkind so England went to my brother, who is stupid and loved by his subjects. I also had a question about demense size but I figured things out. It shrank because Ireland is Primogeniture. Only thing to do is not get married and wait to die.

In other news mongols are huge, as in ate both byzantines and HRE. Well, I wont do anything else in the war I joined against them.

[Eldan]

I think I have a bug. The pope is continually excommunicating me for no reason I can discern. I'm not any kind of heretic, I've been a good crusader, I've donated money, I bought indulgence for my sins... and yet, every time I buy off my excommunication, he immediately excommunicates me again. More evidence for why I think it's a bug: it's been happening with three generations of my royal family and three popes, now.

[tonberrian]

I think someone might have it out for your family. Paying off the pope to Excommunicate you whenever they can.

Or it's a bug. But I like the other one better.

[tyckspoon]

I think I have a bug. The pope is continually excommunicating me for no reason I can discern. I'm not any kind of heretic, I've been a good crusader, I've donated money, I bought indulgence for my sins... and yet, every time I buy off my excommunication, he immediately excommunicates me again. More evidence for why I think it's a bug: it's been happening with three generations of my royal family and three popes, now.

This is the game telling you it's time to raise an Antipope.

[Maryring]

Or convert to the Cathar heresy.

[Eldan]

I suppose. I like Crusading, though.

Edit: the Mighty Suomi Empire (Kingdoms of Suomi, Lappi, Rus and Volga Bulgaria) has fallen to the Mongols.

[Rockphed]

I suppose. I like Crusading, though.

Edit: the Mighty Suomi Empire (Kingdoms of Suomi, Lappi, Rus and Volga Bulgaria) has fallen to the Mongols.

Then convert to fraticelli. They get a pope who can call crusades.

[Malimar]

Then convert to fraticelli. They get a pope who can call crusades.

Or, being an emperor, make an antipope and install him as real pope. I don't think the pope can excommunicate you if he's your vassal.

[BannedInSchool]

New Player Still Having Fun With Trait Combinations:

The Erudite, Mastermind Theologian Scholar, who's also Gluttonous, Lustful, and Possessed. Well, you can't have it all and that 19 Learning is pretty good. Say hello to your new Court Chaplain. Just stay out of arms reach and don't be alone with him.

[Flickerdart]

I think I have a bug. The pope is continually excommunicating me for no reason I can discern. I'm not any kind of heretic, I've been a good crusader, I've donated money, I bought indulgence for my sins... and yet, every time I buy off my excommunication, he immediately excommunicates me again. More evidence for why I think it's a bug: it's been happening with three generations of my royal family and three popes, now.

"Wow, I can't believe that worked. Let's shake him down for cash again." --The Pope, probably

[Eldan]

Right. Next time I have an emperor who by his traits is a bit more morally flexible, I'll tell the pope where to stick it.