The incubation period of Sphinx Pox

[The MunchKING]

Is there any reason to think such combinations aren't possible?

In AD&D at least Elf-Dwarf kids were sterile. I don't know about other combos.

[Riftwolf]

I'm thinking this plot point might be indicative of how Hel got a bad deal. That the other Gods let her create a bunch of diseases, but didnt tell her they'd be using 3.5 rules, where non-magic diseases are too weak to be a major threat.

[Kish]

Cure Disease was a third-level spell in 1ed and 2ed, too.

[Grey_Wolf_c]

Cure Disease was a third-level spell in 1ed and 2ed, too.

Also, world 2.0 was created as a 1ed ruleset, since Haley's dad was a 1ed thief.

GW

[hamishspence]

Given that Xykon is a Sorcerer (spontaneous caster, introduced in 3.0) and was one before Haley's dad was born, I wouldn't take the "1st edition thief" thing too seriously.

[Grey_Wolf_c]

Given that Xykon is a Sorcerer (spontaneous caster, introduced in 3.0) and was one before Haley's dad was born, I wouldn't take the "1st edition thief" thing too seriously.

My headcanon is that the change was retroactive: once the edition changed, it changed backwards into the past as well, so by the time we learn of Xykon's backstory, it has been updated as well.

ETA: Remember, it's not just a throwaway reference by Haley, it's also the pit of never-updated monsters that constitutes the first major arc of the comic. At some point, 2ed was a thing, and there are remnants in the current OotS world of it.

GW

[Riftwolf]

Cure Disease was a third-level spell in 1ed and 2ed, too.

Even without magic, looking at the diseases (from pf, as i don't have the phb anymore) most have a decent chance of recovery, even for a 1st level commoner.

[Goblin_Priest]

I think it's worth noting that Remove Disease doesn't always work, and that a mythological pyramid creature also happens to have a supernatural disease that is particularly hard to remove.

Remove Disease could theoretically be cast by Belkar. If he has 9 wis (I don't know what he has), Owl's Wisdom would allow him to cast it. We've seen V cast it on him to allow spellcasting in the past (once). Given that diseases work very slowly in general, hired casting would also likely be an option, it's only a level 3 spell. I really doubt any disease worth showing at this point would be such a pushover as to require a simple casting of Remove Disease to treat.

[Goblin_Priest]

Even without magic, looking at the diseases (from pf, as i don't have the phb anymore) most have a decent chance of recovery, even for a 1st level commoner.

Oh and there are many SRDs for 3.5. Best to use them, as things change. Remove Disease, for example, requires a check in PF, which it does not in 3.5.

[Valynie]

Actually a 5 week incubation disease is really scary depending of the ease of propagation
Let us assume it airborne since everyone on the Mechane is infected
During the incubation period , everyone the cat met and then everyone who met an infected person and then everyone who met who met an infected person etc could be infected

So by day 28 only the cat has to be cured , by day 29 10 people have to be cured , by day 30 , 100 people have to be cured ( depending on the traveling done by the people infected , this number varies.
At this point , everyone in the Godsmeet and everyone on the gnome town is infected. I assume after the godsmeet , every cleric has gone back to his town

This is a plague wich will kill many people ...

[Goblin_Priest]

Actually a 5 week incubation disease is really scary depending of the ease of propagation
Let us assume it airborne since everyone on the Mechane is infected
During the incubation period , everyone the cat met and then everyone who met an infected person and then everyone who met who met an infected person etc could be infected

So by day 28 only the cat has to be cured , by day 29 10 people have to be cured , by day 30 , 100 people have to be cured ( depending on the traveling done by the people infected , this number varies.
At this point , everyone in the Godsmeet and everyone on the gnome town is infected. I assume after the godsmeet , every cleric has gone back to his town

This is a plague wich will kill many people ...

Are diseases even contagious in D&D? I don't think they are. And even if they were, I don't think they are during the incubation period.

[goto124]

Are diseases even contagious in D&D? I don't think they are. And even if they were, I don't think they are during the incubation period.

"Thanks to my unholy power, every man and woman on that ship is now infected."

Also, whether a disease is contagious during the incubation period depends on the virus.

[Snails]

Are diseases even contagious in D&D? I don't think they are. And even if they were, I don't think they are during the incubation period.

The DMG is clear as mud. It presumes that the source of the disease is obvious, such as explicitly listed on some monster stat block.

As the rules are written, generally speaking, no, your PC cannot get a disease from an infected PC. I suppose a specific disease listing could say otherwise.

I would also say your point about incubation period makes sense.

Methinks Hel does not know what the hell she is talking about with respect to diseases. Like it or not, the OotSverse runs on metaphysics that bears striking semblance to a game, and it does not work in a game to handwave that everyone is infected by some asymptomatic character and it is time for everyone to make rolls to see how quickly they die now.

[Riftwolf]

Oh and there are many SRDs for 3.5. Best to use them, as things change. Remove Disease, for example, requires a check in PF, which it does not in 3.5.

My problem with online srds as opposed to tree-flesh ones is the online ones keep diverting me to ad sites that i can't close down.

[Emanick]

Methinks Hel does not know what the hell she is talking about with respect to diseases. Like it or not, the OotSverse runs on metaphysics that bears striking semblance to a game, and it does not work in a game to handwave that everyone is infected by some asymptomatic character and it is time for everyone to make rolls to see how quickly they die now.

Hel is the goddess of disease. Methinks she probably understands at least the basics of how disease works in the OOTSverse.

[goto124]

My problem with online srds as opposed to tree-flesh ones is the online ones keep diverting me to ad sites that i can't close down.

d20srd.org diverts you to ad sites?

[georgie_leech]

d20srd.org diverts you to ad sites?

If so, get your computer checked out, because that sounds like adware.

[goto124]

I wanted to say virus, considering what we're talking about.

Back on topic, OotSverse diseases do seem a tad more realistic than DnD diseases.

[TheNecrocomicon]

To some extent, I can't help but wonder if the Sphinx Pox was nothing but a throwaway joke instead of the actual eventual cause of Belkar's death.

The actual death or serious close call of a party member has so far been marked by dramatic causes -- Roy was blasted from a flying dragon; Vaarsuvius was nearly taken out by Xykon himself; even Durkon was killed in solo combat with a full-fledged vampire.

There is no way a disease that we've only just heard of midway through this very book is going to be the direct doom of a major character who has been with the series since strip #1, whose end has been prophesied for years and several hundred strips in real time. Sure, it could very well be a contributing cause. But this is not enough on its own to fit the general trend of how OotS has been written.

If the Sphinx Pox is what does Belkar in on its own, well, then I'll just have to live with it. But I cannot help thinking there is still a LOT more to the true form of the puzzle that we don't yet understand or know about.

[martianmister]

It can't be the cause of Belkar's death, he'll be dead before the incubation period is over. But it's a good way to solve the question of "what will happen to the kitty after Belkar's demise?".

[Flame of Anor]

FitzChivalry Farseer, one of my favorite Fantasy/Swords and Sorcery protagonists ever, died of

Spoiler: Last Fool's Assassin Book (Robn Hobb) Spoiler

Show

a disease that makes you bleed out of your eyes that had been foreshadowed two books previously

Er...did you just spoil the really important bit out in the open, while only putting a relatively minor detail inside the spoiler tag?

[Emanick]

It can't be the cause of Belkar's death, he'll be dead before the incubation period is over.

Do we know that? They got to the desert a couple of days after Roy said Belkar had seven weeks left. I rather assume Mr. Scruffy will bite it before - or more likely, around when - Belkar dies, due to the extra narrative heft that would hold. I don't think any character besides Belkar would react strongly to Mr. Scruffy dying, so I don't see the narrative point in him expiring after the Belkster does.

[Kish]

If Sphinx Pox actually kills Mr. Scruffy ever, that will be more than I expect from a joke on Hel.

[Goblin_Priest]

"Thanks to my unholy power, every man and woman on that ship is now infected."

Also, whether a disease is contagious during the incubation period depends on the virus.

Honestly I have a hard time following Hel on the issue. "Thanks to her", and yet, she then says she can't intervene. So... did she, or did she not play a role in them getting a disease?

But I guess it does pretty much make it clear that the disease is infectious during the incubation period. Assuming we can take trust those words.

The DMG is clear as mud. It presumes that the source of the disease is obvious, such as explicitly listed on some monster stat block.

As the rules are written, generally speaking, no, your PC cannot get a disease from an infected PC. I suppose a specific disease listing could say otherwise.

I would also say your point about incubation period makes sense.

Methinks Hel does not know what the hell she is talking about with respect to diseases. Like it or not, the OotSverse runs on metaphysics that bears striking semblance to a game, and it does not work in a game to handwave that everyone is infected by some asymptomatic character and it is time for everyone to make rolls to see how quickly they die now.

Hard to know what to make of Hel's knowledge/power over diseases. On top of the point stated above, one would assume that a god of disease would not need to be reminded of its incubation period...

I guess this specific disease would be statted as transmissable, if her statement of every crew member being infected is accurate.

My problem with online srds as opposed to tree-flesh ones is the online ones keep diverting me to ad sites that i can't close down.

Adblock? In any case, book or SRD, if you look at PF rules, you are likely to come up with wrong conclusions for many things. PF and 3.5 are very similar, but also have many important differences.

Hel is the goddess of disease. Methinks she probably understands at least the basics of how disease works in the OOTSverse.

Does she? See two points above.

To some extent, I can't help but wonder if the Sphinx Pox was nothing but a throwaway joke instead of the actual eventual cause of Belkar's death.

The actual death or serious close call of a party member has so far been marked by dramatic causes -- Roy was blasted from a flying dragon; Vaarsuvius was nearly taken out by Xykon himself; even Durkon was killed in solo combat with a full-fledged vampire.

There is no way a disease that we've only just heard of midway through this very book is going to be the direct doom of a major character who has been with the series since strip #1, whose end has been prophesied for years and several hundred strips in real time. Sure, it could very well be a contributing cause. But this is not enough on its own to fit the general trend of how OotS has been written.

If the Sphinx Pox is what does Belkar in on its own, well, then I'll just have to live with it. But I cannot help thinking there is still a LOT more to the true form of the puzzle that we don't yet understand or know about.

Same, I also have a hard time grasping the extent of Sphinx Pox's importance, given how casually it was thrown on scree, and then how casually it got cast off. And then completely ignored for the following strips. Plus the inconsistencies noted above.

[wumpus]

The DMG is clear as mud. It presumes that the source of the disease is obvious, such as explicitly listed on some monster stat block.

As the rules are written, generally speaking, no, your PC cannot get a disease from an infected PC. I suppose a specific disease listing could say otherwise.

I would also say your point about incubation period makes sense.

Methinks Hel does not know what the hell she is talking about with respect to diseases. Like it or not, the OotSverse runs on metaphysics that bears striking semblance to a game, and it does not work in a game to handwave that everyone is infected by some asymptomatic character and it is time for everyone to make rolls to see how quickly they die now.

Contagion under the SRD doesn't say (and I thought it used to).

Under disease:
"When a character is injured by a contaminated attack, touches an item smeared with diseased matter, or consumes disease-tainted food or drink, he must make an immediate Fortitude saving throw. If he succeeds, the disease has no effect—his immune system fought off the infection. If he fails, he takes damage after an incubation period. Once per day afterward, he must make a successful Fortitude saving throw to avoid repeated damage. Two successful saving throws in a row indicate that he has fought off the disease and recovers, taking no more damage."

IMPORTANT: The source for "disease contaminated" is left unspecified. Methinks this is intentional to allow a DM to flavor the setting with anything from modern germ theory to "a witch touched it". Note that even in the late 19th century, germ theory was fighting an uphill battle.

Under Lycanthropy:
"Lycanthropy can be spread like a disease. Sometimes a lycanthrope begins life as a normal humanoid or giant who subsequently contracts lycanthropy after being wounded by a lycanthrope. Such a creature is called an afflicted lycanthrope. Other lycanthropes are born as lycanthropes, and are known as natural lycanthropes."

This can be used to imply that the setting "should" obey the laws of germ theory. As an old-school grognard, I'd insist that "like a disease" means "like a disease" in our world. Note that it doesn't say "as a disease" meaning that diseases are expected to spread this way. But obviously lycanthopes are disease vectors for lycanthropy.

[Lord Torath]

I'm guessing the disease was already made by then. Modifying it after the fact, to suit her specific needs, would be considered an illegal intervention.

"Thanks to my unholy power, every man and woman on that ship is now infected."

Also, whether a disease is contagious during the incubation period depends on the virus.

Honestly I have a hard time following Hel on the issue. "Thanks to her", and yet, she then says she can't intervene. So... did she, or did she not play a role in them getting a disease?

But I guess it does pretty much make it clear that the disease is infectious during the incubation period. Assuming we can take trust those words.

Hel might or might not be able to directly intervene on the Prime Material Plane without "inviting" another deity to intervene as well. But she doesn't have to. She has an agent on the Mechane (or did at the time the Mechane left the desert) who would be capable of casting Cause Disease or Make Disease More Infectious or Encourage Mr. Scruffy's Fleas to Bite Everyone on Board or what ever spell would be needed to infect everyone. Greg had easy access to the entire ship, and a goddess willing to grant any spell he needed. Heck he could even have Spread Disease as a granted power or something.

[Kish]

Hel can arrange for a disease to spread any way that respects the disease's normal vectors, even if that particular transmission is very unlikely. She can't just smite people with a disease they haven't been exposed to. Same way Thor can send a storm after the Mechane and have its strikes bypass the lightning rod, but he can't override control weather, or make lightning strike someone underground.

[Goblin_Priest]

Hel might or might not be able to directly intervene on the Prime Material Plane without "inviting" another deity to intervene as well. But she doesn't have to. She has an agent on the Mechane (or did at the time the Mechane left the desert) who would be capable of casting Cause Disease or Make Disease More Infectious or Encourage Mr. Scruffy's Fleas to Bite Everyone on Board or what ever spell would be needed to infect everyone. Greg had easy access to the entire ship, and a goddess willing to grant any spell he needed. Heck he could even have Spread Disease as a granted power or something.

We haven't seen them do any of that, though. The lack of foreshadowing would make it unsettling if this did, in fact, occur.

Hel can arrange for a disease to spread any way that respects the disease's normal vectors, even if that particular transmission is very unlikely. She can't just smite people with a disease they haven't been exposed to. Same way Thor can send a storm after the Mechane and have its strikes bypass the lightning rod, but he can't override control weather, or make lightning strike someone underground.

I have a hard time of thinking of what exactly this could be manifested as. Diseases already spread in every context they can. What more could it do without breaking its normal limitations?

[georgie_leech]

We haven't seen them do any of that, though. The lack of foreshadowing would make it unsettling if this did, in fact, occur.



I have a hard time of thinking of what exactly this could be manifested as. Diseases already spread in every context they can. What more could it do without breaking its normal limitations?

Think of it as being able to redirect a boat to Madagascar in that Pandemic game

[goto124]

Turns out Hel has been playing a gane if Pandemic all these while!