OOTS #1124 - The Discussion Thread

[Mister_Vimes]

WOW. You got me thinking. In the scene with his mother, Durkon wears the same robes he's seem with when he's tossed out of dwarven lands. Could it be that all of that happened in sequence, and Durkon had a fight (verbal, not physical) with his mother and than was sent away without the chance to reconcile?

Hey that's a nice catch! I was thinking we were about to see a big blowup revelatory argument, but if that happened right before he got tossed out, that's even better.

[Keltest]

WOW. You got me thinking. In the scene with his mother, Durkon wears the same robes he's seem with when he's tossed out of dwarven lands. Could it be that all of that happened in sequence, and Durkon had a fight (verbal, not physical) with his mother and than was sent away without the chance to reconcile?

Given that that's basically his work uniform, that strikes me as unlikely. All the clerics of Thor seem to wear those robes when not in their battle gear. Other clerics wear similar robes too when at their temples.

[Resileaf]

Hey that's a nice catch! I was thinking we were about to see a big blowup revelatory argument, but if that happened right before he got tossed out, that's even better.

To be fair, as a cleric, Durkon would be expected to wear the same clothes whenever he's on the job, so that's not super surprising he'd be dressed the same.
Dramatically though, it would be quite the reveal that Durkon has a fight with his mother and is kicked out of dwarven lands immediately after. I can scarcely imagine the guilt Sigdi would be feeling, thinking that her son might have run away because of it. She'd never believe the 'mission in human lands' excuse.

[MartianInvader]

WOW. You got me thinking. In the scene with his mother, Durkon wears the same robes he's seem with when he's tossed out of dwarven lands. Could it be that all of that happened in sequence, and Durkon had a fight (verbal, not physical) with his mother and than was sent away without the chance to reconcile?

This is definitely my favorite theory about the memory so far. It would wrap up Durkon's backstory nicely and be a darned fine bit of storytelling.

But I'm still at a loss as to why Durkon would want to show this memory to the vampire.

[Ionathus]

Nobody said it was free... It might as well be paid (literally) in blood.

WOW. You got me thinking. In the scene with his mother, Durkon wears the same robes he's seem with when he's tossed out of dwarven lands. Could it be that all of that happened in sequence, and Durkon had a fight (verbal, not physical) with his mother and than was sent away without the chance to reconcile?

These are explicitly two different scenes. In the prequel book "Origin of PCs," we're shown the entire scene of Durkon being exiled from dwarven lands. It happens essentially as the brewmaster told it, and was directly linked to the prophecy from Odin.

This scene where he's talking to his mother is, unambiguously, a different one.

[factotum]

This scene where he's talking to his mother is, unambiguously, a different one.

The scene with his mother could happen the night before the day he gets kicked out, though, and still be an unambigiously different scene. I think it unlikely myself, because kicking a neophyte cleric out into the cold less than a week after he started work seems unduly harsh even for this situation...not to mention that Durkon seemed very familiar with his Temple colleague in the scenes leading up to him getting kicked out.

[Rogar Demonblud]

*It wouldn't be quite that bad

Only one person caught the joke. This is why I don't bother most of the time.

[Thurulian]

so i noticed something in strip #1007 when you see the memory of Durkon being thrown out of the dwarven lands, he says "After all our family has done fer them this is the thanks we get.?" i think that's foreshadowing to the fact the conversation we are waiting for with Sigdi telling him she donated alot of gold to the temple of Thor.

[Rogar Demonblud]

The scene with his mother could happen the night before the day he gets kicked out, though, and still be an unambigiously different scene. I think it unlikely myself, because kicking a neophyte cleric out into the cold less than a week after he started work seems unduly harsh even for this situation...not to mention that Durkon seemed very familiar with his Temple colleague in the scenes leading up to him getting kicked out.

More to the point, High Priest Pointyhair knew Durkon well enough to know he could out-Lawful a modron.

[Jasdoif]

Only one person caught the joke. This is why I don't bother most of the time.

I didn't want to overexpose Muphry's Law....

[Doug Lampert]

Those aren't the questions you should be asking.

Where's the pizza from? Is it fresh? What are the toppings?
Who's giving the massages? Are the certified?

These are the questions you need to ask. Remember, Durkula's (probably?) lawful evil. You need to be sure about what you're getting.

Given the whole "dominated by vampires" thing, the Pizza almost certainly has no garlic. Pizza without garlic is greatly inferior to pizza with garlic. You should avoid vampire approved pizzas.

[Perficio]

It seems like we're going to find that Sigdi could have paid for the healing all along. That she instead donated to the church, out of a combo of a very dwarven attitude of doing her duty and giving to the community, and punishing herself over not saving her husband. That Durkon, not knowing any of that, became a cleric for the sake learning to heal her himself, and only later discovered that she would refuse it if he did.

It could be for setting up a parallel between Durkon and Durkula, a thread of "I'll do whatever it takes to make my progenitor happy, all the inconveniences and pains to so are worthwhile, wait mom what do you mean THAT'S what you want?"

But not sure what yet it could be, what would be an apparent betrayal on Hel's part to Durkula, when he's claimed not to have ambitions of his own.

[Skull the Troll]

People need to let the "speed of thought" thing go. The only reason it was mentioned was to make the point that Durkon couldn't distract fake Durkon or cause noticeable "lag" which would give fake Durkon away. It didn't mean that memories couldn't unfold as is dramatically appropriate (as is happening in this strip). Whatever Durkon is planning has nothing to do with the real time it takes to think the memory.

Its odd because this story isn't matching up with what we saw before. In the first story about Durkon being taken to see the sky, there was time for the "Elaborate Story about your Mother" in between the lighting hitting the ship and Greg shouting "Thor's Nuts!" (Half a second? They are still jumping backwards when he said it.) Greg also says "Only a split second will pass outside your head no matter how many memories you give me at once." Now In this comic we see at least 3 combat rounds go by. Roy attacks once and calls the sword back and Elan attacks Roy 3 times. Greg contributes nothing to the fight the entire time. This seems to indicate that something is keeping him busy. Now the Giant might have a plan for this. It may be that Greg was lying, but I don't think so. I'm thinking the story has his interest more than he's letting on. Either way it seems to be a point that has captured some interest for some of the readers.

[Snails]

It could be for setting up a parallel between Durkon and Durkula, a thread of "I'll do whatever it takes to make my progenitor happy, all the inconveniences and pains to so are worthwhile, wait mom what do you mean THAT'S what you want?"

When you put it that way, I perceive a parallel with Elan, in his "Yes, I dream my family would be happy together, but my dream would be a terrible idea" insight.

[Yendor]

The scene where we see why Durkon became a cleric in the first place begins with Roy saying, "...they'd also be able to regenerate limbs -- and I can't think of a reason why they wouldn't do so." The subtext is that Sigdi had a means of restoring her arm, but chose not to do so. Either the way she lost the arm or the source of her wealth is shameful for some reason. It's also probable that none of her friends know what really happened. We're probably about to get the true story.

On another note, that Sigdi deliberately didn't get her arm regenerated undermines Durcon's smugness about the situation.

[dtilque]

Given the whole "dominated by vampires" thing, the Pizza almost certainly has no garlic. Pizza without garlic is greatly inferior to pizza with garlic. You should avoid vampire approved pizzas.

Right. Most likely would be bloodwart pizza. Who wants that?

As for the massage, hands up anyone who wants one from an undead.

[Rogar Demonblud]

Really, everyone's so hung up on the pizza and massages, even after Elan said it wasn't true.

The pizza is a lie.

[Peelee]

Really, everyone's so hung up on the pizza and massages, even after Elan said it wasn't true.

The pizza is a lie.

He never said it wasnt true, he said they can lie freely. The two statements are not mutually exclusive. They may well get pizza Thursdays.

Don't you start talking smack about pizza, man.

[Blue Griffin]

What handed is Roy? I mean it might not mean anything in dnd, but Roy has the sword in both, left, and right in this comic. I understand it's usually a 2 handed weapon, but was curious.

[Peelee]

What handed is Roy? I mean it might not mean anything in dnd, but Roy has the sword in both, left, and right in this comic. I understand it's usually a 2 handed weapon, but was curious.

Ambidextrous, why not.

[Ionathus]

Ambidextrous, why not.

I know in 5e the language implies anyone who dual-wields is ambidextrous, I think just because it's more streamlined that way.

[Kish]

Ambidextrous is a feat in 3.5e. One Roy is very unlikely to have taken, since he's entirely built around using a greatsword.

[Jasdoif]

Ambidextrous is a feat in 3.5e.

Wait, wasn't Ambidextrous one of the few things that didn't survive the 3.0->3.5 transition?

[Kish]

So it is. I think of it as having been rolled into Two-Weapon Fighting, but at least without digging out my actual Player's Handbook rather than using the SRD I can't be certain that's intended at all; it's entirely possible that characters are free to choose what counts as "on-hand" and "off-hand" freely by default. My mistake.

[brian 333]

I'm betting Ponytail Dwarf makes it out of this situation. She's been in the last three pages right in the middle of the fight. She has a uniform like Minra's, but I haven't seen her cast any spells.

[WolvesbaneIII]

If it was so easy to do that there'd be a lot more good vampires around. Admittedly, we don't have a large sample to choose from in the strip, but I still don't think vampires turning good is something that regularly happens. (And note that most people would have "Loves their mother" as a personality trait, so it's not like this is something only Durkon could do).

I didn't say it was easy. I meant that he would "try" it. Not saying he'd be successful, but hey. he gave it a shot.

[Dion]

He never said it wasnt true, he said they can lie freely. The two statements are not mutually exclusive. They may well get pizza Thursdays.

.
If the question is “Do thralls get pizza?” then the answer is “No,no they do not. Thralls do not get pizza.”

If the question is, “Is Elan lying about the pizza?” then the answer is more complicated. Elan’s probably not technically lying. He’s probably just wrong.

[ThePhantasm]

Its odd because this story isn't matching up with what we saw before. In the first story about Durkon being taken to see the sky, there was time for the "Elaborate Story about your Mother" in between the lighting hitting the ship and Greg shouting "Thor's Nuts!" (Half a second? They are still jumping backwards when he said it.) Greg also says "Only a split second will pass outside your head no matter how many memories you give me at once." Now In this comic we see at least 3 combat rounds go by. Roy attacks once and calls the sword back and Elan attacks Roy 3 times. Greg contributes nothing to the fight the entire time. This seems to indicate that something is keeping him busy. Now the Giant might have a plan for this. It may be that Greg was lying, but I don't think so. I'm thinking the story has his interest more than he's letting on. Either way it seems to be a point that has captured some interest for some of the readers.

He's been actively engaged in directing his minions and using his dominating gaze. I really doubt he's been so engrossed by the memories of dishwashing that it is keeping him from combat. Nothing interesting has happened in the memory yet.

[KorvinStarmast]

Given the whole "dominated by vampires" thing, the Pizza almost certainly has no garlic. Pizza without garlic is greatly inferior to pizza with garlic. You should avoid vampire approved pizzas.

this is nearly sig worthy.

I remember reading somewehere in the 3.5 PHB that all spell with a duration not of permanent or instantaneous end if the caster is killed.

We had a discussion about Domination in the strips from a few threads ago, ad the provisional conclusion was that domination continues after the vamp is destroyed. Do you have a place in the spell casting rules that I can look at? I am not expert at 3.5 D&D, so I am not sure where to look for that kind of rules text.

[Jannoire]

Right. Most likely would be bloodwart pizza. Who wants that?

As for the massage, hands up anyone who wants one from an undead.

Probably the same kind of people who want to play pottycake with a wight...

It could be for setting up a parallel between Durkon and Durkula, a thread of "I'll do whatever it takes to make my progenitor happy, all the inconveniences and pains to so are worthwhile, wait mom what do you mean THAT'S what you want?"

Either you imply that Hel actually wants to be a minor and forgotten goddess without the ability to make clerics among the living... or I'm misreading your post....