I messed up and gave my players a wish.

[Talakeal]

At the end of my last session the players did a favor for a genie and were rewarded with a single wish. I gave them until the next session to think it over and discuss what to do with it.

Now, it is a legit wish, not some screwjob waiting to happen, I am not going to twist it. I was thinking it would be a wild card which allowed the players to break the story and take it in a new direction.

The problem is that anything cool that someone suggests an idea, someone else shoots it down for one of to reasons:

It is a storyline thing, and therefore wasted in the eyes of the more gamist players.

Or

It only benefits one member of the party and therefore the others are jealous.


So at this point it looks like they are just going to wish for gold or xp which they can split amongst themselves which, to me, feels like a giant waste of a wish. It is so boring and easy to come by, they have the opportunity to reshape the world and they are just going to use it on something they get anyway every time they go dungeon crawling.

So, any idea on how I can nudge them into wishing for something a bit more dramatic?

[Altheus]

Don't bother nudging, this sort of thing warrants a full on rant.

"Come on you unimaginative tadpoles, this is a real opportunity to do things you never could otherwise, a kingdom - it's yours, a life of ease and plenty - it's yours, The swiftest horse in the world - it's yours, the most desirable partner etc. etc."

[Kaptin Keen]

I approve of calling your players unimaginative tadpoles - regardless of context. Even if they're the most imaginative group of people you ever met ... keep them on their toes!

Other than that, usually I go for the old GM trope of saying .. slowly, ponderously even: .. are you sure that's what you want to do? I mean, are you absolutely positive this is the action your characters are going to decide on. It usually works.

[MoiMagnus]

Do they need to come with a wish immediately?

As a player, the most interesting "god's favors", we used was the one we could use "in reaction".

Stuff like the sole survivor to an almost TPK saying "I wish we had won" (or any similar time alteration).
Or stuff where you get a solution out of nowhere ("I wish for an army of angels to save us"), change the resolution of a campaign arc and mess up with the DM's plans.

If they really want to have some "gamer-friendly" stuff, or if you need something immediate, design a set of relics (one per character) that you retcon as being "the OP artifacts every child wish to find" and suggest they may want them.
(Then you can talk with each player on what kind of effect they want for their personal relic)

Another fun suggestion is "everyone unlock a special power". Something which would not be accessible trough normal level up, for example a feature of another subclass of the same class, another class, or you can look for "psychic capacities" from any supplement containing Psions and letting them chose one power.

[Lapak]

"IT IS CLEAR THAT YOU FEAR YOU WILL CHOOSE POORLY. THEREFORE, I WILL GIFT YOU WITH THE POWER TO UNDO A SINGLE MISTAKE."

Then have the genie give the party a use-activated item that, when broken, reverses time. Once and once only, they can time skip back to, oh, let's say an hour ago. That's a tool they can use in a lot of ways which range from ordinary (undo a single death, recover from a TPK) to imaginative (absolutely risk-free information gathering) to campaign-breaking (undo the unleashing of an Elder God, foil a conspiracy before it even begins.)

[Segev]

Have the genie be listening. Grant the wish they ask for, and also the more interesting ones they came up with. Quietly. Perhaps gated behind quests.

What are some of the wishes they’re debating and shooting down?

[Talakeal]

Have the genie be listening. Grant the wish they ask for, and also the more interesting ones they came up with. Quietly. Perhaps gated behind quests.

What are some of the wishes they’re debating and shooting down?

To free one of the player's souls that was sold to a devil, to remove the curse off a powerful cursed artifact they found, to resurrect a dead ancestor, to kill the BBEG.

Three of them were shot down for not having a mechanical benefit, the fourth because the artifact would make one of the PCs very powerful which would be unfair to the rest of the party.

"IT IS CLEAR THAT YOU FEAR YOU WILL CHOOSE POORLY. THEREFORE, I WILL GIFT YOU WITH THE POWER TO UNDO A SINGLE MISTAKE."

Then have the genie give the party a use-activated item that, when broken, reverses time. Once and once only, they can time skip back to, oh, let's say an hour ago. That's a tool they can use in a lot of ways which range from ordinary (undo a single death, recover from a TPK) to imaginative (absolutely risk-free information gathering) to campaign-breaking (undo the unleashing of an Elder God, foil a conspiracy before it even begins.)

Its not that they are afraid of making the wrong choice or that I will screw them, rather they only want wishes that have a permanent, tangible, mechanical effect that benefits the entire party evenly.

Do they need to come with a wish immediately?

As a player, the most interesting "god's favors", we used was the one we could use "in reaction".

Stuff like the sole survivor to an almost TPK saying "I wish we had won" (or any similar time alteration).
Or stuff where you get a solution out of nowhere ("I wish for an army of angels to save us"), change the resolution of a campaign arc and mess up with the DM's plans.

If they really want to have some "gamer-friendly" stuff, or if you need something immediate, design a set of relics (one per character) that you retcon as being "the OP artifacts every child wish to find" and suggest they may want them.
(Then you can talk with each player on what kind of effect they want for their personal relic)

Another fun suggestion is "everyone unlock a special power". Something which would not be accessible trough normal level up, for example a feature of another subclass of the same class, another class, or you can look for "psychic capacities" from any supplement containing Psions and letting them chose one power.

The thing is, I don't want the whole campaign to be about the ramifications of the wish. Its supposed to be one time cool thing that allows them to "go off the rails," not a fundamental shift in mechanical style. If I give everyone a special power or artifact, it is going to be a fairly minor one.

[tyckspoon]

Three of them were shot down for not having a mechanical benefit, the fourth because the artifact would make one of the PCs very powerful which would be unfair to the rest of the party.

You're trying to give one reward to multiple people. This is always going to be a problem unless the people in question are already agreed about what they want (the easy result is if they all, for example, agree that they want to have a cool home base, in which case they go 'We wish for a castle' or an airship or a secret lair carved out of an ancient dead volcano with the magically-active corpse of a great wyrm at the center or something.) Unfortunately you don't have that, you have your players, no two of which seem to ever want the same thing out of the game

Is there a group buff they all enjoy, some ability that normally burns a round to cast? Suggest they could Wish to have that become a permanent effect instead. Make them all emanate a 5-foot Circle of Protection or give them the Aura of Menace ability that Archons have. Have the genie offer to use the (presumably currently unusable because curse) artifact's power to buff all their equipment, give all their weapons and shields an additional +1 or +1 equivalent enhancement that won't count against the cost for future improvements.

[jjordan]

You didn't mess up. Let the players hash it out and see how things work out. They'll make a good choice or a bad choice and it will contribute to the game in a little way or a big way. Don't try to nudge them.

[Segev]

Why do they want a dead ancestor alive again? Is it somebody they knew? Do they have a different motive? (If so, what is it?)


Freeing the soul of a PC from a devil isn't going to have mechanical impact? I take it the devil doesn't collect in the context of the game, then?


Killing the BBEG does sound...anticlimactic, but is it really within the power of this genie? And how would that not benefit the whole party, if doable?


I know: they can wish for the bound soul of the BBEG, then trade that for a dual favor from the devil: the (far less awesome) soul of the PC back, and the devil cleansing the artifact. The devil, thinking he's clever, obliges by shoving a new soul into it. One he grabs from the past ties of the party. It's the dead ancestor! Now the artifact isn't cursed, but is a sentient item with the soul and memories of the dead ancestor and with a motive to help the party as a whole (or at least his descendent), while it is still best used by the guy who you said would benefit most greatly. He just...has more ties to use his power to help others in the party out, now.

[Talakeal]

Why do they want a dead ancestor alive again? Is it somebody they knew? Do they have a different motive? (If so, what is it?).

The party is descended from a legendary hero. I assume they figure having him alive again would be tremendously helpful.

Freeing the soul of a PC from a devil isn't going to have mechanical impact? I take it the devil doesn't collect in the context of the game, then?

Its a backstory thing more or less. One of the PCs made a deal with the devil(s) before the game began. Its more of a long term storyline thing rather than an immediate impact.

Killing the BBEG does sound...anticlimactic, but is it really within the power of this genie? And how would that not benefit the whole party, if doable.

It is sort of within the genies capability. The BBEG has a trick up his sleeve that will allow him to survive, but at greatly diminished capacity, and the wish would make the final battle significantly easier for the PCs.

The thing is, one of the players is firmly in the camp of "if it doesnt increase a number on my character shee it doesnt matter,".

[Segev]

Well, then, the only thing you can do is let them hash it out. Be impartial. Don't involve yourself, and don't allow yourself to care about what they wish for until they've made the wish. There's nothing wrong with the player who likes more numbers on his sheet, other than the fact that if that's literal, he is grossly incompetent at powergaming. Because some of the most powerful things you can do in most games don't directly increase numbers on your sheet.

[MrSandman]

The thing is, one of the players is firmly in the camp of "if it doesnt increase a number on my character shee it doesnt matter,".

You can tell that player that even if it increases a number on his character sheet it won't matter because you will thenceforth tailor encounters to render that increase irrelevant. wink wink, tongue in cheek response.

[Jay R]

Wishes are great. But they are also dangerous if you don't trust your DM 100% to rule exactly the way you expect him to rule.

Unless they have absolute faith that your approach to the game matches theirs, and that there could never be a misunderstanding between you, you will not convince them to get more dramatic.

[Kyutaru]

Tell them they could solve all their problems if one of them wished to become an all-powerful genie.

[noob]

Tell them they could solve all their problems if one of them wished to become an all-powerful genie.

What problems?
Like if anything was a problem for an adventurer?
being in abyss and on fire and in acid and right under the foot of a balor surrounded by an army of demons is not having a problem: it is being in an target rich environment.
The evil king betraying you and getting busy shovelling orphans in a furnace to fuel a world destroying machine is not a problem: it is a character development opportunity.

[MrSandman]

What problems?

The problem of not being able to agree on what to wish, presumably.

[jintoya]

The evil king betraying you and getting busy shovelling orphans in a furnace to fuel a world destroying machine is not a problem: it is a character development opportunity.

I'd grab a shovel and outdo him, he's my kind of King.

[Lord Torath]

Is the one who wants bigger numbers on his sheet the same one who wants his equivalent gold share of any magic items that go to anyone other than him? A.k.a. Bob? Not that it really matters.

Assure them you have no intentions of twisting their wish and that the genie will tell them before-hand if they wish for more than he can deliver, and let them hash it out. In fact, have the genie attempt to clarify what they want, just to be sure they're getting what they actually want.

At the start of the next session, if they still can't agree, have the Genie (in character) give them each 1-2 minutes to present their wish and the reasoning behind it, and take a vote. Then have the genie ask any clarifying questions necessary about the wish that won the vote, and grant said wish. Don't let them drag it out into two hours of debate.

Don't take any crap from "Bob" if he complains to you. It's a group decision, and he needs to deal with it.

[Talakeal]

Is the one who wants bigger numbers on his sheet the same one who wants his equivalent gold share of any magic items that go to anyone other than him? A.k.a. Bob? Not that it really matters.

You already know the answer to this one

[zinycor]

I don't get it... Why is that a problem? let them make whatever wish they want. Isn't that the whole point of a wish? If you didn't want them to do so, why did you even gave them the option?

[Kyutaru]

The problem of not being able to agree on what to wish, presumably.

Bingo! Make one guy a genie and then use him to grant everyone more wishes. The party member now fits in a knapsack too and has phenomenal cosmic power.

[Kardwill]

Well, then, the only thing you can do is let them hash it out. Be impartial. Don't involve yourself, and don't allow yourself to care about what they wish for until they've made the wish.

And once the wish is done, even if it's something boring like money or attribute points, try to make it cool, maybe give it ramifications, so that it doesn't look like a missed opportunity. Not "screw you over" ramifications, but opportunities and cool factor. The money is made entirely of currency from some mysterious, long-dead civilisation, the attribute points or XP are obtained by channeling the power of their dead ancestor, something that comes with a new quest opportunity, that kind of things.

It may not be easy to pull off in the heat of the moment (especially since any complication this creates should not feel like it undermines their reward, but adds to it), but I think it could be story fuel, or at least give the Players that care about it (i.e. anyone but Bob) something cool to brag about that goes beyond mere numbers.

[Talakeal]

I don't get it... Why is that a problem? let them make whatever wish they want. Isn't that the whole point of a wish? If you didn't want them to do so, why did you even gave them the option?

The problem isnt that they are wishing too big, but too small. I want them to make a wish, to do something grand and shake things up a little.

[zinycor]

The problem isnt that they are wishing too big, but too small. I want them to make a wish, to do something grand and shake things up a little.

Exactly, no problem at all, grant them that and move on to the next thing. If you want players to wish whatever you think is cool and/or awesome, then you will have to be a player, not a gm.

[Talakeal]

Exactly, no problem at all, grant them that and move on to the next thing. If you want players to wish whatever you think is cool and/or awesome, then you will have to be a player, not a gm.

That's a very pessimistic way to look at things.

[The Library DM]

Others above forgot to continue the quote a bit further “...and everything that comes with it.”

That’s where the DM steps in— not with a cruel interpretation of the wish, but with the perfectly natural and logical consequences of the wish.

For example, if they wish they’d won the “wish” lottery, they’d also get:
The tax man coming to collect his share. Or else.
Relatives/old friends/new old friends crawling out of the woodwork for a “loan for my great investment/tied me over/save the family farm, etc., etc..”
Lots of attention from people who absolutely love them and want to get married, super-quick...
Strong encouragement to make a sizable donation to the local temple/shrine/Thieves Guild.
Oh, yeah. Other unwanted attention by the Thieves Guild.
So much gold the local economy collapses due to hyperinflation (Google Mansa Musa), and everyone now hates them.
The arrival of a dragon whose treasure horde it once was.
The close attention of the BBEG, who could use the treasure for his own nefarious ends.

Not to mention the issues of how to move it (gold weighs A LOT), where to store it, how to access it, how to keep others from accessing it without approval, and so on.

Mundane wishes can have very interesting results.

As for the “I want my ‘stats’ to go up” dude, I say (as the genie): “Prithee, little brother, what meaneth thee by ‘stats’? This word I knoweth not, and thus may not complete thy wish.”
Asking for specific game mechanic enhancements is a non-starter with me, as the characters don’t think in such terms, nor do the beings they encounter. It’s the character who is making the wish, not the player!
So, no wishes that they all “level up” (“This term I knoweth not”). Similarly, no wishes that their hit points go up, or their Constitutions, or anything of the sort, or any other reference to rule specific concepts. And thus, no “rules lawyer” wishes can be made.
If “Bob” can be made to understand that, then maybe he’ll shift to suggesting more imaginative wishes that benefit the group.

Or they can vote, and “Bob’s” character can be given a consolation gift of a big bonus on the next treasure find.

[tyckspoon]

or their Constitutions, or anything of the sort,

'I want to increase my Constitution' may be an awkward phrasing, but it's a perfectly sensible sentence - strength, intelligence, wisdom, charisma, dexterity, and constitution are understandable concepts that mean more or less the same thing they do in the game rules. These are even standard Wishes for D&D 3.5 - they'll result in gaining an Inherent bonus to the relevant stat.

[Excession]

Its not that they are afraid of making the wrong choice or that I will screw them, rather they only want wishes that have a permanent, tangible, mechanical effect that benefits the entire party evenly.

Yes, how dare players wish to be fair, balanced, and not break the game. How dare they! Better players would use their wishes to further your story, not benefit their characters.

Seriously, you gave them a wish, just for once give them the agency to go along with it.

The thing is, I don't want the whole campaign to be about the ramifications of the wish. Its supposed to be one time cool thing that allows them to "go off the rails," not a fundamental shift in mechanical style. If I give everyone a special power or artifact, it is going to be a fairly minor one.

Did you explicitly tell your players this? Do you really truly mean it? "Be careful what you wish for" is an old trope, and I wouldn't blame players or characters for sticking to it. Djinn are not to be trusted, and quite often GMs aren't either.

In terms of "taking the story in a new direction"... the story is going to continue no matter what the players do. Unless they can see where it's going, and what a change would bring, changing direction is meaningless to the players.

[Mr Beer]

Just give them what they wish for, like you literally handed the players a chance to do something nice for themselves and now you're bitching because they're going to do something for them instead of for you.

If you want some other stuff to happen that's more interesting for you, stick that into the campaign next episode. This is such a non-issue.