Order of the Stick: November II

[Ilaun_Undil]

She may be Lawful, but she has been swayed at least once into staying at the hotel. Now that nigh all the party is aligned agianst her, except Durkon, but that could just be because he to is Lawful.

[TheAneamicDeamon]

Hi there. My appologies if this post is in the wrong place. If it is let me know where to place it.

So I'm new to OOTS. I started reading the comics from #1 starting day before yesterday. A friend pointed me to the site.

I've read every episode up to the latest on (#250). What I want to know is where is #251? The text at the top of the comic page says updated every monday wednesday and friday, but It's tuesday and still no #251. Withdrawal's a bitch!

Is the master and creater at a convention, in a hospital, engaged in deep zen like meditation to solve the problems of world poverty and athletes foot?

Anyway. Besides the above question I reckon good on Roy.

On the point of assasins being evil: It depends on perspective a bit. I mean if say someone was sent to kill some person of questionable morality, they might be seen as good. Yet the family/supporters/henchmen of the saif evil doer might take a different view. Yes-no?

[Leveller]

Hi there. My appologies if this post is in the wrong place. If it is let me know where to place it.

So I'm new to OOTS. I started reading the comics from #1 starting day before yesterday. A friend pointed me to the site.

I've read every episode up to the latest on (#250). What I want to know is where is #251? The text at the top of the comic page says updated every monday wednesday and friday, but It's tuesday and still no #251. Withdrawal's a bitch!

Is the master and creater at a convention, in a hospital, engaged in deep zen like meditation to solve the problems of world poverty and athletes foot?

Anyway. Besides the above question I reckon good on Roy.

On the point of assasins being evil: It depends on perspective a bit. I mean if say someone was sent to kill some person of questionable morality, they might be seen as good. Yet the family/supporters/henchmen of the saif evil doer might take a different view. Yes-no?

250 IS the comic for monday. The one last friday was cancelled due to a mistake, so on sunday we got friday + monday as one, and we'll get 251 on wednesday and everything will be back to normal.

There was a really long thread dabating the alignement of the assasins, if you dig through the forum Im sure you'll find it.

[Sylian]

TAD, you'll have to accept that the comic is late sometimes. Don't write it in the forums, because Rich, the artist, doesn't like that anymore.

Edit, added an e to somtimes.

[Sylian]

http://www.giantitp.com/cgi-bin/yabb...128995;start=0

Aligment of the "assassins".

[TheAneamicDeamon]

Aha... Now for the next problem. Could someone please move Northern America closer to Southern Africa?

The time differnce sucks. It's like I have to wait a whole day longer for the update

[DeathQuaker]

Aha... Now for the next problem. Could someone please move Northern America closer to Southern Africa?

The time differnce sucks. It's like I have to wait a whole day longer for the update

Wouldn't that just generally mean you get updates on Tuesdays, Thursdays, and Saturdays? Really, ultimately no difference from a broad perspective.

As for 251 we all have to wait a tad longer anyway; it was the exchange for rather than getting an update on Friday and Monday, we got a double sized one on the weekend.

Just go reread your favorite old strips in the meantime. :)

[Duraska]

She only desisted from massacring them. She didn't desist from taking them against their will. I mean sure they went "willingly" but if they had said no, what would she have done?

The only thing she could do, take them by force.

Miko is following orders given to her directly by her master. Don't blame the messanger if you don't like the message.

I don't think Miko will cry. Sure, it probably hurt her feelings a little, but Roy's a jerk. She's far too disciplined to let some poor excuse for a leader sway her from her duty.

[Kadi]

Miko is following orders given to her directly by her master. Don't blame the messanger if you don't like the message.

Oh I'll blame her.

"I was only following orders" is never an excuse.

[humanpylon]

You know, regardless of whether Roy is being a jerk or not, this was about the funniest thing he could have done, and thats the most important thing for me.

By the way this is my first post (not including the post in the welcome thread) :)

[BrooklynKnight]

Wouldn't that just generally mean you get updates on Tuesdays, Thursdays, and Saturdays? Really, ultimately no difference from a broad perspective.

As for 251 we all have to wait a tad longer anyway; it was the exchange for rather than getting an update on Friday and Monday, we got a double sized one on the weekend.

Just go reread your favorite old strips in the meantime. :)

Heh, from the livejournal quote I was under the impression that Sunday was double length to make up for Friday and that we'de still get monday.

Oh well!

:-D

[Marller]

Oh I'll blame her.

"I was only following orders" is never an excuse.

and lo and behold, how much the police cares, what a suspect has to say on that matter, when they arrest him, especially with evidence. And the Order confessed the destruction of the gate (although it was after they surrendered).

[Kadi]

Uh...what?

[evileeyore]

On the whole idea of "Miko as a police officer", I'd point out that she did, after all, investigate the group before she passed judgement. She gathered several witness statements (including ones from the flumphs, who are known to be LG) which indicated that the Order of the Stick were horrible people.

Correct so far...

When she arrived on the scene, she did her own investigation, via Detect Evil. She found them to be MASSIVELY evil, already guilty of destroying the gate, and several other crimes; killing them was within reason, based on what she knew. When presented with counter-evidence (through Durkhon), she desisted.

And wrong. She found Roy to be Evil. She then offered them the option of 'surrender or die'. Roy (Evil in her eyes) refused to surrender. She attacked.

When evidence to the contrary concerning Roy's Evil (her failed Smite) gave the combat pause Durkon managed to explain what was going on. It was then that Roy admitted to the OotS having inadverdantly destroying the Gate and agreed to surrender and go to her Lord to explain their actions and face judgement.

Miko is not to blame for the OotS screw ups so far. She has been above board, fair, and honest with them. Yes her blunt and hard manner have rubbed the slack-asses a little wrong but not enough to warrant outright meanness.

Roy was both right and wrong. This will come back to bite him in the rump.

[Vitas]

Well, Miko is very likely to deliver something horrible in return, but that could be even more funny:) Or perhaps she will admire him in some way for his courageous, even if VERY rude speech...:)I just can't wait until the next comic strip...

[Wrecan]

I have trouble believing that Miko has not suffered worse humiliations during her training as a monk and then as a paladin, not to mention the levels she took in cranky smarty-pants.

[Trisk]

Miko saw Roy to be evil because of the amulet he wore. That was the only reason

Gotta love the look on her face...priceless....

[MrNexx]

Miko saw Roy to be evil because of the amulet he wore. That was the only reason

No. She also saw him as evil because she had the testimony of several reliable witnesses that the entire Order of the Stick was evil...

http://www.giantitp.com/cgi-bin/Gian...tscript?SK=174

Some flumphs (LG) confirmed that they did, indeed, destroy the castle (and seem to have abused the flumphs in the process). A dwarven smith testified that the "blond one" gave them over to the "big bald fighter". A guild leader testified that the little one killed three people for fun. A weasel recounts being fed to an ogre (which, I will admit, is the least heinous of the bunch). This is in addition to her own lord's orders, which are informed by a diviner, gives us somewhat of a clue that, hey, maybe she had a good reason to think they were evil once Roy twigged as evil.

[kriklaf]

Roy's a jerk. She's far too disciplined to let some poor excuse for a leader sway her from her duty.

Um. I completely disagree with what you've said here. Sure--what Roy said was harsh. However, Miko has been generally unpleasant to the entire Order--condescending, smug and belittling. These people are Roy's friends. Yes, he pays them to adventure with him, and yes, sometimes they get him into trouble, but they've also helped him complete (to their knowlege) his father's quest, they've defended his life--in short, they are his comrades. For Miko to all but ask Roy to hit on her again in the future after she's just said that the Order is a bunch of greedy sloths who can't look after their own moral welfare is callous at least and bordering on grotesque. Roy just traded slap for slap. As for Roy being a bad leader--he's at least managed to wrestle the Order into a functioning group of adventurers. Under Miko's lead, there is all sorts of resentment between Order members. Members hesitate to obey, causing potentially deadly delays. Time spent arguing and thinking uncharitable thoughts towards one another takes away from time spent earning XP. Roy knows how to take advantage of Belkar's bloodthirstiness and Hayley's love of treasure. Miko incites them both to try to undermine her authority--not good for a team. Miko may be a fine paladin, but she's got a lot to learn about people before she becomes a good leader. Mark my words--she's gonna get a few harsh words from Lord Shojo about this trip!

[Annalia]

Miko may be a fine paladin, but she's got a lot to learn about people before she becomes a good leader.

Now you got it! That's the real problem with Miko. She doesn't understand others and doesn't try either. If she would just try to learn the ways of people she'll be an even better paladin and could become a nice leader. This is her real problem.

Edit: Sorry, I deleted the second post.

[NEO|Phyte]

not to mention the levels she took in cranky smarty-pants.

you mean "mean old cranky pants?"

[Devils_Advocate]

Roy was both right and wrong.

Do you mean that he was morally wrong to deliver his criticism of Miko in the form of a verbal slap to the face, but factually right that she is an uptight, overbearing, self-righteous bitch?

[Umael]

I have trouble believing that Miko has not suffered worse humiliations during her training as a monk and then as a paladin, not to mention the levels she took in cranky smarty-pants.

So have troubles believing.

Whether she did or not is conjecture and besides the point. Maybe she did suffer something that was more humiliating when she was younger and less experienced, maybe it isn't even humiliation but just emotional pain.

We don't know.

So why fill in the gaps of our knowledge about her with whatever makes your world-view comfortable?

For that matter, why go back and lamblast her for something she did not have (cranky smarty-pants prestige class levels)?

[DOOM2099]

I agree with the majority here. Wotta bee-atch! And its good to sse Roy lay her straight... I mean lay it on the line.. I mean... Eh, I'm done.

[bananna]

I LOVE Haley in the last 3 panels. Best. 3. Panels. Ever.

[Winged One]

I actually expected Roy to say what he said. I actually laughed and clapped. And then I saw Haley, and that got me laughing all over again. I love this comic.

[Kadi]

As far as I'm concerned, Miko's bitchy attitude is sec-er, ancillary to the trouble. The trouble is that she took them prisoner to begin with.

Now consider it...if your family were kidnapped by some people but they were treated well, would you then not be upset that someone took them against their will to begin with?

A gilded cage is a cage nonetheless.

[evileeyore]

Do you mean that he was morally wrong to deliver his criticism of Miko in the form of a verbal slap to the face, but factually right that she is an uptight, overbearing, self-righteous bitch?

That too.

He was right to cut his ties in an abrupt and bridge burning fashion. It earned him kudos and renewed support from his team. Something that has begun to become a problem, Team Morale. They began to see their leader slipping into Miko 'spell' and were losing faith.

He was wrong in cutting her down in that fashion. Had he just said "No. Oh no." pause "I can see how poorly you treat others and my team in particular and could never allow myself to continue to be smitten by you only your looks." He would have gotten his point across without shaming her. Likely it would have smoothed over his 'break' with the group, not as quickly but a very good start. It would have been enough for Elan and V. Haley would have come around eventually.

Never forget "Hell hath no fury like a women scorned". Miko may very well be even more tyranical now.

I'm looking forward to it.--EvilE

As far as I'm concerned, Miko's bitchy attitude is sec-er, ancillary to the trouble. The trouble is that she took them prisoner to begin with.

Now consider it...if your family were kidnapped by some people but they were treated well, would you then not be upset that someone took them against their will to begin with?

A gilded cage is a cage nonetheless.

Okay, you've finally managed to annoy me.

She never forced them. Roy and the team agreed to go with her. She got into her head she was their 'captor' and Roy has let her believe this.

The team is not helpless. Sure one on one most of them couldn't take her out, but should they choose to leave she could not stop it.

The entirety of the issue is her attitude. The OotS are not prisoners, she just believes it and treats them as so. If she understood at the core they are going of their free volition and treated them as equals there would be no animosity betwixt the two. Thus there would be no issue.

[Duraska]

As far as I'm concerned, Miko's bitchy attitude is sec-er, ancillary to the trouble. The trouble is that she took them prisoner to begin with.

Now consider it...if your family were kidnapped by some people but they were treated well, would you then not be upset that someone took them against their will to begin with?

A gilded cage is a cage nonetheless.

I think in this situation, a more apt metaphor would be:

If your father committed a crime, and the police arrested him for that crime, would you be upset at the police?

Yes, I think most people would be upset. We humans have a tendency to support laws when they affect other people, but dismiss those very same laws when they affect us personally.

There's nothing inherently wrong with that. I think it's pretty natural. However, a rational view on the situation would be: Your father committed the crime, now he has to deal with the consequences.

I think the main reason people don't like Miko is the fact that she made some less than polite remarks to the group. I can understand that. What I can't understand is when people blame Miko for "taking the group prisoner." The fact is, she's got a job to do. The Order of the Stick committed the crime, now the Order has to deal with the consequences.

[The Giant]

New comic is up.



Hee. ;D