Erfworld 93 (Page 84)

[slb]

I really enjoyed this character build-up with Parson. Also it seems Bogroll has been unable to do something with the sword handle, maybe the blade or the batteries to power-up the laser will come in the next meal :)

[PePe QuiCoSE]

one thing to note:
Parson only gave 1 look from the tower to the Foolamancer, not a good way to see that the he was affected by the link breakup. So Parson not only guessed Maggie's game, but also gambled right assuming that the Foolamanacer had a backlash too.

[SteveMB]

The thinkamancy-as-dangerous-construct has been planned from the start, and from there we can see the underlying connections through the entire story.

It casts another layer of meaning on Wanda's "the very hard way" comment. Presumably she knew the risk of backlash if the spell broke:

I do not believe that Wanda suffered the backlash from mere inexperience. She was well aware of the dangers, as shown when she initially informed Parson of how fragile things such link-ups are. Would someone as calculating as she fail to understand the risks involved in her own link with Jillian? No. Either she deliberately chose to spare Jill the backlash, or alternately she so firmly believed in Jill's own love in her that she could not imagine ever needing to protect herself from such a backlash. Misguided love indeed.

one thing to note:
Parson only gave 1 look from the tower to the Foolamancer, not a good way to see that the he was affected by the link breakup. So Parson not only guessed Maggie's game, but also gambled right assuming that the Foolamanacer had a backlash too.

Or he debriefed the hobgobwin guards (if at least one of them was among those left behind for the Titans to come up with some plan for).

[Jayngfet]

is it just me or does parson look a lot like an evil overlord here, and act like it, the fact that the thinkamancer who he's ordering looks horrified.

[sihnfahl]

is it just me or does parson look a lot like an evil overlord here, and act like it, the fact that the thinkamancer who he's ordering looks horrified.

No, he looks like a Boss when he finds out a subordinate did something really, REALLY wrong. And she has all the look of the subordinate realizing the boss knows they did something wrong.

Since he's the Chief Warlord, she knows that, if he really wanted to, he could Disband her.

Think about it. If your boss had you come into their office, call you to the mat on something you did, and the intimation that you could be fired for it, how'd you react?

[SteveMB]

Think about it. If your boss had you come into their office, call you to the mat on something you did, and the intimation that you could be fired for it, how'd you react?

Especially if the boss just found out what you did because you inadvertently revealed it yourself, not realizing (based on your experience with Previous Pointy-Haired Boss) that he'd see the implications of your statement.

[Keri Thornwood]

Oooh, someone's been naughty...

[snafu]

For reference, colonials: if Maggie is anything like... who she looks like... then she'll be completely remorseless and very dangerous. Fortunately she's taking Parson's orders, so she'll be dangerous to the enemy, and not to, say, any mining communities that might be around the place. Rejoice, rejoice!

[SteveMB]

The thinkamancy-as-dangerous-construct has been planned from the start, and from there we can see the underlying connections through the entire story.

It casts another layer of meaning on Wanda's "the very hard way" comment.

Hmmm... another thought on that. The spell Wanda cast on page 30 appears to have ended on page 38 (it's hard to see in the online image, but the sparklies that were present around Jillian's head on page 36 are apparently there just before the dawn healing/reset and gone afterwards.

If so, it seems that Jillian did take the brunt of the spell dissolution backlash (which seems to have taken the form of crushing despair, as suggested by Fighteer earlier in the thread). The spell Jillian broke after finding the wounded dwagons would then be another one, cast on her before her "escape", and probably stronger (since it would have to last for at least the duration of the battle). When it broke, Wanda took the brunt of the backlash, for any of several reasons (the second spell was harder to manage because it was more powerful, managing an involuntary spell-breaking is harder than managing an expected end of the spell, Wanda was consciously or otherwise unwilling to let Jillian take the hit).

[The Old Hack]

Wait a minute. Something's not right here.

In several panels, we see the scene beyond the windows. It looks like the crater wall is rising part way up the window. In the last panel, the crater rim appears roughly level with the top of Parson's head. It's also clear that the “camera” is low relative to Parson. Since the rim is a good distance away, it must be a lot higher than Parson's new office.

Now look at the last but one frame of the previous page: we can clearly see Efdup Tower, including the observation deck, rising high above the rim. This view is from Ansom's camp at the foot of GK, which means the observation deck must be much higher than the rim.

I'm pretty certain, based on the shapes of the windows, that the observation deck is the only place in GK where that office could be located. Which means this page contradicts the last one.

Or am I seeing shadows again?

It is somewhat hard to tell at that big a distance, but the observation level is actually far below the top of the tower, as shown here. It is obviously an observation level meant to inspect troops, not look at terrain. You can always walk the stairs to the top (a mere boop x ow/2 so close to it) when you want to see beyond the caldera.

[Xenon]

*ponder* okay, i have a theory.

an heir is very expensive. parson is 'special', and GK has no other heir that we know of.

so, i think parson was summoned not just a warlord, but a royal heir as well. what is the definition of a 'perfect' warlord after all? and you can bet wanda was thinking how nice it would be if stanley was replaced at some point.

[Lizard Lord]

Seems unlikely. Maggie is surely an expert Thinkamancer, or she wouldn't have been able to hold the Eyemancers together. As such she knows the difference between a novice and an expert. She almost certainly knows what she's talking about.

True enough, but she has no reason to think that Wanda would try to protect Jillian.

[Fighteer]

an heir is very expensive. parson is 'special', and GK has no other heir that we know of.

so, i think parson was summoned not just a warlord, but a royal heir as well. what is the definition of a 'perfect' warlord after all? and you can bet wanda was thinking how nice it would be if stanley was replaced at some point.

Are you suggesting that Wanda cast the summoning spell in such a way as to make Parson the designated heir of Gobwin Knob without Stanley's knowledge? Not only is that idea completely unsupported by anything in the comic, but we've also seen absolutely no hint that the mechanics of Erfworld would even allow it.

Parson still has authority in GK because Stanley never revoked his Chief Warlord status. Stanley still holds GK as well as Faq (although it seems that nobody but he, Jillian, and possibly Wanda know about it), and in his absence, without countermanding orders, Parson is in charge.

[Lizard Lord]

It's not a matter of logic, it's a matter of skill. It doesn't matter how much you may want to protect someone if you don't have the skill or ability to do it.

It is all about logic, there is no skill required to protect the target of the spell, only the castor. You can not, however, protect both the target and the castor. Maggie isn't doing a huge investigation on this. She is simply going by what little information she knows about the situation.

[Arkenputtyknife]

I'm concluding that the page 84 is correct and something's amiss with page 83.

Page 4 makes it very clear that what we're looking at is the crater rim, and that the rim is much higher than the tower; this is consistent with most other scenes showing the tower. Thanks to everyone who posted links to relevant pages.

Frame 7 of page 77 gives us a complete view of the entire tower, from which we can see that there is nothing but a point at the top. There really is only one place the throne room could be: inside that disk-like bulge about three quarters of the way up. (Krelon: at no point did I claim or even suggest that the office was at the very top. Where did you get that idea?)

In short, there's no way that the throne room should be visible from Ansom's camp. In fact, as far as I can see the tower isn't tall enough for any part of it to be visible over the crater rim, and most of the comic is consistent about this. Therefore, page 83 is either a mistake or artistic license. Or maybe light doesn't travel in straight lines on Erfworld.

As for the idea of putting the throne room lower for safety from aerial attack — come on! Stanley is surrounded by dwagons. Aerial attack is the least of his worries.

[The Old Hack]

...panel 9 of this strip...

..................

...I cannot believe that I missed the resemblance to Kai Munch's 'The Scream' the first time around...

*head desk* *head desk* *head desk*

Ahhh. My own fault for being too caught up in the story and paying too little attention to Jamie's as always astounding and gorgeous artwork. Thanks again, Jamie.

[The Old Hack]

As for the idea of putting the throne room lower for safety from aerial attack — come on! Stanley is surrounded by dwagons. Aerial attack is the least of his worries.

Except, as we see here in this flashback, the place existed back in the days of Saline IV as well, complete with desk and all. It may well have been constructed way back in the bad old days of no guaranteed air superiority.

[factotum]

Page 4 makes it very clear that what we're looking at is the crater rim, and that the rim is much higher than the tower; this is consistent with most other scenes showing the tower. Thanks to everyone who posted links to relevant pages.

Frame 7 of page 77 gives us a complete view of the entire tower, from which we can see that there is nothing but a point at the top. There really is only one place the throne room could be: inside that disk-like bulge about three quarters of the way up.

But Page 4 also implies that the "bulge" is not as close to the top of the tower as that...you can clearly see it behind Wanda in panel 5, and the bulge is only about two-thirds up the way of the part of the tower we can see, which is clearly not all of it. If there's been an error anywhere I'd say it's in the positioning of the bulge in strip 77.

[fendrin]

As for the idea of putting the throne room lower for safety from aerial attack — come on! Stanley is surrounded by dwagons. Aerial attack is the least of his worries.

Assuming Stanley built GK. It looks like Stanley was promoted to heir in that room.

Saline IV didn't always have such a strong Air Force.

[rosebud]

- As mentioned, this is the same room as Stanley's. The night and angles gives it a different feel, though.

- It was made clear before, but it is nice to see confirmation the foolmancer is not himself.

- With the Angels, Ansom's side will not be very susceptible to suggestion spells.

- Parson was unhappy with Misty's death, but I cannot blame Maggie for protecting herself. She didn't actively attack the other two.

- It's amusing that there are three main actors now. Parson has a bit of free space to operate in.

- The tardy elves should be arriving soon.

[Lamech]

Well now we know why the Archons were ticked at the third. Backlash could have very easily killed Jillian.
Although this backlash has several implications...
1) Maggie can place a suggestion spell on someone, and give them a hit from backlash whenever she feels like it, or Maggie could simply use it as an attack form, that could potentially kill a level 9 warlord.
2) Jillian might have taken a hit; Wanda's backlash didn't manifest immediately, so Jillian may be suffering from some sort of insanity.
3) Jillian is going to have a real fun time explaining her actions (such as lying about the escape), if she ever needs to.

It is all about logic, there is no skill required to protect the target of the spell, only the Castor. You can not, however, protect both the target and the castor. Maggie isn't doing a huge investigation on this. She is simply going by what little information she knows about the situation.

We don't know if skill is required to protect the target. In fact, it could be that nothing can be done to protect the target. (Except not giving the target additional backlash.)

Are you suggesting that Wanda cast the summoning spell in such a way as to make Parson the designated heir of Gobwin Knob without Stanley's knowledge? Not only is that idea completely unsupported by anything in the comic, but we've also seen absolutely no hint that the mechanics of Erfworld would even allow it.

We don't know how Parson is classed. I doubt very much that he is considered a unit under a ruler like say Sizemore. He could be like a gobwin or a witch; a unit that just "pops" with out cities. Or maybe he is treated like a royal because he didn't really pop, so he must have been created by a titan like being.

[Eten]

Suddenly I understand (or think I understand) why parson's hilt came without a blade (on a meta-comic level, at least). The blade-less hilt visually echoes the Arkenhammer. It is a symbol of authority. Rods of various sorts have been used as such for thousands of years: from ancient Egypt and Mesopotamia to the gavels used by judges today.

This is my favorite little bit out of all the things posted. I had the exact same "feeling" from Parson with the hilt in this comic and once you point it out I realize why. It is things like this that make things so good.

[Gez]

For reference, colonials: if Maggie is anything like... who she looks like... then she'll be completely remorseless and very dangerous. Fortunately she's taking Parson's orders, so she'll be dangerous to the enemy, and not to, say, any mining communities that might be around the place. Rejoice, rejoice!

Maybe she was the one who Stanley tasked with whipping the Gobwins back into subservience after their mutiny? (Disregarding whether Stanley was behind it all or not.)

[The Old Hack]

Although this backlash has several implications...
1) Maggie can place a suggestion spell on someone, and give them a hit from backlash whenever she feels like it, or Maggie could simply use it as an attack form, that could potentially kill a level 9 warlord.

We do not know what requirements are needed to cast the spell. Wanda had an entire night alone with Jillian in which she might have performed any number of rituals or preparations we did not see. It might require long conversation with a subjugated, acquiescing or at least unsuspecting victim. And some people might be harder to affect than others.

If we look at Jillian's stats as shown in the background, one of her weak spots is 'knowing what she wants.' Maybe exactly this is why she is vulnerable to suggestions. Stanley, on the other hand, has it as one of his strengths; I would not like to be the Thinkamancer that tried to put him under any sort of manipulative spell whatsoever.

[Raguzert]

Nice comic, great debut for maggie! :D I normally would be annoyed of the lack of movement, (the story stalled way ago) but this one is very well done. Thanks to the creators! About Stanley, I still can not believe he is going to rebuild FAQ, that place is a pit which resorted to mercenary work to survive. It's is not like he has much options anyway, but I still hope that he goes after Charlie... I still can hardly understand why he did not went right after the arkenplier. My hopes of seeing Stanley having a win grow thin.

[Oslecamo]

From what I've seen in the comic, espcecially pages 66-67, I guess the sugestion spell needs some specific conditions to be cast:

-The affected subject will never obey someone it hates.
-The affected subject will never harm someone it likes.
-Based on the above, the caster must get the subject to like it before casting the spell. Sadomasochist sessions on this case.

So here's what I think that hapened:
1-Jillian liked Wanda. But she also liked Ansom. She can't hurt any of them. She ends up deciding that she can defeat the dragons, "rescue" Jillian from Stanley and they all will live happilly ever after. Everybody wins.

2-Then the warlord attacked Jillian. For croacking, not capture. Jillian sees death in front of her eyes. She knew that it was Wanda controling them. She concludes that Wanda isn't more than a ***** that used her as a toy.

3-But Ansom appears and saves her ass, having ridden trough several squares to reach her. Jillian decids that Ansom is the one who really deserves her love.

4-And this is what breacks the spell. The moment where Jillian almost dies at the hands of Wanda and ends up being saved by Ansom. She stops loving Wanda, and this makes the spell breack, as the victim must like the caster for the spell to work. Wanda never expected this to happen and is the one geting the backlash.

So, I think the Thinkmacer can't use sugestion as an ofensive spell. It must be the subject to breack the link.

Also, I assume that the shielding from backslash thingy is something that must be readied before time, not something you can cast in a moment's notice.
Wanda was too selfconfident and never expected Jillian to be able to breack free.

[Vreejack]

Oh… ouch. Not sure I like this Thinkamancer. So that's why the other two were hit so hard.

Doesn't help that she looks so much like Maggie Thatcher.

What's wrong with that? It was the first thing I noticed when I opened the page, "Oh, look, it's the ghost of Margaret Thatcher." But everyone in Britain is a Thatcherite these days, as what was once the conservative fringe is now the center. I am curious, though, as to why she was picked as a model. Other than her appearance she doesn't seem to have much in common with the Iron Lady.

I guess it's about as much as Stanley has in Common with Ace Frehly, or whoever he is currently dressed up as.

[Ethesis]

I rarely post in Erf, but I think I'm going to from now on...
Loved the line "Fatigue has begun to be a factor, Lord."

*chuckles as he surfs some more*

*EDIT* @ Pepz: Where's the typo? Sounds correct to me (as in Stanley talking).

I liked this as well. The series is starting to pull together like I hoped.

[Vreejack]

Parson still has authority in GK because Stanley never revoked his Chief Warlord status. Stanley still holds GK as well as Faq (although it seems that nobody but he, Jillian, and possibly Wanda know about it), and in his absence, without countermanding orders, Parson is in charge.

And just to spell it out, if Stanley is croaked then anyone on his payroll---which excludes any of his followers who have been captured---will be disbanded if there is no designated heir. But when will they be disbanded? Perhaps not until the start of their next turn when the daily maintenance is due. That seems fair to me.

[Ethesis]

And just to spell it out, if Stanley is croaked then anyone on his payroll---which excludes any of his followers who have been captured---will be disbanded if there is no designated heir. But when will they be disbanded? Perhaps not until the start of their next turn when the daily maintenance is due. That seems fair to me.

Though, under some circumstances, they become barbarians and can find employment as free agents.