Werewolf Central III - All potential wolves please read

[Mustiado]

Could I make a suggestion, JX?

If its going to be a problem of having people in heaven and have them to be able to find out different polarities and switches too easily, why not make the objects to be shifted neutral?

Rather than shift players, have eight objects, each representing one of the points of a compass, there when the first player reaches heaven. He can shift from the beginning, but with that many objects to shift up there, it would take a while to figure out what goes where.

[Thes Hunter]

I think it would be fun to run a game, or help run a game. PM me if you would like to plot one of the games that begin in January, or if you would like me to be one of your co-narrators.

[Dallas-Dakota]

I think it would be fun to run a game, or help run a game. PM me if you would like to plot one of the games that begin in January, or if you would like me to be one of your co-narrators.

Just trust me, its a heck of a lot work you're getting into. So becarefull.

Well, atleast for a lazy person like me.

[Thes Hunter]

I fully understand the level of responsibilty that I am requesting. Which is why I haven't been willing until now.

[Supagoof]

If Shadow wanted to play rather then narrate Titans 2, you are more then welcome to join me/us in narrating that game Thes.

But that's up to Shadow. I just know he expressed interest last time when the game was being run.

[Dallas-Dakota]

Supagoof, despite that(I think) all my team was killed by night 4 except one(to be killed on night 6 orso).

I had great fun!
Pre-sign me up for TITANS 2, pleases?

[Shadow]

Well, you seemed to do the bulk of the work last time anyway. I was kinda just along for the ride. Every time I was about to update, you'd just beat me to it or were already working on it. Things like that.
I imagine it would probably be much the same this time, as I'm even busier than I was at that point.
Hopefully that will all change in a few weeks.

Whatchawanna do Thes? Give it a shot? Join us? Play and wait for another time?
I figure I don't have the time to play being in two games right now. I can grab an update once in a while. I can send PMs for night abilities. Actually playing in a game with that many twists and what-not is a little much for me at the moment. So yeah, I was still planning on helping you in a similar fashion to last game if you wanted it. But Thes is more than welcome to join us if she wants.

[Zar Peter]

Shouldn't be the sign up thread for Titans already be there? Or do you want to brake the record for the game with the shortest sign up time?

[banjo1985]

Shouldn't be the sign up thread for Titans already be there? Or do you want to brake the record for the game with the shortest sign up time?

I dunno, particularly popular games can fill up in a matter of 2-3 days, especially at this point when there aren't many games in progress. Then you get games that fill up quickly for no conceivable reason, like the latest Fatbelly.

Titans has a reputation already as a solid, entertaining game, so it shouldn't have problems getting anyone to fill the spots.

[Uncle Festy]

As far as I'm aware, it filled up for a very specific reason – you, Banjo, are an awesome narrator and WW player, and you have a reputation for running awesomely unusual games like ACII. I'm sure that the Fatbelly reputation didn't hurt, either.

[Fin]

BackStabbery: Houses In Conflict has finished.

Doseki of House Decano won the game!

[Jontom Xire]

As poor Freshmeat just died on night one in WW Classic, I just had another idea for a protection system for veteran players.

The last one got shot down because it was considered that people might get upset depending on how they were rated, so now I present my new scheme:

The Village Militia

Every player except the wolves get an additional bane action every night. If a player is attacked by wolves there is a chance that the attack will fail that is calculated as follows:

(number of players baning target) / (original number of players)

So in a game with 30 players, say 6 wolves, if all the villagers and good guys protect Shadow then an attack on him has a 23/30 chance of failing (assuming a villager got lynched).

By night X when there are only 10 players left of which 2 are wolves, such an attack, assuming the same protection applies, the chance of such an attack failing would be 8/30.

Assuming that there are three people likely to be protected (seems typical), and a few selfish/forgetful people, then in a game with 30 people at the start, the probability of an attack failing is more likely to be in the region of 6/30 or 1/5 on night one, and will decrease from there.

This also gives villagers more of a reason to take part in the game, although we don't seem to have as many problems these days with people dropping out as we did when WW first started.

On the downside, it allows the seer and baner to both come forward. The villagers can protect the baner while the baner protects the seer or something. So to even it out the wolves would need some extra advantage of numbers or something.

What do people think?

[Boo]

As poor Freshmeat just died on night one in WW Classic, I just had another idea for a protection system for veteran players.

The last one got shot down because it was considered that people might get upset depending on how they were rated, so now I present my new scheme:

The Village Militia

Every player except the wolves get an additional bane action every night. If a player is attacked by wolves there is a chance that the attack will fail that is calculated as follows:

(number of players baning target) / (original number of players)

So in a game with 30 players, say 6 wolves, if all the villagers and good guys protect Shadow then an attack on him has a 23/30 chance of failing (assuming a villager got lynched).

By night X when there are only 10 players left of which 2 are wolves, such an attack, assuming the same protection applies, the chance of such an attack failing would be 8/30.

Assuming that there are three people likely to be protected (seems typical), and a few selfish/forgetful people, then in a game with 30 people at the start, the probability of an attack failing is more likely to be in the region of 6/30 or 1/5 on night one, and will decrease from there.

This also gives villagers more of a reason to take part in the game, although we don't seem to have as many problems these days with people dropping out as we did when WW first started.

On the downside, it allows the seer and baner to both come forward. The villagers can protect the baner while the baner protects the seer or something. So to even it out the wolves would need some extra advantage of numbers or something.

What do people think?

Why not just let the baner protect two or more people on the first 3 nights, or something? I think that could help your problem, but with all this effort to protect veteran players such as yourself, you're coming off as somewhat selfish.

[banjo1985]

I can see that being a more balanced system than the previous idea, but protection of the baner is a problem. How about, if someone used their bane to knowingly or unknowingly protect the baner, it automatically failed? Essentially meaning that the baner was exempt from the bane abilities of the other players?

And Uncle Festy, you are awesome but wrong. Fatbelly's been fun to run, but there are a few idiosynchrosies in the rules that make it potentially very unbalanced.

EDIT - It's not really selfish, it's an idea to try and help established players survive in games. Players like Jontom, Shadow and Freshmeat tend to get killed off early game without any real thought, as if they aren't on your side they're a threat. Anything that allows experienced players to enjoy the games they join up to for a few more days without breaking the game is a good thing if done properly.

[Boo]

Yeah, I didn't quite read it well enough, or at least my brain didn't. I'm up very late right now, so sorry if I'm acting dumb. I often don't get enough sleep, so... yeah.

[Alarra]

I think you're making a bigger deal out of this than you need to, Jontom. Yes. Veteran players are going to get attacked. However, if you look at games that are currently going on, you'll realize that it isn't really the problem you're making it out to be. For example, Shadow's still alive in Olde West, Goof is practically running Pirates...yeah, Freshmeat died early in Classic, but by his own admission, he's alive in something like 4 other games. And frankly, when's the last time you were killed at night anyway? You're nearly always lynched. I think that changing rules to protect veteran players would be unfair and very unbalancing.....and this is coming from someone who -always- dies early.

[Zar Peter]

And... changing rules in WW Classic would mean blasphemy!

[The Valiant Turtle]

I think you're making a bigger deal out of this than you need to, Jontom. Yes. Veteran players are going to get attacked. However, if you look at games that are currently going on, you'll realize that it isn't really the problem you're making it out to be. For example, Shadow's still alive in Olde West, Goof is practically running Pirates...yeah, Freshmeat died early in Classic, but by his own admission, he's alive in something like 4 other games. And frankly, when's the last time you were killed at night anyway? You're nearly always lynched. I think that changing rules to protect veteran players would be unfair and very unbalancing.....and this is coming from someone who -always- dies early.

I think that lately the wolf roles have been largely leaving power players alone in the hopes that they will get lynched based on the logic that if the wolves haven't kill Shadow/Alarra/Freshmeat then they must be a wolf. I'm guessing they are still getting scried early though.

[Freshmeat]

Freshmeat died early in Classic, but by his own admission, he's alive in something like 4 other games

[nitpick]Half of that actually.[/nitpick].

But just for the record: I honestly don't care at all if I get killed early on or very often (or both), so I don't think the ruleset need to be adjusted in this regard. It might be a good idea to incorporate JX's system (or a variant thereof) in a werewolf game, just to see how it works, but I personally don't believe it to be necessary.

I also think that the village militia method would be way too harsh on the narrators' PM boxes.

[Dallas-Dakota]

I also think that the village militia method would be way too harsh on the narrators' PM boxes.

SECONDED.

Because my PM box always fills up to quickly already, and I'm not running any games yet!

[Haruki-kun]

Trust me when I say that it would not work. It's one of the things that broke Alchemists II. (Among other things.)

Baner becomes known. Villagers protect Baner. Baner protects Seer. Wolves don't even have a say on who to protect.

Wolves are unable to weaken the good guys, while the good guys slowly figure out the wolves. Game over.

[Tormsskull]

As poor Freshmeat just died on night one in WW Classic, I just had another idea for a protection system for veteran players.

You know what might be entertaining in a totally chaotic sort of way? What if every player was name pathed to a different player? Meaning, when people point at Tormsskull, their points toward lynching don't actually go against Tormsskull, they go after his name path.

Example:

Tormsskull is name pathed to Jontom Xire
Jontom Xire is name pathed to Alarra.
Alarra is name pathed to Tormsskull

Villagers all point at Tormsskull, and he gets the most votes for the night. Jontom Xire dies. The name 'Tormsskull' can no longer be pointed at/wolf eaten.

Then either give the ability to determine whose name pathed to whom to the seer/devil, or create a new role on each side that can do that.

It would start off totally chaotic until each side had their chance to gather info. Could be interesting though.

[Haruki-kun]

You know what might be entertaining in a totally chaotic sort of way? What if every player was name pathed to a different player? Meaning, when people point at Tormsskull, their points toward lynching don't actually go against Tormsskull, they go after his name path.

Example:

Tormsskull is name pathed to Jontom Xire
Jontom Xire is name pathed to Alarra.
Alarra is name pathed to Tormsskull

Villagers all point at Tormsskull, and he gets the most votes for the night. Jontom Xire dies. The name 'Tormsskull' can no longer be pointed at/wolf eaten.

Then either give the ability to determine whose name pathed to whom to the seer/devil, or create a new role on each side that can do that.

It would start off totally chaotic until each side had their chance to gather info. Could be interesting though.

That sounds like a REALLY fun game

[banjo1985]

Well look'ee here...I think we might have a truely original concept here...I'd be very interested in seeing how that turns out!

[Zar Peter]

And now I'm thinking of mixing this idea with Grievers Candyland broke where the roles are named after the players...

[Boo]

You know what might be entertaining in a totally chaotic sort of way? What if every player was name pathed to a different player? Meaning, when people point at Tormsskull, their points toward lynching don't actually go against Tormsskull, they go after his name path.

Example:

Tormsskull is name pathed to Jontom Xire
Jontom Xire is name pathed to Alarra.
Alarra is name pathed to Tormsskull

Villagers all point at Tormsskull, and he gets the most votes for the night. Jontom Xire dies. The name 'Tormsskull' can no longer be pointed at/wolf eaten.

Then either give the ability to determine whose name pathed to whom to the seer/devil, or create a new role on each side that can do that.

It would start off totally chaotic until each side had their chance to gather info. Could be interesting though.

Although I know I'd join that game, it sounds like it would be completely random points until the last few people are alive.

[Zar Peter]

Although I know I'd join that game, it sounds like it would be completely random points until the last few people are alive.

Well... sooo much difference to the normal games isn't there...

[Freshmeat]

It sounds interesting, but I think some things need to be taken into account first:

If every name is pathed to one person, what happens when you kill a person whose named is pathed to a wolf? Unlynchable wolf? This is something that's going to need a specific ruling.

I think wolves and especially masons would be quite depowered if they can't properly steer the votes to anyone. They'd have no clue whether their votes are actually helping or are condemning their own even further.

Since most people will be voting somewhat randomly, what with them being unsure about what effect their vote will have, I think the game might become too chaotic unless you take specific precautions against this. What if the seer dies early? With no scries and incredibly confusing voting patterns, it'd quickly devolve into complete randomness. Even if you had somehow found 100% irrefutable evidence of someone's wolfishness, you'd still have no idea who to point at to actually get that person lynched.

[Shadow]

I'm of a mind to agree with Alarra. I don't like your idea there JX.
Sure, we tend to get killed early in games. There are plenty of other people that don't get killed early when they damned well should.
The difference?
A few of us have become famous (or infamous) in these games from our own actions.

If you want to make your name synonymous with Werewolf, you're going to pay for it....

[banjo1985]

Autolynches would also be a problem I guess.