Death Battle 5: Mister Rogers in a Bloodstained Sweater

[HolyDraconus]

Spoiler: this fight

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I was caught a bit off guard, I felt so sure when they mentioned tatsumakis inability to do both defense and offense that this was going to be the game changer. Ah well.

Spoiler: next fight

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Im sorry, but while deadpool is a 4th wall breaker, the mask is full reality warping and in the comics he is INCREDIBLY violent and lethal already. If deadpool doesnt get killed, he will be wishing he could be.

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eh. I was considering nitpicking this, but its death battle. They pick who they want to win.

I guess.

[Celestia]

Oh, is there a new Deadpool movie in the works? I can't think of any other reason to bring him back again.

There is, in fact, a third movie in the works, though I don't think it's coming out for a couple years. I'm guessing he's just back because of popularity. I mean, I like him, too, but this is just getting to be too much. There are so many other great characters out there who have never had a chance yet.

[SKarious]

At this point, I want the Mask to win, because I'm pretty tired of their Deadpool.
But CAN he win? I haven't read the comics, but I know Deadpool has some crazy regeneration properties. (I remember he once regenerated from being a pile of goo in the Cable comics).
Did Bighead fight anyone with those powers? (Ugh, I hate this name. reminds me of that abnoxious frog from Rocko's).

[TeChameleon]

I can sorta get why they're using Deadpool again, honestly- it's a running gag at this point. Not crazy about it, but eh, whatever.

I was sorta surprised by the last matchup's ending, but...

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It more or less makes sense to me the way they explained it. Tatsumaki lives in a rather higher-powered world than Mob does- the final battle from Mob Psycho 100 was kind of eclipsed in terms of insane scale by the first battle in One Punch Man. And Mob really didn't have any especially good defenses against Tatsumaki's fondness for throwing large rocks.

[HolyDraconus]

I can sorta get why they're using Deadpool again, honestly- it's a running gag at this point. Not crazy about it, but eh, whatever.

I was sorta surprised by the last matchup's ending, but...

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It more or less makes sense to me the way they explained it. Tatsumaki lives in a rather higher-powered world than Mob does- the final battle from Mob Psycho 100 was kind of eclipsed in terms of insane scale by the first battle in One Punch Man. And Mob really didn't have any especially good defenses against Tatsumaki's fondness for throwing large rocks.

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Not quite. Mob thru his mentor knows of the Cape baldy. Add in that tatsu has a degrading defense and that they ignored everything that happened to mob outside the anime and that some things about the anime season end is wrong then its just another lazy pick. Mob was phased out.

[TeChameleon]

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Not quite. Mob thru his mentor knows of the Cape baldy. Add in that tatsu has a degrading defense and that they ignored everything that happened to mob outside the anime and that some things about the anime season end is wrong then its just another lazy pick. Mob was phased out.

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... think you might be putting a bit too much weight on the throwaway gag of Reigen's One Punch Man lock screen. Besides, even if Mob had watched the OPM anime or read the manga or whatever- One Punch Man clearly has different metaphysical rules than Mob Psycho 100, so they can't be the same world- what would it have changed in the fight? And I haven't actually watched the Mob Psycho 100 anime, just read the manga, and the stuff they said in the Death Battle still rang more or less true for me.

For that matter, they didn't even ignore the manga- they acknowledged the giant twister thingy that Mob created at the very end of the manga, so it's probably a fair assumption that they were at least aware of what happened. Tatsumaki had... 'degrading defense', as you put it, but she had an overwhelming offensive advantage in terms of shown feats. Sometimes the best defense really is a good offense.

[Man on Fire]

So, I've been recently thinking about Death Battle to suggest involving Dragon Ball characters and came up with another idea.

There is a Marvel character named Skaar, Son of Hulk. Who is...exactly that, son of Hulk and an alien stone warrior woman with geokinetic powers. He inherited both parents' abilities and is kinda like green space Conan except he can also do things like control earth, shape lava, cause Earthquakes, sense presence and even read minds of people touching the ground, create rock spikes, etc And also, he has media outside of comics, being part of the main cast on animated series Hulk and Agents of S.M.A.S.H.

So which DBZ character would make a better opponent for him in hypothetical Death Battle? Gohan is a better thematic foil due to completely different paths in life, but Future Trunks shares his whole "sword-wielding grizzled warrior" thing and could turn the battle into a swordfight.

[McNum]

So, I've been recently thinking about Death Battle to suggest involving Dragon Ball characters and came up with another idea.

There is a Marvel character named Skaar, Son of Hulk. Who is...exactly that, son of Hulk and an alien stone warrior woman with geokinetic powers. He inherited both parents' abilities and is kinda like green space Conan except he can also do things like control earth, shape lava, cause Earthquakes, sense presence and even read minds of people touching the ground, create rock spikes, etc And also, he has media outside of comics, being part of the main cast on animated series Hulk and Agents of S.M.A.S.H.

So which DBZ character would make a better opponent for him in hypothetical Death Battle? Gohan is a better thematic foil due to completely different paths in life, but Future Trunks shares his whole "sword-wielding grizzled warrior" thing and could turn the battle into a swordfight.

I'm thinking... Super Broly.

He's green, he gets angry like you would not believe, and it took a blue Gogeta to fight him evenly. But he's just a nice boy who wants to make friends, really.

Basically, if you're nice to Broly, he gets all confused and tries to be nice. You make him angry, well... He did punch reality so hard it broke mid-fight. Then continued to fight on anyway because he got angry about that, too.

Maybe he'd be a better opponent to just plain Hulk, but I'm honestly not sure who's more ridiculous of those two.

[Reddish Mage]

So, I've been recently thinking about Death Battle to suggest involving Dragon Ball characters and came up with another idea.

There is a Marvel character named Skaar, Son of Hulk. Who is...exactly that, son of Hulk and an alien stone warrior woman with geokinetic powers. He inherited both parents' abilities and is kinda like green space Conan except he can also do things like control earth, shape lava, cause Earthquakes, sense presence and even read minds of people touching the ground, create rock spikes, etc And also, he has media outside of comics, being part of the main cast on animated series Hulk and Agents of S.M.A.S.H.

So which DBZ character would make a better opponent for him in hypothetical Death Battle? Gohan is a better thematic foil due to completely different paths in life, but Future Trunks shares his whole "sword-wielding grizzled warrior" thing and could turn the battle into a swordfight.

I like the idea of Skaar vs. Future Trunks. Trunks is a character that deserves a DB and Skaar an interesting choice of opponent. The ability of the two to cross swords and clash with similar powers and attacks is absolutely crucial to a properly animated fight.

Gohan is far less interesting both because his abilities don't mesh the same way as Trunks and because Gohan is simply less interesting as a warrior. Everyone's seen what Gohan can do anyway (and knows that he'd be able to cream Skaar). Trunks has a lot of side-stories and less well-known material.

Still, at the end of the day, I'm not sure Skaar can come near the strength of Super Saiyan 2, and Trunks has more tricks up his sleeve after that.

[HolyDraconus]

I like the idea of Skaar vs. Future Trunks. Trunks is a character that deserves a DB and Skaar an interesting choice of opponent. The ability of the two to cross swords and clash with similar powers and attacks is absolutely crucial to a properly animated fight.

Gohan is far less interesting both because his abilities don't mesh the same way as Trunks and because Gohan is simply less interesting as a warrior. Everyone's seen what Gohan can do anyway (and knows that he'd be able to cream Skaar). Trunks has a lot of side-stories and less well-known material.

Still, at the end of the day, I'm not sure Skaar can come near the strength of Super Saiyan 2, and Trunks has more tricks up his sleeve after that.

Spoiler: like this?

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[Man on Fire]

I like the idea of Skaar vs. Future Trunks. Trunks is a character that deserves a DB and Skaar an interesting choice of opponent. The ability of the two to cross swords and clash with similar powers and attacks is absolutely crucial to a properly animated fight.

Gohan is far less interesting both because his abilities don't mesh the same way as Trunks and because Gohan is simply less interesting as a warrior. Everyone's seen what Gohan can do anyway (and knows that he'd be able to cream Skaar). Trunks has a lot of side-stories and less well-known material.

Still, at the end of the day, I'm not sure Skaar can come near the strength of Super Saiyan 2, and Trunks has more tricks up his sleeve after that.

I would give it to Trunks too. It would be a close match, tho. Old Power has enough uses to match many of DB techniques and ki attacks. Skaar has superior strength and durability, having taken and dealt blows to Hulk, Silver Surfer, Thor, Thing, She-Hulk. But Trunks can fly, is MUUUCH faster, and relies on technique and strategy while Skaar is almost always just brute strength and instinct.

[Iamyourking]

The winner is:

Spoiler

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The Mask. Not much of a surprise there.

Next time:

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All Might vs Might Guy. I feel like there might be some difficulties determining their capabilities when one of them is explicitly only at a fraction of his full power in every appearance he's made.

[HolyDraconus]

The winner is:

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The Mask. Not much of a surprise there.

Next time:

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All Might vs Might Guy. I feel like there might be some difficulties determining their capabilities when one of them is explicitly only at a fraction of his full power in every appearance he's made.

Spoiler: The interesting part

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About this battle.... they did a "reel" of their questionable fights. INCLUDING Gaara vs Toph. I'm not saying its all of them, but... they seem to recognize them. Which were... Cloud vs Link. Wonder Woman vs Rogue. Tifa vs Whatshername(sorry, she eludes me). Superman vs Goku (I'm assuming fight 1.) So I guess, improvement?

Spoiler: Next Time

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Guy would need to resort to the Gates, AM will probably just use another finger. Though if they go with what's displayed only, even though AM is SUPPOSED to be leagues stronger, they may tone him to what's displayed, which Guy has surpassed. Which would be dumb but not unexpected.

[Kitten Champion]

Next time:

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All Might vs Might Guy. I feel like there might be some difficulties determining their capabilities when one of them is explicitly only at a fraction of his full power in every appearance he's made.

Not a bad idea for a match-up really.

The only real idea I had for All Might was Toguro from Yu Yu Hakusho as they've got essentially the same power-set. Though objectively speaking Toguro would most likely win without much issue. Regardless, even if they thought of it, Toguro wouldn't get the clicks.

[Forum Explorer]

Spoiler: The interesting part

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About this battle.... they did a "reel" of their questionable fights. INCLUDING Gaara vs Toph. I'm not saying its all of them, but... they seem to recognize them. Which were... Cloud vs Link. Wonder Woman vs Rogue. Tifa vs Whatshername(sorry, she eludes me). Superman vs Goku (I'm assuming fight 1.) So I guess, improvement?

Spoiler: Next Time

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Guy would need to resort to the Gates, AM will probably just use another finger. Though if they go with what's displayed only, even though AM is SUPPOSED to be leagues stronger, they may tone him to what's displayed, which Guy has surpassed. Which would be dumb but not unexpected.

Spoiler: Interesting Thing

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Call it controversial fights. If we are complaining about them here, then they are certainly being complained about elsewhere, and I'm sure Deathbattle has heard those complaints. That doesn't mean they agree with said complaints though.

The part I liked about this one was calling out what a horrible mismatch of a fight it was.

Spoiler: Next time

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It makes it really tough to stat out AM abilities because he specifically avoids collateral damage. While Guy doesn't really care, or rather, doesn't typically fight inside cities full of non-combatants.

[Rater202]

Spoiler: Intersting Thing

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If they're calling out Controversial fights, I still want them to revisit Carnage vs Lucy.

They don't have to use the stuff from Absolute Carnage since strictly speaking he was wearing a different symbiote, but Web of Venom Carnage Born and Web of Venom: Funeral Pyre reiterate the fact from Carnage volume 2 that Cletus and any symbiote he wears are magically resistant to all forms of fire and sonics.

If that resistance applies to literal hellfire which burns hotter than any mortal fire can, it should apply to Lucy's explosion finisher and that completely changes the outcome of the fight.

It would have been Lucy pointlessly tearing Cletus apart only for him to keep recovering until she either melted down or got tired enough to get sloppy.

If you count his feats as Dark Carnage, well, he's strong enough to almost casually kill the Incredible Hulk. Now, to be fair, it was Savage Hulk and he wasn't too mad at the time, but he was wearing Venom.

[Traab]

Next time,

Spoiler

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I get the feeling its going to start with gai getting wrecked, then opening gate after gate till he reaches 8. At that point his foot can warp space time through sheer physical power. He wins. All Might is even at his final battle, at city block destroying levels of toughness and strength. And I like the way they are probably matching the timer of the 8 gates with the timer of how long all might can stay buffed up. It will be a good fight, but I fully expect to see united states of smash clash with night gai and night gai overpowering it. Possibly a double ko since its lethal to him as well, but maybe he gets the win because he keeps breathing for roughly 30 seconds before he finishes dying.

This fight,

Spoiler

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wasnt even remotely a surprise.

[HolyDraconus]

Spoiler: Intersting Thing

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If they're calling out Controversial fights, I still want them to revisit Carnage vs Lucy.

They don't have to use the stuff from Absolute Carnage since strictly speaking he was wearing a different symbiote, but Web of Venom Carnage Born and Web of Venom: Funeral Pyre reiterate the fact from Carnage volume 2 that Cletus and any symbiote he wears are magically resistant to all forms of fire and sonics.

If that resistance applies to literal hellfire which burns hotter than any mortal fire can, it should apply to Lucy's explosion finisher and that completely changes the outcome of the fight.

It would have been Lucy pointlessly tearing Cletus apart only for him to keep recovering until she either melted down or got tired enough to get sloppy.

If you count his feats as Dark Carnage, well, he's strong enough to almost casually kill the Incredible Hulk. Now, to be fair, it was Savage Hulk and he wasn't too mad at the time, but he was wearing Venom.

Spoiler: I dunno

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I still would give it to Lucy, on the fact that she was strong enough to pop the planet. With the range needed to do that she can keep Carnage at bay more than long enough to find a near permanent solution to him.

[Rater202]

Spoiler: I dunno

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I still would give it to Lucy, on the fact that she was strong enough to pop the planet. With the range needed to do that she can keep Carnage at bay more than long enough to find a near permanent solution to him.

Spoiler

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At that point it stops being a deathbattle and starts being a game of hide and seek.

[Forum Explorer]

Spoiler: Intersting Thing

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If they're calling out Controversial fights, I still want them to revisit Carnage vs Lucy.

They don't have to use the stuff from Absolute Carnage since strictly speaking he was wearing a different symbiote, but Web of Venom Carnage Born and Web of Venom: Funeral Pyre reiterate the fact from Carnage volume 2 that Cletus and any symbiote he wears are magically resistant to all forms of fire and sonics.

If that resistance applies to literal hellfire which burns hotter than any mortal fire can, it should apply to Lucy's explosion finisher and that completely changes the outcome of the fight.

It would have been Lucy pointlessly tearing Cletus apart only for him to keep recovering until she either melted down or got tired enough to get sloppy.

If you count his feats as Dark Carnage, well, he's strong enough to almost casually kill the Incredible Hulk. Now, to be fair, it was Savage Hulk and he wasn't too mad at the time, but he was wearing Venom.

Spoiler: Lucy vs Carnage

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As I said before, Lucy can actually tear Carnage apart on a cellular level. Or rather, she can rebuild someone on a cellular level, so she can certainly do the opposite. So even if pushing Carnage into the core of the Earth isn't hot enough (or at least deep into the mantle), then she can still just disintegrate him.

As far as I can tell Lucy had four ways to win that fight;

1. A nuclear level explosive attack
2. Throwing Carnage into deep space
3. Pushing Carnage down a volcano, into the mantle.
4. Tearing him apart on a cellular level.

While Carnage had none. He couldn't even wear Lucy out, because Lucy could just walk away on her absurdly long vectors and take a nap if she was being pressed. There is pretty much no chance of causing Lucy to melt because her melting happened when she used the nuclear level explosion, took on an entire naval fleet where she both tore ships/planes apart and defended against missile strikes, attacked a city, and put her boyfriend back together on a cellular level all at the same time. And that was after a really long and emotional day.

So yeah, even if one or two of those methods wouldn't work, Lucy still has more methods that would probably work, so it seems like a pretty solid defeat for Carnage.

[Rater202]

I'm not spoiling this, becuase we're not talking spoilers anymore.

On the proposed ways Lucy could defeat.

1: As I've said before, he's canonically survived an explosion that would be much, much greater than any nuclear explosion in history by a wide margin, being able to use his body to absorb most of it's energy so that instead of being strong enough to deliver it's payload across the world it merely destroyed the top couple of floors of a standard-sized skyscraper. It incapacitated him for a while, but then in a storyline that predated Lucy versus Carnage by about a year, he categorically lost his weakness to fire and sonic vibrations, treating attacks by them as any other attack, which with his toughness and healing a factor makes him practically immune to anything short of uncontrolled atmospheric reentry, which did canonically kill his symbiote(he survived, but died from wounds he suffered on impact a minute later. He was later resurrected as a zombie.) Note that the Carnage symbiote had literally just reconstituted itself from molecules at the time and further recreated Cletus's entire body from scratch just before entry. At full strength, he can shrug off literal Hellfire. All that would do is amuse him.

2: Throwing Carnage into deep space isn't a kill. Symbiotes are fully capable of serving as spacesuits and symbiote hosts don't age or have to breathe. They can also apparently go indefinitely without food as long as the symbiote isn't suffering from some kind of chemical deficiency, and under certain circumstances, they're even capable of self-propelled space-flight. the only reason Carnage didn't come back from the Sentry tossing him into space was becuase Sentry literally tore Kassady in half and then tossed him into the vacuum more or less unprotected. Symbiote had to put him into, essentially, a medically induced coma and cocoon him until he healed. The second time he was spaced, it was as a Poison and his return to earth was an unintended side effect of reconstituting his body.

3: Only works if there's an active volcano near buy. Even then, with his heat resistance that's basically just burying him in some thick mud. It might take some time but he'll just dig his way back up.

4: Tearing Carnage apart at the cellular level means nothing. The symbiote has been able to regenerate from trace amounts of itself bonded to Cletus' bloodstream since Maximum Carnage, from molecules small enough to fit between the rungs in his genetic helix since he was arrested after Carnage USA(Minimum carnage indicates that the prison he was sent to after that kept taking away his symbiote and destroying it only for it to immediately regenerate from seemingly nowhere on his body and they tested to find out why then gave up on taking it from him) and has been able to completely reconstitute Cletus's body from literally nothing since Web of Venom: Carnage Born. Tearing them apart at the cellular level is pointless. At most, it'll buy a few seconds, maybe a minute, each time she does it but eventually, she's either gonna get tired or start melting down(literally) from overuse of her powers and there will be a pissed off Cletus right there waiting to take advantage of that.

And that's just Cletus himself and the Carnage symbiote. If he's "Dark Carnage"(Zombie Cletus with the Grendal Symbiote and well over a thousand absorbed Codexes and one or two forcibly absorbed symbiotes) or "Devil Carnage" (The same, but after forcibly assimilating the Venom symbiote and taking the traces of Venom left in The Incredible Hulk's body, after killing the Hulk, who was wearing Venom at the time.) then he's able to replicate his symbiote thousands of times over in order to build an army of symbiote powered homeless people and mental patients with no personal loss of power, which he can absorb to give himself a small power boost(and those small boosts add up big time, see "killing the Hulk") who operate as an extension of himself and has access to Ghost Rider powers and demonic sorcery and has added the combat skills of a bunch of soldiers, criminals, and even a couple of superheroes to his own, in addition to all of the above powers becuase the Grendal absorbed multible pieces of the orignal carnage symbiote--well over a thousand--and can thus be assumed to have it's abillities since it even demonstratesa few

(Originally, Carnage's ability to use pieces of itself to possess people was demandant on having enough extra biomass--he ate a the entirety of a slaughterhouse's product, staff, and unprocessed carcasses to convert them into extra biomass in Carnage USA--or an Outside power, such as the Elder God Cthon--to possess people. With Grendal, he can seemingly make big enough bits of symbiote out of nothing. Leaving the possession out of the first figh was fair, but if a rematch happened and if they used Dark or Devil Carnage, there's no reason not to use the army.)

And if Lucy can walk away to take a nap, then that kind of defeats the point of it being a fight to the death. You don't get to call breaks, leave, and take a nap in a fight to the death. Maybe if Carnage punted her over the horizon and had to walk for a few hours to get to her she could nap, but I'm not seeing him doing that instead of going for the kill and even if he does she better be awake by the time he gets to her or she's dead.

[Forum Explorer]

I'm not spoiling this, becuase we're not talking spoilers anymore.

On the proposed ways Lucy could defeat.

1: As I've said before, he's canonically survived an explosion that would be much, much greater than any nuclear explosion in history by a wide margin, being able to use his body to absorb most of it's energy so that instead of being strong enough to deliver it's payload across the world it merely destroyed the top couple of floors of a standard-sized skyscraper. It incapacitated him for a while, but then in a storyline that predated Lucy versus Carnage by about a year, he categorically lost his weakness to fire and sonic vibrations, treating attacks by them as any other attack, which with his toughness and healing a factor makes him practically immune to anything short of uncontrolled atmospheric reentry, which did canonically kill his symbiote(he survived, but died from wounds he suffered on impact a minute later. He was later resurrected as a zombie.) Note that the Carnage symbiote had literally just reconstituted itself from molecules at the time and further recreated Cletus's entire body from scratch just before entry. At full strength, he can shrug off literal Hellfire. All that would do is amuse him.

2: Throwing Carnage into deep space isn't a kill. Symbiotes are fully capable of serving as spacesuits and symbiote hosts don't age or have to breathe. They can also apparently go indefinitely without food as long as the symbiote isn't suffering from some kind of chemical deficiency, and under certain circumstances, they're even capable of self-propelled space-flight. the only reason Carnage didn't come back from the Sentry tossing him into space was becuase Sentry literally tore Kassady in half and then tossed him into the vacuum more or less unprotected. Symbiote had to put him into, essentially, a medically induced coma and cocoon him until he healed. The second time he was spaced, it was as a Poison and his return to earth was an unintended side effect of reconstituting his body.

3: Only works if there's an active volcano near buy. Even then, with his heat resistance that's basically just burying him in some thick mud. It might take some time but he'll just dig his way back up.

4: Tearing Carnage apart at the cellular level means nothing. The symbiote has been able to regenerate from trace amounts of itself bonded to Cletus' bloodstream since Maximum Carnage, from molecules small enough to fit between the rungs in his genetic helix since he was arrested after Carnage USA(Minimum carnage indicates that the prison he was sent to after that kept taking away his symbiote and destroying it only for it to immediately regenerate from seemingly nowhere on his body and they tested to find out why then gave up on taking it from him) and has been able to completely reconstitute Cletus's body from literally nothing since Web of Venom: Carnage Born. Tearing them apart at the cellular level is pointless. At most, it'll buy a few seconds, maybe a minute, each time she does it but eventually, she's either gonna get tired or start melting down(literally) from overuse of her powers and there will be a pissed off Cletus right there waiting to take advantage of that.

And that's just Cletus himself and the Carnage symbiote. If he's "Dark Carnage"(Zombie Cletus with the Grendal Symbiote and well over a thousand absorbed Codexes and one or two forcibly absorbed symbiotes) or "Devil Carnage" (The same, but after forcibly assimilating the Venom symbiote and taking the traces of Venom left in The Incredible Hulk's body, after killing the Hulk, who was wearing Venom at the time.) then he's able to replicate his symbiote thousands of times over in order to build an army of symbiote powered homeless people and mental patients with no personal loss of power, which he can absorb to give himself a small power boost(and those small boosts add up big time, see "killing the Hulk") who operate as an extension of himself and has access to Ghost Rider powers and demonic sorcery and has added the combat skills of a bunch of soldiers, criminals, and even a couple of superheroes to his own, in addition to all of the above powers becuase the Grendal absorbed multible pieces of the orignal carnage symbiote--well over a thousand--and can thus be assumed to have it's abillities since it even demonstratesa few

(Originally, Carnage's ability to use pieces of itself to possess people was demandant on having enough extra biomass--he ate a the entirety of a slaughterhouse's product, staff, and unprocessed carcasses to convert them into extra biomass in Carnage USA--or an Outside power, such as the Elder God Cthon--to possess people. With Grendal, he can seemingly make big enough bits of symbiote out of nothing. Leaving the possession out of the first figh was fair, but if a rematch happened and if they used Dark or Devil Carnage, there's no reason not to use the army.)

And if Lucy can walk away to take a nap, then that kind of defeats the point of it being a fight to the death. You don't get to call breaks, leave, and take a nap in a fight to the death. Maybe if Carnage punted her over the horizon and had to walk for a few hours to get to her she could nap, but I'm not seeing him doing that instead of going for the kill and even if he does she better be awake by the time he gets to her or she's dead.

1. As I've said, I've read that comic. There was absolutely nothing suggesting that the explosion was anything near the levels you are suggesting. At all.

2. Space is big. Throw someone at the right angle and speed and they'll likely never see Earth again, just because they won't be able to catch up to the planet. It's a technical KO, but those have happen in DB before.

3. When your range is orbital, going to a volcano is trivial. And there are plenty of famous volcanoes in the world. As for thick mud, remember that the deeper you go, the higher the pressure you experience. What's the heaviest thing that Carnage has ever moved? Pressure increases by nearly a million times when you are that deep.

4. I will point out that it is dumb and doesn't make sense (small things are typically easier to destroy then big things. That's why DNA is kept inside a cell in the first place. To protect it. That's why cooking food is so effective at making things safe to eat. It destroys the viruses without ruining the food.) but will overall concede the point.

[Rater202]

1. As I've said, I've read that comic. There was absolutely nothing suggesting that the explosion was anything near the levels you are suggesting. At all.

2. Space is big. Throw someone at the right angle and speed and they'll likely never see Earth again, just because they won't be able to catch up to the planet. It's a technical KO, but those have happen in DB before.

3. When your range is orbital, going to a volcano is trivial. And there are plenty of famous volcanoes in the world. As for thick mud, remember that the deeper you go, the higher the pressure you experience. What's the heaviest thing that Carnage has ever moved? Pressure increases by nearly a million times when you are that deep.

4. I will point out that it is dumb and doesn't make sense (small things are typically easier to destroy then big things. That's why DNA is kept inside a cell in the first place. To protect it. That's why cooking food is so effective at making things safe to eat. It destroys the viruses without ruining the food.) but will overall concede the point.

1: Basic logic dictates that if the explosions payload is to reach worldwide distribution, it must be several orders of magnitude larger than the greatest explosion ever created. Lucy's explosion is far less powerful than that, and thus would not be comparable to the explosion that Carnage survived. This is in addition to the fact that Carnage had lost his weakness to fire and sonic vibrations in between surviving that explosion and the time DB announced Carnage vs Lucy. I can't stress this enough, literal Hellfire created by The Heir of Mephisto, fire so hot that it burns things that have no physical substance, such as souls, had absolutely no effect on Carnage when he was at full strength. No ordinary explosion, no matter how big, is going to hurt him.

2: When it comes to Carnage, there is no "technical" KO. There is "dead," there is "in prison" and there is "is going to kill you." Throwing him into pace only lasts until Alpha Flight or SWORD sees him breaching Orbit and grab him to make sure he's dead.

3: It still takes time to physically carry him to a Volcano and presumably Lucy needs to be able to see that far. Carnage is a borderline immortal that's basically impervious to harm. It doesn't matter what his maximum lift is, he just needs to be able to move enough to keep digging up. It'll get easier as he climbs higher.

4: Physically tearing molecules part would require you to be able to see individual molecules and manipulate them. As long as Carnage has even a handful of molecules, it, and by extension Cletus, can't die. Being able to physically manipulate cells is one thing, but molecules are another thing entirely.

If Carnage is determined to kill Lucy, he will kill Lucy. It's not a matter of if. It's a matter of how long does it take and how frustrated is he that it's taking this long

Two of you proposed win scenarios would be ineffective. Two are just delaying the inevitable.

And the throw him int space one is less effective if he's Dark Carnage or Devil Carnage, since the Grendal symbiote is capable of independent space-flight. forgot to mention that when I was detailing how even more screwed she'd be if we took all of Absolute Carnage into account and not just the parts that apply to Cletus and hs symbiote.

[Lemmy]

C'mon, guys! Let's not turn the whole thread into a discussion about our hangups of a single match!

Let's change the subject a little!

So... That Goku vs Superman... What a cheat, huh?

[Anteros]

You could show Rater a video of Stan Lee himself drawing an official Marvel comic with Carnage losing that fight and they still wouldn't buy it. It's best to just move on.

[Rater202]

You could show Rater a video of Stan Lee himself drawing an official Marvel comic with Carnage losing that fight and they still wouldn't buy it. It's best to just move on.

I don't buy it because DB ignored that Carnage had been immune to heat and sonics for a year by the time they announced the matchup and Lucy's win is predicated on a weakness that Carnage no longer had.

You might have noticed that during the battle, the big finishing explosion that killed him was also the only thing that did any meaningful damage. Carnage would have won by attrition if DB hadn't ignored Carnage vol 2, becuase nothing else Lucy has could do meaningful damage. Especially now that we know that that fire immunity extends to the literal fires of Hell.

"Ignoring an objective fact about the character that would have radically changed the results of the matchup" is a perfectly valid criticism and I find it somewhat annoying that you would dismiss it out of hand.

I still want a rematch with that immunity taken into account. Bonus points if they take Absolute Carnage into account becuase Dark Carnage's final form has an amazing design and I'd like to see it animated, even in crude sprite animation.

[HolyDraconus]

snip

This battle is probably one of the few where they CAN hide behind the fact that the animation doesn't always represent the results. The fact is, Carnage can not touch Lucy. She literally has the range of being able to physically touch the moon. She can toss him into space. Battle over. He does not have the speed to evade it, and can't match her range. Since it's a death battle, its 1v1. So no sword, alpha flight, goombas, anything to pick him up and check to see if hes dead. What defense does he has to that? And remember, that's just A way to win, and probably the easiest.

[Rater202]

What defense does he has to that? And remember, that's just A way to win, and probably the easiest.

Being able to survive in space indefinitely and, depending on when the in the timeline he's in, fly under his own power. It ain't a tournament, there's no wining by ring out.

Temporary kills might count for the purposes of the battle, but it doesn't matter becuase Carnage doesn't get tired and Lucy can't hurt him. Spacing him isn't a win.

Lucy will get tired before Cletus does.

[Traab]

Yeah im honestly unsure how ring outs work as its never really been an issue in death battles before as the only time long distances are involved both sides are capable of teleportation or greater than lightspeed travel so it turns into more a 3 second annoyance as (made up example here) stephen strange gets sent to the hoary realms of niblgurth the malevolent, sighs, then opens a sling ring back to the battle, or its a running battle where both sides are traveling as they fight like the flash or with the superman/goku fights. I have to wonder if it WOULD be treated as a win if the character was capable of getting back to the battle, but not for some significant length of time, meaning taking longer than a few seconds or a minute or two at most. I do admit to finding the idea funny, lucy hurls carnage into space, powers down, gets to work on whatever after battle care she requires, gets a drink of tea, there is a whistling sound getting louder then BLAMMO! Carnage spears right through her like a flaming meteor made of razor blades.

[Man on Fire]

I don't buy it because DB ignored that Carnage had been immune to heat and sonics for a year by the time they announced the matchup and Lucy's win is predicated on a weakness that Carnage no longer had.

You might have noticed that during the battle, the big finishing explosion that killed him was also the only thing that did any meaningful damage. Carnage would have won by attrition if DB hadn't ignored Carnage vol 2, becuase nothing else Lucy has could do meaningful damage. Especially now that we know that that fire immunity extends to the literal fires of Hell.

"Ignoring an objective fact about the character that would have radically changed the results of the matchup" is a perfectly valid criticism and I find it somewhat annoying that you would dismiss it out of hand.

I still want a rematch with that immunity taken into account. Bonus points if they take Absolute Carnage into account becuase Dark Carnage's final form has an amazing design and I'd like to see it animated, even in crude sprite animation.

I would rather not have Carnage again on the account that Absolute Garbage was a horrible book writtenby someone who screwed over other titles to boost up its sales and couldn't even care enough to work with other writers and then had the nerve whining he is being pirated.

Also, you're wrong on the fire immunity thing. After Carnage vol.2 ended there was no indication Chton's blessing wasn't taken away from Cletus. It wasn't until this year Absolute Garbage that it was established that Cletus still has it and even between his return to life and establishing this facts people assumed all traits of fire immunity he showed were results of a different power boost from Knull. DB had no reason to beleive Carnage's fire immunity wasn't as temporary as Rune King Thor.