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2024-02-12, 10:42 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Feb 2017
Re: OOTS #1297 - The Discussion Thread
Indeed. That has nothing to do with the starmetal.
Who said anything about rule violation?
We were talking about rules being discarded. A DM has full authority over what rules they chose to apply or ignore, that does not mean that not applying a rule isn't discarding the rule.
A rule violation would be something like using a loaded dice set or not subtracting damage to HP, not things that would happen in this comic.
Who said anything about hundreds?
Again, no one was talking about rule violation. Thor doing the deed is explicitly portrayed as a discarding of the rules,
Then why are you arguing that the author never (or very rarely, since you're willing to let me "take it as one") discarded/ignored game rules (or as you put it, The Rules) for the benefit of the story?
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2024-02-13, 12:30 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Mar 2016
Re: OOTS #1297 - The Discussion Thread
Almost nothing is impossible, but that is exceedingly unlikely. The chance is less than one in a trillion. I think it is small enough to conclude that there's a biased coin - not to the level of absolute certainty, but enough so that the chances of it happening randomly can be discounted.
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2024-02-13, 01:16 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Oct 2008
Re: OOTS #1297 - The Discussion Thread
I'm not following this debate closely but I'm compelled to interject that (IIRC) in the Blood commentary Rich admitted that Break Enchantment takes 10 minutes and Durkon wouldn't have Detect Magic available again. While the second has the thumb-induced break as a factor they both fit into the 'story over rule verification' column. This feels deep in the 'A Wizard Did It' territory with the added fun that people think they can deduce exactly how a wizard would do it.
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2024-02-13, 02:27 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: OOTS #1297 - The Discussion Thread
If you wanna play this by the rules, Rules Compendium says "A spellcasting creature that lacks hands or arms can provide any somatic component a spell might require by moving its body." claws instead of fingers are fine. Not moving your body, and having spells shoot from the eyes, is strange.
Getting a googolplex heads in a row with a fair coin is improbable, not impossible, either. The rest of your point has nothing to do with sample size. The argument wasn't "we analytically know that X", it was "we conclude that X". Concluding stuff through induction is at the basis of pretty much everything we do, and it seems weird to say it can't be done in this context.
Which leads us back to the claim that the sample size is small. I'll assume that we're saying it's too small for the evidence to be overwhelming. It supremely isn't, despite our intuition saying so. You've got a better chance of winning the powerball by buying a single ticket twice in a row than getting 90 or more heads out of a 100 coin flips with a fair coin.Screaming defiance with the last breath
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2024-02-13, 04:22 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Feb 2024
Re: OOTS #1297 - The Discussion Thread
That's one thing V didn't extrapolate from Xykon during their battle: 'If you're going to use a type of damage, try to have an item or something that makes you immune to it - or at least resistant.'
A couple of extended protection from energy-spells wouldn't go amiss, either.
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2024-02-13, 04:32 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Jul 2016
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Re: OOTS #1297 - The Discussion Thread
To be fair, that was about AoE damage spells, especially the type that can catch you in the radius. Which is why Xykon could get away with casting a Stilled Meteor Swarm at point-blank range.
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2024-02-13, 04:55 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Feb 2024
Re: OOTS #1297 - The Discussion Thread
To be sure. It would be nice to see V take that to the next level by improving their personal defenses, be it by doodads or spells, though. Learning the lesson and taking its wisdom to the next level.
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2024-02-13, 06:43 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Dec 2009
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2024-02-13, 09:51 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Jun 2008
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2024-02-13, 12:10 PM (ISO 8601)
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- May 2015
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Re: OOTS #1297 - The Discussion Thread
I get the idea that this power is linked to the weapons of legacy book, and Roy's discovery of various powers as he uses his grandfather's reforged sword.
https://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots1010.html and other strips on the ship and elsewhere.
Perhaps the starmetal enhanced some of the sword's latent powers? It did increase it's magical + to hit ...
As to Thor: Thor's gonna be Thor.Avatar by linklele. How Teleport Worksa. Malifice (paraphrased):
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2024-02-13, 12:25 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Dec 2019
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Re: OOTS #1297 - The Discussion Thread
Starmetal powers are rule breaking by its nature of being "wishy washy emotional magic" with impossible to predict results, according to Eugene the Wizard.
Last edited by Precure; 2024-02-13 at 12:27 PM.
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2024-02-13, 12:50 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Feb 2024
Re: OOTS #1297 - The Discussion Thread
I thought that was Eugene's comment on the powers of a Weapon of Legacy being connected to emotion, rather than wizardly construction of spells. I'm not sure whether he even knows the sword has been reforged with starmetal; his only concession to the importance of the greenhilt sword to his family seems to have been that he didn't just dump or destroy it after Horace passed away.
Last edited by Grendelkin; 2024-02-13 at 12:54 PM.
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2024-02-13, 01:12 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Aug 2022
Re: OOTS #1297 - The Discussion Thread
At question is not the fact that there's an "S" in the spell requirements list, but that the text actually says that the ray "srpings from your hand". To be perfectly honest, if I was GMing D&D, I'd allow ray type spells to be fired from whatever body part the caster wanted, as long as they meet the other requirements for casting the spell. At the end of the day, that's a purely cosmetic difference and I don't care about it one bit.
I doubt Rich does either.
Yeah. My assumption is that the only effect from the starmetal itself is the +5 bonus, and the occasional green glow that does extra damage to undead. The other effects (like healing up Roy, and returning to his hand), are from it being a Weapon of Legacy.
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2024-02-13, 01:26 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Feb 2024
Re: OOTS #1297 - The Discussion Thread
The green glow and extra damage to undead did get mentioned as side-effects of reforging the sword with starmetal by the master bladesmith, back in Azure City.
But can we be sure that the Greenhilt sword wasn't already in the process of becoming a Weapon of Legacy even then? If so, then the glow might have been incorporated into the Legacy effect as the sword 'evolved' with Roy's adventures and his continuing dedication to it.
And possibly it did none of this for Horace because to him, it was just 'my sword'. He took good care of it and used it well, but he didn't have a problem with handing it off to Roy in the middle of battle. To him, it would have been the tool of his trade, but not a symbol.
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2024-02-13, 02:19 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: OOTS #1297 - The Discussion Thread
Green light effect is part of every unusual power the sword shown to have, so the source must be same, whether it's due to starmetal or due to legacy.
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2024-02-13, 02:37 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Feb 2017
Re: OOTS #1297 - The Discussion Thread
Reforging the Greatsword into a +5 starmetal sword after it was shattered by an epic-level Lich against whom the wielder has a blood oath to defeat was likely a significant step into making a Weapon of Legacy.
So it's probable that any power the sword has or will have in the future will be based/themed around the "core" of that green, flame-like effect granted by the starmetal.
That's how legends grow, after all.Last edited by Unoriginal; 2024-02-13 at 02:38 PM.
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2024-02-13, 04:31 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Aug 2022
Re: OOTS #1297 - The Discussion Thread
Absolutely. And that's what causes all the other effects. But the "deadly green glow that is particularly harmful to the undead" and the +5 bonus is explicitly stated to be a function of a starmetal forged sword.
The returning and restoration (and probably the whole "he can make it glow for more than a moment at a time while striking" effects seem to be from it becoming a weapon of legacy.
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2024-02-13, 04:43 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: OOTS #1297 - The Discussion Thread
I believe this to be incorrect, the chance of winning powerball grand prize on a single ticket is 1 in 292.2 million [Per internet search], twice in a row is thus a chance of 1.17122E-17.
The chance of exactly 90 heads out of 100 tosses from EXCEL is "=(COMBIN(100,90)/2^100", which is 1.36554E-17. About 16% greater than the chance of two lottery wins in a row, and if you throw in the chance of 90 or more heads out of 100 is slightly larger still.
The two are however, surprisingly close.Last edited by Doug Lampert; 2024-02-13 at 04:43 PM.
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2024-02-13, 05:02 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Apr 2020
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Re: OOTS #1297 - The Discussion Thread
Screaming defiance with the last breath
It would be strange indeed if so celestial an article as FREEDOM should not be highly rated.
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2024-02-13, 05:34 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Feb 2017
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2024-02-13, 06:57 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Aug 2022
Re: OOTS #1297 - The Discussion Thread
Yeah. I think that's certainly close enough that the point is valid.
I'm still not even sure where the whole "roll 90 heads out of 100 coin tosses" bit came from though, but it seemed like a bit of hyperbole in the first place. We're maybe talking odds a bit, but really about behavior patterns by the author (I guess? Kinda lost track honestly). Is he more likely to ignore the statistical damage of two hits of the spell at the spell level required to cast two polar ray spells using the occular feat? Or is he more likely to ignore the spell description which says it's a single beam and emanates from the hands? Do we look through the comic and note that he's usually consistent with spell effects and use? Or do we look through the comic and note that when metamagic feats are used, they are often stated as being used when casting the spell?
I guess techinically both are things that can fall into the "Cool over rules" category. Personally? Either could be the case. Not really important actually. Calder cast a cold based ray spell, and hit V with it. V was badly damaged, but survived. Done. Maybe the details will be clarified in future strips. Maybe not. I'm not sure how much it matters either way. Certianly not enough to insist that it must be one and not the other. I tend towards "he just took artistic license with an otherwise standard casting of the spell" due to it being a simpler explanation, but I'd certainly have zero problems if the next page has Calder complaining that "I used two metamagic enhanced 8th level spells and the wizard is still alive. Bah!".
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2024-02-13, 07:20 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Feb 2017
Re: OOTS #1297 - The Discussion Thread
I think an important part of the argument is that while The Giant is usually consistent with spell effects and use, he isn't always and stated himself he doesn't have "following the game's rules" as a priority.
If everyone was willing to accept the author's words on the topic, there would be a lot less debate about it.
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2024-02-13, 07:49 PM (ISO 8601)
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2024-02-13, 11:14 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Apr 2020
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Re: OOTS #1297 - The Discussion Thread
Screaming defiance with the last breath
It would be strange indeed if so celestial an article as FREEDOM should not be highly rated.
My judgments and medals!
The Iron Chef Optimization spreadsheet!
Song, Sword, and Sorcery: my 5E homebrew half-caster bard (Version 2.0!)
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2024-02-14, 01:37 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Aug 2009
Re: OOTS #1297 - The Discussion Thread
Another possibility is that Roy and V don't really have Mind Blank up (we haven't seen it cast since the vampire fight), and this whole fight is an illusion.
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2024-02-14, 03:31 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Jan 2016
Re: OOTS #1297 - The Discussion Thread
Last edited by Kardwill; 2024-02-14 at 03:35 AM.
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2024-02-14, 05:28 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Feb 2017
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2024-02-14, 08:17 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Jan 2016
Re: OOTS #1297 - The Discussion Thread
Last edited by Kardwill; 2024-02-14 at 08:20 AM.
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2024-02-14, 09:52 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Feb 2024
Re: OOTS #1297 - The Discussion Thread
I did not enjoy that episode...
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2024-02-14, 10:55 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Jan 2024
Re: OOTS #1297 - The Discussion Thread