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2016-01-28, 04:45 PM (ISO 8601)
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Elan and Nale's Parentage, Take II - Rich?
In a thread I bumped into because of the quote archive I ran into this exchange.
Originally Posted by jidasfire
Originally Posted by The Giant
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2016-01-28, 05:24 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Apr 2014
Re: Elan and Nale's Parentage, Take II - Rich?
Holy crap, I forgot all about this! PLEASE ANSWER, GOOOD SIR GIANT, HALLOWED BE THY NAME. *Raises hands for guidance* PLEASE HEAR AND ANSWER, GOODLY GIANT.
But for reals though, I get that Elan is good, and as the hero, would always work to spare his enemies, especially if they have a name. It was only after he found out about his dad doing bad things that he started to wonder about it (especially on the airship).
Edit: Also, is Tarquin his last name? Making Elans Mom Mrs. Tarquin?Last edited by grandpheonix; 2016-01-28 at 05:24 PM. Reason: additional question
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2016-01-28, 05:50 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Jul 2009
Re: Elan and Nale's Parentage, Take II - Rich?
He can't spoil the reveal that Elan's Mother is a celestial yet.
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2016-01-28, 07:24 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Oct 2015
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Re: Elan and Nale's Parentage, Take II - Rich?
Just curious, when were the quotes in OP taken? It's probably important as to how much of BRitF had played out to know whether the answer has come or not yet.
I do find it neat that Elan himself speculated on that question after Nale died.
If it hasn't come yet:
Spoiler: speculationI suspect it's related to whatever reason Sabine was sent to look after and groom Nale-- something about him specifically is innately Evil.
I always thought the scene of Nale hitting Elan in his soft undeveloped baby skull in DCF provided the answer to that, although it may have been a throwaway joke in the early days of the comic.
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2016-01-28, 10:16 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Oct 2010
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Re: Elan and Nale's Parentage, Take II - Rich?
Given that the comic suggests even baby black dragons aren't born irredeemably evil, I'm not seeing the value in or likelihood of portraying baby Nale that way. My educated guess is that the Giant leans a bit more on the "nurture" side of the NvN debate.
Plague Doctor by Crimmy
Ext. Sig (Handbooks/Creations)
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2016-01-28, 11:30 PM (ISO 8601)
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- May 2009
Re: Elan and Nale's Parentage, Take II - Rich?
"None of us likes to be hated, none of us likes to be shunned. A natural result of these conditions is, that we consciously or unconsciously pay more attention to tuning our opinions to our neighbor’s pitch and preserving his approval than we do to examining the opinions searchingly and seeing to it that they are right and sound." - Mark Twain
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2016-01-29, 12:25 AM (ISO 8601)
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- May 2015
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- Texas
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2016-01-29, 01:52 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Oct 2014
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- California
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2016-01-29, 06:31 AM (ISO 8601)
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- May 2015
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Re: Elan and Nale's Parentage, Take II - Rich?
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2016-01-29, 02:58 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Oct 2010
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- My own private Nogero
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Re: Elan and Nale's Parentage, Take II - Rich?
So everyone else is a zombie?
PS Also Elan = HaleyLast edited by dtilque; 2016-01-29 at 03:03 PM.
Curated Thread: Gazetteer of the Stick
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2016-01-29, 04:27 PM (ISO 8601)
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2016-01-29, 06:14 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Jul 2012
Re: Elan and Nale's Parentage, Take II - Rich?
The quote was from 11-18-2011. Strip 815 was the most recent strip at that time according to the discussion thread index. So Nale had just attacked the Order and fled from Malak, while Roy and Tarquin were traveling to the palace. Nale and Tarquin had not yet spoken on panel. So about halfway through the book. Rich is almost certainly referring to the manner Tarquin treated Nale as a pawn in his story and Nale's eventual rant against his father, which both give insight into their shared history. Tarquin hadn't yet been revealed as the control freak who murders his own son for not doing what he wanted.
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2016-01-31, 02:36 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Aug 2009
Re: Elan and Nale's Parentage, Take II - Rich?
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2016-01-31, 11:10 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Dec 2004
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- Chicago!
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Re: Elan and Nale's Parentage, Take II - Rich?
Yes it was serious. I was one of them.
The reasoning were
As celestial or half celestial Haley would be a closer opposite of Sabine.Her tattoo on her back initially looked like scar where wings might have been.She had a secret that she had never shared,During her time with her cryptogram speech, She started to say "I'm not exactly fully . . ." (the theory was that she wanted to finish with human)For a long time, Her mother had never been shown in panel
The theory lost popularity as
Liner Guild moved away from evil opposites
Tattoo was confirmed as I Heart Money
She stopped keeping secrets but didn't tell Elan about mix heritiage
She's not fully something else that has been implied
Her mother was shown on panel as an ordinary human.
And mostly it makes no sense to introduce her celestial lineage this late in the story.If you find yourself watching Power Rangers and wonder how some characters got their powers and zords back for an anniversary episode, just assume they were restored off screen. They have 20+ seasons of team geniuses to call on.
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2016-01-31, 11:41 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Jan 2012
Re: Elan and Nale's Parentage, Take II - Rich?
I think the angel in comic 193 having a palette swap of Haley's head and hair may have also helped fuel it.
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2016-02-01, 10:24 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Aug 2009
Re: Elan and Nale's Parentage, Take II - Rich?
I think it also partly stemmed from one sentence in the DCF commentary:
Spoiler: DCF commentaryHonestly, though, Sabine hasn’t really yet shown all her true colors and neither has Haley, so I’ll keep quiet about another key way in which they are opposed.
However, in the meta-commentary from the PDF, the Giant revealed what that sentence actually referred to:
Spoiler: DCF PDFOh, and regarding that “key way” that Haley and Sabine are
opposed that I’m hinting about here: I don’t want to spoil future
books in case you haven’t read them yet, but let’s just say it involves
whether or not the character in question is also working for another
organization, and whether or not their respective leaders think they are.
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2016-02-01, 07:57 PM (ISO 8601)
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- May 2007
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- The Land of Cleves
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Re: Elan and Nale's Parentage, Take II - Rich?
One other piece of circumstantial evidence about Haley: She uses a longbow. Rogues are proficient in shortbows, but not longbows. Now, she could have picked up proficiency via a feat, and longbows are a little better than short, but only a little, so it would be a waste of a precious feat slot. Unless, of course, she has free proficiency with martial weapons from some source.
Time travels in divers paces with divers persons.
—As You Like It, III:ii:328
Chronos's Unalliterative Skillmonkey Guide
Current Homebrew: 5th edition psionics
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2016-02-01, 08:17 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Feb 2016
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- A Humorous Location
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Re: Elan and Nale's Parentage, Take II - Rich?
Ummm, thats really f***ed up. Haley is 28. Elan is 21. That means Haley must have been 7 when she had Elan, and that's just not possible with the female anatomy. Also, in the flashback when Nale and Elan talked about their childhood, Elan's mom was blond. I know Haley could have dyed her hair, but when she talks about her hair color (I forget the comic, but it happened) she likes her plain orange hair. But I DO see a part of the theory: Haley is chaotic good. When Nale questions why they split up, it is revealed that Elan's mother is chaotic good. But the other part, the fact that Elan's father is Lawful Evil (Tarquin) Does not fit because Elan is "Lawful Stupid" in the adventure game, and is definitely nowhere near being evil. After his recent actions of leaving his father in the desert and not pulling him up, he could have become neutral. But another part that people have obviously missed is that he does not want Nale to die. He would not have wanted to stab him at the drop of a hat. Plus, The Oracle Of Sunken Valley says that he'll have a happy ending. Becoming a cruel tyrant and not having haley as his wife/girlfriend is definitely not a "happy" ending in his book.
Edit: I just read the part about "not remembering" in time travel. Unless there's some weird thing where the world Blackwing saw through the rift was the friggin doctor who reality, I don't think there's any sort of time travel device in 3.5e, let alone D&D. I don't see how this would be something they would want to do, traveling back in time. Unless they saw some sort of rune, and they pressed it for no reason whatsoever, and noone was there to stop them, that COULD happen but by what I've seen here its just a very very low chance of this happening. Also, lots of people will not like this ending if it ends up like this. Including me.Last edited by Gluteus_Maximus; 2016-02-01 at 08:23 PM.
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2016-02-01, 09:36 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Mar 2015
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2016-02-01, 10:47 PM (ISO 8601)
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- May 2015
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Re: Elan and Nale's Parentage, Take II - Rich?
"They" implies that Haley travel back in time with Elan. I'm not that sick.
I see that you read the time traveling part, but as this is the opening of your post I have to respond. Put a strikethrough when you edit your post.
Also, in the flashback when Nale and Elan talked about their childhood, Elan's mom was blond. I know Haley could have dyed her hair, but when she talks about her hair color (I forget the comic, but it happened) she likes her plain orange hair. But I DO see a part of the theory: Haley is chaotic good. When Nale questions why they split up, it is revealed that Elan's mother is chaotic good.
But the other part, the fact that Elan's father is Lawful Evil (Tarquin) Does not fit because Elan is "Lawful Stupid" in the adventure game, and is definitely nowhere near being evil. After his recent actions of leaving his father in the desert and not pulling him up, he could have become neutral. But another part that people have obviously missed is that he does not want Nale to die. He would not have wanted to stab him at the drop of a hat. Plus, The Oracle Of Sunken Valley says that he'll have a happy ending. Becoming a cruel tyrant and not having haley as his wife/girlfriend is definitely not a "happy" ending in his book.
Edit: I just read the part about "not remembering" in time travel. Unless there's some weird thing where the world Blackwing saw through the rift was the friggin doctor who reality, I don't think there's any sort of time travel device in 3.5e, let alone D&D. I don't see how this would be something they would want to do, traveling back in time. Unless they saw some sort of rune, and they pressed it for no reason whatsoever, and noone was there to stop them, that COULD happen but by what I've seen here its just a very very low chance of this happening.
Elan remembers a name: Tarquin, which he thinks it's how he was called. Tarquin feels a urge for a great story, and starts adventuring, that's when he meets the Vector Legion. While adventuring with them, he becomes a twisted version of himself, one that wants narrative perfection at all cost, with him as a *tagonist (an- or pro-).
During his adventures, he meets a girl: Elan's Mother (Haley). They both feel that they belong to each other. Tarquin stops adventuring and start a life with Elan's Mother, who gives birth to twin boys: Elan and Nale. However, because Tarquin is a twisted version of the man Haley once loved, their marriage fails.
When he accepts that the marriage is over, not knowing what to do, he remembers that he has a reason for him to fight in the Western Continent. He doesn't remembers what is the reason exactly, but he knows that Nale is involved. He takes his son with him and goes to the west.
The rest is history.
Also, lots of people will not like this ending if it ends up like this. Including me.
And, in the spirit of the joke: You are not Elan, there is no prophecy that the story will have a happy ending for you.
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2016-02-01, 11:08 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Elan and Nale's Parentage, Take II - Rich?
I get that it's a joke theory, but there are a few things I'd like to point out:
- Haley is a redhead.
- Elan and Nale were both blond.
- In his youth, Tarquin had brown hair.
- Elan's mother is blonde.
For this theory to work, "Tarquin" would have had to dye his hair brown and "Elan's mother" would have had to dye her hair blonde. The twins would have gotten the gene from their father instead, though it would have appeared as though they got it from their mother.
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2016-02-01, 11:55 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Feb 2013
Re: Elan and Nale's Parentage, Take II - Rich?
Why use dye when they can just use magic? Prestidigitation is a cantrip, for Reorx's sake.
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2016-02-10, 08:45 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Jun 2007
Re: Elan and Nale's Parentage, Take II - Rich?
Rich?
5char
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2016-02-10, 09:11 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Jan 2013
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Re: Elan and Nale's Parentage, Take II - Rich?
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2016-02-10, 09:32 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Jul 2012
Re: Elan and Nale's Parentage, Take II - Rich?
Well, the question was already answered. It was clearly referring to the second half of the book getting into that exact relationship.
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2016-02-11, 11:09 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Aug 2008
Re: Elan and Nale's Parentage, Take II - Rich?
I believe speculation is supposed to be in spoiler tags.
Besides, we all know that Elan's Mother isSpoilerdead. An upcoming story line will be about how Elan has failed to realize this for all the time he has been out adventuring and how he was childish enough to believe her comforting lies when he first headed out. This will add a sense of personal tragedy to a character that started as the obvious comic relief yet has now evolved beyond such simple classifications.
I don't think the above theory is impossible or even that far-out but I hope it is false.