Zinc Saucier XVIII: An Illithid Affair

**mattie_p** · 2013-09-22, 07:24 PM (ISO 8601)

Welcome one and all to the eighteenth Zinc Saucier challenge, where Playgrounders come to test their skill in the art of beautiful and bizarre (and bizarrely beautiful) builds, summoning a savory dish of superb swordplay and sublime sorcery.

The challenge? To come up with a build that has the same abilities and feel as the Secret Ingredient WITHOUT actually using it!

For the eighteenth challenge, get ready to overchannel your inner aberration, from the Complete Psionic it's the Flayerspawn Psychic!

Our challengers will have about 2 weeks to build a complete build up to Effective Character Level 20 using a 32 point buy and all official WOTC D&D 3.5 materials (excluding dragon magazine, but including any WOTC online enhancements) with the abilities and feel of a Flayerspawn Psychic without actually using any levels in it. Competitors will receive a total of 209,999 experience points, expressly permitting LA buy-off or other tricks.

Entries must be submitted by Sunday, 11:59pm GMT, 6 October, 2013. As usual, please submit your entries via private message to the chairman, so as not to influence the other sauciers.

Judges will then have until Sunday, 11:59pm GMT, 20 October, 2013, to post scores for all dishes.

Contestants will be judged and awarded a score out of 5 in each of 4 categories;

* Innovation (Uniqueness in character concept, race, class, etc)
* Power (How powerful and versatile it is compared to the base class)
* Elegance (What can only be described as how well the build "flows", i.e not using lots of 1-2lv dips, sacrificing flavour for power or using flaws)
* Ingredient (How well the build captures the abilities and feel of the base class)

Presentation would be best in the style of how the iron chef does their presentations, however any style is allowed so long as it is clear on how the build was made.

Recommended style:

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NAME OF ENTRY
{table=head]Level|Class|Base Attack Bonus|Fort Save|Ref Save|Will Save|Skills|Feats|Class Features

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|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities[/table]

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[b]NAME OF ENTRY[/b]
{table=head][b]Level[/b]|[b]Class[/b]|[b]Base Attack Bonus[/b]|[b]Fort Save[/b]|[b]Ref Save[/b]|[b]Will Save[/b]|[b]Skills[/b]|[b]Feats[/b]|[b]Class Features[/b]

1st|New Class Level|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

2nd|New Class Level|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

3rd|New Class Level|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

4th|New Class Level|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

5th|New Class Level|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

6th|New Class Level|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

7th|New Class Level|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

8th|New Class Level|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

9th|New Class Level|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

10th|New Class Level|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

11th|New Class Level|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

12th|New Class Level|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

13th|New Class Level|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

14th|New Class Level|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

15th|New Class Level|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

16th|New Class Level|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

17th|New Class Level|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

18th|New Class Level|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

19th|New Class Level|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities

20th|New Class Level|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|[center]+x[/center]|Skills|New Feats|New Class Abilities[/table]

For entries with spellcasting, use the following table for Spells per day and Spells Known. (Spells Known only if necessary, i.e. Sorcerer or Bard, but not Wizard or Warmage). For other systems (Psionics, ToB, Incarnum, etc.) keep track of PP/maneuvers/essentia separately, preferably in a nice neat list, similar to this:

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Spells per day/Spells Known
{table=head]Level|0lvl|1st|2nd|3rd|4th|5th|6th|7th|8th|9th

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[b]Spells per day/Spells Known[/b]
{table=head][b]Level[/b]|[b]0lvl[/b]|[b]1st[/b]|[b]2nd[/b]|[b]3rd[/b]|[b]4th[/b]|[b]5th[/b]|[b]6th[/b]|[b]7th[/b]|[b]8th[/b]|[b]9th[/b]

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Please do not post details of your build on the board before it is ready, so as not to spoil the surprise for others.

Sauciers may submit as many builds as they want but please don't use leadership, as we don't want to overfeed the judges.

Previous challenges;

* Classes marked with an asterisk have had their original posts updated to reflect the final results.

This competition is inspired by the Playground Iron Chef Competitions and uses mostly identical rules.

Also it comes with double prize money.

Allez Sauciers!

**mattie_p** · 2013-09-22, 07:25 PM (ISO 8601)

A few administrative notes:

Competitors will be free to use any official 3.5 rulebook in constructing their builds. Dragon magazine is disallowed, and Unearthed Arcana is allowed; but see Elegance below. Web-exclusive 3.0 or 3.5 materials by WotC are expressly allowed, but take care to verify that an updated version did not appear in print elsewhere, as this may cause an Elegance deduction at the judges' discretion. Alternate rule systems from UA such as gestalt are not allowed, as they create a different playing field. Also, item familiars are forbidden because I hate 'em.

Power level is up to you. Cheese is acceptable, but should be kept to a sane level unless you're showcasing a new TO build you've discovered. In the words of one of my predecessors, a little cheddar can be nice, but avoid the mature Gruyere unless you're making a cheese fondue.

Elegance could bear a little elaboration. It basically measures how skillfully you put your build together, and whether you sacrificed flavor for power. We're cooking here - if your dish doesn't taste good, it doesn't matter how well-presented it is. Use of flaws is an automatic loss of one point per flaw in this category. Other things that will cause lost points here are excessive multiclassing, and classes that don't fit the concept - using Cloistered Cleric in a front-line melee fighter, for example, may lose you points. Please note the following: a legal source's relative obscurity should not be considered as penalizing Elegance, excepting the aforementioned issues with Unearthed Arcana. Using too many sources may be an Elegance deduction at the judges' discretion, but a book's relative obscurity may not.

What's the minimum score in a category? Assuming an entry is legal, the minimum score in any category is 1. If a judge is convinced that an entry is illegal by the RAW, the judge may give a 0 or decline to score a given entry. Because this contest focuses on Player Characters, an entry that is not technically allowed for a PC, but is viable as an NPC, counts as a legal entry, but may receive a minimum score at the judges' discretion.

Is Dragon Compendium Allowed? Yes, but individual issues of Dragon Magazine are not.

What about 3.0 materials? 3.0 materials, whether online or in printed form, are allowed unless they've been officially updated to a 3.5 edition.

Are Dragonlance, Ravenloft, Planescape, Dark Sun, or Kingdoms of Kalamar allowable sources? The Dragonlance Campaign Setting is allowed, but the subsequent books for Dragonlance are considered 3rd party, and are therefore not eligible, despite the "WotC approved" status of those books. The same holds for Oriental Adventures (1st party) and the subsequent Rokugan books (3rd party). Materials from Ravenloft, Planescape, Dark Sun, and Kingdoms of Kalamar are considered 3rd party for purposes of this contest, and are therefore not allowed.

What about online sources in general? If the online source is a) published by WotC, and b) not replaced by an updated version at a later time, it is eligible. Use it, link it.

Where's the line drawn with "acceptable/unacceptable" for Unearthed Arcana? This will likely vary a bit from Chairman to Chairman. Variant class features and variant character classes are espressly permitted. Item Familiars and Gestalt have always been verboten, since before IC migrated to GitP; don't expect that to change. Flaws have similarly always been noted as warranting a deduction; while I am Chairman, I'm extending that to Traits, though they warrant 1/2 the penalty in Elegance that a Flaw would because they're roughly 1/2 as useful. Alternate spell systems, alternate skill systems and alternate crafting rules all create an uneven playing field, and as such, will be disallowed for as long as I am Chairman. Bloodlines are ripe for abuse, and will be discouraged as long as I am Chairman. Note that judges are allowed to look askance at any use of Unearthed Arcana not specifically mentioned above, at their discretion, and otherwise penalize Elegance according to their preference.

What does ECL (Effective Character Level) 20 mean again? It means that the sum of Racial Hit Dice, Class Levels, and Level Adjustment equals 20. Normally ECL 20 characters have 190,000 exp, you have a slightly higher total to permit level adjustment buy-off in accordance with the rules in Unearthed Arcana.

Level adjustment buy-off (from Unearthed Arcana) is expressly permitted in this particular competion, because you are granted a set experience point total of 209,999 to use. What you do with it is up to you. Mitigating EXP loss via thought bottle or other shenanigans is prohibited, though. Once you spend XP, you cannot get it back under any circumstances, nor can you claim "XP is a river," etc.

What, exactly, does the ban on Leadership mean? As folks have started to try to work around the edges of this one, I'm forced to spell it out more plainly. No Leadership, Draconic Cohort, or Feats that grant a similar ability are allowed EXCEPT Wild Cohort while I am chairman. Any PrC you choose with Leadership or a Leadership-analog has that ability entirely ignored for this contest, as it may neither be used nor traded away via any means whatsoever.

What's the minimum score in a category? Assuming an entry is legal, the minimum score in any category is 1. If a judge is convinced that an entry is illegal by the RAW, the judge may give a 0 or decline to score a given entry. Because this contest focuses on Player Characters, an entry that is not technically allowed for a PC, but is viable as an NPC, counts as a legal entry, but may receive a minimum score at the judges' discretion.

How the heck do I even do this? Your mission, should you choose to accept it, is to select a combination of race, templates, classes, alternate class features, prestige classes, skills, and feats, meld them into a single character that progresses from ECL 1 to ECL 20, that is as close as possible to the secret ingredient as possible in look, feel, class features. How you do it is up to you, I recommend you read previous competitions if you are interested in seeing how others have done it before you. Capture the essence!

A thread for your amusement/edification:

Handy Tips for the Iron Chef in the Playground Noob

**CyberThread** · 2013-09-22, 07:31 PM (ISO 8601)

<-< this is warlock bait, going to have to be more clever then that.

**nobodez** · 2013-09-22, 07:41 PM (ISO 8601)

Um, I'm not competing, but you have a "Ranger" in place of "Flayerspawn Psychic" in the introductory post.

**mattie_p** · 2013-09-22, 07:44 PM (ISO 8601)

Originally Posted by nobodez

Um, I'm not competing, but you have a "Ranger" in place of "Flayerspawn Psychic" in the introductory post.

Thanks, and also thanks to relytdan via pm, who alerted me to this. I thought I'd gotten all the changes.

**relytdan** · 2013-09-22, 07:48 PM (ISO 8601)

quick like a bunny - I have a concept I will have to mull over.- I am in

**Segev** · 2013-09-23, 12:14 AM (ISO 8601)

I somehow feel like dropping "Illithid" in as the race would be...cheating.

**inuyasha** · 2013-09-23, 12:32 AM (ISO 8601)

Mmk I might contribute for the first time, I have a few questions however.

do we see anyone elses builds?

and when designing a build, I understand you must pre plan a character progression, is there a guide for how this works?

**relytdan** · 2013-09-23, 01:09 AM (ISO 8601)

Originally Posted by inuyasha

Mmk I might contribute for the first time, I have a few questions however.

do we see anyone elses builds?

and when designing a build, I understand you must pre plan a character progression, is there a guide for how this works?

se other builds not until they are posted by the chairman - then they are unknown authors - until judging is complete - see previous contests -

preplan a guide for it - um build a character with race, class ect - that in this case mimics the SI without using the SI - upto ECL 20 - format it, so it looks good, then pm it to the chairman when your satisfied - you have until the end of contest prior to judging -roughly 2 weeks- to submit an entry if you wish ...

* on that note - chairman if I missed anything feel free to enlighten.

**CyberThread** · 2013-09-23, 01:14 AM (ISO 8601)

Don't use prestige ithalid slayer :P

**relytdan** · 2013-09-23, 12:47 PM (ISO 8601)

Originally Posted by Rubik

I've already got mine! I just need to write up the history, and I'll be done.

However, it's nearly 2 am, and I'm tired, so I'll do the writeup later, yes?

sounds about like me - I may have to attempt another build as there is time.
*Edit - Chairman please confirm receipt of Entry

**dysprosium** · 2013-09-23, 01:50 PM (ISO 8601)

I will be entering this one.

I have an idea but I think it might be too obvious but let's see how it plays out.

**mattie_p** · 2013-09-23, 05:58 PM (ISO 8601)

relytdan, I've got it.

Rubik, glad to have you aboard. We're always looking for fresh ~~meat~~ ~~victims~~ ideas.

**WhamBamSam** · 2013-09-23, 06:00 PM (ISO 8601)

I might have an idea here. We'll have to see if I can hammer it into something workable and whether I have time around this round's IC judging and real life responsibilities.

**relytdan** · 2013-09-23, 08:30 PM (ISO 8601)

chairman please confirm entry 2 - thanks

**mattie_p** · 2013-09-23, 08:58 PM (ISO 8601)

Originally Posted by Rubik

You know what? I had some ideas on how to do this, but given the way this is scored, I'll scrap that and leave you with my build:.

Umm, great? If someone actually entered that, you just spoiled it. So please edit your post to remove your feedback. Thanks.

Also, the point of this is to not just replicate the class, but to be better in every possible way.

**mattie_p** · 2013-09-23, 09:08 PM (ISO 8601)

Originally Posted by Rubik

What, I can't add my entry here? Also, check the manifester level. It basically is.

You are supposed to send a private message to the chairman with your entry, rather than post it in the thread.

**relytdan** · 2013-09-23, 10:41 PM (ISO 8601)

Originally Posted by Rubik

You know what? I had some ideas on how to do this, but given the way this is scored, I'll scrap that and leave you with my build:

( REDACTED )

That pretty well replicates the PrC in its entirety, and all it uses are Five feats and a power known.

^^^^^^^^^^^ REMOVE THE OFFENDING BUILD STUB^^^^^^^^^

Originally Posted by mattie_p

Umm, great? If someone actually entered that, you just spoiled it. So please edit your post to remove your feedback. Thanks.

Also, the point of this is to not just replicate the class, but to be better in every possible way.

I am going to sencond what mattie_p stated edit your post and remove the build stub.

**DeAnno** · 2013-09-24, 01:31 AM (ISO 8601)

I think the trickiest part of this particular challenge is actually restraint. Getting the flavorful abilities without accidentally overshadowing them with not flavorful but stronger abilities is tricky.

**CyberThread** · 2013-09-24, 02:51 PM (ISO 8601)

Well my spell counts as a stun, if your dead, you are stunned forever :P

**Humble Master** · 2013-09-24, 06:56 PM (ISO 8601)

Count me in! I already have an idea, but I'll need to mull it over.

Edit: Double checking, we have 1 less xp than needed for 21st level and LA by off is allowed?

**Kuulvheysoon** · 2013-09-24, 07:24 PM (ISO 8601)

Well, I did it. I just know that someone else is going to submit the exact same thing.

**Humble Master** · 2013-09-24, 07:50 PM (ISO 8601)

Originally Posted by Kuulvheysoon

Well, I did it. I just know that someone else is going to submit the exact same thing.

I sense that a build with a monster race was submitted...

**Newcomer** · 2013-09-24, 10:45 PM (ISO 8601)

Originally Posted by CyberDrag

Don't use prestige ithalid slayer :P

I'm not going to participate in this one, as I'm completely unfamiliar with psionics. And I would offer to judge, but I don't have the system/optimization mastery to really be qualified. Ranger played to my strengths.

I'm eager to see the builds and happily spectate!!

**mattie_p** · 2013-09-24, 11:02 PM (ISO 8601)

Originally Posted by Newcomer

I'm not going to participate in this one, as I'm completely unfamiliar with psionics. And I would offer to judge, but I don't have the system/optimization mastery to really be qualified. Ranger played to my strengths.

I'm eager to see the builds and happily spectate!!

You know, and I bring this up as chairman, you don't actually have to use psionics at all for a dish. See the official criteria:

* Innovation (Uniqueness in character concept, race, class, etc)

* Power (How powerful and versatile it is compared to the base class)

* Elegance (What can only be described as how well the build "flows", i.e not using lots of 1-2lv dips, sacrificing flavour for power or using flaws)

* Ingredient (How well the build captures the abilities and feel of the base class)

The only thing I might be concerned about is for the Use of Secret Ingredient. If you read carefully, it says captures the abilities and feel. If you can capture the abilities and feel by other systems, go for it. Nothing there says that you must use identical class features, including manifesting.

**Segev** · 2013-09-24, 11:19 PM (ISO 8601)

Since this was nixed by virtue of--well, no, crud. I don't know that this wouldn't impact others' creativity points if they found a way to do it that I can't think of.

Chairman, you know what I asked you about, what do you think? Should I share the thought here as an example, or should I wait to share it until after submissions?

**mattie_p** · 2013-09-24, 11:25 PM (ISO 8601)

Originally Posted by Segev

Since this was nixed by virtue of--well, no, crud. I don't know that this wouldn't impact others' creativity points if they found a way to do it that I can't think of.

Chairman, you know what I asked you about, what do you think? Should I share the thought here as an example, or should I wait to share it until after submissions?

I'd recommend you wait. Speculation of all kinds, publicly posting ideas on how to qualify for or replicate a class, or even posting a concept will be strongly discouraged while I am chairman.

Missed this earlier

Originally Posted by Humble Master

Edit: Double checking, we have 1 less xp than needed for 21st level and LA by off is allowed?

Correct on both counts.

**Svata** · 2013-09-26, 01:12 PM (ISO 8601)

May end up doing this one, but am not particularly inspired by anything. I'll flip through my books and see if anything jumps out at me, though.

**relytdan** · 2013-09-27, 01:10 PM (ISO 8601)

do we have any judges on this yet - or did I miss them?

**mattie_p** · 2013-09-28, 10:38 AM (ISO 8601)

I haven't seen any volunteer judges yet. We always get at least one, though. On the bright side, we have four entries so far for this terrible PrC. I'm sure more are on the way.

Thread: Zinc Saucier XVIII: An Illithid Affair

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