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Thread: If Charm Person fails...
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2010-01-04, 07:03 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Sep 2009
- Location
- Italy
- Gender
If Charm Person fails...
My bard/wizard is in front of a guy. I cast Charm Person on that guy, and his saving throw succeeds. Now, if he isn't extremely stupid, he's just understood that I cast a spell on him, and it didn't work. Won't that make him extremely angry against me? If so, a failed Charm Person will almost always result in the contrary effect.
Another scenario. My bard is in front of a wizard. I cast Charm Person, and the saving throw fails. The wizard is Charmed, but he rolls a Spellcraft check and understands that I cast Charm Person. His aptitude should be friendly toward me, but he knows that is because of the spell, and therefore has really good reason to be angry against me and to avoid me. How does the spell work in this case?
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2010-01-04, 07:05 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Dec 2004
- Location
- The Land of Angles
Re: If Charm Person fails...
Yep. Being obvious with Charm Person tends to be a bad idea.
Obviously, the Wizard tells himself, your friend cast Charm Person on you because it was the best thing for you in the circumstances. After all, he's your friend, right? He wouldn't do anything to harm you.
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2010-01-04, 07:17 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Nov 2009
- Location
- Crown Point, Indana
- Gender
Re: If Charm Person fails...
#1. Charm Person isn't a good idea.
#2. Here's my combo of persuasion (both gestalt and non-gestalt)
Gestalt: Bard//Merchant 15/ Evangelist 5: Focus on Diplomacy, Knowledge: Nobility and Local, and Preformance: Oratory
Non-Gestalt: Merchant10/Bard5/Evangelist5: Same skill focuses, just without gestalt ease
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2010-01-04, 07:19 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Aug 2009
- Location
- Erutnevda
Re: If Charm Person fails...
In the first scenario unless they have spellcraft they know you've cast a spell, but they don't know what. Pretty easy to convince them it was a mental buff spell.
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2010-01-04, 07:23 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Sep 2009
- Location
- Italy
- Gender
Re: If Charm Person fails...
"I cast you a mental buff spell just because I really like you even if we've never met before, not a spell to convince you to give me that item for free..."
Is that a -50 to Bluff, or just a -40?
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2010-01-04, 07:37 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Sep 2008
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2010-01-04, 07:40 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jan 2008
- Location
- Jerusalem, Israel
- Gender
Re: If Charm Person fails...
"There was a terrible curse on you! I had only a few moments left to cure it before it killed you!"
The only thing worse than an empty signature is one that has nothing at all to say. One that simply yammers on with little or no point; quietly, subtly draining away seconds of your life.
The worst are the ones that look like they have a point. Multiple paragraph monstrosities that you're sure will have some sort of satisfying conclusion. Some sort of goal, to show that your reading was not in vain.
It doesn't and it was.
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2010-01-04, 07:43 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Dec 2006
- Location
- London, England.
Re: If Charm Person fails...
I think you get this response.
Qui-Gon: Right, which one of you is in charge?
Droid: State your business.
Qui-Gon: Let these men go. We're taking them to Croissant.
Panaka: Coruscant.
Qui-Gon: What he said.
Droid: Under what authority?
Qui-Gon: Don't you recognise me? I'm your commander!
Droid: My commander is a droid.
Qui-Gon: I'm undercover.
Droid: What is your serial number?
Qui-Gon: It's... uh... I roll for Bluff!
GM: There aren't enough dice in the world. They draw their weapons.Last edited by Saph; 2010-01-04 at 07:43 PM.
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2010-01-04, 07:43 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Dec 2005
- Location
- California, USA
- Gender
Re: If Charm Person fails...
Bluff opposed by both Spellcraft and Sense Motive, I'm afraid...
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2010-01-04, 07:44 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Nov 2008
- Location
- Ireland
- Gender
Re: If Charm Person fails...
"Whoa, thanks for charming me. I'm worried I'd have been too quick to distrust you otherwise, and that would be a terrible thing to happen with a guy as nice as you."
I remember a story about a guy who tried to use a Bluff check to speak Elvish. He ended up telling an elven border guard that he had come to eat their children or something.Last edited by Prime32; 2010-01-04 at 07:48 PM.
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2010-01-04, 07:51 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Oct 2004
- Location
- Ohio
- Gender
Re: If Charm Person fails...
Still spell is excellent for this. Your words just suddenly seem unnaturally attractive.
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2010-01-04, 07:58 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Dec 2004
- Location
- The Land of Angles
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2010-01-04, 08:01 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Apr 2007
- Location
- Tampa, FL
- Gender
Re: If Charm Person fails...
Eerie, yet accurate; this is exactly how I would play it.
Unless you also have silent spell, that feat that lets you hide the verbal components of spells in normal speech, or the skill trick that hides them both, your target will still notice you slipping "An Xen Ex!" or "Kal Vas Mani!" into regular conversation.
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2010-01-04, 08:03 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Dec 2009
- Location
- Pittsburgh
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2010-01-04, 08:31 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Nov 2009
Re: If Charm Person fails...
If a wizard succeeded on his spellcraft to identify a charm person being cast on him, wouldn't he try to avoid and have the spell dispelled somehow - he might like them but he knows of the spell and its exact effects plus he has a high intelligence.
Finally why would you do it right in front of the target, charm person may only have a range of close but that is still at least 30 feet; do it from outside the shop before you come in, across the bar before you approach then its just a random person muttering to themselves and you can excuse looking at them weird as "eh its you i was trying to figure out if it was" or " do i know you ive been trying to figure out if i know you for ..."
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2010-01-04, 08:36 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Mar 2008
- Location
- NYC
- Gender
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2010-01-04, 08:38 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Apr 2007
- Location
- Tampa, FL
- Gender
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2010-01-04, 08:40 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Aug 2007
- Gender
Re: If Charm Person fails...
Based on casting rules, IIRC: You see the caster speak some unintelligible words and make some complex gestures, then you feel an unknown malevolant force in your head but you manage to will it away.
Yeah, the caster isn't exactly looking like a saint here. Either you need some crazy bluff action and someone who has never seen a caster in their life, or it's time to fight.Last edited by ericgrau; 2010-01-04 at 08:41 PM.
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2010-01-04, 08:45 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Feb 2008
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2010-01-04, 08:46 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Dec 2004
- Location
- The Land of Angles
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2010-01-04, 09:09 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Nov 2007
- Location
- Caught in a Mosh!
- Gender
Re: If Charm Person fails...
If your spell fails, then it's Plan B. You do have a Plan B, right? Someone suggested taking advantage of the spell's range. Do that.
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2010-01-04, 09:15 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Apr 2007
- Location
- Tampa, FL
- Gender
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2010-01-04, 09:25 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Dec 2009
Re: If Charm Person fails...
"Elephant trunks should be used for elephant things only. Nothing else."
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2010-01-04, 09:42 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Nov 2007
- Location
- Caught in a Mosh!
- Gender
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2010-01-04, 09:43 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jun 2008
Re: If Charm Person fails...
One could just use slight of hand to conceal the spellcasting without the trick.
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2010-01-04, 09:58 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Dec 2004
- Location
- The Land of Angles
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2010-01-04, 10:00 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Aug 2007
- Location
- Virginia
Re: If Charm Person fails...
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2010-01-04, 10:03 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Mar 2009
Re: If Charm Person fails...
You can have glibness up so that they believe you.
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2010-01-04, 11:06 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jan 2008
- Gender
Re: If Charm Person fails...
I Would ask how they knew that you cast a spell on them and not on yourself, but apparently you feel "a malevolent force you will away" or something...
My favorite is stilled + silenced spell... you look "really hard" at him and thats all it takes to cast the spell.I do not have a superman complex; for I am God, not Superman!
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2010-01-04, 11:15 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Dec 2004
- Location
- The Land of Angles