[Steam]Survivors Vs. Blu Team Vs. Gordon Freeman Vs. Little Babies Vs. GLaDOS

[Mtg_player_zach]

The Blutsauger: Suddenly my Medic is less durable, or has to stop healing me to regain hit points at the normal rate.

The Backburner: Suddenly I burn to death more often if a competent ally equips it...

Targe/Eyelander: Well, there went my team's area denial. That definitely weakens us.

Dalokohs Bar: There went his ability to heal us...

Just how as a Medic I'm less likely to pocket a Targe Demo or a Backburner Pyro, you need to know when you should heal that Soldier and when you shouldn't heal the Soldier. If you could ALWAYS heal him, that's to HIS disadvantage: I've won fights by equalizing the target at the last minute when out of rockets and almost dead. A bit of extra healing and my hp would have been high enough for me to not get the kill, and not high enough for me to have time to reload or get the second shotgun shot off before dying.

And Dog? Hate to say it, but, even if you're a great Medic, you can't be everywhere at once. As a fairly competent Soldier, I know that me being alive is to my team's benefit: thus, the Equalizer allows me to escape and get back to my medic or, if he's busy, say, leading a push, it allows me to run past him to health without breaking our attack strength. I expect my Medic to work with me...if I see that he can heal me without breaking his stride, I'll drop it. If he's needed, then I can get to the health and back into combat faster than I could without it. I've done this many, many times. It works, and it works well.

My conclusions? A competent Soldier will know when and where to use the Equalizer. If you're pocketing me and I'm almost dead, but am at point blank range to an injured foe and out of rockets? Yeah...I may pull out the EQ. And I might just save us both with it. If you find a GOOD Soldier, trust his judgement. It's his job to keep you alive as much as it is yours to keep him alive. Just like he is fully aware that you may run off it you're both really outgunned or you're heavily damaged, expect that he'll use the best weapon for the job at the time it's needed.

I agree for the most part. Except the part where you said MY medic. The medic is not yours. In fact the medic is more important than you are. Oh, and blutsauger is awesome. I've helped teammates out with it. It's amazing what flanking the enemy can do, that extra dps (and health) can be worth not healing your buddy for a period of time. Of course it is IMPERATIVE to KEEP AN EYE ON BUDDYS HEALTH. Just don't let him die.

Note: Does not translate well into comp settings. Use syringe.

[Dogmantra]

The Blutsauger: Suddenly my Medic is less durable, or has to stop healing me to regain hit points at the normal rate.

The Backburner: Suddenly I burn to death more often if a competent ally equips it...

Targe/Eyelander: Well, there went my team's area denial. That definitely weakens us.

Dalokohs Bar: There went his ability to heal us...

Hold on, remind me when any of those things prevented any class from doing the one thing they were made for. Being on fire doesn't make Engineers build at 1/2 rate. Not having stickies in the vicinity doesn't make Scouts move at 100% speed. Heavies don't decloak all nearby friendly Spies when they eat the Dalokoh's Bar. The Equaliser does stop Medics from charging uber and healing.

My problem with the Equaliser is that it takes the decision out of the Medic's hands as to when to heal, who to heal, and when to drop healing for a quick flank. No other unlock makes someone else's decisions for them (which is kinda what I meant when I said about the weaknesses: apologies for the poor phrasing). If you can't see why that's a problem, I am completely at a loss. I merely mentioned that if there was an unlock that took away a more popular class's decision making and gave it to someone else purely because they want to use the best available weapon, then people would scream at Valve to get rid of it. Then everyone got all up in my earhole because I want to be able to decide how I play the game. It's not much to ask to heal people when I'm playing a class with a gun that shoots healing at people and is the only one that can do so. I'm not asking to make other people's decisions for them. I'm asking that the stupid goddamned Equaliser stops blocking healing because it is no fun for anyone.

If I can't choose exactly when to use my own class features and be able to: there is something wrong with the game.

[Thrawn183]

I really wouldn't mind the equalizer blocking healing if it didn't block building uber. It's really frustrating to be running to a fight and unable to build uber is a soldier running around with his equalizer out. Every time I die at around 80% or more charge and I know I could have had an uber if not for that soldier, a little bit of me dies inside.

[Byrnbot08]

How about if the Equaliser didn't stop you from charging uber, but it wouldn't actually heal them until it is put away?

[onasuma]

My problem with the Equaliser is that it takes the decision out of the Medic's hands as to when to heal, who to heal, and when to drop healing for a quick flank. No other unlock makes someone else's decisions for them (which is kinda what I meant when I said about the weaknesses: apologies for the poor phrasing).

But the engineer takes away every choice a sentry gun has! He decides which way it faces, where it stays and even its loadout! No one has ever felt that that is a poor gameplay design choice.

[Dogmantra]

I actually thought about that and I thought I'd posted that I wouldn't mind it nearly as much. By all means, Soldier, broadcast that you're an easy target to everyone and don't get healed, but at least let me charge my uber. Then maybe you could stop Soldiers from snagging the health too. It would have to say something like "Queueing for Healing: [Yhiddy] Dogmantra + (Put away Equaliser to receive healing)" though, so that people realise.

...
Onasuma, sentry guns are controlled by AI, and contrary to popular belief, I'm not a robot.

[Dread Cthulhu]

Kay. Here's how we decide. We find two soldiers of equal skill, with identical loadouts except for one having the shovel and one having the Equaliser. We then give each of them a Medic of about equal skill and see what happens.

Also, I bought a Steam Indie Pack for £15 for after the exams are over. And Yet It Moves, Osmos, Galcon Fusion, World of Goo and Machinarium. This will be fun.

[onasuma]

...
Onasuma, sentry guns are controlled by AI, and contrary to popular belief, I'm not a robot.

The Sentry gun is just a loadout option for the civilian and we all know it

[drolkcal]

any idea how long steam support takes? I've been waiting over a day.

Can't login to steam

[Dogmantra]

Kay. Here's how we decide. We find two soldiers of equal skill, with identical loadouts except for one having the shovel and one having the Equaliser. We then give each of them a Medic of about equal skill and see what happens.

Wouldn't work. Even I understand that when there's no Medic around, the Equaliser is, 95% of the time better (but that urge to get it out when you still have three rockets and a full shotgun loaded which betrays the fact you're on low health seems to be quite popular, and mostly leads to people wondering how a Medic killed them). In the middle of an actual game, though, the Equaliser becomes more loathsome.

Anyway, this debate has been going for three pages now. Can we just all accept that I hate the Equaliser, think it's a terrible design choice, think that Medics need to be able to heal people when they choose to because that's what playing the class is all about?
I promise to accept that you're all wrong.

Oh, and drolkcal: it took them two days to reply to my report about L4D2 crashing/texture problems. After that though, we had a short conversation of about five or six posts and it was done by the end of the next day. It might last longer for Steam issues rather than game-specific ones though, considering that it's got a much larger playerbase.

Double oh, and Onasuma: Oh man, I forgot about that. I kinda main Medic, and I only have 10 hours as Civilian down, so I didn't know. Ever since the Razorback got released I just found it impossible to play so I gave up.

[Volatar]

Now I am confused.

Civilian = ?

[Byrnbot08]

Now I am confused.

Civilian = ?

Civilian = OMGWTFBBQPWNED

Or: Civilian = OP and I quote a reliable source of information

/Blatant lies.

[Volatar]

I read that, what I mean is:

I kinda main Medic, and I only have 10 hours as Civilian down, so I didn't know. Ever since the Razorback got released I just found it impossible to play so I gave up.

Civilian isn't a real class is it?

[Dogmantra]

Well it used to be joinable by typing "join_class civilian" into the console but it got patched. I believe that there are still a couple of glitches to get yourself to join the class.

[Pie Guy]

Well it used to be joinable by typing "join_class civilian" into the console but it got patched. I believe that there are still a couple of glitches to get yourself to join the class.

Wait, really?

[Djinn_in_Tonic]

Can we just all accept that I hate the Equaliser, think it's a terrible design choice, think that Medics need to be able to heal people when they choose to because that's what playing the class is all about?

Certainly. Once you stop bringing it up constantly when one of us who plays Soldier a lot happens to have it equipped because we happen to like it, think it's a good choice, or find that it either fits our playing style or allows us to survive more than we would otherwise.

[Dogmantra]

Dunno... I seem to remember reading that there's still a glitch that hasn't been patched... Apparently they have all been patched now though. If you can accidentally access the console on the Xbox version you could do it though. Sometimes you just need to activate ubercharge to open it...

And Djinnikins: I only bring it up when either I'm near a Soldier with it out and want to heal them, or I'm talking to Emlyn.

Or occasionally when a Soldier gets it out and I'm nearby so I chase them down and kill them with the Blutsauger. One of these days I need to mod the Equaliser to look like a white flag.

[wojonatior]

Words and such about the equalizer removing people's ability to do stuff.

I think I have to agree with dogmantra here. The game is designed so that each class has a role.

The soldier's role if to kill people at long to mid range.

The Medic's is to support his teammates by making them indestructible and keeping them from loosing health.

Many of the unlocks may only slightly effect your role in the game, EX: The flaregun can give somewhat better range on the pyro. So then the pyro can chose what role he plays in the game. But with this It doesn't keep the heavy from shooting, doesn't undisguise the spy, it dosen't disable engineer buildings. And those are those classes roles.

So when the soldier decides to use his equalizer, that prevents the medic from fuffiling his role as a person who"Supports his teammates by making them indestructible and keeping them from loosing health."

no other unlock has done that yet, what each person does with their role in TF2 is their concern, but when it overlaps into other roles, it causes problems. And in no means am I saying that you can't have people share roles, but you shouldn't be able to close the ability for people to do their roles.

One of these days I need to mod the Equaliser to look like a white flag.

Or a sign that says "Don't heal me!"

[Emlyn]

Dear lord people STOP! This has gone on far too long. You've consumed the last 3 pages of this thread, and its going nowhere. If your so bent out of shape about this make a thread elsewhere. I doubt I'm the only one sick of this consent back and forth over something so trivial, especially because no one seems to be listening to anyone.

Now, lets return to the usual content of this thread.

[Byrnbot08]

What is this rumour going about that ChHa's server provider has gone bust? Is this something I should know about?

[watsyurname529]

Dear lord people STOP! This has gone on far too long. You've consumed the last 3 pages of this thread, and its going nowhere. If your so bent out of shape about this make a thread elsewhere. I doubt I'm the only one sick of this consent back and forth over something so trivial, especially because no one seems to be listening to anyone.

Now, lets return to the usual content of this thread.

Damn, I had one really really good point to make too, and then I was going to be done.

But I'll say it shortly anyway and I'll be done.

You can make the same argument for the Medic Medigun's. If the Medic uses the Kritz vs Uber, you're altering the way someone else is playing the game depending on the uber choice.

[Emlyn]

What is this rumour going about that ChHa's server provider has gone bust? Is this something I should know about?

Check the Server thread, and yes you are correct.

[Jibar]

Now, lets return to the usual content of this thread.

What usual content?
It's the Jibarocalypse or bickering about TF2, and the considering the second is what we usually do the first is your only other option.

[Volatar]

I have started practicing my Airblasting

[Emlyn]

What usual content?
It's the Jibarocalypse or bickering about TF2, and the considering the second is what we usually do the first is your only other option.

There is a difference between (casual/playful)bickering and turning this thread into a full fledged debate and we went about as far to the debate side as you can get.

Personally I'm interested in the first, and there are plenty of other things to discuss as far as Steam/Games are concerned.

[Myatar_Panwar]

I think I have to agree with dogmantra here. The game is designed so that each class has a role.

The soldier's role if to kill people at long to mid range.

The Medic's is to support his teammates by making them indestructible and keeping them from loosing health.

Many of the unlocks may only slightly effect your role in the game, EX: The flaregun can give somewhat better range on the pyro. So then the pyro can chose what role he plays in the game. But with this It doesn't keep the heavy from shooting, doesn't undisguise the spy, it dosen't disable engineer buildings. And those are those classes roles.

So when the soldier decides to use his equalizer, that prevents the medic from fuffiling his role as a person who"Supports his teammates by making them indestructible and keeping them from loosing health."

no other unlock has done that yet, what each person does with their role in TF2 is their concern, but when it overlaps into other roles, it causes problems. And in no means am I saying that you can't have people share roles, but you shouldn't be able to close the ability for people to do their roles.

What? All kinds of unlocks screw up other classes abilities. The basic flame thrower stops a spy's ability to disguise, a razorback his ability to stab. Airblast hinders a soilders mid-long range killing power. Etc

And for the record, I really don't understand this kind of equalizer hate. As a soilder who uses it, I switch back when a medic is in the vicinity.

And if I am using any melee weapon as soilder while a medic is healing me, I am doing something wrong.

I imagine the bulk of the hate comes from when you guys do all melee or something. Which is really something valve shouldn't be balancing the game for.

[Byrnbot08]

LOOK OUT! ITS TIME FOR

THE JIBPOCALIPH JIBPOCALYPSE

PART TWO, SEGMENT ONE, IN THE YEAR 20XX

Somewhere in the Sahara desert.

Emlyn was not a man to be trifled with. It was hot, it was boring and it was getting repetitive dealing with Dogmantra and his bandits.

"Look Dog, I have no time for this [expletive], so cut it out. Tell me where my goddamn men went!"

His men looked upon them, emotionless and silent. Dogmantra stepped forward, his tribal shield perched on his back.

"Sure Emlyn, I'll tell you where they are, but first; CAN I INTEREST YOU IN A RAZOR-"

Emlyn fired a slug at one of Dogmantra's escorts, sending him flying. The others did not flinch as wordlessly, another took the fallen's place.

"[EXPLETIVE] YOU! I DON'T WANT TO HEAR ABOUT ANOTHER ONE OF THOSE STUPID, STUPID [EXPLETIVE] PIECES OF TRASH."

Dogmantra shook his head wearily, sheathing his knife away as he drew his bow. "Oh Emlyn, we all know you really want one. If you won't join us, I guess we'll have to make you take one, maybe bury it with you when we're done. Gentlemen?"

"You son of a [female dog]," Emlyn muttered, as an arrow darted over his head. The swarm of men silently slid towards him, all of them moving with such speed.

He pumped his shotgun, firing slug after slug into the oncoming mass of men. But even as they fell, more and more kept coming. How did this happen again Emlyn wondered, hastily loading his gun again. He suddenly felt a jerk as the gun flew out of his hands, an arrow wedged firmly into the barrel.

Far away, he could see Dogmantra waving proudly. Emlyn drew his shovel.

"Oh you can't be serious. YOU'RE GONNA NEED A LOT MORE [EXPLETIVES] TO TAKE ME DOG!"

[mightymonarch]

For those that don't have it and would like to try it, Killing Floor is about $13 right now on Steam.

Killing Floor!!!

[watsyurname529]

For those that don't have it and would like to try it, Killing Floor is about $13 right now on Steam.

Killing Floor!!!

Gets it now!

Also, here is the new IP for the Chocolate Hammer server. To read what happened to it, check out the server thread.

68.232.183.52:27015

[Jibar]

There is a difference between (casual/playful)bickering and turning this thread into a full fledged debate and we went about as far to the debate side as you can get.

Personally I'm interested in the first, and there are plenty of other things to discuss as far as Steam/Games are concerned.

THE JIBAROCALYPSE

CHAPTER THREE, PART DEUX, WHY YOU SUCK

"So, give it to me straight Doctor, how long does he have?"
"We've no idea. His physiology is completely unknown to us. It's as if he isn't-"
WHUD. WHUD. WHUD.
"Isn't even human. And with the infection, who knows what's happening to his body?"
WHUD. WHUD. WHUD.
"We need him Doc. We need him. Rutskarn's got faith in him and so do I."
"I could do so much more-"
WHUD WHUD WHUD.
"If I knew anything about him or the infection. This is alien to all of us here. I mean-"
WHUD WHUD WHUD
"Why does he keep pounding on the screen like that, what is he doing?"
"He lives to fight. He wants to get back onto the battlefield. But with the-"
WHUDWHUDWHUD
"The infection, he's a danger to us all."
The Doctor pulled a lever and bright green gas started filtering into the chamber. Djinn rushed into a corner, trying to escape but soon it filtered into his lungs. His limbs felt dead, head getting... lighter... eyes... heavy... The Doctor rearranged his glasses.
"I'll have to consult with the rest of the staff about what to do with him. Have Miss Pond and the Sigs creature brought down here to do their own inspections."
Emlyn leant upon the window, looking at his comrade with a heavy heart. Djinn was slumped against the padded wall, his hands still balled into fists.
"Mr Emlyn, sir. If there's anything you can tell us about the Djinn or his... his infection, it would help us greatly."
"What can I say? Apparently I don't know the whole deal. I always thought Djinn was some natural born warrior, a bezerker of old living again. He eats, he sleeps, he drinks... somewhat more than he should. You brought me back Doctor, surely you can save him?"
"You're human though, through and through. Djinn... something's odd about his system. Short of opening him up there's not a thing I can do while he's infected. Is there really nothing you can tell me of the infection?"
Emlyn paused, a little too long.
"All I know is that thing was once a man, a man named Jibar. He had a group, the El Mosquitoes, and they did some things. Then, at some point he became those. They take over people, make them one of them. Nobody knows how. And the only man who does, a renegade member of the El Mosquitoes, won't say a word about him."
Emlyn turned and strode gallantly to the exit. Riot shield and bazooka bouncing on his back.
"If you want to know, ask Rutskarn."