WW Central VII: Important WW information goes here - READ OPENING POSTS!

[Andre Fairchilde]

Vampire The Masquarde needs more players.

Where is the sign up thread link thing?

Yes. Yes it does.

Seriously - the game has quite a few power roles which depart from the classic WW gameplay that will ensure quite a fun ride for all parties involved.

Not to take away from the Vampire sign up, which I think I may do just because.

But this got me to thinking - an obvious statement - almost all (not quite all) the games here are a deviation from the standard WW game. In fact there's pretty much only one totally standard game.

Why not have more standard games too?
They don't have to be big, 9-15 is fine for a WW play by post game. WW Classic can be a bigger game, and the other WW/Mafia games can be smaller and faster.

(Not that this is about me - I typically only play Classic (if I catch the sign up), as the additional rules hurt my head.)

[Gray Mage]

Well, basicaly known sides would be the same problem with self vote. Instead of voting for themselves, each member of the team would vote for another, as to get each 1 vote. Of course, this will happen as soon as a seer scries someone with the same side or when someone says, "I'm from team X, let's vote for each other and escape the lynch".

Martian needs a boost, because having to kill everyone by himself with only a night kill sounds underpowered.

[Andre Fairchilde]

WW The Masquerade sign up thread here: V:TM II: The Danse Machbre

How many players do you want again?

[GrlumpTheElder]

I am tempted, but have alot on my plate at the moment... sorry... It does look an intreaguing game though
and I still can't spell

Edit: anyone got any problems with me claiming the 7th of Feb for the start of my WW:Gnome Way to Conduct Politics game?

[Lady Tialait]

WW The Masquerade sign up thread here: V:TM II: The Danse Machbre

How many players do you want again?

26 players would be perfect. It can run with as little as 23, but I think that is a minimum.

[Thufir]

But this got me to thinking - an obvious statement - almost all (not quite all) the games here are a deviation from the standard WW game. In fact there's pretty much only one totally standard game.

Why not have more standard games too?
They don't have to be big, 9-15 is fine for a WW play by post game. WW Classic can be a bigger game, and the other WW/Mafia games can be smaller and faster.

(Not that this is about me - I typically only play Classic (if I catch the sign up), as the additional rules hurt my head.)

It's an issue - typically many narrators like to try to do something new and different, rather than just have the standard roles with different fluff, but then you end up with everyone doing that so there are no simple games, which is OK for some players but not for others, and potentially problematic for attracting new players.
Running smaller games with the standard rules could be a partial solution, because a narrator who wants to run a big, complicated game can also run a small, simple one without either particularly detracting from the other.

[Andre Fairchilde]

Ok.

After this Mafia, I will run a smaller version using the Classic rules.

It will be a D&D version of WW.

And also, I want to run a small WW game about "Emerald Rose and Andre Fairchilde get married" about a WW event before the wedding. The next one would be about the Reception, and the next the Honeymoon.

EDIT ** Where we roleplay as out avatars.**

[happyturtle]

I agree. Whenever I see a long list of weird roles and powers, my eyes glaze over, and I skip it. I'm down to one game at a time, at most, and that game is usually to be something that's no more complicated than Mafia.

When I see 'Lots of power roles!' given as a reason to join, it has the opposite effect on me. I like a nice fun wolf hunt, and for that to work, you need villagers for them to hide among.

Then again, even if every game were simpler, I'd still join only one game at a time, so changing things wouldn't improve my participation much.

[Korias]

But this got me to thinking - an obvious statement - almost all (not quite all) the games here are a deviation from the standard WW game. In fact there's pretty much only one totally standard game.

Why not have more standard games too?
They don't have to be big, 9-15 is fine for a WW play by post game. WW Classic can be a bigger game, and the other WW/Mafia games can be smaller and faster.

(Not that this is about me - I typically only play Classic (if I catch the sign up), as the additional rules hurt my head.)

Well, this is actually true. But there are quite a few levels of differentiation. For example, Vampire adds in a ton of new roles that aren't ever in normal Werewolf, but TARDIS keeps it fairly simple with only a few minor changes besides theme.

V:TM is one of those "So much new stuff to create a whole new game" type of deals.

[Lady Tialait]

V:TM and The Shards game are both examples of lots of power roles, and I knew once I saw Shards taking off that V:TM wasn't going to get players. I will keep it on standby, when I get enough players I will get it going.

The classic games are simpler and run in a way that has no balance issues, and that is a nice thing too...just...not something I wanted to narrate.

Maybe we need to adjust the schedule so it's listed how much customization there is. That way this doesn't happen, and make good games die out.

[Trixie]

When I see 'Lots of power roles!' given as a reason to join, it has the opposite effect on me.

*is hurt* ^.^"

[Murska]

Hmm. *glances at the City II preliminary ruleset*

Yeah... I guess I'm one of those 'not-so-simple-rules' narrators/players.

[Orzel]

The many games running is why I'm holding off on Open WW. Combined with the fact that is a "many power roles" (with 5 seers of all things) games, I'll just sit back 'n' wait.

Plus I'm nice and gonna let other people fill up some games. 'cause I have a 3 game limit before I before what is going on.

[Qwaz]

(Not that this is about me - I typically only play Classic (if I catch the sign up), as the additional rules hurt my head.)

When I see 'Lots of power roles!' given as a reason to join, it has the opposite effect on me. I like a nice fun wolf hunt, and for that to work, you need villagers for them to hide among.

See my Sig and sign up then. Same stuff (maybe with a Daybaner / Beast), different names!

Doesn't start until the end of January.

[101jir]

Well, basicaly known sides would be the same problem with self vote. Instead of voting for themselves, each member of the team would vote for another, as to get each 1 vote. Of course, this will happen as soon as a seer scries someone with the same side or when someone says, "I'm from team X, let's vote for each other and escape the lynch".

Martian needs a boost, because having to kill everyone by himself with only a night kill sounds underpowered.

Did I write exactly opposite of what i mean again? I do that sometimes. I will check that. But no, I think I will give Mars Martian some minions. And no, no one knows who is on their side.

[Saposhiente]

The many games running is why I'm holding off on Open WW. Combined with the fact that is a "many power roles" (with 5 seers of all things) games, I'll just sit back 'n' wait.

Plus I'm nice and gonna let other people fill up some games. 'cause I have a 3 game limit before I before what is going on.

May I suggest that we have the system be that all the games must be defined as simple or complex in power roles, and alternate types in the slots so that there isn't too much of an imbalance of one kind of game at a time?

[Gray Mage]

Did I write exactly opposite of what i mean again? I do that sometimes. I will check that. But no, I think I will give Mars Martian some minions. And no, no one knows who is on their side.

Again, that will change after night 1, unless it's a seerless game too. And if no one claims for the lulz, I mean, it's not like he'd get lynched, since if someone on his team votes for him he's imune to lynching at worst or the lynchee will be ramdomly decided among every player at best.

[Saposhiente]

Again, that will change after night 1, unless it's a seerless game too. And if no one claims for the lulz, I mean, it's not like he'd get lynched, since if someone on his team votes for him he's imune to lynching at worst or the lynchee will be ramdomly decided among every player at best.

Again, I'd have people vote more than once (for different people). Maybe also allow self votes, so that inactives are more likely to get lynched.

[Gray Mage]

Again, I'd have people vote more than once (for different people). Maybe also allow self votes, so that inactives are more likely to get lynched.

It doesn't matter how many votes each player has. The only difference is that instead of needing only two for the plan to work, now they need three. Also, self vote would make the difference between one vote w/o self vote and two votes with self vote moot.

[101jir]

Again, that will change after night 1, unless it's a seerless game too. And if no one claims for the lulz, I mean, it's not like he'd get lynched, since if someone on his team votes for him he's imune to lynching at worst or the lynchee will be ramdomly decided among every player at best.

Wait, better idea, suppose that instead of the reverse votes, suppose that scrying Do-Do turns a scrier into a fool for the rest of the game?

[Gray Mage]

True, what would you think of a seerless game? Masons only?

If you want masons to be unlynchable...

Edit:

Wait, better idea, suppose that instead of the reverse votes, suppose that scrying Do-Do turns a scrier into a fool for the rest of the game?

That'd be interesting. It'd be a one time thing or every time he's scried?

[101jir]

If you want masons to be unlynchable...

Edit:

That'd be interesting.

Do-do is interesting, so I think he should have some totally unprecedented ability that is really strange. Like the Scrier to fool thing. maybe he can pick heros or villains too?

[Gray Mage]

Do-do is interesting, so I think he should have some totally unprecedented ability that is really strange. maybe he can pick heros or villains?

Hmm, that'd make him not only a great ally or foe, but also help him survive. It's tempting.

Edit: The seer to fool would be a one time thing?

[101jir]

Hmm, that'd make him not only a great ally or foe, but also help him survive. It's tempting.

Edit: The seer to fool would be a one time thing?

OK, for some reason, the edit only shows up on the new reply page. I was thinking a permanent change from scrier to fool, but do you think that would cause problems? Also, if we managed to hack out the rules, would you be interested in hosting it?

[Gray Mage]

OK, for some reason, the edit only shows up on the new reply page. I was thinking a permanent change from scrier to fool, but do you think that would cause problems? Also, if we managed to hack out the rules, would you be interested in hosting it?

Well, I think either is fine (permanent or not), but maybe have fool to seer too?
As for hosting, it'd depend on when it starts, right now I'm helping at various games because I'm having a lot of free time, but once college begins again I'm not sure if I'll be able.

[101jir]

Well, I think either is fine (permanent or not), but maybe have fool to seer too?
As for hosting, it'd depend on when it starts, right now I'm helping at various games because I'm having a lot of free time, but once college begins again I'm not sure if I'll be able.

No concern about when it starts, just as long as we don't forget the rules by that time. That would be awesome to go fool back to seer if they scry him a second time. I like your thinking. How confusing!

[Gray Mage]

No concern about when it starts, just as long as we don't forget the rules by that time. That would be awesome to go fool back to seer if they scry him a second time. I like your thinking. How confusing!

There could also have an "beast" like effect, but instead of dying one of the killers gets another role (not side) ramdomly? Kind of dangerous for some roles and worthwhile for others.

[101jir]

There could also have an "beast" like effect, but instead of dying one of the killers gets another role (not side) ramdomly? Kind of dangerous for some roles and worthwhile for others.

If you would like, but keep in mind that I am considering releasing the items on Dodo's death. If you compile the three, it would be crazy, and that does fit Dodo (as i found out it is supposed to be spelled I guess), but would that be overkill to have the three together?

[Lady Tialait]

How about all Masons are Beasts?

Also....Jirry....go join my VTM game...or I'll polymorph you!...into...a thing.

[Fortuna]

Alright, I'm going to try running one more game. I realize that I've not exactly been the most consistent poster in this forum, but I'm confident that I can manage one game. The 14th looks to be still open. D'you mind if I take that for Ghosts WW: I'll finish this one, I promise?

Kidding. Ghosts WW: The Spectre of Forgetfulness

EDIT: Here's the rules for the game, for review.

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OK, this is a more than slightly complicated WW game. Before trying to understand these rules, make sure that you understand the basic rules. There's still a team good, and a team bad, but six of the players have somewhat unusual roles.

Ground Rules
This is a no-PM game, with the exception of bonded spirits and their hosts (see below).
Helgraf's Scry Interference is not in effect.
Role claiming is permitted.

Good People

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Townsperson: An unremarkable soul, the townspeople simply want to live their lives in peace. (Villager).
Journalist: Well-versed in investigation, the journalist is able to determine something about someone. Once per night, the journalist may scry a target with a 75% chance of success, or only 25% if the target is a ghost. (Seer).
Mayor: Although extremely rich and influential, the mayor is more than happy to help those in need. Every night, the mayor may choose a target (not themselves). Each time the target takes an action until the mayor next uses the power, there is a 50% chance that the action will be enhanced (more explanation below). (Special).
Cop: Good-hearted and strong as an ox, the cop is more than capable of defending the innocent. Each night, the cop may protect one target from night-kills. (Baner)

Good Spirits

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Watcher: The watcher has centuries of experience in seeing what is hidden from others. Once per night, the watcher may scry a target with a 75% chance of success, or only 25% if the target is a person.
Giver: The giver has nothing physical to give anymore, but the spiritual should not be underestimated. Every night, the giver may choose a target (not themselves). Each time the target takes an action until the giver next uses the power, there is a 50% chance that the action will be enhanced (more explanation below).
Guardian: Love is said to be the strongest shield of all, and the guardian has fiercer love than any. Each night, the Guardian may protect one target from night-kills.

Bad People

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Fraud: A consummate liar, the fraud can make falsehoods seem true and truths seem like lies. Each night, the fraud chooses two non-townsperson roles. There is a 50% chance that any attempt to scry on one of those roles will return the other. (Special)
Crook: The best burglar, pickpocket and all-around scumbag in the business, the crook wants what you have and will have it. Each night, the crook chooses a target. There is a 50% chance that the target's next vote will not count, in which case the crook's next vote counts double. (Special)
Psychopath: Relishing death and terror, the psychopath savours the kill. Each night, the psychopath may attempt to kill a target, with a 50% chance of success. (Special)

Bad Spirits

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Deceiver: The line between actuality and fantasy blurs when you want it to, and the deceiver helps the process along. Each night, the deceiver chooses two non-townsperson roles. There is a 50% chance that any attempt to scry on one of those roles will return the other. (Special)
Taker: People have so much that they are never thankful for until the taker removes it from their lives. Each night, the taker chooses a target. There is a 50% chance that the target's next vote will not count, in which case the taker's next vote counts double. (Special)
Madman: Purple octopus bicycles reenact porpoises through flying tortoises! Each night, the madman may attempt to kill a target, with a 50% chance of success. (Special)

In addition, one spirit is the Spectre of Forgetfulness. This spirit's essence has been corrupted by long years of half-life, and so this spirit wins only if its team wins and it or its descendant is dead.
Spirits

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Certain roles are spirits, which obey special rules. Spirits vote for lynch and night-kill as usual, but they also have other abilities.
Bonding: Each night, a spirit must choose a target to bond to. It cannot be the same target that they bonded to the previous night. The spirit and their bonded host may PM each other freely until the spirit bonds to another host. If a spirit attempts to bond to another spirit, a random host is selected for the following night. If two spirits attempt to bond to the same host, then the ancestor takes precedence, or if neither is the ancestor then both rebound to a random host. If there are more spirits than people in the game, then one or more spirits will be chosen at random from among those rebounding to go hostless. Hosts are informed of the spirit to whom they are bonded, although neither has their role revealed.
Child Sense: When a spirit bonds to their descendant, both are made aware of this fact.

Descendants
Each spirit has a descendant, whether actual or spiritual it matters not. These descendants resonate more strongly with the spirits than any other host. When a spirit and their descendant are bonded, their special actions grow more powerful, so long as both use their actions for the same purpose. The journalist is the watcher's descendant, the mayor is the giver's, the cop is the guardian's, the fraud is the deceiver's, the crook is the taker's, and the psychopath is the madman's. These roles gain the following benefits when working together.

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Journalist-Watcher: Both guarantee knowing the target's role, and also learn who else has targetted the target that night and who the target has targetted that night. They also penetrate either the Fraud or the Deceiver, though if those two are working together then the investigation is fooled.
Mayor-Giver: The target receives the enhancement, and their votes additionally count double (beyond the enhancement).
Cop-Guardian: The target is also Day-Baned, and Night-Baned the next night.
Fraud-Deceiver: The deception can fool even the Journalist and Watcher working together, and remains until tested (although after the first night, the Journalist and Watcher working together can penetrate it).
Crook-Taker: The theft is guaranteed, with each of the pair gaining a double vote the next day. In addition, there is a fifty percent chance that the target's vote on the day after is also voided, in which case either the crook or the taker gains an additional vote on that day.
Psychopath-Madman: The kill succeeds, and if either of the two are killed the next day then one person who voted for them is also killed.

Enhancement
The mayor and giver can enhance a target's actions. For power-roles, this guarantees their power working the next day. In any event, the target's voting (both day and night) is doubled in strength.