General Exalted Discussion IV: Roll Join Debate

[a_humble_lich]

I'm not seeing any of the real Exalts?
Were there no Infernals in 1e? I need a 1eologist.

You're right, there aren't any Alchemicals. They got everyone else important though.

[Xefas]

You're right, there aren't any Alchemicals. They got everyone else important though.

Well done, sir.

---

Unrelated, the more I read about Abyssals, the more I think Autochthon may have intentionally built a crazy switch into the Solar Exaltations.

[Turalisj]

Nope, there's two things that taint the view of Abyssals-

1) The guy making the book didn't like em (or so I heard)
2) They are Solars corrupted by the Deathlords, they are set to crazy by default.

[Xefas]

The two psychotic unfounded conspiracy theories I'm working on so far are:

1) Autochthon built a crazy switch into the Solar Exaltations just in case their sparkliness wasn't sufficient to kill the Primordials. This is what he was modeling the Soulsteel Castes for, and this is why Solars can actually become a different Exalt type without dying (either via monstrance, or Nephilpal said that there's a theoretical charm that would allow a Solar to do the conversion on his own power).

2) Because the Unconquered Sun was created as a specific inversion of the Dragon's Shadow, his very nature to be the defining opposite of something else, when he infused his Exaltations, he also gave them the nature of being a defining opposition of something far more terrible.

[Ganurath]

The original Exalted Limit track was originally designed by the gods and Autochthon to act as an ablative defense against madness-inducing Primordial magic. Unfortunately, Limit created an unintended backdoor vulnerability that the dying Primordials exploited and corrupted with their Great Curse, bypassing anti-Shaping defenses through this hidden imperfection.

The section on Abyssal Redemption is most insightful in this regard.

[Turalisj]

This is what he was modeling the Soulsteel Castes for, and this is why Solars can actually become a different Exalt type without dying

Except Solars weren't designed to be corrupted, it took one of (if not the) most dangerous of all the Yozi to figure out how to do it. And Soulsteel existed before the Usurpation.

[Lochar]

Solar Exaltations are a fragment of the perfection of the UCS.

When applied against a human soul, the Solar Exalt is a perfection of human ability.

The Abyssals, for all they are 'death and destruction ho!' are the same. They've reversed the energy feed, but it is still a perfection applied to a human soul. However, they've just said 'anything that isn't kill everything related hurts'.


The Infernals are still a perfection. However, they've been hooked up to a new powersource, the Yozi. In addition, they are no longer being allowed to perfect the soul they are attached to, instead they are given direct access to said Yozi power.

It is no wonder the Infernals are baby-Primordials. The power of the UCS' perfecting touch applied against Yozi power means the owners of the Exaltation shards mean they're going to go above and beyond the broken Yozi.

[Xefas]

The section on Abyssal Redemption is most insightful in this regard.

Oooo, cool. I may have to use this conspiracy theory in my tabletop game at some point.

Except Solars weren't designed to be corrupted, it took one of (if not the) most dangerous of all the Yozi to figure out how to do it. And Soulsteel existed before the Usurpation.

Nothing you've said here actually refutes this at all.

stuff

Okay?

[Lochar]

Just a random thought.

[Ganurath]

Oooo, cool. I may have to use this conspiracy theory in my tabletop game at some point.

If you're referring to what I quoted, the Scroll of Errata is canon. Moreso than most of the other books. Not sure where it stands compared to Alchies, as they're withholding errata on that for the moment.

[Xefas]

If you're referring to what I quoted, the Scroll of Errata is canon. Moreso than most of the other books. Not sure where it stands compared to Alchies, as they're withholding errata on that for the moment.

No, I mean that what you quoted is canon, and it adds an interesting bit of info for my first conspiracy theory, so it has enough basis that I might actually want to use it for an adventure.

[The Rose Dragon]

Hmm, top left just below the Incarna are the Terrestrials. Someone I don't know, Peleps Deled, Mnemon fighting with Tepet Ejava, then Tepet Arada having a nap next to some Pattern Spiders.

Someone you don't know? You don't recognize Sesus Nagezzer, the most awesome Terrestrial to ever Terrestrial the Terrestrial out of that Terrestrial?

((Also, that is not Roseblack fighting with Mnemon. In the colored version, it is much clearer, since she is wearing red and has black hair. If I had to guess, she would either be Sesus Rafara or Tepet Lisara.))

EDIT: For reference, the colored version:

Spoiler

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[Xefas]

I think something has gone terribly wrong with the Midnight Caste lady in the colored version. Shouldn't those bits below her censor-chain be flesh colored instead of purple? D=

Presuming that she wears an actual dress seems kind of insulting.

[The Rose Dragon]

I think something has gone terribly wrong with the Midnight Caste lady in the colored version. Shouldn't those bits below her censor-chain be flesh colored instead of purple? D=

Presuming that she wears an actual dress seems kind of insulting.

Shh. This is a T-rated picture. We don't talk about c-e-n-s-o-r-s here.

((Also, I will note that Harmonious Jade never wears that much in any of her artwork either.))

[Lix Lorn]

I think something has gone terribly wrong with the Midnight Caste lady in the colored version. Shouldn't those bits below her censor-chain be flesh colored instead of purple? D=

Presuming that she wears an actual dress seems kind of insulting.

This is exactly what I though. D=
I have problems.

[Xefas]

((Also, I will note that Harmonious Jade never wears that much in any of her artwork either.))

Oh crap, you're right! I didn't even realize. Yeah, that seems pretty deliberate, which is kinda awful. I'd say it's a case of slut shaming, but there's not really any scantily clad men to compare it to. Which makes me wonder why there are no scantily clad iconic male Exalted. I mean, Panther is topless, but why can't we get like an Abyssal in a thong? He could be like The Todd, and his catchphrase could be "This is totally 'trappings of the grave'. ESSENCE RESPIRATION FIVE!" (insert high five). Or maybe a Water Aspect in a mankini.

Hell, why is their clothing in Autochthonia? Isn't he climate controlled or something? Those textiles could be going to work fixing the Great Maker, citizen. Now relinquish yon pantaloons.

EDIT: Also, squee@foxlix

[Kris Strife]

Hell, why is their clothing in Autochthonia? Isn't he climate controlled or something? Those textiles could be going to work fixing the Great Maker, citizen. Now relinquish yon pantaloons.

To keep any... tender bits from getting caught in the machinery.

[Lix Lorn]

Oh crap, you're right! I didn't even realize. Yeah, that seems pretty deliberate, which is kinda awful. I'd say it's a case of slut shaming, but there's not really any scantily clad men to compare it to. Which makes me wonder why there are no scantily clad iconic male Exalted. I mean, Panther is topless, but why can't we get like an Abyssal in a thong? He could be like The Todd, and his catchphrase could be "This is totally 'trappings of the grave'. ESSENCE RESPIRATION FIVE!" (insert high five). Or maybe a Water Aspect in a mankini.

It's probably just that the artist doesn't want to draw 'dirty' artwork. (shrugs)

Hell, why is their clothing in Autochthonia? Isn't he climate controlled or something? Those textiles could be going to work fixing the Great Maker, citizen. Now relinquish yon pantaloons.

Halt, citizen. A lack of clothing would lead to unnecessary temptation, which would reduce productivity.

EDIT: Also, squee@foxlix

Aww, thanks. It's an avvie of Millie from Ozyandmillie, and it's drawn by Rae Artemi.

[The Rose Dragon]

It's probably just that the artist doesn't want to draw 'dirty' artwork. (shrugs)

Heh. Have you seen any of Melissa Uran's actual artwork? A good portion is not exactly work safe.

[Lix Lorn]

Huh. Then maybe she just wanted this piece to be?
To be fair, chibi+naked is an odd combination. It might be that.

[TheCountAlucard]

To be fair, chibi+naked is an odd combination. It might be that.

Thanks, Lix - once again, you have contributed to my various horrifying thoughts.

[Mr.Bookworm]

1) Autochthon built a crazy switch into the Solar Exaltations just in case their sparkliness wasn't sufficient to kill the Primordials.

Main problem with this theory: Autochthon had no idea that death essence was a thing. You couldn't have made an Abyssal until after the Exaltations were made, when the first Primordial was killed and the Neverborn came to be.

This is what he was modeling the Soulsteel Castes for,

It also seems pretty clear that Autobot didn't model the Soulsteels on anything. See: Alchemical resonance rules.

Nephilpal said that there's a theoretical charm that would allow a Solar to do the conversion on his own power).

Well, Black Mirror Revelation and you're almost already there.

2) Because the Unconquered Sun was created as a specific inversion of the Dragon's Shadow, his very nature to be the defining opposite of something else, when he infused his Exaltations, he also gave them the nature of being a defining opposition of something far more terrible.

Oooh, I like this idea. But again, the "opposite" wasn't in existence until after the War.

Thanks, Lix - once again, you have contributed to my various horrifying thoughts.

Sexy, sexy horrifying thoughts.

[Yuki Akuma]

The Ebon Dragon is very specifically not a Creature of Death.

He can make himself one, as it is his nature to cheat and subvert all the rules, but natively his Essence is not of Death.

[Qaera]

So how are Red Moon Princesses and Black Star Viziers getting around to existing? Cause I've been thinking about a coupling based on some lines from a Florence and the Machine song:

Spoiler

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I took the stars from our eyes and then I made a map.
And knew that somehow I could find my way back.
Then I heard your heart beating, you were in the darkness too.
So I stayed in the darkness with you.
THE STARS, THE MOO-OO-OON

So yeah, Cosmic love, go check it out.

[Lix Lorn]

Thanks, Lix - once again, you have contributed to my various horrifying thoughts.

Sexy, sexy horrifying thoughts.

But... I was just saying how ODD naked-chibi is. xD

So how are Red Moon Princesses and Black Star Viziers getting around to existing? Cause I've been thinking about a coupling based on some lines from a Florence and the Machine song:

Spoiler

Show

I took the stars from our eyes and then I made a map.
And knew that somehow I could find my way back.
Then I heard your heart beating, you were in the darkness too.
So I stayed in the darkness with you.
THE STARS, THE MOO-OO-OON

So yeah, Cosmic love, go check it out.

...you are a great arty type AND you have good taste in music?

[SurlySeraph]

... would those be hell-Lunars and hell-Sids, or underworld-Lunars and underworld-Sids?

I think having Lunars stay Lunars regardless of who they're working for makes sense. Adaptability is their thing, so adapting to being a servant of the Yozis shouldn't be too tricky for them. (Granted, they need to be at E4 to get Green Sun Child, and E6 for Essential Mirror Form, and I don't remember whether EMF lets them learn Yozi charms or they'd need something else for that).

Regular Sids are trying to figure out the Underworld's astrology so they can use it, though having some turn underworld-y due to improperly messing with the Calendar of Setesh, having a BEST IDEA EVER, etc. is viable. I haven't read the enormous homebrew MoEP: Nocturnals, but I think it could be used for hell-Sids since they apparently have a theme of defying fate and doing the impossible.

[Qaera]

...you are a great arty type AND you have good taste in music?

I try

... would those be hell-Lunars and hell-Sids, or underworld-Lunars and underworld-Sids?

I think having Lunars stay Lunars regardless of who they're working for makes sense. Adaptability is their thing, so adapting to being a servant of the Yozis shouldn't be too tricky for them. (Granted, they need to be at E4 to get Green Sun Child, and E6 for Essential Mirror Form, and I don't remember whether EMF lets them learn Yozi charms or they'd need something else for that).

Regular Sids are trying to figure out the Underworld's astrology so they can use it, though having some turn underworld-y due to improperly messing with the Calendar of Setesh, having a BEST IDEA EVER, etc. is viable. I haven't read the enormous homebrew MoEP: Nocturnals, but I think it could be used for hell-Sids since they apparently have a theme of defying fate and doing the impossible.

Hell of course.
Lunars staying the same makes sense but I think there should be a Knack or something mechanical that can represent Infernal affiliations.

[Yuki Akuma]

Pretty sure the only way for Lunars to learn Yozi charms is to get Akuma'd - only Solaroids can learn Yozi charms without selling their soul.

Of course if Lunar Exaltations got all corrupted by the Yozis that might change.

And they already have knacks that let them turn into demons.

[Lix Lorn]

There is a homebrew knack for red moon princesses. Lemme look.

Ayup.

[Yuki Akuma]

There is a homebrew knack for red moon princesses. Lemme look.

Ayup.

Huh. Neat.

Hey, Lochar?

Take note of that knack.