Reverse WW V - The Villagers Wrath!

[Gray Mage]

Don't you know, Gray Mage? Bacon is a type of vegetable.

I thought ham and bacon were different things, are they not?

[Lex-Kat]

Bacon is a vegetable?

[Zjoot]

I thought ham and bacon were different things, are they not?

Not if you live in Canada.

[bladescape]

Ramsus because he's pointing at me. And that is utterly scary.

[TFT]

super dark33 for his unique font!

[Trixie]

Bacon is a vegetable?

Well, ponies eat it, so it must be

[cd4]

Qwaz hasn't got anyone point at him yet, so I'll make another one person wagon.

[Tasroth]

Well, my random point goes to erikun.

[TigerFang]

Well, ponies eat it, so it must be

You know that is a very good point.


Gray Mage because meat is good for werewolves. If Lex-Kat forgot about that vegetarian nonsense so be it! Plus that way I get more customers.

[Ramsus]

Gray Mage solely because he's the only person with more than 1 vote on him and we really should lynch someone.

Edit: I'm wondering something. Bill, why do you say using the night kill is bad? The wolves are all blind, we don't have any power roles we could accidentally hit. I don't see how the random guessing/analysis of the crowd is necessarily any better than that of an individual.

[billtodamax]

Gray Mage solely because he's the only person with more than 1 vote on him and we really should lynch someone.

Edit: I'm wondering something. Bill, why do you say using the night kill is bad? The wolves are all blind, we don't have any power roles we could accidentally hit. I don't see how the random guessing/analysis of the crowd is necessarily any better than that of an individual.

The random guessing of the crowd versus the individual is one way to look at it, and yes, they're generally both about equal (Although with more members in the crowd it's more likely to have correct analysis, and flaws in reasoning can be examined more thoroughly).

However! The analysis of the crowd is visible to everyone, and adds much more information from a lynch than the nightkill does - which way people vote, what they say to justify their vote, and so on. A nightkill only reveals someone's role - something we get from the lynch.

[Gray Mage]

Gray Mage solely because he's the only person with more than 1 vote on him and we really should lynch someone.

Edit: I'm wondering something. Bill, why do you say using the night kill is bad? The wolves are all blind, we don't have any power roles we could accidentally hit. I don't see how the random guessing/analysis of the crowd is necessarily any better than that of an individual.

I find this awfully suspicious, Ramsus. Why change your vote for blade?

[Grue Bait]

Gray Mage solely because he's the only person with more than 1 vote on him and we really should lynch someone.

Edit: I'm wondering something. Bill, why do you say using the night kill is bad? The wolves are all blind, we don't have any power roles we could accidentally hit. I don't see how the random guessing/analysis of the crowd is necessarily any better than that of an individual.

Ramsus has a good point, Billtodamax The night kill won't hurt us any more than lynching, so why would you say that unless you were afraid of an unexpected kill? I'm not accusing, I'm just wondering if you know something the rest of us should know.

[Thufir]

Ramsus has a good point, Billtodamax The night kill won't hurt us any more than lynching, so why would you say that unless you were afraid of an unexpected kill? I'm not accusing, I'm just wondering if you know something the rest of us should know.

We've been saying this since the first game, Grue Bait. Unless you have legitimate reasons to suspect someone of being a Villager, it's just blind luck, so odds are you'll hit a fellow Wolf. So you're thinning down our numbers without giving us any information.
The one counterpoint to this is that using the night kill it limits the number of times the Villager can recruit. But this is stacked up against how much we outnumber the Villager(s) already, which is obviously increased the less of our own we kill.

[Grue Bait]

Sorry, Thufir, but I haven't been here since the first game. This is only my 3rd ww game and I'm still not clear on all the subtle nuances.

[Ramsus]

The random guessing of the crowd versus the individual is one way to look at it, and yes, they're generally both about equal (Although with more members in the crowd it's more likely to have correct analysis, and flaws in reasoning can be examined more thoroughly).

However! The analysis of the crowd is visible to everyone, and adds much more information from a lynch than the nightkill does - which way people vote, what they say to justify their vote, and so on. A nightkill only reveals someone's role - something we get from the lynch.

Ah, yeah....I have no idea how I overlooked that. Good point. I'll stand with you on it being a bad idea to use the night kill.

Edit: Gray Mage, now I'm actually suspicious of you. That was a very weak defense considering I explained my reasons pretty clearly.

[Gray Mage]

Ah, yeah....I have no idea how I overlooked that. Good point. I'll stand with you on it being a bad idea to use the night kill.

Edit: Gray Mage, now I'm actually suspicious of you. That was a very weak defense considering I explained my reasons pretty clearly.

Considering that there's no minimun number of votes needed to lynch anyone, I don't find your reasons to be that straightfoward and clear.

[Zjoot]

Switching to Ramsus, because Grue wanted me to switch off of him and it's the first name that came to my mind.

[erikun]

Sorry, Thufir, but I haven't been here since the first game. This is only my 3rd ww game and I'm still not clear on all the subtle nuances.

In order for the wolves to win, all the villagers need to be dead. In order for the villagers to win, they need to take up 50% of the population.

The only time a random kill is desired is when it is more likely to hit a villager than a wolf - which would be never, as the villagers would've already won by that point. Plus, random night kills would just shorten the time needed to find the villagers. At 22 players, it would take us 15 days before the villagers won. (21 starting wolves - 15 wolves = 6 wolves; 1 starting villager + 5 villagers = 6 villagers) Every additional wolf death from a night kill drops that number roughly by one day.

Please note that if the person with the night kill is certain that someone is a villager, or at least reasonably certain, then that heavily factors into things and will easily make it a good idea. How good depends on how certain you are. (and if you are correct, of course )


Yay maths for the second day in a row! This is apparently becoming a habit for me.

Note: Some bad math up above, as I forgot to include the lynchings. We should expect to have 9 days, at the least, to locate the villagers; this assumes a worst-case scenario where only wolves get lynched each day. Regardless, the point still stands; killing an additional wolf each night speeds things up, and you are much more likely to hit a random wolf than a random villager, especially on the first day.

[Ramsus]

Ok unlike Gray Mage I'll actually defend myself and probably not magically have votes put onto someone pointing at me in a sudden lump of suspiciousness.

1) I forgot about not needing a minimum number of votes in this game. It's pretty standard to need a minimum number and I didn't bother to go check.

2) We'd all still be lynching nobody at all if I hadn't gone ahead and pointed out nobody was voting and just waiting around for wagons to jump onto.

3) I knew I was drawing attention to myself when I voted first and when I was third on Gray Mage's wagon and again when I asked Bill a question. Does that sound like someone who is trying to avoid attention? And yes, I could be the villager and using having a high profile as a tactic for my defense but....really that gets you lynched more often than not so it's not a tactic I would likely be using. And if I really was anti-town I probably would have tried to make a case for using the night kill, I'm sure there are decent arguments for it I could have used.

4) How many times do I have to die in the first couple days in a row? C'mon, let me play. Sheesh.

[Qwaz]

CD4...Petty revenge point is petty.

[Gray Mage]

Ok unlike Gray Mage I'll actually defend myself and probably not magically have votes put onto someone pointing at me in a sudden lump of suspiciousness.

1) I forgot about not needing a minimum number of votes in this game. It's pretty standard to need a minimum number and I didn't bother to go check.

If by standard you mean at most Lex's games, and now not even her latest game does. In fact, the standard is not needing a minimum.

2) We'd all still be lynching nobody at all if I hadn't gone ahead and pointed out nobody was voting and just waiting around for wagons to jump onto.

Yes, we would. It'd have been me, since Tiger voted I had 2 votes on. And even if that was not the case, we'd have been lynching blade, since he got the first point.

3) I knew I was drawing attention to myself when I voted first and when I was third on Gray Mage's wagon and again when I asked Bill a question. Does that sound like someone who is trying to avoid attention? And yes, I could be the villager and using having a high profile as a tactic for my defense but....really that gets you lynched more often than not so it's not a tactic I would likely be using. And if I really was anti-town I probably would have tried to make a case for using the night kill, I'm sure there are decent arguments for it I could have used.

No comments here, it's far too early in the morning to start debating what ifs.

4) How many times do I have to die in the first couple days in a row? C'mon, let me play. Sheesh.

I'd say the same thing, I've been lynched a lot recently too and would also like to play.

Comments in bold.

[Ramsus]

Well then why not suggest an alternate target if you're in the same boat?

[Lex-Kat]

I suggest lynching Lemonus. Lemons are sour. When someone is sour, it means they are bad. The villager is bad. Therefore, Villager = Bad = Sour = Lemons = Lemonus.

[TsukikoJ]

Lemonus. Good logic!

[TigerFang]

I suggest lynching Lemonus. Lemons are sour. When someone is sour, it means they are bad. The villager is bad. Therefore, Villager = Bad = Sour = Lemons = Lemonus.

That made my day. So Lemonus.

[Ramsus]

I suggest lynching Lemonus. Lemons are sour. When someone is sour, it means they are bad. The villager is bad. Therefore, Villager = Bad = Sour = Lemons = Lemonus.

Hard to argue with logic like that. Lemonus it is. Better than me at any rate.

[Gray Mage]

Well then why not suggest an alternate target if you're in the same boat?

Sorry for the delay in answering, I was in class all day and posted that message just before leaving.

Lemonus.

[Lemonus]

Ramsus for not being me.

And why exactly am I being wagoned?

[Deathslayer7]

day ends. update to come. No more voting.