Civ 4: The War of the Staches

[happyturtle]

It is well known that one cannot be a truly great leader without a truly great Mustache of Might. But only one leader can be said to have the best, the most magnificent, the most glorious mustache.

Eight leaders peered at one another across the battleplains, determined to take their place as the Mustache victor!

{table]||
Tokugawa|Gandhi|Peter
||
Louis XIV|Stalin|Bismarck
|
Mansa Musa|DeGaulle
[/table]

For this succession game, we will need 3-5 players. Once the player roster is set, we'll vote on which Stache we will choose to represent as the Best Stache Ever in the War of the Staches. Only leaders shown in their leaderhead with mustaches unaccompanied by beards are eligible. Hence the eight above.

Any victory type is acceptable, so long as we win!

Players:
1. Happyturtle
2. Obadiah Slim
3. Winthur
4. Terra Oblivion
5. Jonzac

*. Murska (will pick up occasional turnsets)

[ObadiahtheSlim]

Hell yeah! Mansa Musa. I'm down depending on what difficulty we play at. Also we using any mods? I'd say we should just go with BUG.

[Winthur]

Cyrus and Brennus got lost somewhere there.

I'd vote for Stalin myself, mostly because of my brother's reaction to my unpacking of Civ4 BtS: "why the hell is Mario a new leader of the Russian Empire?" On the other hand, we've already done Russia in the previous succession game, which, to my knowledge, we never finished.

Secondary pick would be Mansa.

I suppose I could chime in - I haven't played Civ4 in a long while so I will definitely be very rusty - but I might as well play from the backlines, giving out lurker feedback.

Depends on how popular this thing gets.

Wonder how Terraoblivion's doing.

[Terraoblivion]

I'll give it a shot, even if it's ages since I've played. For leaders I agree with Stalin or Mansa Musa, maybe Bismarck, the mustaches of the other five are weak and not worthy of victory!

[Jonzac]

I'm up for a vanilla run. Germany for me...that handlebar stashe seems "excellent"

[ObadiahtheSlim]

I hope by vanilla you mean BtS expansion.

[happyturtle]

Cyrus and Brennus both have beards, which disqualified them. Otherwise, the list would be a lot longer.

I'm partial to Toku's stache myself, but Bismarck is a close second.

That's five players, or six if Murska plays (I chatted with him about it, and he seemed interested, but I didn't get a firm yes out of him) so I'll mark the recruiting phase closed. Hopefully this game won't fizzle as bad as the Russian one did. For one thing, I think we'll go light on any roleplay type restrictions like we did with that game.

Let's go for a vote on the leaders, with your first, second, and third choices. We'll weight all the votes accordingly, and then decide.

1. Tokugawa
2. Bismarck
3. Stalin

My preference for map type
1. Pangea
2. Continents
3. Don't care that much

Difficulty:
1. Monarch
2. Emperor

[ObadiahtheSlim]

Leader
1.) Mansa Musa
2.) Gandhi
3.) De Gaulle

Map:
Any standard style map.

Difficulty:
Monarch.

[Jonzac]

Yes, by vanilla I mean BtS no mods.

my choices

1. Bismark
2. Gandhi
3. Tokugawa

Monarch difficulty for me...I'll have trouble with that, but it will be fun to try.

[Terraoblivion]

Yeah, the BUG mod caused all sorts of problems last we tried sending saves around while using it.

Leader:
1. Stalin
2. Bismarck
3. Mansa Musa

Map:

Any standard

Difficulty:
1. Emperor
2. Monarch

We all seem to play better here than we do when we're at home alone and it's been ages that a game has even come up tricky for us on Monarch, even with weird variants going on, so I'd say we're ready for Emperor. We just need to communicate properly.

[Avilan the Grey]

Just popping in to say that Bismark was my favorite Civ 4 leader. He fit my playstyle perfectly (I don't like to attack too early, and getting ubertanks in the 20th century was basically perfect for me) and since Sweden (or Vikings) doesn't exist in the game anyway....

[Winthur]

and since Sweden (or Vikings) doesn't exist in the game anyway....

Ragnar Lodbrok is giving you the evil eye.

1. Stalin
2. Bismarck
3. Mansa

My preference for map type
1. Fractal
2: Continents
3: Whatever

Difficulty:
1. Monarch - works better for everyone, myself included, since I'm rusty.

[happyturtle]

Murska says he wants to play as a Joker, and just pick up a turnset now and again, without being in the rotation proper. I guess that means we're ready to begin!

Votes:
Bismarck 2+2+3+2=9
Stalin 3+3+1=7
Mansa 1+1+3=5
Gandhi 2+2=4
Tokugawa 1+3=4
DeGaulle 1=1
Louis XIV = 0
Peter = 0

Whatever 1+3+3+1=5
Continents 2+2=4
Fractal 3=3
Pangea 3=3

Monarch 3+2+3+3+3
Emperor 3+2

So, the winning settings are: Bismarck, Random map type, Monarch difficulty

If no one objects, I'll also do Standard size and Normal speed, and leave all the other options as default. If anyone has any strong feelings for anything else, speak up. I won't built the map and run the first turnset until tomorrow morning.

[Terraoblivion]

Sounds fine to me.

[Winthur]

If no one objects, I'll also do Standard size and Normal speed, and leave all the other options as default. If anyone has any strong feelings for anything else, speak up. I won't built the map and run the first turnset until tomorrow morning.

You better not give us that option, because I remember the polls in a certain PBEM had people voting for map climate (temperate, arid, rocky, etc.) and sea level.

Aside from that, I could live without Random Events if only because most of them seem either hugely irrelevant or are just pesky annoyances (nothing beats whipping a Forge and then losing it to a fire a turn later), but you can leave everything normal.

[happyturtle]

I've set up the game. Since we had two mustached French leaders and two Russian ones, I chose 'Unrestricted leaders' and gave both Louis and Stalin a Random civ to lead. Figured it'd add a bit of fun as well as avoid some of the "Hey, are we at war with Red Russia or Purple Russia?" confusion.

The start:

Spoiler

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The file:
http://www.sendspace.com/file/641o5y

I think the start looks right for settling in place, start on a worker, and mine the pigs. Germany starts with hunting and mining, so I think BW is the best starting tech. Might as well get right into Slavery! Your thoughts? Bystanders are welcome to chime in too. :{D

[Terraoblivion]

The starting spot does look good, but I'd like to know what there is to the east. Nothing to do in that regard though, so settling in place is fine. However, I don't agree that we should go straight for bronze working. Food is the most valuable for a city starting up and it looks like our best shot at early food is the pigs, so I think animal husbandry, followed by bronze working will be a better bet. Unless founding the city reveals something amazing to the east.

[Winthur]

I'd ordinarily propose moving the Scout on the Marble by one tile, then towards whatever direction can see more tiles to the west. Reasoning is that moving to the east causes the Scout to only move once in this turn, and I'm tempted to move 1W if there's more food there, because then we will have a better capital (with no Fresh Water, but we are Expansive) with a center plot worth 2 hammers whch is strong with Expansive (+25% faster workers).

However the west is all plains and there doesn't seem to be much food there overall, so it might as well give us nothing. East has grasslands, but the only viable move for the Scout seems to be 1NE.

This looks like it really sucks.

[ObadiahtheSlim]

I really hope we have some starting iron or copper. Because unless we have unrevealed food to the east we are going to be hurting for growth.

On the bright side, that's a ton of forest to chop for our REX or to grab 'mids. I'd say we'd be foolish to not grab 'mids and run a SE given our industrious trait.

[Winthur]

On the bright side, that's a ton of forest to chop for our REX or to grab 'mids. I'd say we'd be foolish to not grab 'mids and run a SE given our industrious trait.

The Pyramids cost 500 hammers, not necessarily the investment we need. We don't know how the land grab is going to go and we don't know if the forests can't be used for other things (Oracle -> Metal Casting [a monopoly tech and Industrious Forges], an Axeman/Swordsman army, The Great Library or just plain old Workers/Settlers for the REX.). What if we find Marble? I'd be totally up for Pyramids if we had Stone nearby though.

Also, if the roster isn't lying to me, you're up, Obadiah! disregard that i suck lollipops

Also also, if we DO rush Bronze Working, we probably want to revolt to Slavery right after getting our first Worker AND BW out. If we don't rush BW then wait for Slavery until after the first Settler.

[happyturtle]

I still need to play the opening turns. I was just showing off the start for thoughts. I'll go and play my turns now.

[Winthur]

I still need to play the opening turns. I was just showing off the start for thoughts. I'll go and play my turns now.

>_> I'm not thinking straight, you're right. Gl&hf in any case.

[happyturtle]

War of the Staches: Turns 0 through 18

"My mustache is ever so mighty, wouldn't you agree, Jeeves?"

"It looks like a you drew it on with a marker"

"What was that?"

"I said, it is a true mark of nobility, Sire."

"Very well, very well."

"Have you considered that it might become even mightier, were you to found a city dedicated to its growth?"

"What a fine idea! Let us do that at once!"

And so the Upper Lip Empire founded the city of Bathroom Mirror.

Spoiler

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When I moved the Scout, I saw I had pig to the North, so I sacrificed a turn to move the Settler. The Dye tile will make a nice cottage, when we learn pottery.

Not much happened. We got gold from one tribal village, and a second Scout from another. I named a few landmarks.

Then...

Spoiler

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"Look at that, Jeeves! He thinks that childish attempt at facial hair is a mustache to be proud of!"

"It is certainly quite stylish, Sire."

"What did you say?"

"I said, he could learn a lot from you about style, Sire."

"Yes. He could indeed. Ask for directions to his place. I'll soon sort him out."

And behold.

Spoiler

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"Holy shaving soap! Doesn't he realize we need elbow room?"

"Apparently not."

"Ask him nicely if he would move elsewhere. There's a good chap."

"I'll get right on it, Sire."

Spoiler

Show

Logging by BUG Mod 4.4 [Build 2220] (BtS 3.13-3.19)
------------------------------------------------
Turn 0/500 (4000 BC) [14-Jan-2013 15:09:59]
0% Gold: 0 per turn, 0 in the bank

Turn 1/500 (3960 BC) [14-Jan-2013 15:10:01]
Tribal village results: a little gold
Berlin founded
Bathroom Mirror begins: Worker (15 turns)
Research begun: Animal Husbandry (13 Turns)
100% Research: 9 per turn
0% Gold: 0 per turn, 48 in the bank

Turn 2/500 (3920 BC) [14-Jan-2013 15:14:52]
100% Research: 9 per turn
0% Gold: 0 per turn, 48 in the bank

Turn 3/500 (3880 BC) [14-Jan-2013 15:15:11]
100% Research: 9 per turn
0% Gold: 0 per turn, 48 in the bank

Turn 4/500 (3840 BC) [14-Jan-2013 15:15:55]
100% Research: 9 per turn
0% Gold: 0 per turn, 48 in the bank

Turn 5/500 (3800 BC) [14-Jan-2013 15:16:17]
100% Research: 9 per turn
0% Gold: 0 per turn, 48 in the bank

After End Turn:
Bathroom Mirror's borders expand

Turn 6/500 (3760 BC) [14-Jan-2013 15:16:47]
100% Research: 9 per turn
0% Gold: 0 per turn, 48 in the bank


Turn 7/500 (3720 BC) [14-Jan-2013 15:18:33]

Turn 7/500 (3720 BC) [14-Jan-2013 15:17:16]
Player Comment Geez, this sea really is starving.
100% Research: 9 per turn
0% Gold: 0 per turn, 48 in the bank

After End Turn:

Other Player Actions:
Buddhism founded in a distant land

Turn 8/500 (3680 BC) [14-Jan-2013 15:18:48]
Player Comment Gah! I just saw the tribal village near Bathroom Mirror! I hope we get there first.
100% Research: 9 per turn
0% Gold: 0 per turn, 48 in the bank

Turn 9/500 (3640 BC) [14-Jan-2013 15:19:59]
100% Research: 9 per turn
0% Gold: 0 per turn, 48 in the bank

Turn 10/500 (3600 BC) [14-Jan-2013 15:20:56]
100% Research: 9 per turn
0% Gold: 0 per turn, 48 in the bank

After End Turn:

Other Player Actions:
While defending in the wild near Bathroom Mirror, Scout 1 (Berlin) (1.00/1) defeats Barbarian Wolf (Prob Victory: 99.9%)

Turn 11/500 (3560 BC) [14-Jan-2013 15:21:21]
Player Comment Our brave scout has earned a name for himself!
100% Research: 9 per turn
0% Gold: 0 per turn, 48 in the bank

Turn 12/500 (3520 BC) [14-Jan-2013 15:22:37]
100% Research: 9 per turn
0% Gold: 0 per turn, 48 in the bank

After End Turn:
Bathroom Mirror finishes: Worker

Turn 13/500 (3480 BC) [14-Jan-2013 15:22:53]
Bathroom Mirror begins: Warrior (15 turns)
100% Research: 10 per turn
0% Gold: 0 per turn, 48 in the bank

After End Turn:
Tech research finished: Animal Husbandry

Other Player Actions:
While defending in the wild near Bathroom Mirror, Wolfslayer (0.64/1) defeats Barbarian Panther (Prob Victory: 73.8%)

Turn 14/500 (3440 BC) [14-Jan-2013 15:23:52]
Research begun: The Wheel (8 Turns)
Wolfslayer (Scout) promoted: Woodsman I
Tribal village results: scout
100% Research: 10 per turn
0% Gold: 0 per turn, 48 in the bank

Turn 15/500 (3400 BC) [14-Jan-2013 15:25:17]
100% Research: 10 per turn
0% Gold: 0 per turn, 48 in the bank

After End Turn:

Other Player Actions:
Hinduism founded in a distant land

Turn 16/500 (3360 BC) [14-Jan-2013 15:25:41]
100% Research: 10 per turn
0% Gold: 0 per turn, 48 in the bank

Turn 17/500 (3320 BC) [14-Jan-2013 15:26:04]
100% Research: 10 per turn
0% Gold: 0 per turn, 48 in the bank

After End Turn:

Other Player Actions:
Player contact made: Tokugawa of Japan

Turn 18/500 (3280 BC) [14-Jan-2013 15:26:48]
A Pasture was built near Bathroom Mirror
100% Research: 9 per turn
0% Espionage: 4 per turn
0% Gold: 0 per turn, 48 in the bank

Dammit! Of all the people to start as your next door neighbour, Toku is... well, he's not Monty at least. But we aren't exactly going to be able to take him out in an axe-rush. We can try and settler rush to choke him out until catapults become available. Or we can roll a new start.

Thoughts?

http://www.sendspace.com/file/v8w5qp

[Terraoblivion]

I have a thought...Where is all the food. This land is practically starved! We'll definitely need to get some farms up and running to food some of our other cities, we have grasslands but no food resources after all.

Also, I think the best way to handle Tokes is to try and out-pace him in settling. He's a grumpy introvert, so if we can avoid him killing us too fast he should fall behind on tech and be easy to take care of later. He never has any friends either.

[Winthur]

Honestly with the amount of forests around our starting location and in the even we find Bronze/Iron we can probably rush Tokugawa, we will just need a few extra units to deal with his Protective trait on Archers.

Go beyond the impossible, and whip cities to the curb. That's the Team Moustache way.

Alternately, what can't be done with whippa, can be done with choppa.

[tyckspoon]

I'd go for a REX and hedge him off; there doesn't seem to be a terribly obvious good place to drop a city yet, but even if you have to settle for mediocre sites running 3 cities to 1 (plus whatever marginal edge sites he can still get to) will let you roll him over whenever you want to.

[happyturtle]

Works for me. Of course if Kyoto is on a hill city, we definitely don't want to do it with an axe-rush. But choking him in is fine with me.

[Winthur]

Since kissing up to Tokugawa is almost impossible anyway and he's a natural target, maybe we could bust a Worker from him with our next unit (since our initial Scout is obviously unviable for the task)? It would delay him and reinforce our choke, and 60 free hammers is 60 free hammers; radical REXes have the tendency to have a worker shortage in favor of more Settlers.

[ObadiahtheSlim]

Kyoto is going to be a problem. Double starting gold is bad news when it isn't yours. He's also protective so those archers of his will hurt more. I wouldn't advise an axe rush unless we have starting copper. We could try to find some elephants near by in that jungle and beeline construction for elephants and catapults.

[happyturtle]

How's your turnset coming, Obadiah?