Number of Character Appearances V

[Bird]

But reading on Gamr, yeah, it's obvious its him. Now, the question is: what the hell are the blue dwarf-giants in the back?
Grey Wolf

They may just be unnamed Frost Giants.

[Grey_Wolf_c]

They may just be unnamed Frost Giants.

Ah, frost giants. That makes sense. I'm afraid my mental image of them may have been altered by the marvel movies, but now that you mention it, I can see that being the case.

Thanks!

Grey Wolf

[martianmister]

Updated through 946
Bandana (+1), Belkar Bitterleaf (+1), Blackwing (+1), Durkon Thundershield (+1) (as vampire), Elan (+1), Haley Starshine (+1), Hel (+1), Julio Scoundrél, Mr. Scruffy (+1), Roy Greenhilt (+1), Vaarsuvius (+1)

I see no reason to add "Durkula", or "trapped soul of Durkon" to the list.

[ti'esar]

I see no reason to add "Durkula", or "trapped soul of Durkon" to the list.

I don't know about "trapped soul of Durkon", but "Durkula"/the High Priest of Hel is explicitly not Durkon. He's just walking around in his body.

[137beth]

Updated through 946
Bandana (+1), Belkar Bitterleaf (+1), Blackwing (+1), Durkon Thundershield (+1) (as vampire), Elan (+1), Haley Starshine (+1), Hel (+1), Julio Scoundrél, Mr. Scruffy (+1), Roy Greenhilt (+1), Vaarsuvius (+1)

I see no reason to add "Durkula", or "trapped soul of Durkon" to the list.

You're missing Garmr.

[Domino Quartz]

You're missing Gamr.

You mean "Garmr."

[Flame of Anor]

I see no reason to add "Durkula", or "trapped soul of Durkon" to the list.

You are in a small minority.

[oppyu]

Oh mighty and powerful curator, whose hard work and dedication gives life to this incredibly helpful list. I and some other forum members humbly petition you to reconsider your stance on not including not-Durkon/High Priest of Hell/'Durkula' (henceforth referred to as not-Durkon) as an individual character apart from Durkon. I feel that given the last strip, it is clearly established that Durkon and not-Durkon are clearly separate entities with divergent motivations, loyalties, and physical appearance. That being said, you are the great and terrible curator and I will cede to anything you decide.

Thank you for your consideration,

Humble Peon #1942

[martianmister]

I don't know about "trapped soul of Durkon", but "Durkula"/the High Priest of Hel is explicitly not Durkon. He's just walking around in his body.

There is three problems:

1. Should we count other undead versions of lived characters (like Isamu) as different characters as well?

2. How is Durkula independent from Durkon? Is he an extension of Durkon, or pre-existed his death? Is he different from other vampires?

3. When did he created/possessed Durkon? Is he different from Malack's thrall?

You're missing Garmr.

I find it kind of speculative, but whatever. I'll add it.

[137beth]

Honestly I could go either way on the High Priest of Hel thing. We are still tracking alterations, so anyone who wants to see it can subtract the "Durkon (as vampire)" count from the total Durkon count.

Arguably, every appearance of High Priest of Hel also counts as an appearance for Durkon (as trapped soul). At which point it is just simpler to make vampirism an alteration.

[Elldrick]

I think as yet Durkon and Durkula are the same person despite being different entities. I agree that it's not worth listing Durkula as separate, but it may be worth noting the difference between vampire Durkon and regular Durkon, and I think making a distinction between the two of them will become more important as the plot line is developed.

[Sir_Leorik]

2. How is Durkula independent from Durkon? Is he an extension of Durkon, or pre-existed his death? Is he different from other vampires?

This is the $64,000.00 question. We don't know if this is the case for all Vampires, for only Dwarven Vampires, or if Hel turned Durkon into the High Priest of Hel for a special purpose, and wouldn't have done so otherwise. Until we learn more details, I don't see a need to make special entries for the HPoH.

[b_jonas]

Sabine as schoolgirl is listed to have 1 appearance, but she has way more: in #342, #343, #349, #351 and #355, #365.

Sabine as policeman should be listed too in #365.
Leaky Windstaff as large bear should be listed, he appears in #353, #354, #358.

Update: my mistake, Leeky as bear is already listed, it's just that I knew his name wrong. He's called "Leeky", not "Leaky".

[ti'esar]

Sabine as schoolgirl is listed to have 1 appearance, but she has way more: in #342, #343, #349, #351 and #355, #365.

We don't track clothing alterations. Sabine was only shapeshifted into the form of a schoolgirl in 342.

[b_jonas]

We don't track clothing alterations. Sabine was only shapeshifted into the form of a schoolgirl in 342.

Ah, tricky! Indeed she shapeshifts back in the end of #342 and only keeps the schoolgirl clothes. Thank you.

[The_Final_Stand]

#947: Durkon Thundershield, (as child +1), High Priest of Hel.

I think that's how it works? Because clearly we have vanilla Durkon, but we also clearly have HPoH stood next to him. Did we ever reach a consensus on the difference between Durkon's vampirised body and the entity controlling it?

[ti'esar]

#947: Durkon Thundershield, (as child +1), High Priest of Hel.

I think that's how it works? Because clearly we have vanilla Durkon, but we also clearly have HPoH stood next to him. Did we ever reach a consensus on the difference between Durkon's vampirised body and the entity controlling it?

Given that we now see them outright interacting, the HPoH should clearly be listed as a separate character.

[martianmister]

Updated through 947
Durkon's Mother (+1), Durkon Thundershield (+1) (as child), Dwarf Guardian with gray hair (+1), Dwarf Guardian with red hair (+1), Dwarf with ladder(+1), Hel's High Priest

[ChristianSt]

Hel's High Priest

Why not call him "High Priest of Hel"? That is the only version that was used in the comic, and I don't see any reason to deviate from it.

[137beth]

Updated through 947
Durkon's Mother (+1), Durkon Thundershield (+1) (as child), Dwarf Guardian with gray hair (+1), Dwarf Guardian with red hair (+1), Dwarf with ladder(+1), Hel's High Priest

Why are the +1s red? It isn't bonus material, they should be blue...

[Grey_Wolf_c]

Why not call him "High Priest of Hel"? That is the only version that was used in the comic, and I don't see any reason to deviate from it.

Seconded. Also agree with 137ben on the colour. Also, can someone check how many times HPoH has appeared? According to canon, he has only been present since Malack's death. Not sure if "Durkon as a vampire" should count only while he was a thrall (maybe change it to "Durkon as a Vampire Thrall", and adjust the count accordingly?), or if each appearance counts as a double for both Durkon and HPoH, under impersonate rules.

Grey Wolf

[Fawkes]

Seconded. Also agree with 137ben on the colour. Also, can someone check how many times HPoH has appeared? According to canon, he has only been present since Malack's death. Not sure if "Durkon as a vampire" should count only while he was a thrall (maybe change it to "Durkon as a Vampire Thrall", and adjust the count accordingly?), or if each appearance counts as a double for both Durkon and HPoH, under impersonate rules.

Grey Wolf

By my count, assuming that the Priest took over in 907, he's made a total of 23 (+3) appearances, including today's comic. (Add one more if you think 906 counts.)

Going by precedent, each of those should count as an appearance for both the Priest and Durkon. As far as alterations go, we might want to call the Priest inhabiting Durkon's physical body "High Priest of Hel as Durkon", which would include every appearance except possibly today's, where he is some sort of apparition or projection, but that seems like an unnecessary step unless we see his 'true form' later on.

[Gift Jeraff]

He should just get all of Durkon as vampire's appearances.

[Cizak]

Shouldn't High Priest of Hel get some sort of alteration tag for this comic? He doesn't have fangs or red eyes in this one.

[martianmister]

About the whole Durkon/Durkula/HPoH thing:

Q. What counts as an appearance?

A. Any likeness of the character being visible (so Elan's appearance on Nale's blueprint counts, and Belkar's self-portrait in blood counts)

According to this HPoH never had an actual apparance (yet) by Wrecan's standards. But:

and any dialog from a character, even if "off-panel" or invisible (so the strip where the party is in the invisibility sphere counts for each of the main characters).

We actually have HPoH's dialog, even though we never seen him. So, strips with his dialog should count as an appearance, and strips without shouldn't count even if Durkon is there.

Thoughts?

[ti'esar]

What do you mean, we've never had any appearances of the character? He's a negative energy spirit possessing Durkon's body - he's been in every strip Durkon's body has been in for the last 40 or so strips.

[Gift Jeraff]

I would just count every appearance of vampirized Durkon as an appearance for him.

[137beth]

What do you mean, we've never had any appearances of the character? He's a negative energy spirit possessing Durkon's body - he's been in every strip Durkon's body has been in for the last 40 or so strips.

Yea, I'm having a hard time seeing the justification for not counting all of vampire Durkon's appearances as appearances for HPoH. I believe you (martianmister) are misinterpreting an old quote.

[Jaxzan Proditor]

Yea, I'm having a hard time seeing the justification for not counting all of vampire Durkon's appearances as appearances for HPoH. I believe you (martianmister) are misinterpreting an old quote.

I think it's a little confusing because, in this case, it is Durkon's body that has been here this whole time, even if his soul has now taken a back seat to the High Priest of Hel. So, I think that we should count it based on who's in charge, and say that whenever it's an appearance of the body (or, as in 947, the actual spirit) we should count it as an appearance for the High Priest of Hel, and whenever we see Durkon's soul (946, 947) it's an appearance for him. Or, we can count it like how we counted appearances for when Nale impersonated Elan.

[Mad Humanist]

Or, we can count it like how we counted appearances for when Nale impersonated Elan.

Why is this not obvious? It counts for both. Or at the very least the body always counts for Durkon but the speech counts for the High Priest.