Erfworld 49

[Idris]

Another great comic and wonderful use of Will's verse

re "the little battle", it's worth considering that Parson might be quoting
- for instance Field-Marshall Montgomery (a notable tactician) said:
“Every soldier must know, before he goes into battle, how the little battle he is to fight fits into the larger picture, and how the success of his fighting will influence the battle as a whole.”

(there is also a short animated film called The Little Battle, the moral of which is that in order to succeed, an athlete needs to face his or her fears, never giving up even if he or she fails - can't see a connection though)

[innovan]

It's Sonnet #28 in entirety.

http://whitewolf.newcastle.edu.au/wo...sonnet028.html

[Xerxos]

My guess on the exploit (or rather how I would do it):

1. Take 7 Command units (they give boni right?) + 1 Dwagon
2. move over water or dense forest near "non flying" stack
3. kill the few flying units in the "non flying" stack (max powered dwagon should kill them easily, the rest can't attack)

______________Air superiority from here on ______________________

4. Bring the rest of the dwagons (and any other flying unit) and kill all archer/air targeting units with hit and run tactics, hurt dwagons can fly over water/forest to get to safety
5. kill helpless rest

that would leave the problem of the "flying" stack, but that could be dealt with in another turn

[spite48]

Spoiler

Show

I do believe that the exploit has to be attacking in guerilla warfare style at night. Day/Night/Rest and other thematically appropriate terms appear more than 10 times in the quoted verse. People are shown at rest or at least not conducting the business of war at night. Parson wakes up, and expresses an awareness of an exploit. How could it be anything else, unless we are being deliberately misled?

[sukotto]

The previous sonnet is about how the author is tired (physically and emotionally) and grows more distant from the lover.
This sonnet continues that thread of being tired, kinda lonely, and feeling physically/emotionally drained due to some sort of distance.

It's kind of like 16th Century Goth poetry... Elizabethan angst and we could pull something like this out of it:

I'm so lonely because you're so far away from me.
I can't sleep because I keep thinking about you. but it seems like you're not that interested in me.
Even so... I just can't get you out of my head... I want you even though you're not interested.

You're so beautiful that I told the Gods of Daylight and Nighttime how lucky they are that they can see you and be with you.

Even though they are bitterly opposed to each other, they still agreed to make my life hard... by making it impossible for me to rest. All day I have to work hear, and all night I lie awake and think about you.

I try to make the God of Daylight happy (so she'll be nice to me?) by explaining how beautiful and wondrous you are. Even when the sky is overcast and the light is dim, the day still feels bright because you are in it.

You are like the starts, shining brightly... no, you're even BETTER than the stars because they only shine at night (and when the sky is clear), but you shine all the time.

But Day and Night still conspire against me and make my feelings of loneliness, frustration, and pain stronger and stronger.

My life sucks so hard... but I just can't give you up.

I think this is giving us additional insight into the relationship between Ansom and Jill. Though it could be hinting at some other relationship.


On another topic (and this might have been mentioned by now since it took me a longtime to write this) I wonder what happens if you never end your Turn. Also, what if your Mole, who is a Royal, ends a Turn early at your bidding (thus leaving your units exposed and vulnerable)

[ShneekeyTheLost]

My guess on the exploit (or rather how I would do it):

1. Take 7 Command units (they give boni right?) + 1 Dwagon
2. move over water or dense forest near "non flying" stack
3. kill the few flying units in the "non flying" stack (max powered dwagon should kill them easily, the rest can't attack)

______________Air superiority from here on ______________________

4. Bring the rest of the dwagons (and any other flying unit) and kill all archer/air targeting units with hit and run tactics, hurt dwagons can fly over water/forest to get to safety
5. kill helpless rest

that would leave the problem of the "flying" stack, but that could be dealt with in another turn

I'd go with 7 Dwagons and a Command unit. Command unit gives bonuses to every Dwagon in the formation, probably much better all around than seven command units (which are probably harder to come by than Dwagons anyways) and one Dwagon. Then carry out your plan.

[Cisalpine]

Is that Vinnie's coffin in Ansom's panel? if so, nifty.

[SteveMB]

I just noticed that the backgrounds behind Ansom in his panel and Jillian in her panel mesh together visually (similar colors, though with different texture, and the top edges where the night sky shows through align neatly).

I've reread it a few times, and this page is turning out to exceed even the previous height of reaction I experienced (to page 41). Another tip of the message hat to Rob and Jamie.

[Ultimatum479]

>This page implies Stanley has a heck of a lot more dwagons than some of us thought

Don't count me in that group, as you can tell from what I posted earlier. ^_^

Parson comes from outside and is familiar with a society where gamers habitually exploit rulesets, so not only is he capable of thinking outside the box, he's bound to have some insight into typical design flaws which the Erfworlders simply aren't capable of developing - at least until he's demonstrated it for them.

Who wants to bet Wanda will be the first to understand and start using his idea of mechanics-abuse? :P

Harumph. "Twees."

Sorry to burst your bubble, but it's "trees" judging by Parson's Stupid Meal.

For Parson's sake, I hope we don't get to witness him explaining his plan before he actually executes it. If we see him explain it in excruciating detail first, then we KNOW it's not going to work. Basic "law" of dramatic fiction. ;)

Indeed. Parson proved that with the ambush incident.

[Mr Wizard]

Irrelevant. In the real world we don't think of the laws of physics as being game rules to be exploited. That doesn't stop people from researching new technology and generals making new tactics. Sometimes those tactics are so revolutionary or clever they would very likely look like exploits to someone from a different universe.

Indeed!



OMG HAX!!!!1

[kansas_dave]

Irrelevant. In the real world we don't think of the laws of physics as being game rules to be exploited. That doesn't stop people from researching new technology and generals making new tactics. Sometimes those tactics are so revolutionary or clever they would very likely look like exploits to someone from a different universe.

Sure, but it took a paradigm shift for us to start coming up with breakthroughs in science and technology with any regularity. We're no smarter than the Babylonians; we just have a different way of thinking.

Also, they seem to pick warlords based on their looks.

[jjpickar]

Parson builds a nuke? That...might...TOTALLY ROCK!!!! Good sonnet too.

[Scientivore]

Also, they seem to pick warlords based on their looks.

I think that we're pretty similar, in a way. Just off the top of my head, some statistically significant predictors for which candidate will win an election in the U.S. include:

• white
• male
• tall
• Ivy League
• rich
• optimistic

To the best of my knowledge, "solid grasp of international politics and macroeconomics" is not on the list.

[Rollory]

All of Ansom's air units went off to rescue Jillian.

Ansom's column looks to me like it is walking through a heavily forested area.

Do dwagons breathe fire? Does it count as a ranged attack? In Age of Wonders (1/2/Shadow Magic), a classic devastating attack is to attack a huge army that has no ranged weapons or air support with one air galley or a few dragons (just one in AOW1 is enough, they limited the dragonfire repetitions in 2). They can systematically take out whatever units they want, without fear of repercussion, then (if dragons and out of flame) melee whatever selected units they want (usually weak infantry because it means minimal chance of serious damage to the dragons, and killing a lot more units), until either the entire enemy army is dead, the dragon-owning player decides to break off, or the enemy gets in some lucky hits in melee and kills them. I remember one MP game I played where I had an absolutely terrifying army of goblins led by chaos lords that got slaughtered by one air galley (repeated airborne javelin shots).

This would make "the little battle" indeed salvageable, as even though the battle around Jillian didn't happen, the events surrounding it would have laid Ansom's main force open to a devastating raid.

[fractal]

I think that we're pretty similar, in a way. Just off the top of my head, some statistically significant predictors for which candidate will win an election in the U.S. include:

• white
• male
• tall
• Ivy League
• rich
• optimistic

Those are all pretty easy to recognize. However, I'm not sure you're right that they're statistically significant, at least at the upper levels; no one who doesn't have those traits is in the running.

To the best of my knowledge, "solid grasp of international politics and macroeconomics" is not on the list.

The problem is that we haven't got the right 3-D glasses to see who has those.

[musicnerd]

This was my favorite strip so far. You have almost lost me a couple of times, but this was beautiful and intriguing. I really liked the roosting dwagons and the use of the Shakespeare. Very classy

[SandroTheMaster]

So, it looks like Parson is going to test if battles CAN happen at night. Maybe, what he is looking forward, isn't for it to be possible, but quite the opposite. Since, if it is possible, once the attack by night starts, Ansom's army will just figure out what happened and counter-attack. If it can't happen, then it is possible that something can be exploited from that.

[BarGamer]

This comic finally got me to register, too. (Oddly, it looks similar to the Guild Wars Guru forums...)

I wondered how long it would take for someone to make a Matrix comparison, and it's pretty apt. Altho, Parson would have to be the fattest Neo yet. XDDD

You have to have a REALLY nice vocabulary, and a little contextual creativity, to see how the Authors are taking this comic. Here's MY interpretation:

Panel 1: Parson angsts about how tired he is, no surprises there. But it also sets up the personification of "day" and "night."

Panel 2: Has day and night be enemies of each other, (especially since this fuels those who speculate that Wanda might overthrow Stanley) yet they still delight in collectively torturing Parson.

Panel 3: The one in Toil: Stanley. The other to complain: Wanda in 47. Still farther off from thee: Still no idea how to win. It's here that I've established that "thee" and "thou" are referring to Parson's "Lady," or ultimate victory.

Panel 4: Roughly translated: "Of COURSE, Stanley, you're ALWAYS right, no, that setback doesn't mean anything..." But this could also make a reference to Vinny's influence on Ansom.

Panel 5: This one was the hardest. This I did manage to drag out: Flatter Wanda as well. With "twire" meaning "twinkle", the next line makes a little better sense. When the stars are not out, "Victory" shines in the evening. From the previous Klog, we can assume that this is Ansom's non-flier units, but what do they have to do with those lines? A nighttime strategy? Ah, the speculation...

Panel 6: And now angst from Jillian. Altho this could be a reference to the pain of the previous "day and night," or the current night's.

Panel 9: Parson makes a reference to the "little battle" in the previous Klog, but other than that, everyone else has speculated enough on that. That's all I got. And now, to make my "Hello, I'm a noob" post...

[SandroTheMaster]

This comic finally got me to register, too. (Oddly, it looks darn similar to the Guild Wars Guru forums...)

I wondered how long it would take for someone to make a Matrix comparison, and it's pretty apt. Altho, Parson would have to be the fattest Neo yet. XDDD

It also amuses me how some just don't get Shakespeare, and others get it, but miss the point, and some ignore it in favor of speculation. You have to have a REALLY nice vocabulary, and a little open-minded creativity, to see how the Authors are taking this quote into context. Minus punctuation errors. ;) Here's MY interpretation of the comic:

Panel 1: Parson angsts about how tired he is, no surprises there. But it also sets up the personification of "day" and "night."

Panel 2: Has day and night be enemies of each other, (especially since this fuels those who speculate that Wanda might overthrow Stanley) yet they still delight in collectively torturing Parson.

Panel 3: The one in Toil: Stanley. The other to complain: Wanda in 47. Still farther off from thee: Still no idea how to win. It's here that I've established that "thee" and "thou" are referring to Parson's "Lady," or ultimate victory.

Panel 4: Roughly translated: "Of COURSE, Stanley, you're ALWAYS right, no, that setback doesn't mean anything..." But this could also make a reference to Vinny's influence on Ansom.

Panel 5: This one was the hardest. This I did manage to drag out: Flatter Wanda as well. With "twire" meaning "twinkle", the next line makes a little better sense. When the stars are not out, "Victory" shines in the evening. From the previous Klog, we can assume that this is Ansom's non-flier units, but what do they have to do with those lines? A nighttime strategy? Ah, the speculation...

Panel 6: And now angst from Jillian. Altho this could be a reference to the pain of the previous "day and night," or the current night's.

Panel 9: Parson makes a reference to the "little battle" in the previous Klog, but other than that, everyone else has speculated enough on that. That's all I got. And now, to make my "Hello, I'm a noob" thread...

Nice interpretation

[Yodimus]

Quite possibly one of the best pages so far.
From here on, the REAL fun begins!

[Misvit]

My opinions (just cause one more voice can't hurt)

I feel like it'd be really lame if the exploit turns out to be something like attacking at night... It'd be like making land units go into the water in games where there are no water units. It's one thing to find an exploit and another to just be able to break the rules, why play the game then?

2, on the whole dragon stack thing, just because I like to be different. Send out all your ground units as bait into a heavily forested area. Give them all hatchets. When the enemy air units come over to mop up, cut down the trees and presto, clean clear plainscape that you can attack air units in. Basically my suggested xploit is changing the landscape.... I don't know if I like that either though, cause it seems a bit too cheap.

3, An exploit based on move would be acceptable. Many times I used this myself. I believe I remember that not only do the dwagons fly, but they have the fastest move. Basically, most unbeatable forces in games can be delt with when you have a unit that can move and attack while your enemy can only move to catch up.

4th and finally, while the previous ideas are stuff I'd do, I'm going to have to say Parson's xploit will still deal with the magic system, since he seemed so bent on it before. It'd be wierd for him to have been looking for a trick within the spells and then go an entirely different route without explanation as to why he couldn't find one there.

[Bilgore]

Also, they seem to pick warlords based on their looks.

This is perfectly logical if the bonus a leader unit provides isn't specified by rank alone. If a unit has a "charisma" bonus which increases the effectiveness of all other units in the same stack, it makes sense.

[Lumenadducere]

I personally enjoyed the Shakespeare. Added a little more to a comic that largely seemed to be a strange mix of adults-in-kiddieland and fantasy...not that that's a bad thing, mind you.

[Beleriphon]

Is that Vinnie's coffin in Ansom's panel? if so, nifty.

And more to point, is that a Bacardi bat?

[erewhon]

Aha, but what cheat codes would he input? Black Sheep Wall? Power Overwhelming? Operation Cwal?

"Manhattan Project"

Or,

"Oppenheimer"

[Bogardan_Mage]

Also, they seem to pick warlords based on their looks.

Stanley picks warlords based on their looks. Wanda has attempted to enlighten him as to the desirable features of a warlord on more than one occasion. Considering Stanley's other tactical, um, idiosyncracies, it is likely that this is not a cultural norm but just Stanley.

[ShneekeyTheLost]

"Manhattan Project"

Or,

"Oppenheimer"

iddqd
idkfa
^^vv<><>babaSelectStart

(Jeez... I think I just dated myself...)

[Drager]

AHAHAHA! Wonderful bit of very appropriate Shakespeare; followed by the battlecry of desperate and frustrated gamers everywhere: 'sploitable mechanic...


Good job Elvis in the Playground! :D

Awesome that juxtaposition of the shakespearian sonnet and parson was lovely.

I like shakespear and I like erfworld so this made me a happy camper.

And inspired me to post for the first time even when (certain other events) couldn't!

[GKBeetle]

Wanda looks so cute sleeping with the teddy skull. She really does look just like a little girl in this one, and you would never imagine her being dangerous at all if this is the first time you saw her. Anyway, I want a teddy skull, but with red or black wings instead of girly pink ones.
I have no idea what the Shakespeare meant. I will have to get one of my English major friends to interpret it for me. I'm not going to speculate on the plan until I can find out what the Shakespeare means.

[SteveMB]

The Shakespeare sonnet and Jillian at the campfire made me think of the campfire scene in Henry V. Which fits quite nicely, because it's addressing the doubts and fears and hopes of the various people involved right before a major battle.

Hey, guess what's coming up?

Yes -- that fits the mood perfectly.

You have to have a REALLY nice vocabulary, and a little contextual creativity, to see how the Authors are taking this comic. Here's MY interpretation:

Panel 1: Parson angsts about how tired he is, no surprises there. But it also sets up the personification of "day" and "night."

Panel 2: Has day and night be enemies of each other, (especially since this fuels those who speculate that Wanda might overthrow Stanley) yet they still delight in collectively torturing Parson.

Panel 3: The one in Toil: Stanley. The other to complain: Wanda in 47. Still farther off from thee: Still no idea how to win. It's here that I've established that "thee" and "thou" are referring to Parson's "Lady," or ultimate victory.

Panel 4: Roughly translated: "Of COURSE, Stanley, you're ALWAYS right, no, that setback doesn't mean anything..." But this could also make a reference to Vinny's influence on Ansom.

Panel 5: This one was the hardest. This I did manage to drag out: Flatter Wanda as well. With "twire" meaning "twinkle", the next line makes a little better sense. When the stars are not out, "Victory" shines in the evening. From the previous Klog, we can assume that this is Ansom's non-flier units, but what do they have to do with those lines? A nighttime strategy? Ah, the speculation...

Panel 6: And now angst from Jillian. Altho this could be a reference to the pain of the previous "day and night," or the current night's.

Nice interpretation. I came up with one based on disregarding the original context and referents, simply applying each set of lines independently to the corresponding character; this one uses Parson's POV and changes the context rather than simple abandoning it -- and they both work reasonably well.

I just keep getting more and more impressed.

Edit: Might the first line imply that Parson is feeling that being teleported into a game world isn't as great as he'd imagined and wants to get back home somehow? If so, and the next sonnet is used at some point, that might indicate acceptance of his new life even if things aren't going well for him as a warlord.