Warhammer 40K Tabletop XXIX: Ro, Ro, Ro Your Boute

[Cheesegear]

Guide to Shadow War
Part 1 - Being Skilled

This is only going to be relevant for campaign play. If you aren't playing in a Shadow War campaign, this portion of the Shadow War Guide will mean nothing to you and you may as well just skip this and move on to Part 2 (whenever that happens). The Advance Table is random, so when you roll a Characteristic increase, just choose whichever one is right for that character. The thing is, you get to roll 2d6 and pick the best skill, so...Yes. It does matter, because gaining Skills isn't totally random and there actually is some choice in the matter.

Combat:

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Combat Master: This is great for models who really need to win combat (e.g; Aspiring Champions), or are terrified of being dogpiled on by Orks (e.g; Harlequins, Grey Knights, etc.). The more expensive your Melee model becomes, the more they're going to need this skill.
Disarm: For when you really want to win combat.
Feint: This almost makes up for being WS3, but models with WS4 aren't going to really need it.
Block: This isn't so much of an auto-win as Disarm is, but it is a really, really important skill to have.
Counter-Attack: For sure the least useful skill in the group, but by no means bad.
Step Aside: If Disarm and Block have already failed, you'll fall back on this one.

Ferocity

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Berserk Charge: Handy to have.
Impetuous: What? This is the last skill you want in this group. It's not even...Why?
Iron Will: If your LEADER can roll on Ferocity, keep rolling until you get this skill. Then you never need it again.
Fear: Fear is nice.
Nerves of Steel: If you aren't part of a Team that already does this, and you're a Melee model, you want this skill.
True Grit: Sure

Guerilla

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Armourer: *shrug*. Doesn't stack.
Scavenger: Go to your army roster. If your TROOPER and starting wargear costs more than 100 Points, you're going to need one or more Scavengers in your Team (yes, it stacks). Otherwise every time you need to buy a new Trooper, you're spending a Promethium Tank, and that's how you lose. Probably the only reason you're ever going to roll Scavenger is because they rolled an Advance on the Serious Injury table, and you have a 'free' Level Up. Using your real Level Up trying to roll for Scavenger is probably not the greatest idea.
Hunter: Sure.
Medic: Why is this Guerilla? Whatever. Somehow, a Medic can patch your model up so good that they don't even get Captured. As with Scavenger, this is really, really good to have. It's just awkward to deliberately try and roll for when there are other, more important things.
Destined for Greatness: This is a 'waste' of a roll, since you don't get anything immediately, and requires you to spend even more Advances on one model. The only time that this would be useful is for a Chaos Marine Aspiring Champion. But, again, there are way more important things to roll for - especially on a Leader.
Survivor: Like a Medic, but can't be used on other models.

RAW Alert: After Mission Rewards happen 'in sequence'. That means that Recover Injured Fighters (What Doesn't Kill You...) and Advance happens before Resupply.
Which means that you can apply the effects of Scavenger at the end of the same Mission that you pick up the Skill.

Guerilla is an awkward table, because it doesn't help you win games. It helps you 'lose less badly'. Even the stronger abilities like Scavenger and Medic aren't even useful until the end of the next Mission.

Agility

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Catfall: No.
Dodge: Maybe.
Jump Back: Hit & Run will always be one of the better Skills in the game. Remember to only use it in your opponent's turn, because if you do it in your turn, it just frees up your opponent to shoot you without the 50% chance to hit their own models, and then gives the model you were in combat with anyway, a free second Charge.
Great Leap: I mean, what kind of terrain do you even play on?
Catch Grenade: lulzy. But no. It doesn't even work 66% of the time. Waste of a skill roll.
Sprint: Arguably one of the best Melee skills there is. Unfortunately you have to roll on...the rest...of the Agility tree as well. Sprint, on the Agility tree, is the epitome of 'Not all skills are equal'.

Muscle

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Bodycheck: 'Kay.
Burly: Yes.
Crushing Blow: Seems okay. But you could just get a Chainsword.
Headbutt: 'Kay.
Hurl Opponent: No idea why you would do this instead of hitting. If your meta plays with a whole bunch of 10" drops, and you think you're going to effectively use this Skill more than zero times, sure. Unless you play with massive terrain pieces, this Skill just isn't very good.
Iron Jaw: You get your Save, and then an FNP roll.

Muscle is basically the combat tree, except worse. It's what you roll on when you want non-Melee models to be in Melee, and how come you haven't built your Team correctly, and what are you even doing?

Shooting

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Crack Shot: Yes. Re-rolling the Injury Table is the fastest way to win.
Fast Shot: Yes.
Gunfighter: If you have access to Plasma Pistols, this skill is amazing. If you don't have access to Pistols at all...Well, yeah.
Hip Shooting: Why not? It's not bad. You can reach Objectives quicker and do some damage.
Marksman: Yes.
Ammo Hound: Again, not like it's bad. This is extremely useful on models with Sustained Fire weapons, and arguably better than Marksman on the same models, because Marksman only gives more chances to roll 6s.

This grouping effectively breaks a campaign. See, in the days of Necromunda, you only just barely had to worry about Heavy Stubbers. In Shadow War, which is definitely not Necromunda, you have to worry about Plasma weapons with Sustained Fire, or, just anything that Wounds easily re-rolling on the Injury Table taking out fighters left and right. For any model to even remotely have a chance of making it into Melee, they have to be really, really fast, and have at least a -2 To Hit, or some other means of avoiding shooting. Remembering that because Shooting is so Emperor-damned effective, Photo-Visors are common as dirt. Almost like putting 40K models down, as-is, completely ruined how Necromunda works. Yeah...Almost something like that.

Stealth

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Ambush: Hide and Overwatch in the same turn. Sniper Rifles and Camo Cloaks for the win.
Dive: Run and Hide in the same turn. Combine with Sprint, and you'll actually make it to Melee.
Escape Artist: Any time you get Captured, Advance instead. A really, really, really nice skill to have, but it's still random and there are just better options to have.
Evade: Doesn't actually work like that. Still, it's extremely useful and one of the best skills to have for literally any model as it explicitly works in the open.
Infiltration: Potentially one of the best skills in the group, and on the right model; In the game.
Sneak Up: Sure.

The only way that a Stealth skill could be considered bad is if you put it on a model that clearly doesn't need it.

[Wraith]

Medic: Why is this Guerilla? Whatever. Somehow, a Medic can patch your model up so good that they don't even get Captured. As with Scavenger, this is really, really good to have. It's just awkward to deliberately try and roll for when there are other, more important things.

Because it was an intrinsic part of Necromunda's post-game sequence, so it "had" to be included in Shadow War (please note the inverted commas) even though the Techno skill tree no longer exists. Scavenger was the next closest thing, I suppose.

Catach Grenade:

Typo.

Hurl Opponent: No idea why you would do this instead of hitting.

Because in Necromunda you could pitch guys off walkways and from the top of buildings with it, in a game where every 3" you fell would inflict a S1 hit on your guy, increasing cumulatively; If you fell 9" it'd be a S3 hit, and so on. Ultimately, there was a rule which said something like, if you took a hit from falling damage whose Strength was Equal To or Greater than your Toughness score (so you had T3 and fell 12" for a S4 hit) you would be automatically taken Out Of Action if you were wounded by it.

This would occasionally lead to some strange results on the injury table, where falling 14" off a building would lead to you being Captured by the enemy gang (presumably they come and scrape you up after the fight? Or are stood at the bottom with a big net and a calculating expression?) or would land on a man-hole cover and be left scarred with a reversed imprint of "Hive Primus Water & Sewage Company" across your face that would be so awesome, you'd instantly man-up on the spot and try to beat the crap out of your gang leader and take his job.....

....Anyway, I don't know if Shadow War includes that rule, but given the amount of copy/pasting and quality assurance I've heard of, it wouldn't surprise me if they left in Hurl Opponent but somehow left out the reason for it being dangerous.

[Drasius]

....Anyway, I don't know if Shadow War includes that rule, but given the amount of copy/pasting and quality assurance I've heard of, it wouldn't surprise me if they left in Hurl Opponent but somehow left out the reason for it being dangerous.

IIRC, if you fall 12" or more (unless you're Harlequins), you go SPLAT!, no saves, no "gears of war" dead, no rolling for injuries, just dead. Handy for dumping heavy weapon chumps off their high perch or just to get someone out of cover so your guys can shoot 'em if you don't think you can beat 'em in CC.

[Cheesegear]

If you fell 9" it'd be a S3 hit, and so on.

Which is about the standard. The Tower of the Fortress of Redemption is about ~14" tall. How much terrain are you using that's that big, that makes you believe that throwing people off of something is a good idea? I can only imagine one or two situations where throwing someone off a walkway so they take damage is better than actually hitting them, and in those cases, any other skill from the Muscle group would be more useful.

Ultimately, there was a rule which said something like, if you took a hit from falling damage whose Strength was Equal To or Greater than your Toughness score (so you had T3 and fell 12" for a S4 hit) you would be automatically taken Out Of Action if you were wounded by it.

Oh, that rule still exists. As I said above, how many players are really playing with buildings with ramparts 12" off the ground? And is it worth blowing a skill just to defenestrate somebody one or two times? Similar to the Great Leap skill in Agility? How many times is that going to come up, that it's actually worth not picking the other skill you rolled?

...Anyway, I don't know if Shadow War includes that rule, but given the amount of copy/pasting and quality assurance I've heard of, it wouldn't surprise me if they left in Hurl Opponent but somehow left out the reason for it being dangerous.

Again, it's not that there's 'no reason' to use Hurl Opponent, it's more a case of 'What could you possibly be doing where Hurl Opponent is your best choice?'

[Eldan]

We use a mixture of Mordheim and Malifaux terrain, mostly, with a few smaller 40k pieces for flavour. Mainly since that's what we used for our Mordheim campaigns and had around.

So, a lot of two and three story buildings, ground level is mainly three-inch wide alleys, bridges and dangerous slopes everywhere, lots of cover. Twelve inches is not uncommon. We've had a few rare 15" and 18" falls.

[Wraith]

As I said above, how many players are really playing with buildings with ramparts 12" off the ground? And is it worth blowing a skill just to defenestrate somebody one or two times?

Again, I think this is a throw-back to Necromunda that may not have been addressed by the new game. The old plastic bulkheads were 4" tall, and the standard set had two different structures that were each 3 bulkheads tall, so back then I played every single game with at least 50% of my buildings being 12" tall, if not taller when I finally killed my original cardboard templates and started making my own to replace them.

With that, brings the answer to the second question, I suppose, which in turn determines how good the skill is; if your group likes having lots of terrain and climbing all around it, Hurl Opponent might not be so situational as you have found it.

Again, it's not that there's 'no reason' to use Hurl Opponent, it's more a case of 'What could you possibly be doing where Hurl Opponent is your best choice?'

It's the only thing in the game that is even remotely equivalent to Hit & Run in 40k; you get charged, win the combat by 1 and - not sure that you'd be able to put down your opponent with just one hit - instead choose to throw them a couple of inches so that your guy can make his own charge and try to get more hits with an extra die.

Or to throw them off a building. Or into another danger, like a pit or a pool of acid (there were rules for those previously). Or to get your guy out of a tar-pitty fight and onto something more meaty. Or to 'feed' a weak opponent to another of your team to farm experience on them, rather than the same guy hogging it all the time. Or to negate the effects of multiple combatants by tossing a few out of the way (am I right in thinking that Multiple Combatants still aren't auto-Out of Action?).

Or just because it's fun to see a guy thrown about like a ragdoll. You remember 'fun', right?

[Cheesegear]

With that, brings the answer to the second question, I suppose, which in turn determines how good the skill is; if your group likes having lots of terrain and climbing all around it, Hurl Opponent might not be so situational as you have found it.

I guess what I would have preferred is some kind of Bullrush/Knockback skill. "If you Charge, instead of making a To Wound roll, you can instead immediately push the opposing model D6" in any direction in the Charger's forward arc." meaning that you do a Bullrush instead of making a To Wound roll. If a Bullrush happens in the Move Phase (because it's a Charge) it can potentially knock a model out of Cover/Hiding to be shot at in the shooting phase. Or, maybe you're only T3 going up against a T5, and it'd be quicker/easier just to knock them off a rampart instead of trying to use a Guardsmen to hack'n'slash a Tyranid Warrior which he will never win.

As it is, Hurl Opponent is made instead of the Injury Roll. You've Hit, you've done a Wound, your opponent failed their armour save, and now you're at the final step...And you choose to do no damage, and instead push them off a roof. Now, if the roof is 9(T3) or 12(T4)" high, go for it. I approve whole-hardheartedly. If it's not 12" high, you're better off doing an Injury. Because unless the fall causes Instant SPLAT!, you're doing less damage than if you knock them down.

inb4; 'But you cause fighters to be Pinned!' But you've made it to the Injury Roll! Your better option is to knock 'em down and go to town.

It's the only thing in the game that is even remotely equivalent to Hit & Run in 40k

lolwat? Jump Back (Agility) is Hit & Run, and it's one of the best skills in the game.

Or into another danger, like a pit or a pool of acid (there were rules for those previously).

That sounds like a thing that was cut out of the game. It hasn't come up in any of my games at all, which may just mean that I haven't gone looking for it.

Or to 'feed' a weak opponent to another of your team to farm experience on them, rather than the same guy hogging it all the time.

There's no experience. IMO that's literally the biggest thing they cut out. Only one dude Advances per Mission (not including What Doesn't Kill You...). Your model can literally do nothing all game, and still Advance. That's how people Level Up their Leaders early on. Leaders are too valuable to 'waste' on the front lines, so you hide them in the back for the first two games, give them a free Level Up for the skill of your choice; Once your Leader has a 'free' Skill and a few extra points of wargear, only then do you step him into Line of Sight of enemy models.

Or just because it's fun to see a guy thrown about like a ragdoll. You remember 'fun', right?

Is that the thing where...
No. I'm thinking of something else.
I think I remember what 'fun' is. Back in the long, long ago.

If you think Hurl Opponent sounds like fun, and you plan to use it heaps to solve all your problems. Then do that. But it is by far one of the least useful methods of problem solving. As long as you know that before you pick Hurl Opponent over...Something else...It's fine. Just make informed decisions. If I tell you Hurl Opponent is bad not very useful, and you pick it anyway, that's on you.
(Alternatively, I'm bad at the game and have no idea what I'm talking about)

[bluntpencil]

Hurl can be useful if objectives are up high. Shove them off the building - even if they survive, they're no longer going to take an objective.

[Adrastos42]

So, this doesn't change the fact that Hurl Opponent is always going to be a situational skill, but it seems like some of those posting either don't know or are misremembering the falling damage rule and so thinking the skill is worse than it is. So, straight from the rulebook:

Falling Damage

A fighter who falls sustains an automatic hit at a Strength equal to the height of the fall in inches. If this hit wounds the fighter, a fall of up to 3"
will inflict 1 wound, and a fall of more than 3" will inflict D6 wounds/ A fall of 7" or more uses rules for High Impact (pg 35).

Saving throws can be made against wounds sustained by falling. Save modifiers are the same as for hand-to-hand combat hits from combatants with high Strengths. So, Strength 4 inflicts a -1 penalty, Strength 5 inflicts -2, Strength 6 inflicts -3 and so on.

A dizzying fall of more than 10" takes the fighter out of action automatically - there is no need to make a To Wound roll, and no saving throws can be made.

A fighter who falls without going down or out of action is pinned.

So, I haven't had a chance to play any games yet, so I can't say for sure how lethal the combat is, but I feel like it won't be too uncommon to be fighting at a height where the ground will do more damage than your hits will.

[Forum Explorer]

So, this doesn't change the fact that Hurl Opponent is always going to be a situational skill, but it seems like some of those posting either don't know or are misremembering the falling damage rule and so thinking the skill is worse than it is. So, straight from the rulebook:



So, I haven't had a chance to play any games yet, so I can't say for sure how lethal the combat is, but I feel like it won't be too uncommon to be fighting at a height where the ground will do more damage than your hits will.

The crucial part is that you've already done a wound. If it was after hit, but before rolling to wound, or before they took their armor save, then I could see it being pretty useful. As is, it's only useful if you are 10" or higher up, because they'll already usually go down as a result from your hit, and throwing them off simply gives them another chance to take no damage.

[Wraith]

lolwat? Jump Back (Agility) is Hit & Run, and it's one of the best skills in the game.

Godsdammit, this is why I don't post from my 'phone very often; because the copy/paste feature is a prat. That sentence should have had "for some Factions" at the end of it - ones with more access to Muscle skills than Agility ones. Orks, for example?

There's no experience. IMO that's literally the biggest thing they cut out.

...I'm starting to like this game less and less. It's not a reprint of Necromunda at all, it's just a shaved-down version of Kill Team with new terrain in the box.

If I tell you Hurl Opponent is bad not very useful, and you pick it anyway, that's on you.
(Alternatively, I'm bad at the game and have no idea what I'm talking about)

Oh, absolutely it's all my own fault. Don't get me wrong, I'm not arguing that Hurl Opponent is a great skill and that you're dumb for not seeing it, not at all. I was just under the crazy impression that, when people said Shadow War was "like Necromunda", that it was actually a little bit like Necromunda. Were that the case then it'd be a much more useful skill; as it stands, situational at best, just as you say.

[Adrastos42]

The crucial part is that you've already done a wound. If it was after hit, but before rolling to wound, or before they took their armor save, then I could see it being pretty useful. As is, it's only useful if you are 10" or higher up, because they'll already usually go down as a result from your hit, and throwing them off simply gives them another chance to take no damage.

But it is after hitting. At least, if I'm reading correctly:

The fighter may use this skill if they win a combat, in place of hitting their enemy.

If the fighter does use it, they have to pass a strength test, and then they throw the opponent D6" in whatever direction you choose. The thrown opponent is pinned, suffers falling damage if they are thrown off a drop, and if they are thrown at another opponent, both opponents are pinned.

So if I'm reading it right, you get to try this when you have won the combat (so you know you are going to attempt to wound the opponent, and how many hits you have to do it with) but before wounds are actually caused.

[Cheesegear]

It's not a reprint of Necromunda at all, it's just a shaved-down version of Kill Team with new terrain in the box...

Now you're getting it!
Although I've described it as 'Kill Team with Level Ups'.

I can see that I've badly misrepresented Hurl Opponent, mostly because I don't have the rulebook and I wont have it for another two weeks, and I'm going off of information I've (badly) scribbled down from the store's rulebook. Looking up a actually, I can finally see how Hurl Opponent works, and it works like I wanted to; Hurl Opponent is used instead of making a To Wound roll, not Injury roll, which makes it far more useful. But still not good.

Unless you're throwing them down a drop, it's a complete waste of time. And unless you're throwing them off a 10" drop, it's not even good.

Even then, it's still the worst Skill in the Muscle tree and will remain how I left it.

[druid91]

Ummm just for reference, you do realize that this is how GW seems to think shadow war should be played?

It's probably NOT being played like that because that's by my estimate at least $1,200 worth of scenery thrown into one map. But.

[lord_khaine]

Well lucky those few who saved all their old Necromunde terrain then

[Cheesegear]

It's probably NOT being played like that because that's by my estimate at least $1,200 worth of scenery thrown into one map. But.

"All the money you saved not buying a lot of models can be spent on buying terrain!"

[Eldan]

I forgot the name of what we use, but basically, we buy modular walls and floors that can be clipped together into buildings for our gaming club. Still expensive, but orders of magnitude cheaper than GW.

[boomwolf]

To be honest, nearly all of GW's tables are completely over the top and represent the "ideal world gaming table", rather than your average one.

I mean, look at some of these tables

https://20889-presscdn-pagely.netdna...yral-prime.jpg
https://20889-presscdn-pagely.netdna...ble-hall-2.jpg
https://20889-presscdn-pagely.netdna...ble-8-crop.jpg
https://20889-presscdn-pagely.netdna...s/IMG_7813.jpg
https://20889-presscdn-pagely.netdna...gan-bridge.jpg


How many FLAG and/or private tables you know that can match up to these things?
I don't know a single one. I have NEVER gotten to play on anything remotely as amazing.
Gaming on these is simply the BEST. it also explains why jump troopers are so bad compared to bikers-with this much 3d movement, the jump units are far more impressive.

Similarly, playing a game of shadow war on a game like that monstrosity of a table the rig is with it's 9 floors is the final divine form of the game, and more than this and you are going backwards (heck, after the sixth or seventh floor I'd reckon its not really adding anything any more)

But a three-floor multi-building complex is not that far away from possibility, especially with the new terrain kit that came with it being a two-floor small complex on its own.

Id say, if you got the box, you get a Magnavent, Furnace and an Alchomite. I'd reckon all you need to do is add a second Magnavent and a set of Manufactorum, maybe one kit of the armored containers and/or pipes, and you have yourself a wicked industrial table setup.
Adding a second Manufactorum, second furnace and third Magnavent kits-and you can have yourself a seriously epic table.

So yea, its not dirt cheap, but even assuming you go and buy everything especially for this table, and didnt get a game kit for the discuont, AND buy direct from GW (and by everything i mean 3 magnavant, two furnace, two manufactorum, a set of contains, a set of pipes and an alchomite) for 318, for not a good table-but an amazing one.
And odds are, you are not building an entire table out of nowhere at one go.

Now, that's if you want to be a bullhead and insist on heavy industrial feel and want to have all the new goodies and tons of variety.
If you want an urban table though, two sets of Imperial Sector for 140 should set you up. 3 sets for 210 will give you a ton of buildings (seriusly, 3 sets is an outright absurd size), though it will bit a bit same-ish.

[lord_khaine]

How many FLAG and/or private tables you know that can match up to these things?
I don't know a single one. I have NEVER gotten to play on anything remotely as amazing.
Gaming on these is simply the BEST. it also explains why jump troopers are so bad compared to bikers-with this much 3d movement, the jump units are far more impressive.

Actually the tables at the club where i used to play more or less looked like the first picture you linked, though still clearly inferior in painting quality and setup.

[druid91]

I forgot the name of what we use, but basically, we buy modular walls and floors that can be clipped together into buildings for our gaming club. Still expensive, but orders of magnitude cheaper than GW.

Dwarven Forge?

[Eldan]

Doesn't look like ours, no. Ours was relatively thin material, about as thick as plasticard, that was then stuck together.

[Drasius]

How many FLAG and/or private tables you know that can match up to these things?
I don't know a single one. I have NEVER gotten to play on anything remotely as amazing.
Gaming on these is simply the BEST. it also explains why jump troopers are so bad compared to bikers-with this much 3d movement, the jump units are far more impressive.

Our local club used to have a storage cupboard that was the size of a normal room FULL of terrain, enough to fill 8 tables to a good standard of terrain. About 1/2 of that was 1 persons. Our local 30k enthusiasts have enough terrain that each can individually fill an 8x4 board with enough terrain that movement becomes an issue while one in particular has enough to fill 2x 6x4's to the same degree with both a forest and an industrial theme. Our local GW is also fairly flush with terrain, again, to the point where we have choices in how we theme our tables.

I guess I'm lucky, but yeah, our tables look like a couple of those pictures without fail every game.

[Wraith]

I mean, look at some of these tables

I am fortunate enough to live within a 20 minute drive from Warhammer World, so I have played on some of those tables. They're actually quite impractical - every piece is fixed in place, so it can't be nudged aside or anything to allow easy measuring or retrieval of models, their irregular surfaces looks nice but often lack enough flat surface to stand a whole squad upright properly, and I've lost count of the number of times that I've almost impaled myself on a tower when leaning in to fetch an errant die or lost model.

As nice as they look and as ideal as it would be able to afford the 'recommended' amount of Shadow War terrain, I stand by my previous statement that the old style bulkheads from the original Nercomunda set are one of the best pieces of terrain that GW have ever released. Compact, modular, adaptable and simple; they'd make a fortune if they brought them back and sold them in packets of 5 or something, with sheets of plasticard to cut to preference.

[boomwolf]

Can't really comment on the old necromunda terrain, as I've never seen it...

But the spesific tables I've linked pictures to have plenty (in fact mostly) flat surfaces, they simply have lots of high buildings, multi-floors, cover and LoS blockers

this one:
https://20889-presscdn-pagely.netdna...ble-hall-2.jpg

is the most problametic, due to the narrow corridor nature of it. but its clearly not for regular 40k, but for killteam/shadowwar games (maybe even zone mortalis?)


Its all about matching the table to your game.

[Ricky S]

I was lucky for a while in that a friend had a 2 car garage he converted into a mini battle bunker. He had 4 beautiful tables, one of which was a full zone mortalis set. We had linked battles and the zone mortalis acted as a ship or bunker.

I've moved away from him though so the best I can summon for zone mortalis is my space hulk box, which still isn't terrible.

I know of tournaments which require you to bring terrain, it's never a bad idea to have some handy.

[LeSwordfish]

Can't really comment on the old necromunda terrain, as I've never seen it...

But the spesific tables I've linked pictures to have plenty (in fact mostly) flat surfaces, they simply have lots of high buildings, multi-floors, cover and LoS blockers

this one:
https://20889-presscdn-pagely.netdna...ble-hall-2.jpg

is the most problametic, due to the narrow corridor nature of it. but its clearly not for regular 40k, but for killteam/shadowwar games (maybe even zone mortalis?)


Its all about matching the table to your game.

All I can think of when I see that is the contortions and screwdrivers needed to get models/dice out of all those little nooks and crevices once they inevitably fall in.

[Mystic Muse]

If there's a more appropriate thread for this, I apologize. I got the Hive Tyrant kit for the swarmlord, and realized I have nothing I can do with the wings.

Anybody have advice for a Harridan kitbash or something?

[Brookshw]

If there's a more appropriate thread for this, I apologize. I got the Hive Tyrant kit for the swarmlord, and realized I have nothing I can do with the wings.

Anybody have advice for a Harridan kitbash or something?

Magnatizing isn't an option?

[Mystic Muse]

Magnatizing isn't an option?

I got this specifically to make it a swarmlord. Even so, no, I have no magnets and don't feel like waiting for magnets to arrive in the mail. I also already have two flying hive tyrants.

[Knaight]

I am fortunate enough to live within a 20 minute drive from Warhammer World, so I have played on some of those tables. They're actually quite impractical - every piece is fixed in place, so it can't be nudged aside or anything to allow easy measuring or retrieval of models, their irregular surfaces looks nice but often lack enough flat surface to stand a whole squad upright properly, and I've lost count of the number of times that I've almost impaled myself on a tower when leaning in to fetch an errant die or lost model.

They do look like the sort of thing that would work best if everyone had a croupiers stick and one of those extended grabber things.