Warhammer 40K Tabletop XXIX: Ro, Ro, Ro Your Boute

[Wraith]

Apparently I've learned that it's a Thing that Australians do. Do people in other countries just not constantly rip on their friends? Weird.

If an Australian makes fun of you once, he probably hates you. If he makes fun of you constantly, he's your best mate...Weird.

It's something you inherited from us. To the English, your best friend is the guy you can spend all day trading all of the foulest of insults that you can imagine, slowly getting more and more polite as you like the subject less and less. If you meet an English guy and he is nothing but perfectly impeccably, icily nice to you.... you ****ed up somewhere.

The Scottish are slightly harder to read. They're generally insulting everyone, all the time, whether they like you or not; the difference depends on how many headbutts are incoming throughout the barrage.

My armies and their reaction to the news:

In my case...
Grey Knights: You aren't going to believe how many Daemon-Hammers I've got waiting for this. It's going to be great.
Black Templars: Assaulting out of Drop Pods oh god yes please
Carcharodons: The Possibility of non-gimped Terminators, you say? I'm tentatively excited to be dusting off Tyberos, though I suspect that it'll still be the case that whatever he does, the Templars will do better.

[bluntpencil]

It's something you inherited from us. To the English, your best friend is the guy you can spend all day trading all of the foulest of insults that you can imagine, slowly getting more and more polite as you like the subject less and less. If you meet an English guy and he is nothing but perfectly impeccably, icily nice to you.... you ****ed up somewhere.

The Scottish are slightly harder to read. They're generally insulting everyone, all the time, whether they like you or not; the difference depends on how many headbutts are incoming throughout the barrage.

.

It depends on how the insult is prefaced in Scotland.

"He's a ****." = the most horrific of insults, although not as bad as if you said it to an American.
"He's a good ****." = "He is a most respectable individual!"

I'm not going to drop hints on the language used.

[LeSwordfish]

I mean... I assume that many things that are "Unwieldy" now will have to go later, in the same way as things that are "High Initiative" now will get to go first? Or have I missed something?

[Forum Explorer]

I mean... I assume that many things that are "Unwieldy" now will have to go later, in the same way as things that are "High Initiative" now will get to go first? Or have I missed something?

Maybe, but I actually doubt it. I think it's a flat rule, whoever charged goes first with only very rare things changing that.

[Cheesegear]

I mean... I assume that many things that are "Unwieldy" now will have to go later, in the same way as things that are "High Initiative" now will get to go first? Or have I missed something?

I have heard some rumours from Adepticon that says weapons that are currently considered 'Unwieldy' will be able to go at the same time on the turn they Charge. Every other round they'll go last. But, so far that rumour doesn't seem to have panned out. Either;
- It was never true in the first place
- It was true at the time of Adepticon, and has since been cut because it isn't 'simple' enough
- It just hasn't been leaked PR Statement'ed yet.

[Requizen]

https://www.warhammer-community.com/...-40000-morale/

AoS, etc.

The bit about Dark Apostles affecting nearby units suggests no attaching to units.

[LeSwordfish]

The bit about Dark Apostles affecting nearby units suggests no attaching to units.

Not really - could just be a bubble effect.

[Drasius]

https://www.warhammer-community.com/...-40000-morale/

AoS, etc.

The bit about Dark Apostles affecting nearby units suggests no attaching to units.

Not really - could just be a bubble effect.

IIRC they already said characters would be seperate but could not be directly targetted if within [x]" of a friendly unit, though I could be misremembering that.

I hope they do something different to AoS here as all too often it becomes "point d6 mortal wound generator at hero, remove hero" and anything with less than 7 wounds is a waste of time, but then, it'd be nice to not have to deal with 2+ re-rollable characters tanking for a unit of grav devs too. Even just allowing characters to attach, allowing us to assign wounds as we wish but removing look out sir would fix a large number of problems now that they have stopped abilities transfering to other units (no more hit and run ATSKNF guardsmen or other shenanigans thankfully).

[9mm]

No, AoS went from Nothing to AoS while Fantasy died and got converted to 9th age. From all the changes I've heard so far, 40k will play nothing like the 40k we're used to beyond the charge phase and everything like AoS .

no AoS was constructed from the sacrificed corpse of WFB and it's setting, complete with beard measuring. Now maybe its cause the last time I really played 40K was back when the Tau were first released (ie coming up on 5 editions ago), but for me the biggest difference between 40K and AoS, is shooting out of and into melee combat, and the stats math.

[CN the Logos]

Oh, right. The Skitarii kit sucks. I forgot.

Ranger Alpha; Galvanic Rifle, Red-Dot Laser Sight - 205 Points
Ranger; Galvanic Rifle, Red-Dot Laser Sight - 135 Points
Ranger; Galvanic Rifle, Red-Dot Laser Sight - 135 Points
Ranger; Galvanic Rifle, Red-Dot Laser Sight - 135 Points
Ranger; [Knife], Omnispex - 120 Points
Specialist; Plasma Caliver, Photo-Visor - 180 Points

Total: 920 Points.

I like Arc Pistols on your Alpha and Specialist, only because you can use them in combat, and they're cheap. Weapons that kill their opponent on a Down isn't quite what it says on the tin. A model that goes down in HtH is dead anyway, except when you're fighting multiple opponents. Except if your Alpha or Specialist is fighting multiple opponents, they're already dead.
An Arc Maul on start is too early and too expensive. Maybe if your Alpha rolls +1WS (why didn't you take the +1BS?) or +1S, or rolls the right/wrong Skills, then you pick up the Arc Maul.

Skitarii are an extremely strong shooty army, with everyone having access to Red-Dots, and the ones who don't, have access to Photo-Visors. If your dudes accidentally roll Gunfighter (ew.), you can always pick up dual Pistols.

Thanks for the explanation; that clarifies some stuff. Not sure what to do modeling-wise re. the unarmed guy, but I'll take another look at the kit and see what I can do tonight. I may need some smaller magnets.

...As an aside, I am the quasi-mythical being that GW thinks it's selling to when it says people buy their models to collect. I can't really justify buying a kit if I'm never going to use it, but if I could hypothetically play a game with it and not get curb-stomped, then I'll happily buy it even if it's suboptimal. I think the arquebus looks neat.

...Oh well, I have ten guys to play with and apparently the magic number is six. That gives me some room to screw around with modeling.

Apparently I've learned that it's a Thing that Australians do. Do people in other countries just not constantly rip on their friends? Weird.

If an Australian makes fun of you once, he probably hates you. If he makes fun of you constantly, he's your best mate...Weird.

Oh, I mock my friends all the time, and they return the favor. That's not alien to me (Florida is the USA's Australia anyway, from what I've heard of Australia). But I don't really know you, aside from you being "that guy who provides detailed and generally useful analysis on the 40k thread in the forum I frequently lurk in." (And thank you for being that guy by the way, it's really helpful.) I just figured I should let you know: my feelings aren't hurt, but when I say I'm new to a game and need advice, and the response I get is "Why do you hate yourself?" I just assume that there's at least some mild contempt there. If you care about how you're perceived by a random dude on the internet.

[Forum Explorer]

The new morale phase seems to be pretty bad for horde armies, who are traditionally low LD. Like, Incubi are pretty much only seen in a squad of 5. They lose 2 guys, and they pretty much can't take a casualty from the Morale check.

Though Dark Eldar may have just become one of the best factions in the game depending on if they keep their LD modifying abilities, and Fearless/TSKNF change.

[boomwolf]

It is rational though that small elite units are less vulnerable to failing moral than a ragtag mass.

[Brookshw]

The new morale phase seems to be pretty bad for horde armies, who are traditionally low LD. Like, Incubi are pretty much only seen in a squad of 5. They lose 2 guys, and they pretty much can't take a casualty from the Morale check.

Though Dark Eldar may have just become one of the best factions in the game depending on if they keep their LD modifying abilities, and Fearless/TSKNF change.

I'm wondering if each horde army will have means of mitigating loss via morale (nids = synapse/fearless, orks = cap to losses a' la mob rule, guard = blam!). Morale may not be much of a game changer depending how they shift factions off their current bases.

[Forum Explorer]

I'm wondering if each horde army will have means of mitigating loss via morale (nids = synapse/fearless, orks = cap to losses a' la mob rule, guard = blam!). Morale may not be much of a game changer depending how they shift factions off their current bases.

I'd love for Commissars to become useful again. Something like, 'you may execute one model of your choice. If you do so, you won't have to roll a Morale test at all.'

Still, with Space Marine's LD dropping to 7, I think everyone's LD is going to go down a little. So being able to spread out damage among a horde army to force multiple rolls can be pretty brutal if they don't have any mitigation.

[Requizen]

Reminder that in AoS, Bravery (LD) is increased by 1 for every 10 models. Not guaranteed to transfer over to 40k, but I feel like mobs will get something.

[bluntpencil]

https://17890-presscdn-0-51-pagely.n...Characters.pdf

Hahahaha! Sly Marbo is back!

[Blackhawk748]

Still, with Space Marine's LD dropping to 7, I think everyone's LD is going to go down a little. So being able to spread out damage among a horde army to force multiple rolls can be pretty brutal if they don't have any mitigation.

Its a 7 now? What are Orks gonna be, 5? *hoping for old school Mob Rule intensifies*

https://17890-presscdn-0-51-pagely.n...Characters.pdf

Hahahaha! Sly Marbo is back!

Lol

[Cheesegear]

The new morale phase seems to be pretty bad for horde armies...

If Sigmar has taught me anything, it'll be the models/units (e.g; Stormcasts Space Marines) that ignore/mitigate 40K!Battleshock that will be vital to the core of any army. Battleshock is extremely simplistic, but it makes the game go very quickly.

'Roll a dice. Lose models.'

When you know that that's a rule, you have to plan for it when building your army.

[Turalisj]

I just want to see Adeptus Mechanicus not split into three books.

[Blackhawk748]

I just want to see Adeptus Mechanicus not split into three books.

Amen fellow Robo brother. Wait...whats our 3rd book?

[Haruspex_Pariah]

The new Morale system does seem to favor smaller units. If you shoot up a squad of five and eliminate them, congratulations you've killed five enemy models. If you aim that fire at a larger unit, you have a chance of inflicting more losses via morale damage. It will be interesting to see if the new rules provide any benefits for taking larger squad sizes.

[Bobby Baratheon]

Amen fellow Robo brother. Wait...whats our 3rd book?

Maybe the Taghmata book from 30k? I think the Imperial Agents book also has like one thing from the Admech.

[Drasius]

Amen fellow Robo brother. Wait...whats our 3rd book?

I think he means Imperial Knights?

[Bobby Baratheon]

I think he means Imperial Knights?

That makes more sense, though I don't think Imperial Knights should be an exclusive AdMech thing.

[Cheesegear]

The new Morale system does seem to favor smaller units.

Kind of. It also is brutally unfair to expensive units and/or units of models with more than one Wound. When you fail your Bravery Leadership, you lose models, not Wounds.

That makes more sense, though I don't think Imperial Knights should be an exclusive AdMech thing.

They're not. It's just that the War Convocation is the must have Formation, and needs three Codecies to run the Mechanicus competitively.

[Saambell]

Now that all the Codex Books and Supplements seem to be out, would be neat to go through and see what armies needed what number of books. Orks, Ad Mech, and Space Wolves all needed 3. Space Marines maybe 2, but different books from each other, depending on Chapter. Chaos Space Marines, funnily enough, only need 2 given all but one of their books were terrible. And of course Eldar only needed the base book, as that had everything they needed to stomp all the other armies.

[Bobby Baratheon]

Kind of. It also is brutally unfair to expensive units and/or units of models with more than one Wound. When you fail your Bravery Leadership, you lose models, not Wounds.



They're not. It's just that the War Convocation is the must have Formation, and needs three Codecies to run the Mechanicus competitively.

I thought he was referring to the new edition - it would be odd for them to Mechanicus only after being their own thing. The War Convocation, of course, is insane and hopefully there's nothing with quite that level of free stuff in the new edition (also looking at you, Gladius).

[bluntpencil]

Is it just me, or does it look like both opposing sides in a melee can lose models to Morale?

[Cheesegear]

would be neat to go through and see what armies needed what number of books.

Castellans = +2. Fall of Cadia plus Coteaz (Imperial Agents)

Space Marines; Angels of Death (+/- Fall of Cadia [Celestine])
- Black Templars; Castellans
- Ultramarines; Rise of the Primarch

Blood Angels; Angel's Blade and Fall of Cadia (Celestine)
Grey Knights; Fall of Cadia (Celestine)
Space Wolves; Champions of Fenris and/or Curse of the Wulfen and/or Dark Angels
Codex AM; Mont'ka or Castellans (+/- MTs)
Sisters; Castellans
Adeptus Mechanicus; Plus Cawl
Skitarii; Flesh Tearers Taxi Service (Blood Agnels plus Exterminatus) was nerfed into the ground, making War Convocation the only way to run them; AdMech + Knights

Chaos Marines; Traitor's Hate and/or Traitor Legions. Plus Wrath of Magnus (for Magnus).
Chaos Daemons; Curse of the Wulfen, plus Chaos Marines and WoM (For Sorcerer, x2 Cultists and Magnus).

Orks; The Red Waaagh! and/or Waaagh! Ghazgkull
Dark Eldar; Fracture of Biel-Tan, and Codex: Eldar.
Harlequins; Ditto.
Tau; Farsight was required until Breachers were un-nerfed. Using a Fire Warrior build, you'll also need Kauyon or Planetary Assault.
Tyranids; Leviathan plus 1 or 2 of the Rising Leviathan, and Codex: Genestealer Cults
Genestealer Cults; Tyranids or AM plus Celestine.

[Forum Explorer]

Is it just me, or does it look like both opposing sides in a melee can lose models to Morale?

Yup. Since Morale happens at the end of the turn, you roll the dice so long as you've taken casualties, no matter the source. Or at least, that's my impression of it.