Werewolf Central III - All potential wolves please read

[Andre Fairchilde]

Not true.
Roles are assigned randomly (or they SHOULD be anyway).
Hypothetically, the chances of a newbie getting any certain role should be exactly the same as a seasoned player.

This becomes a bit skewed when you take into account that most players have been playing for a while and therefore there are many more seasoned players than newbies - thereby allowing a greater chance of a vet getting a role than a newbie by default.

So the overall chances of it going to a vet are higher, while the individual chances of it should be equal.

What?

I get what you said, but that was confusing for a couple of seconds. No need to repeat it though, and I'm not trying to start a discussion. Bears suck.

[Shadow]

I'll explain it again anyway.

If there are 30 players in the game, there may be 4-5 new players. Probably not, but maybe.
So there are 25 veteran players.
If the ratio is 5-1 in favor of seasoned players, the likelihood of a seasoned player getting a role over a newbie would be 5-1, same as the ratio of players.

So the chances of a new player getting a Role are (or should be) EXACTLY the same as a veteran player.
But as there are more veteran players than newbies, the scale SEEMS skewed even though it's not.

Veteran players get Roles more often than newbies because there are more vets in the player pool.




And.... Vikes suck even worse. I mean, you couldn't beat my Bears' now could you?

[UncleWolf]

okay, thanks for clearing that up.
Personally I'm a Ravens fan, even though they have been losing.
Death on wings!

@Alarra: I was born in D.C. and lived in Maryland for over 9 years. (I was born in 1990) I'm in Missouri now

[Alarra]

Ravens fan? Does that mean that you reside in the general vicinity of Baltimore?

And *on topic*...
One thing that also needs to be taken into account is the fact that many narrators actually are hesitant to give a brand new player an important role that involves a lot of actions. Statistically, first time players are more likely to allow themselves to be autolynched, so until a player has proven that they are actually interested and willing to play the game, many narrators will not allow them to be randomly given the seer roll, for example.

[Shadow]

I never take a player's experience into account when assigning Roles. A new player will have their own take on how a Role should be played, whereas an experienced player will fall into the niche that this Role has been carved out. A new perspective is always a good thing.

Not my game, but as an example:
*remembers CurlyKitGirl's first run at a game, where she was the single most effective Baner I've ever seen, specifically because she DIDN'T know how that Role was traditionally handled*

[Andre Fairchilde]

(Remembers that game when Andre, CKG, and ZP were in cahoots vs. Shadow.

Hmm.

Networking works. )

[Shadow]

I had fun screwing with you and leading you astray in that one.

There were times that you were getting extremely close and the others wanted to kill you.
I told them to leave you alone and let you have some fun in your first (I think?) game.

I think I cost us the game in the long run, because I wanted to be nice to you. But it was well worth it in my opinion. Andre Fairchilde & Mafia have become synonymous these days.
Would that have been the case if I'd let them kill you on night 4 or so?

[PhantomFox]

Well, I'm told that HaleyInTraining is now unavailable, and I now have a slot open in Universal Smash Bros. It's only night two, so I could sub someone in without it affecting too much. However, this is a HIGHLY complicated game, it's crazy-go-nuts insane. But if you're itching for a game right off the bat, I can arrange your spot in it.

Sheesh, I started in Llama Llama Duck, the game that USB is based off of, and I didn't turn out too bad, did I?

[Helgraf]

Well, I'm told that HaleyInTraining is now unavailable, and I now have a slot open in Universal Smash Bros. It's only night two, so I could sub someone in without it affecting too much. However, this is a HIGHLY complicated game, it's crazy-go-nuts insane. But if you're itching for a game right off the bat, I can arrange your spot in it.

Sheesh, I started in Llama Llama Duck, the game that USB is based off of, and I didn't turn out too bad, did I?

I'd go for it, but I was already killed in USB. First night victim sucks.

[Copacetic]

Whenever I see this thread in the bottom of the Form screen, I think it's some wacky School themed Town thread. Just thought I would share that with you.

[Griever]

So there are 25 veteran players.

How do you define "veteran player", out of curiousity?

[Andre Fairchilde]

Having played more than one game, and a bit of experience.

If you're checking this thread you are probably a veteran. If you've developed and/or run a game all the way to the end. If you've had a couple of different roles.

It only takes one game to be a solid veteran.

The people that don't usually autolynch - those are veterans. The ones that know the rules, and lie when they post by saying "Oh! Am I still in this one?" or "I'm not keeping track anyway...." or the worst "Random point at X."

Those are signs of veterans and people playing to win.

[Dallas-Dakota]

The people that don't usually autolynch - those are veterans. The ones that know the rules, and lie when they post by saying "Oh! Am I still in this one?" or "I'm not keeping track anyway...." or the worst "Random point at X."

Those are signs of veterans and people playing to win.

Except the last one are all lines by me, but its the truth! The only logic I try nowadays is llama logic... But I'm telling the truth then. Sometimes I honestly forget or think I already died. Or sometimes I don't notice I died...
If I get a important role like seer or alpha I generally network and let others suggest names from which I'l pick one on hunches.

[Freshmeat]

I always found the way the term 'veteran' is used in a werewolf-related context a little misleading. Most people would expect that whoever is called a veteran would, by necessity, be highly skilled and experienced since there's no reason to assume the word in itself would be used in a light manner. It just seems strange and counterproductive to use what is essentially the wrong word.

Not that I think it should be changed because of what is little more than a minor, semantical inconvenience, mind you.

[UncleWolf]

Well, I think I'll do well(hopefully) in these games because I've always liked mindgames.
Except Sudoku, I hate Sudoku.

[banjo1985]

I've decided on Demon: The Progeny for my game for early next year, a game that pretty much just popped into my head as I've got down to writing again. It takes a lot of elements from the World of Darkness game setting, and a story from my own fevered imagination, a marriage made in hell if ever there was one. 40 player game in an ideal world.

Tell me what you think of the initial rules, and my attempt at literature.

Demon: The Progeny

Initial Story

Spoiler

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“Join us Abby.”

Abby backed further down the alleyway, away from the strangely emotionless man in the brown business suit. She felt the hard unyielding pressure of a wall behind her; she’d come to a dead end.

“Join us Abby. We are the key.”

The man just kept walking calmly towards her, his pale blue eyes staring a hole right through her head. He’d followed her on the walk home from her night shift at the bar, getting right behind her before she’d realised he was there. Abby had known instinctively he was dangerous, for a second she actually saw a crimson mist around him, like the fiery pits of hell itself. She’d run down the alleyway hoping it would throw him off the scent, instead she was trapped like a butterfly pinned to parchment.

“Join us Abby. We are the key.”

Buy some time, that’s what she had to do…

“What do you mean? Who are you?”

“I am Legion, for we are many. We are the key.”

The man was less than ten feet away now, slightly too long arms reaching out towards her. Still he looked almost disinterested, his slack face showing no sign of pleasure, anticipation, even anger.

“Back off!”

A shot rang out from the entrance of the alley and the mans head exploded in a shower of blood and brain matter. He pitched forward into a puddle and didn’t move.

“You okay?”

A young man in a white suit was walking towards her, shoving a revolver into the belt of his trousers. Abby gripped the wall behind her in panic, hoping that somehow the wall would swallow her and spit her out safe on the other side. The man seemed to register her fear, smiling and holding his hands up in a show of innocence.

“Don’t worry Abby, you’re safe now.”

“You killed him!”

At that moment the use of her name didn’t register. The man in white stepped over her fallen assailant and stood in front of her. She had to admit, he didn’t look like a cold blooded murderer.

“I didn’t kill him, I killed it. That was a demon Abby, and it wanted you.”

“A demon? Are you crazy? And how the hell do you know my name?”

The man laughed a little, which only confused her further.

“I’m not crazy. I wish I was though; it would be far easier to sleep at night. We’ve been keeping an eye on you for a while now, we knew this was going to happen.”

“How could you…..what the hell is going on?!”

She shouted this last, making the young man wince.

“Okay okay, calm down, please. My name is Sebastian Pewter, Seb to my friends. Sorry we couldn’t meet in better circumstances Abby, but needs must.”

Abby sighed and put her head in her hands, she didn’t know what to believe.

“I saw…crimson mist around him, like an aura or something…please…I don’t know what’s happening to me…”

Seb put a hand on her shoulder, an awkward attempt at comfort from someone not used to providing it.

“Abby, what you saw was true, that thing was a demon. They come from somewhere else…a reality next door to ours or something. They come here…well for god knows what, but it’s never good. People die. It wanted you because it recognised your scent. You’re like me, you have demon blood inside of you…one of these things is hanging off your family tree like the biggest ugliest monkey you’ve ever seen.”

Abby laughed despite herself. This was complete madness, had to be.

“So I smell like a demon or something? Wow Seb, you really know how to charm a lady.”

Now it was Seb’s turn to laugh.

“I try my best. C’mon, come back to the church with me, you can meet my friends. They’re all like me to some extent, and we all hold off these things in whatever way we can. Even if you don’t believe me, there’s safety in numbers right?”

They turned around to leave the alley, and stopped dead.

The body of the man/demon was gone, leaving nothing but a pool of blood. For a second there was a shadow at the end of the alleyway, then that too was gone.

“What…that was a clean shot…what the hell was that thing?”

Abby shook her head, at least she wasn't the only one confused. Seb jogged to the end of the alleyway, a troubled look on his face.

“I don’t like it. Not one bit. Come on, I need to tell the guys about this.”

Abby followed Seb out of the alley and into the night…

Roles

The Lucifuge and Allies

Spoiler

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Abby Cameron (Seer)
Saved by the Lucifuge just before Legion could take her, Abby has the blood of Demons running through her veins. This gives her some limited foresight, but only at night, when the creatures from the other world are at their strongest.
Abby can scry one target each night to identify their role.

Mr White (Baner)
Seb’s mentor and long time friend, Mr White has long since ceased hiding his demonic heritage within human society. He lives alone in a ruined church deep in the wilderness, the sacred ground protecting him from the powers of Legion.
Mr White can protect one player each night in the ruined church, preventing them from being killed by Legion, Ghoul or Harlequin.

Sebastian Pewter (Mason Alpha)
Demon blood runs particularly strong in Seb, being the direct offspring of demon and human. He leads the Lucifuge, a tight-knit group of demon blooded humans who patrol the borders between reality and the Otherworld, preventing other demons from getting through. Due to his ancestry, Seb can manifest demonic power, its type dependant on how many Lucifuge remain alive:
- 4 – Cloister – A bane each night, usable only on Lucifuge members.
- 3 – Obfuscate – A disguise action each night, usable only on Lucifuge members.
- 2 – Foresight – A scry action each night, 50% accuracy rate.
- 1 - Doom – Seb’s point counts double.
- 0 – Unholy Strength – When killed, Seb will kill a random player responsible for his death.

The Lucifuge (Masons)
Individuals with demon blood that have joined with Seb over the years to defend humanity from Otherworld threats like Legion. All are committed to the cause, but their blood is weak, so they are unable to manifest powers in the same way as their leader. Instead, their survival allows Seb to manifest powers of his own.

Imp (Fool)
A cowardly demon Seb came across several years ago. He broke the creature’s weak will, and Imp now feeds him information about his fellow demons. A twisted unnatural little thing, Imp travels between reality and the Otherworld, gathering information for Seb. Problem is, Imp isn’t half as sneaky as he thinks he is, and the demons of Otherworld feed him false information to damage the Lucifuge.
Imp can scry one target per night, but the result will be random. He will always scry Abby as the Fool.

Justin & Lauren Ford (Lovers)
Two parts of the same soul that never should have been split, Justin and Lauren are identical twins that begin the game knowing each other. Their demonic blood is very weak, only manifesting when one or the other suffers serious anguish or pain.
If one twin is killed, the other will receive the role of someone responsible for the death. When the second twin is killed, their spirit intertwines with that of the other twin, causing a rip in reality that traps one person responsible for their death forever.

Masque (Disguiser)
No-ones sure whether Masque is a demon or fractured human being, and the lady herself sure isn’t telling. She wanders around the city, wearing a full face theatre mask upside down at all times. Anywhere she goes things seem to go wrong; machinery develops unexplainable gremlins, electronics won’t even turn on, and peoples auras swirl and change like leaves on the wind, making them impossible to read.
Each night Masque can disguise one target as any role in the game.

Civilians
These are the poor innocent sheep, the majority of human society that remain blissfully unaware of the threats that hide just beyond the veil. The Lucifuge would be happy for it to stay that way, but the sad fact is that with Legion around, they need all the help they can get.
Civilians vote each day to lynch one player; they have the power to beat Legion, if someone points them in the right direction.

Neutrals

Spoiler

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Ghoul (Assassin)
Ghoul used to be human, still is physically. But mentally he is a broken soul, existing now only to kill and feed on the people the voices in his head tell him to. He wears a medieval plague carrier mask, because it’s dirty work he’s doing, very dirty indeed, and the world must be cleansed. He had the misfortune to wander in to the Otherworld by accident; part of him escaped, but whatever made him human was lost in there.
Ghoul can kill one player per night.

The Tattooist (Marker)
Another fellow who wandered into Otherworld by accident, but fortunately came back relatively unscathed. Unscathed, but not unchanged. The tattooist now always finds himself doodling strange patterns and symbols that seem to dance and sway in front of his eyes. He has the unquenchable desire to mark other people with these patterns, and for him it has become an obsession.
The Tattooist can mark one player per night with a demonic tattoo. This has no in-game effect, but counts towards his victory condition.

Harlequin (Wildcard)
An androgynous and ephemeral demon who wears the colourful garb of a travelling minstrel or entertainer. The colours of its clothing changes with its mood, which seems to alter as often as the wind. Harlequin cares nothing for reality, or the Otherworld from which it came, it just wishes to follow the path set out for it in its mind and not be disturbed. No doubt some poor wretch will be unlucky enough to get in the way.
Harlequin has five abilities, all of which must be used before one becomes available to use again:
- Bane
- Scry
- Fools Scry
- Kill (50% success rate)
- Disguise
Harlequin will not know which scry ability it is using.

Legion

Spoiler

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Legion (Blind Wolves x 7)
The demon now known as Legion is another broken soul, just one possessing a massive will. It forced itself through the veil between here and the Otherworld, intent on breaking down the barrier and allowing the demons of Otherworld free reign across reality. But something went wrong; when Legion forced its way through the veil its soul was divided into seven pieces, each unaware of the others except with the dullest of senses. Legion needs to join its broken soul together to regain its former power, then and only then can the veil be torn down.
All parts of Legion’s soul begin the game blind, each sending a night kill vote. Targeting another part of Legion puts the two players in contact and manifests the power of Foresight. As more of Legion joins together, the growing soul manifests new abilities and becomes more powerful.
2 – Night Scry ability
3 – Night Void ability
4 – Night Bane ability
5 – A second 50% Night Kill ability
If all seven parts of Legion ever join together, the second night kill becomes 100% successful.
One Legion will be identified as the Alpha, having a casting vote on the kill target in case of a tie.

Victory Conditions

Spoiler

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The Lucifuge and their allies win if they kill Legion.

Legion wins when the number of Legion souls left is equal to the other player remaining.

Ghoul scores a win if he personally kills all of the following:
- Abby Cameron OR Imp
- Legion x2
- Harlequin OR The Tattooist
- A Lucifuge Member
- Civilian x2

The Tattooist scores a win if more than 50% of the survivors at the end of the game have been marked with a tattoo.

Harlequin scores a win if she outlives Sebastian, Ghoul and the Legion Alpha.

Comments, thoughts, ramblings?

I've tried a new mechanic for the wolves, I'd appreciate opinion on that in particular, because I honestly don't know whether it will work.

[Mordokai]

I'll join this banjo, you know as much. However, few comments.

I'm not sure giving masons extra abillities is a good idea. Having been just killed in AC, I can say this makes a game quite harder on wolves. Especially since they start a game with bane ability. One of them comes out on day one and bam, instant network. Sure, it gets destroyed the second one mason is kileld, but to me, it still holds too much power. Also, lovers seem quite powerful. Perhaps they could simply be two villagers knowing each other from the start? Even that gives them a leverage over the others.

Ghoul has the potentional to screw the game, either way, for wolves or villagers. Giving him specific victory conditions helps a lot, but a night kill every night? To me, it looks like everybody will just want to waste him once they find him. Tattooist and Harlequin are interesting roles, I'll give you that. However, both of them have quite harsh victory conditions, which seems to be the case with Ghoul as well. Why not just make survival their only victory condition? Sure, it isn't half as interesting, but I find current ones just too harsh. The amount of bluffing required...

As for the Legion... interesting new concept for blind wolves. Getting them more powers as they become whole... interesting indeed. What happens if one of the souls gets killed when merged with others? Are those souls killed as well? Perhaps making the wolves blind will make up for everything that they have against them.

All in all, an interesting game. But I really think it could use some rule polishing.

[banjo1985]

Well, as I said, these have been written pretty much on the fly, so by all means point out the holes you see.

- I can immediately agree a bane for the masons is potentially a bad idea. I think I'll remove it in place of something that aids information gathering.

- The lovers are tough, I agree, but I don;t want them to be the burden they usually are for the good guys. Maybe I've overcompensated. Wouldn't be the first time.

- Ghoul is meant to be a dangerous pest. He'll have to work hard to win, but giving him a kill list makes him an equal menace to both sides I feel. As for the other two...well a tough condition gives a player something to aim for right? I think they'd be much less interesting to play without their win conditions.

- When one part of a Legion joined with others is killed, the group simply lose the ability associated with the numbers they don't now have. So if there are four of them, and one is killed, they retain a scry and a void ability, but lose their bane.

So yeah, agreed on some parts, and I will tweak accordingly. But I think the neutral roles will stay as they are in the main. Thinking about it, Legion has the potential for three wolf scriers if they get three groups of two...is that overpowered?

[Vampiric]

Definitely gonna play

And that might be overpowered... on the other hand, they will then be fighting for kills.

It's also a very unlikely situation. I doubt it would last for more than one night. Two groups of two? Possible, but also is unlikely to last long...

[Supagoof]

I never take a player's experience into account when assigning Roles. A new player will have their own take on how a Role should be played, whereas an experienced player will fall into the niche that this Role has been carved out. A new perspective is always a good thing.

QFT

I too never let a player's experience get in the mix when randomizing roles.

Placing any restriction on role assignments tilts the games and should not be done. For the sake of that game and all the others here.

Using Shadow's 30 player and Alarra's example, well that means 5 players = villagers which means the pool of those who have roles is narrowed down = more likely experienced players have a role = unbiased roles.

Unbiased roles lead to "rules of shadow" and other non-sense things.

These things begin to affect other games people play in.

And how does that help bring new people into the games?

If you are one of the "many" - Stop it!
[gets off soapbox]

And PhantomFox - Yeah, coming into and having LLD be your first game - well that's enough to drive any man nuts. Your creation from it though is simply a great game.

[The Bushranger]

Ravens fan? Does that mean that you reside in the general vicinity of Baltimore?

And *on topic*...
One thing that also needs to be taken into account is the fact that many narrators actually are hesitant to give a brand new player an important role that involves a lot of actions. Statistically, first time players are more likely to allow themselves to be autolynched, so until a player has proven that they are actually interested and willing to play the game, many narrators will not allow them to be randomly given the seer roll, for example.

Well, my very first WW game was Mafia IV, as R2D2 - the Seer. I don't think I did too badly if I do say so myself.

[Murska]

Well, my first game, Starcraft, was a villager... but my second, third and fourth games were all masons, one with a kill every 3rd night too.

[Dallas-Dakota]

I can't remember what my first WW game was here.... I think it was either Camp or Hogwarts...

[Shadow]

Sorry I've been so lax on keeping this up to date lately.
How do I know where I left off last time you ask?
It's almost as if I put a notation for where I left off right at the bottom of the scheduling post!

So, here we go!

Thinking about running The Day Candyland Broke this next May, probably starting around 10-15 or so...

Scheduled.

And I know it's a bit late for this, but....

Shadowcaller - Yeah, it's a bummer when players simply drop out of the game because they don't like their role.

Everyone
Speaking of which, I'd like to open a discussion on it and how it affects the games, because quite simply it SUCKS when half the villagers stop playing simply because they don't "feel involved".

To all of you who drop out early, or let yourself auto-lynch because you didn't get a unique role.

STOP IT!
[rant]
You are ruining the games for the rest of us.

If you don't want to commit yourself to playing the game for the few minutes a day during the 4-10 weeks it takes to run, then don't sign up.

Every role has the ability to change the game. EVERY ROLE.

Look at the damage I caused in Pirates 4, as a villager.

Look at the damage that Shadow caused in YOW3, as a villager.

And don't use the excuse - "Oh, but you guys a really good..."

You know why we're seen that way? Because we don't quit when we get a role we don't like.

A huge hug to all of you who keep up your commitments. Thank you for making these games the best parts of my day.
[/rant]

QFT!!!!!

I disagree. I think that a narrator can have a very positive or negative impact on a game.
*snip*
Anyone else remember in AC:II whenever Banjo made that post after Shadow was killed and the whole thread was thinking "HOLY CRAP ON A TUBA! WE ARE DOOMED!" That really added a level of emotion to the game.

I think that's just a normal reaction to my untimely death....

One suggestion. Don't be afraid to right your own kill/death scenes. If you are on the way to a lynch, and can see the inevitable coming, write something yourself to contribute. That way you can really go out with a bang. The games I have had the most fun in is where I've been able to contribute in that manner. You can get some AWESOME lynch scenes that way, and the narrators normally don't mind at all. It saves them the trouble of having to write the scene themselves :-)

I agree completely. I don't recall who said it, but someone once told me that it was a pleasure running a game that I played in because (as a wolf) I'd write kill scenes and send them in with the kill.
Who was that?!?

This depends on what you play these games for. Roleplayers, for example, will find a villager role decidedly less unappealing.

The only way in which a villager role 'sucks' is power, but therein lies its usefulness as well. Any potentially dangerous task can be delegated to a villager. That's what the entire proxy concept is based on, though its not necessarily limited to just that. A villager can certainly be an active part of the machine provided you take into account that ultimately, they're expendable. And if the wolves already know that a certain person is a villager, I guess it's up to said person to make enough of a nuisance of him- or herself that the wolves decide to kill him or her anyway, even though those wolves are well aware that they won't hit the seer or a mason in doing so. Besides, in the game of chess even pawns can become queens. The road is longer and more difficult, but not necessarily less interesting.

If you groan every time you end up being a villager, then you're not going to find WW all that enjoyable, because that's precisely the role you'll end up with most often.

Emphasis mine.
If you think te Villager Role sucks, ask yourself why myself, Freshmeat_ and a number of others are killed SO VERY OFTEN in the first few nights of the game.
Because they're AFRAID of us, that's why.
... Even if we're Villagers....
Get that kind of a mentality, tell yourself that you're going to do as much damage as possible as a nobody, and do it every game you play.
With that mentality, the Villager Role doesn't suck anymore.
Matter of fact, it's my favorite Role to get.

Me, I send the narrators night actions when I don't have a role. For fun.

I can attest to that! Even in a game that evnafets, Llama and I have been kind enough to take over for the missing narrator, when we had no clue what was going on!
Getting a night action from someone that's dead (in that particular situation) made us think we'd screwed something up.
"What the hell is this?"
It was funny as hell when we figured it out though!

The general consensus seems to be:
"I wish I wasn't a vllaget!"
But truth be told..
I ALWAYS WISH I was!
When I'm NOT I just get scxried/killed early and end up not playing.

Villager = WIN!

Non-villager = Dead

The Reasons fo that were explained by Goof earlier.
OIf I weren'yt so tired and drink I'd link i.....

I don't even remember typing that....

You unlock this door with the key of imagination. Beyond it is another section of the forum: a dimension of lies, a dimension of betrayal, a dimension of strategy. You're moving into a land of both shadow and supagoof, of things and ideas; you've just crossed over into the Werewolf zone.

I'd like to steal a spot early in January next year, 5-6th is as good as any I guess.

I'll be running either Fatbelly V - Culinery Apocalypse or Demon: The Progency depending on whether I want to run something light hearted or intense.

Penciled in as undecided.

You know that WW is serious business when...

It's October and people are keen to book game slots for next year.

Dude, there's a game scheduled for MAY!!! I laugh at January!
Hahaaa!

Update: Queen (The Rock Group) WW.

*snip*

If I could, I'd like to reserve a spot for this potential game in February.

When in February? Any idea?

Oh, before anyone in this thread mentions it (as mentioned in another thread by Mordokai), I chose this name before I knew about the werewolf games.

(and thanks to Mordokai to pointing the way to here)

I foresee a lot of pointing coming your way

Nah, just kidding Glad to have you around.

Welcome aboard!

I've decided on Demon: The Progeny for my game for early next year, *snip*

And now I'll change it again.

*************

Let me just say that I truly enjoy that this thread sees so much use.
I also truly enjoy that there has been much more discussion on game play and mechanics here than ever before. After all, that's what this thread is for.

Now if I could only find some more free time to keep it updated a bit better....

[Lex-Kat]

Shadow, the first available week of Febuary.

But I need a co-narrator first. Anyone will do. Send applications by PM, please.

Also, does anyone have any further comments about my idea. Anything you think should be changed. Any questions on the rules. Anything.

The last changes are here.

[Zeb The Troll]

Ooo! Shadow? Alarra and I want to try to schedule our Fun House game again. First open spot, please?

[Shadowcaller]

Remember that I still got that spot the 17 November... I'm planning to start the recruitment for Mirrodin the 30 October if thats okay.

Edit: Shadow, Kyou is not going to start at the set date. It will be restarted somewhere around the next year.

[Tormsskull]

Just my .02:

Typically certain players have a role more often than not. Perhaps this is done out of fear that a role given to a relative stranger will result in the entire game being changed when that stranger gets autolynched. After putting in so much time getting the game together, to have it fall apart because some turd signed up and then got autolynched really stinks.

Or perhaps its because the narrators want to try to reward certain posters that they like, or perhaps its because the narrators want a memorable game and they think it is more likely to occur by giving roles to popular people.

Whatever the reason, certain people getting special roles more often than newcomers is obvious IMO. That's why certain people are targeted right away for night kills as Team Wolf is counting on this higher likelihood paying off.

The level of 'skill' in these games is wildly exaggerated. You can analyze every single voting pattern, compare how a player is acting in one game with how they acted in another, etc, but in the end it all comes down to a guess.

[UncleWolf]

Well, whatever happens I'll definitely try not to get autolynched. Only some remarkable circumstances will make it so I forget to post.

[Freshmeat]

A controversial opinion, to be sure, Tormsskull. I wouldn't say that most narrators nowadays are exactly unfair when it comes down to distributing roles. There was a time in the past where I strongly suspected some narrators to take serious liberties where randomized role distribution was concerned, but at this point, and indeed the last six or seven months as well, I believe that the vast majority of narrators employ a system that isn't biased towards anyone in particular.

Furthermore, with the game schedule becoming increasingly more busy, the risk of a game going haywire because of unexpected power roles autolynches isn't quite as bad as it used to be. There is no longer the feeling (if there ever was) of preserving the playability of the game at all costs ("as the next werewolf game won't start for more than two weeks") since there are enough games starting up each week that it's no disaster if a single game runs into trouble for one reason or another.

Whatever the reason, certain people getting special roles more often than newcomers is obvious IMO. That's why certain people are targeted right away for night kills as Team Wolf is counting on this higher likelihood paying off.

That would imply that this opinion would be shared by a sizeable percentage of the werewolf playerbase, which I don't believe to be the case. Granted, if there were suspicions of narrators 'fudging the dice' (so to speak) it's not a stretch of the mind that this topic would be a little taboo. Perhaps it might be a good idea to appoint someone who people could contact in full confidence whenever they suspect foul play (of any kind) is involved in a WW game. Most complaints would be unfounded, obviously, but if some names keep on popping up, it might necessitate a closer look.

The level of 'skill' in these games is wildly exaggerated. You can analyze every single voting pattern, compare how a player is acting in one game with how they acted in another, etc, but in the end it all comes down to a guess.

Werewolf isn't really an exact science, so - unlike a scry - you can't really test a theory save through blood. As such, there's always an element of uncertainty - a 'guess', if you will. However, I gather that this is not exactly what you meant, and this is also the point where I disagree. Some peoples' 'guesses' are simply better than others. In my mind, analysis can and does have a strong impact on the game, and skill is definitely a factor that shouldn't be downplayed. Sure, depending on who you ask, you'll get wildly different views of who is overrated, who's underrated and just how skillful winning a particular game was when taking certain circumstances into account. Still, I'd say that the difference between a veteran (in the regular sense of the word) and someone who played only one or two games is quite noticeable.

It's akin to poker - a game which I find to have many things in common with werewolf. Why do some people win again and again? Are these people more lucky than others? Quite frankly, I'd say the belief that some cosmic force is going out of its way to help a given person out at something as minor as a card game is quite simply ridiculous. A far more likely theory is that everyone's chances are roughly equal but that some people are just better at determining which risks are worth it and which aren't.
Who wins then? Quite simply, whoever can analyze the situation best. Whoever can bet the right amounts of money at the right times, can read his or her opponent best and can keep both his direct and his implied motivations as hidden or as misleading as possible.

Translated to werewolf, this means that some people are better at lying, earning someone's trust, figuring people out, crafting various plans, spotting/recognizing/predicting various types of psychological patterns, disguising perfectly reasoned lynches as random bandwagons, and so on and so forth.
So yes, ultimately I suppose one could still call it a 'guess'. But it can be an educated guess.