LGBTAitP 26: No Time For Snappy Titles

[SiuiS]

I had a weird dream last night where I was cross-dressing.

o.O

I trust it was a good dream?
Honestly, at first I thought you meant you had a nightmare in suit and tie. >_<

This reminds me of an issue I had recently. A trans woman I know identified herself as "gay", and when I asked how she meant, she said "just gay". Not having a set of standards would be immensely helpful.

Ohh, but that's haaa-rrd . But it is a good idea. Why must you be so right all the time, SiuiS?

I get all my clear thinking and wisdom out on the Internet, I assure you. There is rarely enough left For my own life.

Actually, I was talking about the No-No, a handheld hair removal device. Not really removal, I guess, but it supposedly causes hair to take a very long time to grow back (like six weeks before you even notice it again, or something). Bianca and I both want one, but electralysis would be infinitely better.

Aahhh, yes. Those are those things that look like a cross between a personal groomer and a black light, right? I'm... Tryin to talk my girlfriend into getting one. Between the two of us, she is the financial mogul.

Unfortunate, actually. I think she is still hoping I will "man up" and take the reins in the relationship. Part of the reason I've stalled on feminizing.

[tangent][WoD]

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So, like, before she was taken she was Franklin, and then in her captivity, her Keeper turned her into a female? That's just mean, Keeper! Of course, I'm not sure even I would go through being taken and dealing with Arcadia to be female...

And yeah, being a werewolf and trans sucks (no personal knowledge <_< >_>). Any sort of surgery, even with silver (which would hurt a lot, as anesthetics don't work on the People) would heal eventually. Werewolves can grow back limbs and organs, silver just makes it take a lot longer. Basically, for this character, a MacGuffin is her only option. She'll probably learn a lot of the Mother Luna gifts, because those deal with shapechanging. The four-dot gift also allows you to assume the body of any person you've bitten for a short time (in exchange for some essence, so she couldn't use it at will), which could be a placeholder, but to truly change her sex, she'll need something really powerful.

Mage's might not be able to do it, but a high-level Incarna could - those spirits are literally gods, and if they happen to be related to sex and gender, it might work. But what sort of favor would such a being ask for in return?

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Charlotte had low clarity even when a child; super introverted. Little crazy. That sets the stage for her mental balance.

Her durance involved a bunch of tasks she accomplished by creating, pulling resources from her boy and trusting they would grow back.aling cloth from her Good Will, feeding mice bread from her flesh, etc. se eventually stripped herself so much that what grew back was what she was in spirit, not in flesh. Sort of a magical faerie SRS. It's more a blessing than hindrance, and the one good thing to come out of her capture. Her theme is bein broken, and adaptin to psychological damage. Stockholm-ish.

And I have to admit I don't know much about werewolf, though I want to get the book soonly. The incarnae could help, and it would be easer to find a Thyrsus and bribe them, since controlling even the incarnae is within their reach - as is creating a new one solely to help Transfolks change.
Mages are totes broken.

Adding something like that to my wallet might be a good idea. Can I steal that?

Please! I suggested it for you, after all.
Well, you and Helio. And me.

The principle is, "You kids and your new-fangled computers! In my day, we talked to people in person or on the phone when we wanted to know how they were doin', and we liked it that way! Yes ma'am!" Maybe making a fake account would be a good idea. I like Falsa, maybe I'll use her...

Respectable. Consider the net a way to he past social issue that hinder old fashioned interactions. It's not a replacement, it's a supplement!

So I have another story to share. It seems so simple, but I can't really express the enormity of how it's affected me:

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As I mentioned a little while ago, I went shopping on Saturday, and now I have female clothes for the first time since before I was in college. One of the things I bought was a pair of pajamas that I liked. At first, even though I was home alone, I felt like I was being judged when I tried them on. Even my cat and dog seemed to be looking at me funny, and I was always worried that my folks would get home sooner than expected.

But as I got over that, I started to feel really nice. During our consultation, my therapist asked if I ever feel uncomfortable in my body or with the clothes I wear, and I had a hard time answering, because I didn't remember actually feeling uncomfortable. But now, it's like I've realized that it wasn't because I was comfortable before, but because I had never known what being comfortable meant, so I couldn't identify discomfort for what it was.

That first night, for the first time in a long, long time, when trying to fall off to sleep, my mind was, not still, but peaceful. And then I noticed I was smiling, ever so slightly, without realizing it. Which is a big deal, because normally I have to consciously try to smile, and I'm not very good at it.

And now, only two days later, it's like I can't wait to go to bed, because when I'm safe in my room, I get to feel cozy and pretty, as long as I don't think too much about how my body doesn't match. Who would have guessed all that could come from something as small as a pair of pjs?

Yeah~
I have a pair of stockings mesel' >.>

This is also how I vote.

It's as good a strategy as any, methinks.

So I really want to join the GSA, but I doubt my parents will let me. And it's my junior year of high school. I want to do this, it seems like the next logical step. Freshman year was defining myself. Sophomore year was learning to be comfortable with who I am, and being able to spread myself openly. Now it seems like the next step would be to actually join the GSA I'd been wanting to join for over two years now. It's one of those things that I'm still too afraid to do yet, and it makes me sick. I'm such a coward, so overwhelmed by a sense of inadequacy and doubt and fear that I can't even join a school club that openly supports a piece of who I am as a person.

I want to, but my belief that following my heart over my head only gets me into trouble and heartbreak keeps me from taking that chance. It's like thinking someone might disapprove of a fundamentalpiece of you, and them actually telling you that they wish it would change.

Join. Your parents can't stop you, they can't really judge you for activism unless they ask and you tell, and taking that plunge is always easier than what If.

Heartbreak is always more fun than self loathing. Getting your heart broken now is acute; the worst has happened, and by the time you're slide this you're on the mend. Realizing every couple of days, weeks, months, years, that you missed a life-shaping opportunity? That requires way more effort to overcome.

Save yoursel the hassle. Your mind may hate you but your soul will be relieved.

Also, keep in mind that "I have a boyfriend" is often used as a way to let you save face. You're facing an uphill battle, but then, so are most people. (Although I find it interesting how people who are more attracted to trans folk have ... well, the reputation chasers have.)

Well, what reputation do chasers have?

GSA. Think about what each of the letters mean. Plenty of straight folk go there to earn points towards their ally badges because they want to help. Depending on your parents, spinning it as "this is a cause I believe in, and I want to help out/pad my college applications" instead of "this is something I have a vested personal interest in" should shush them. It's unfortunate when you have to learn spin control on your own parents, but it's a handy skill when you are in that sort of situation.

Agreed. On both counts.

[Skeppio]

I trust it was a good dream?
Honestly, at first I thought you meant you had a nightmare in suit and tie. >_<

Yeah, it was a fun dream, and I was in 'girl' clothes. I probably should have been clearer.

[Reluctance]

Well, what reputation do chasers have?

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Wiki to the rescue. Punching some of the alternate names into urbandictionary, especially the one that ends with "chaser" should paint a clearer if less board-appropriate picture.

You also have similar reactions to other -chaser types, chubby being another well known type.

[golentan]

Apologizing is for what you do. Never apologize for what you are. That way lies madness.
Re: your parents potentially not approving: They don't have veto power over your decision.
Take control of your life.

I can think of several cases where I should apologize for what I am. In general I agree with this statement, though. And I can't think of anything someone who could be defined as a human could also be that would necessitate an existential apology.

[SiuiS]

... *Finds herself wondering if the 'drunken Irishman' stereotype isn't everyone else just being jealous* X3

Maybe a little. I think it's the American Irish who gave it a bad rep. Scrappers, the Lot.

I thought about marrying into technical noble lines so I could technically claim to be a noble.

I've been knighted by a drunken descendant of Scottish royalty. >_>

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Wiki to the rescue. Punching some of the alternate names into urbandictionary, especially the one that ends with "chaser" should paint a clearer if less board-appropriate picture.

You also have similar reactions to other -chaser types, chubby being another well known type.

Yeah, it was a fun dream, and I was in 'girl' clothes. I probably should have been clearer.

Well, that's what I figured, but I prefer to have personal experiences rather than just passing on whats been passed on.

So you find it interesting that people who expressly enjoy relations with Transfolks have the same reputation as trans chasers? Or am I reading that wrong?

[Asta Kask]

I read the article, and now I feel sad for hir. Of course, he* got to be Emperor for a few years, so it probably wasn't all that bad.

When using "hir," wither for gender-neutral or because you don't know the proper gender, what would be the "subject" form (forget the proper grammatical term for that)? "He"/"She" doesn't work.

I think the correct term is "ze". Yeah, ze was leading up to the crisis of the 3rd century where emperors came and went, the empire split into three and everyone thought it was finito. Then came the Illyrian emperors and put the empire back together again.

The crisis of the 3rd century was a combination of

1. Massive political division, with each and every general liable to be made emperor by his troops whenever he won a battle
2. This, as you can imagine, led to 60 years of more or less continuous civil war
3. In order to keep the loyalty of the troops, every emperor gave massive cash bonuses and wage increases to them, leading them to expect and those and murder everyone who didn't please them
4. Severe manpower shortage, because so many people were killed in civil wars
5. Shrinking tax base, leading to less money to pay the army, forcing the govenment to raise taxes and debase the coins
6. Massive inflation, making coins basically worthless and later forcing Diocletian to demand all taxes in natura
7. Collapse of trade due to taxes, inflation and civil war
8. Invasion on all the major fronts - the Rhine front, the Danube front and the Persian front - because troops were removed to fight civil wars
9. And to top it all off, smallpox

Clearly whoever played this game set the difficulty level to "Insanely high".

[Reluctance]

Well, that's what I figured, but I prefer to have personal experiences rather than just passing on whats been passed on.

So you find it interesting that people who expressly enjoy relations with Transfolks have the same reputation as trans chasers? Or am I reading that wrong?

It's more me wondering why people who often complain about how a trait makes it hard for them to find somebody then turn around and get upset when they find somebody with a fetish/fantasy for that trait. Creepers and mild abuse are obviously not cool (the latter often in the form of "you're lucky to have me, who else will have you?"), but it tends to smack hard at decent people who admit to their fetish/fantasy as well.

[CheesePirate]

It's more me wondering why people who often complain about how a trait makes it hard for them to find somebody then turn around and get upset when they find somebody with a fetish/fantasy for that trait. Creepers and mild abuse are obviously not cool (the latter often in the form of "you're lucky to have me, who else will have you?"), but it tends to smack hard at decent people who admit to their fetish/fantasy as well.

For some I guess it could be hard to accept that someone is attracted to the very things that they wish to "escape" from, the things that they don't like about themselves, or even hate. Also, some might think; is it me they are attracted to or is it just this one side of me, if this person has a fetish for pre ops, are they going to stick around once I am post op?

[turkishproverb]

Try to find a date when you have a social phobia (which is getting worse) and extreme anxiety+depression.. It sucks D:

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Though it's odd.. I've been without a boyfriend for oh, about two months or so now, but for once in my life.. I've been okay with it. Before I've always -craved- love, because of my PTSD (not feeling loved by parents/family, only a boyfriend 'fills the hole' [no pun intended]). But I've been so absorbed in gaming, building a 'new life' (well, it feels like it) for myself in WoW (and now Guild Wars 2) that is so much better than my real life. I've got a good guild, with loads of nice caring people in it who also want what I want to happen in it, I've got a few max-level characters and well.. It makes me feel accomplished. It makes me feel like living is actually worth-while, strange as it sounds.. Some people say it's good, others say it's bad. I think it's personally good, because it's stopped my life-long goal of finding 'the one', and being so depressed all the time that I haven't. I'm just kind of wondering what other people think of it? :/

Actually, I have a natural problem with social situations, and have had anxiety problems and depression, so I can sympathize to at least a small degree (never had outright PTSD).

*hugs*. Best wishes ar emost of what I can do.

All I can say is try not to go too far at once. You don't want to over extend and go into some kind of shock (mind you, i'm not a person who should be giving the relationship advice). Not sure if the game is a good or bad thing, without more experience in your behavior. On the game, though, if you do decide you need to give it up, take my advice: Cold turkey isn't for everyone. You may have to ween yourself.

[Mono Vertigo]

The issue with many such fetishes/fantasies is that the fetishist tends to consider people relevant to their fetishes less as people and more as arousing objects who happen to have a person attached to them. For example, people with a fetish for, say, transwomen, have a specific and stereotypical picture of what transwomen are like, and probably don't want to deal with them as persons with their own thoughts and desires.
Plus, fetish often involves characteristics that are exotic to the fetishist (like chubby chasers who are also chubby are quite uncommon). Not everyone likes to be treated like an exotic number.
So yeah, I'm sure many fetishists treat the object of their fetishes with respect, but I can certainly perceive the problem with people perceiving you as an object first and a person last, even if it is a revered object.

[SiuiS]

It's more me wondering why people who often complain about how a trait makes it hard for them to find somebody then turn around and get upset when they find somebody with a fetish/fantasy for that trait. Creepers and mild abuse are obviously not cool (the latter often in the form of "you're lucky to have me, who else will have you?"), but it tends to smack hard at decent people who admit to their fetish/fantasy as well.

Ah, okay. That makes much more sense. Thank you.

[Heliomance]

Actually, I was talking about the No-No, a handheld hair removal device. Not really removal, I guess, but it supposedly causes hair to take a very long time to grow back (like six weeks before you even notice it again, or something). Bianca and I both want one, but electralysis would be infinitely better.

Epilators are an awful lot cheaper than $250.

So I have another story to share. It seems so simple, but I can't really express the enormity of how it's affected me:

Spoiler

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As I mentioned a little while ago, I went shopping on Saturday, and now I have female clothes for the first time since before I was in college. One of the things I bought was a pair of pajamas that I liked. At first, even though I was home alone, I felt like I was being judged when I tried them on. Even my cat and dog seemed to be looking at me funny, and I was always worried that my folks would get home sooner than expected.

But as I got over that, I started to feel really nice. During our consultation, my therapist asked if I ever feel uncomfortable in my body or with the clothes I wear, and I had a hard time answering, because I didn't remember actually feeling uncomfortable. But now, it's like I've realized that it wasn't because I was comfortable before, but because I had never known what being comfortable meant, so I couldn't identify discomfort for what it was.

That first night, for the first time in a long, long time, when trying to fall off to sleep, my mind was, not still, but peaceful. And then I noticed I was smiling, ever so slightly, without realizing it. Which is a big deal, because normally I have to consciously try to smile, and I'm not very good at it.

And now, only two days later, it's like I can't wait to go to bed, because when I'm safe in my room, I get to feel cozy and pretty, as long as I don't think too much about how my body doesn't match. Who would have guessed all that could come from something as small as a pair of pjs?

That's really sweet :)

[Absol197]

Also *hugs* for Absol.

*Hugs back!*

And now for the rant because I never provide valuable opinions on issues, other than semi-functional voice tips and an argument about Pokémon:

So I really want to join the GSA, but I doubt my parents will let me. And it's my junior year of high school. I want to do this, it seems like the next logical step. Freshman year was defining myself. Sophomore year was learning to be comfortable with who I am, and being able to spread myself openly. Now it seems like the next step would be to actually join the GSA I'd been wanting to join for over two years now. It's one of those things that I'm still too afraid to do yet, and it makes me sick. I'm such a coward, so overwhelmed by a sense of inadequacy and doubt and fear that I can't even join a school club that openly supports a piece of who I am as a person.

I want to, but my belief that following my heart over my head only gets me into trouble and heartbreak keeps me from taking that chance. It's like thinking someone might disapprove of a fundamentalpiece of you, and them actually telling you that they wish it would change.

You've got several options aailable to you, but I woudl think the best one is to just join. The big reason your parents would be against it is because they don't want your brother finding out, right? Well, like others said, you can always say you're going in order to show support for "some guys" you know who are great guys and happen to be gay. He never has to know that those guys include you. And that's if they find out that you're going. Just don't lie about it if they do ask. You can be evasive, but don't outright lie, 'cause that'll ruin your reputation.

Also, keep in mind that "I have a boyfriend" is often used as a way to let you save face. You're facing an uphill battle, but then, so are most people. (Although I find it interesting how people who are more attracted to trans folk have ... well, the reputation chasers have.)

Yeah, it is a way to save face, but I think I'd still prefer to get an honest answer. I mean, how can I improve myself if I don't know how I'm deficient? Maybe not for that particular person, but for the next person I ask?

I get all my clear thinking and wisdom out on the Internet, I assure you. There is rarely enough left For my own life.

Aaah, that "internets" thing I've been hearing about a lot recently, huh? Wouldn't have figured sommat like that to be so good with wisdom, meself.

Aahhh, yes. Those are those things that look like a cross between a personal groomer and a black light, right? I'm... Tryin to talk my girlfriend into getting one. Between the two of us, she is the financial mogul.

Unfortunate, actually. I think she is still hoping I will "man up" and take the reins in the relationship. Part of the reason I've stalled on feminizing.

Yep. And that's not very nice of her! Does she know, or...?


WoD Discussion

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If you're willing to draw very tenuous connections (NWOD-OWOD-Exalted), Luna's probably your girl. Guy. Simultaneously. You still have the question of bringing something to trade to something powerful enough to effect the change, but at least the forsaken have an in with an entity who can cover that. Other spirits of gender run the risk of being overly essentialist.

Luna's big deal is shapechanging, but in NWoD (especially in Werewolf) she's mostly portrayed as female. In fact, the Uratha call her "Mother Luna."

Charlotte had low clarity even when a child; super introverted. Little crazy. That sets the stage for her mental balance.

Her durance involved a bunch of tasks she accomplished by creating, pulling resources from her boy and trusting they would grow back.aling cloth from her Good Will, feeding mice bread from her flesh, etc. se eventually stripped herself so much that what grew back was what she was in spirit, not in flesh. Sort of a magical faerie SRS. It's more a blessing than hindrance, and the one good thing to come out of her capture. Her theme is bein broken, and adaptin to psychological damage. Stockholm-ish.

And I have to admit I don't know much about werewolf, though I want to get the book soonly. The incarnae could help, and it would be easer to find a Thyrsus and bribe them, since controlling even the incarnae is within their reach - as is creating a new one solely to help Transfolks change.
Mages are totes broken.

You know the old gamer adage, "If it has stats, we can kill it?" In the W:tF book, when it's describing the various Ranks of spirits and how powerful they are, any spirit rank 5 or higher is an Incarna. Of those, the Incarnae of Rank 6 or higher only have an asterisk in the chart. The footnote? Something to the effect of, "At this level of power, an Incarna has no need for stats. They are, in effect, god-like beings." Even if there's some book out there that says there's an archmage spell that can control an Incarna, I personally would say that there isn't. A mage would Ascend to the Supernal Realm long before they reach the level of power to control something so strong it transcends stats!

Either way, though, Charlotte sounds like an awesome character! Changeling is one of those games that I've wanted to play for a while, but never have had the chance to do so. I've also wanted to play an actual Werewolf game, not merely the four-session intro game I ran twice for two different groups of friends. My friends who like WoD don't like the Werewolf setting, even though they won't really try it, and my other group gets rweally uncomfortable when not playing something d20-based. It's annoying!

Please! I suggested it for you, after all.
Well, you and Helio. And me.

Then consider it stolen!

Respectable. Consider the net a way to he past social issue that hinder old fashioned interactions. It's not a replacement, it's a supplement!

That is kinda what I'm doing here, is it not? I suppose the other reason fro not wanting a Facebook is because everybody has one nowadays, and I want to be special! I'm special dernit! I'm a snowflake! Weeee! Ohnothesunarrrgh! *melts*

Yeah~
I have a pair of stockings mesel' >.>

I think the correct term is "ze".

Ah, thanks!

Clearly whoever played this game set the difficulty level to "Insanely high".

My friend Jay could beat it.

That's really sweet :)

[SiuiS]

Yep. And that's not very nice of her! Does she know, or...?

Yeah. She's not dealing with it so well, though. It's an understandable thig; our relationship is based on her wanting a boyfriend; I already act different enough she's kinda wiggy about things. So we are taking it slow. Baby steps.

WoD Discussion

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You know the old gamer adage, "If it has stats, we can kill it?" In the W:tF book, when it's describing the various Ranks of spirits and how powerful they are, any spirit rank 5 or higher is an Incarna. Of those, the Incarnae of Rank 6 or higher only have an asterisk in the chart. The footnote? Something to the effect of, "At this level of power, an Incarna has no need for stats. They are, in effect, god-like beings." Even if there's some book out there that says there's an archmage spell that can control an Incarna, I personally would say that there isn't. A mage would Ascend to the Supernal Realm long before they reach the level of power to control something so strong it transcends stats!

That's kinda the premise. Magic is about transcending stats. In vampire, you politic and try to maintain your humanity. In changeling, you cope with horrible Things done to you. In werewolf you preserve the balance hated by both sides. In Mage, you have infinite power and try no to go mad and break things. It's a huge paper scale difference. XD

Either way, though, Charlotte sounds like an awesome character! Changeling is one of those games that I've wanted to play for a while, but never have had the chance to do so. I've also wanted to play an actual Werewolf game, not merely the four-session intro game I ran twice for two different groups of friends. My friends who like WoD don't like the Werewolf setting, even though they won't really try it, and my other group gets rweally uncomfortable when not playing something d20-based. It's annoying!

Out of Character thread. We all found out we liked the game and talked a friend into running it as a learning experience. I suggest stalking all WoD threads Thanqol is involved in. His spin on things is sublime. I'd never have tried the new World of Darkness if he didn't do a better job up selling it than the books do.

Stop on by! We love lurkers, and this is my not-so-secret first step to maybe getting someone to talk Werewolf with so I can get into that game, too.

That is kinda what I'm doing here, is it not? I suppose the other reason fro not wanting a Facebook is because everybody has one nowadays, and I want to be special! I'm special dernit! I'm a snowflake! Weeee! Ohnothesunarrrgh! *melts*

Yeah. I technically have a Facebook account, to stay in touch with my old senses, bu neither of us ever use it anymore. I've been thinking of deleting it, dice I can't remember the password or anything. But I'd eventually have to make another one, considering all the Things that require a Facebook account...

[Absol197]

Yeah. She's not dealing with it so well, though. It's an understandable thig; our relationship is based on her wanting a boyfriend; I already act different enough she's kinda wiggy about things. So we are taking it slow. Baby steps.

That's got to be rough for her. So many difficult things to deal with, on both sides. Hopefully things can get worked out!

WoD Discussion

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That's kinda the premise. Magic is about transcending stats. In vampire, you politic and try to maintain your humanity. In changeling, you cope with horrible Things done to you. In werewolf you preserve the balance hated by both sides. In Mage, you have infinite power and try no to go mad and break things. It's a huge paper scale difference. XD

Out of Character thread. We all found out we liked the game and talked a friend into running it as a learning experience. I suggest stalking all WoD threads Thanqol is involved in. His spin on things is sublime. I'd never have tried the new World of Darkness if he didn't do a better job up selling it than the books do.

Stop on by! We love lurkers, and this is my not-so-secret first step to maybe getting someone to talk Werewolf with so I can get into that game, too.

I'll definitely stop on by! And, once I get off work, I'll edit this post to include the link to Mr. Shopping's Detroit Rock City (or you could look it up yourself, should you have time; it's on RPG.net, under Actual Plays). He's a fantastic writer, and his game reads like a novel, with the exception of changing tenses, which you can get used to. He also has, and I quote several people here, including myself, "Perfectly captured the essence of the Werewolf: the Forsaken game." Seriously, the thread where he posts the log of the sessions is full of people signing up for RPG.net solely to say that because of him, they bought the W:tF book. It's great!

Fair warning, though: don't start reading unless you can spare a couple hours every day for the next month or so - you will likely get hooked fast!

Yeah. I technically have a Facebook account, to stay in touch with my old senses, bu neither of us ever use it anymore. I've been thinking of deleting it, dice I can't remember the password or anything. But I'd eventually have to make another one, considering all the Things that require a Facebook account...

It's annoying, because it's technically supposed to be a social thing; optional. And yet, so many people and businesses are requiring it nowadays to interact with them. Grrr! What's a troglodyte like myself supposed to do!

[Lycunadari]

So most of you already know this, being friends with me on Facebook and all, but a couple weeks ago my boyfriend broke up with me.

*hugs* Hope you can be happy again soon.

Heh.

When I was ten, I thought about the logistics of finding people with really cool surnames, and having kids so my immediate family would be the coolest possible >.>

Hihi, I did that, too.

Wow, I've not been posting for quite some time... Hello again!


*Hugs* if you need to talk, I should only be about half full in my PM box.

Also *hugs* for Absol.

And now for the rant because I never provide valuable opinions on issues, other than semi-functional voice tips and an argument about Pokémon:

So I really want to join the GSA, but I doubt my parents will let me. And it's my junior year of high school. I want to do this, it seems like the next logical step. Freshman year was defining myself. Sophomore year was learning to be comfortable with who I am, and being able to spread myself openly. Now it seems like the next step would be to actually join the GSA I'd been wanting to join for over two years now. It's one of those things that I'm still too afraid to do yet, and it makes me sick. I'm such a coward, so overwhelmed by a sense of inadequacy and doubt and fear that I can't even join a school club that openly supports a piece of who I am as a person.

I want to, but my belief that following my heart over my head only gets me into trouble and heartbreak keeps me from taking that chance. It's like thinking someone might disapprove of a fundamentalpiece of you, and them actually telling you that they wish it would change.

Welcome back! I think, the others already gave you pretty good advise here, you should go for it. And that leaves me wondering, how common are LGBT groups or GSAs in schools in the US/Great Britain/wherever you are? My school has none, but that's no surprise, being a catholic convent school and all, but I also know of none at the various other schools in my city.

So, while browsing through DeviantArt, I noticed sort of a fight between bisexuals and pansexuals:
There were bisexuals, who said, that pans are only bis who invented a new term to seem cool, and that there is no such thing as pansexuality because bisexuality already covers the whole sex/gender spectrum, and pansexuals who said that that was rubbish because bisexuality is only love for men and women and that pansexuals are the only ones whose "dating pool" included trans*, intersex, genderqueer, androgyne etc. people.
And I thought "what? Don't you have other things to worry about instead of fighting about how others identify themselves?"

[Lady Serpentine]

So, while browsing through DeviantArt, I noticed sort of a fight between bisexuals and pansexuals:
There were bisexuals, who said, that pans are only bis who invented a new term to seem cool, and that there is no such thing as pansexuality because bisexuality already covers the whole sex/gender spectrum, and pansexuals who said that that was rubbish because bisexuality is only love for men and women and that pansexuals are the only ones whose "dating pool" included trans*, intersex, genderqueer, androgyne etc. people.
And I thought "what? Don't you have other things to worry about instead of fighting about how others identify themselves?"

The answer is probably "Yes, but since they're humans (presumably, at least), they're going to argue over it anyway". People tend to argue over anything at all that they think they disagree with, regardless of whether or not it actually matters.

[noparlpf]

Epilators are an awful lot cheaper than $250.

This is supposed to work by heating hair so it comes off or something weird like that.

So, while browsing through DeviantArt, I noticed sort of a fight between bisexuals and pansexuals:
There were bisexuals, who said, that pans are only bis who invented a new term to seem cool, and that there is no such thing as pansexuality because bisexuality already covers the whole sex/gender spectrum, and pansexuals who said that that was rubbish because bisexuality is only love for men and women and that pansexuals are the only ones whose "dating pool" included trans*, intersex, genderqueer, androgyne etc. people.
And I thought "what? Don't you have other things to worry about instead of fighting about how others identify themselves?"

Oh, that argument again.

[Fragenstein]

So, while browsing through DeviantArt, I noticed sort of a fight between bisexuals and pansexuals...

Pan- as a prefix (Greek πᾶν, pan, "all", "of everything", "involving all members" of a group)

All members of a group. A group of sexual practicioners. Sexual practices as enacted by animals... but apparently not limited to any one type of animal?

I want to party with these people.

[Irish Musician]

The answer is probably "Yes, but since they're humans (presumably, at least), they're going to argue over it anyway". People tend to argue over anything at all that they think they disagree with, regardless of whether or not it actually matters.

I can very much vouch for this, being a debater myself. I do tend to argue over anything and play devil's advocate, even if I don't believe the side I am defending. Now, things like this that are part of another human's identity....I tend to stay away from, because who the hell am I to say they are one thing or they other, right? They know them better than I know them

[The Succubus]

So, while browsing through DeviantArt, I noticed sort of a fight between bisexuals and pansexuals:
There were bisexuals, who said, that pans are only bis who invented a new term to seem cool, and that there is no such thing as pansexuality because bisexuality already covers the whole sex/gender spectrum, and pansexuals who said that that was rubbish because bisexuality is only love for men and women and that pansexuals are the only ones whose "dating pool" included trans*, intersex, genderqueer, androgyne etc. people.
And I thought "what? Don't you have other things to worry about instead of fighting about how others identify themselves?"

I dunno. I think there should be a special term for people that are attracted to cookware and ancient goat legged gods.

[Absol197]

Welcome back! I think, the others already gave you pretty good advise here, you should go for it. And that leaves me wondering, how common are LGBT groups or GSAs in schools in the US/Great Britain/wherever you are? My school has none, but that's no surprise, being a catholic convent school and all, but I also know of none at the various other schools in my city.

Lucy! I must admit, every time I see that you've posted, I get nervous, because I want so much for you to hear good news from your friend that I dread hearing that things went wrong.

As for LGBT-type groups, I think they're probably a bit more common here, if only because America has (or at least seems to have) a bit more bigotry against such people, and therefore we need more support . I know my high school had at least one, and my college had several. I'm still looking for non-school related ones in my area, but I suspect they're out there.

So, while browsing through DeviantArt, I noticed sort of a fight between bisexuals and pansexuals:
There were bisexuals, who said, that pans are only bis who invented a new term to seem cool, and that there is no such thing as pansexuality because bisexuality already covers the whole sex/gender spectrum, and pansexuals who said that that was rubbish because bisexuality is only love for men and women and that pansexuals are the only ones whose "dating pool" included trans*, intersex, genderqueer, androgyne etc. people.
And I thought "what? Don't you have other things to worry about instead of fighting about how others identify themselves?"

The answer is probably "Yes, but since they're humans (presumably, at least), they're going to argue over it anyway". People tend to argue over anything at all that they think they disagree with, regardless of whether or not it actually matters.

No, you're wrong! People don't do that!

In all seriousness, though, I can't imagine why this is an issue. I could see a need for both terms, but being neither, I can't vouch for how accurate either one might be. Unfortunately, that debate might be best left to those who are qualified to know, which is where it seems to be taking place...

Also, SiuiS, I don't know if you noticed, but you didn't add thread #25 to the archive list in the first post; you just nicked what Mystic Muse wrote last time and called it good.

[SiuiS]

The answer is probably "Yes, but since they're humans (presumably, at least), they're going to argue over it anyway". People tend to argue over anything at all that they think they disagree with, regardless of whether or not it actually matters.

Yeah. We are currently in a row about whether or not an extended night time period would have the same effects as I would in reality, when night time is an emanation of the moon and not merely the absence of the sun.

I thought it was pretty civil, util everyone else said they were angry >_>

No, you're wrong! People don't do that!

In all seriousness, though, I can't imagine why this is an issue. I could see a need for both terms, but being neither, I can't vouch for how accurate either one might be. Unfortunately, that debate might be best left to those who are qualified to know, which is where it seems to be taking place...

It's a thing that goes in the "understand but not agree" pile. I can see why Rey make the arguments. But it's stuck in a petty cycle of validating the self by tearing down others, who you feel invalidate you.

Bisexuals feel pansexuals are trying to be them, but better. They insist they were into everyone before it was cool.
Pansexuals insist they are indeed different and the bis are just jealous.

It's inane. They're both right, really; it's a matter of paradigm, not fact. Ah well. There is a reason I am no longer on dA.

Also, SiuiS, I don't know if you noticed, but you didn't add thread #25 to the archive list in the first post; you just nicked what Mystic Muse wrote last time and called it good.

Nuts. I must hve gone in to edit, previewed it, and never hit the submit button.
It's bed time now, but I'll try and do that to... Uh, later today.

[Asta Kask]

So, while browsing through DeviantArt, I noticed sort of a fight between bisexuals and pansexuals:
There were bisexuals, who said, that pans are only bis who invented a new term to seem cool, and that there is no such thing as pansexuality because bisexuality already covers the whole sex/gender spectrum, and pansexuals who said that that was rubbish because bisexuality is only love for men and women and that pansexuals are the only ones whose "dating pool" included trans*, intersex, genderqueer, androgyne etc. people.
And I thought "what? Don't you have other things to worry about instead of fighting about how others identify themselves?"

The main issue is, of course, that 'pansexual' is a Greek prefix on a Latin word. Linguistic pedantry for the win!

[Arachu]

Maybe a little. I think it's the American Irish who gave it a bad rep. Scrappers, the Lot.

I figured, but I didn't want to single America out without being sure (we, er, don't have the best track record with minority welfare)... >.>

I've been knighted by a drunken descendant of Scottish royalty. >_>

*Bows all reverently~* X3

The crisis of the 3rd century was a combination of

1. Massive political division, with each and every general liable to be made emperor by his troops whenever he won a battle
2. This, as you can imagine, led to 60 years of more or less continuous civil war
3. In order to keep the loyalty of the troops, every emperor gave massive cash bonuses and wage increases to them, leading them to expect and those and murder everyone who didn't please them
4. Severe manpower shortage, because so many people were killed in civil wars
5. Shrinking tax base, leading to less money to pay the army, forcing the govenment to raise taxes and debase the coins
6. Massive inflation, making coins basically worthless and later forcing Diocletian to demand all taxes in natura
7. Collapse of trade due to taxes, inflation and civil war
8. Invasion on all the major fronts - the Rhine front, the Danube front and the Persian front - because troops were removed to fight civil wars
9. And to top it all off, smallpox

Clearly whoever played this game set the difficulty level to "Insanely high".

Gah. *Gives that whole century a big hug*

Epilators are an awful lot cheaper than $250.

They also really hurt from what I've heard... That doesn't stop me from really really wanting one, of course.

How cheap is cheaper, by the way? I can get it sooner for less, but I do want to get my money's worth... Also, do you have to grow your hair out first?

... Also also, can they be used anywhere? It doesn't seem wise to test it out on, say, my face without being sure. >.>

This is supposed to work by heating hair so it comes off or something weird like that.

Something about a "pulse of heat that crystallizes hair at the root"? Iunno, sounds just sciencey enough to work.

Pan- as a prefix (Greek πᾶν, pan, "all", "of everything", "involving all members" of a group)

All members of a group. A group of sexual practicioners. Sexual practices as enacted by animals... but apparently not limited to any one type of animal?

I want to party with these people.

Sounds either awesome or creepy. Possibly both.

I tend to stay away from, because who the hell am I to say they are one thing or they other, right? They know them better than I know them

*Glomps~* Has anyone mentioned you're awesome?

Yeah. We are currently in a row about whether or not an extended night time period would have the same effects as I would in reality, when night time is an emanation of the moon and not merely the absence of the sun.

I thought it was pretty civil, util everyone else said they were angry >_>

I've seen my cousins yell at each other trying to remember the details of jokes they made. Kidding voices to verbal fistfight, like that. @.@

Nuts. I must hve gone in to edit, previewed it, and never hit the submit button.
It's bed time now, but I'll try and do that to... Uh, later today.

*Hugs*


~Bianca

[Lix Lorn]

Gah. *Gives that whole century a big hug*

...that's one impressive hug.

[Mina Kobold]

WoD Discussion

Spoiler

Show

That's kinda the premise. Magic is about transcending stats. In vampire, you politic and try to maintain your humanity. In changeling, you cope with horrible Things done to you. In werewolf you preserve the balance hated by both sides. In Mage, you have infinite power and try no to go mad and break things. It's a huge paper scale difference. XD



Out of Character thread. We all found out we liked the game and talked a friend into running it as a learning experience. I suggest stalking all WoD threads Thanqol is involved in. His spin on things is sublime. I'd never have tried the new World of Darkness if he didn't do a better job up selling it than the books do.

Stop on by! We love lurkers, and this is my not-so-secret first step to maybe getting someone to talk Werewolf with so I can get into that game, too.

WoD Discussion:

Spoiler

Show

Ooh, can I stop by too? It looks fun-

...

So many pages. H-how do I catch up? @_@

If I eventually do, I would love to talk Werewolf. It is a very fun game that I played way too little of. ^_^

Re: the Pansexual vs. Bisexual argument: I think it really comes down to personal preference when dealing with labels for one's identity. To some, bisexual fits and encompasses everything well enough, to some pansexual is necessary. Maybe they feel uncomfortable implying duality, maybe they wish to put focus on "all" contra "each" or maybe they have developed an attachment to it. As long as we continue to shape the words as society moves, we do not need to be uniform. Though I am glad that inclusiveness means so much to people that they will fight for the way they think it is found.

[Irish Musician]

...that's one impressive hug.

But not half as impressive as a hug from Lix

*Glomps~* Has anyone mentioned you're awesome?

~Bianca

Haha, well thank you so much. I do what I can.....however little that may be

[Lix Lorn]

But not half as impressive as a hug from Lix

wait foul

[Asta Kask]

Gah. *Gives that whole century a big hug*
~Bianca

For anyone who has an interest in history, here's a podcast with 179 episodes about the Roman Empire. That covers the Roman Empire from the foundation of the city (753 B.C.) until the last emperor is deposed (476 A.D.)