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2018-04-16, 07:31 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Magic The Gathering Thread XXIII: Modern is Dead, Long Live Modern
That's still in closed beta
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2018-04-16, 08:28 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Feb 2009
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- A nice, sparkly place.
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Re: Magic The Gathering Thread XXIII: Modern is Dead, Long Live Modern
I have access to the closed beta. If you want to help me since I'm pretty inexperienced, I would appreciate the help and continue to upload videos on it.
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2018-04-17, 03:08 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Jun 2010
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- Denmark
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Re: Magic The Gathering Thread XXIII: Modern is Dead, Long Live Modern
Swords and Path really are the only two cards in white that does that, or anything close to that. You can use them as a baseline for deck building, but not for information about the color pie.
Black is the most efficient at removal, color pie wise.
Black is also the only color with targeted discard, which you seem to have missed.
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2018-04-17, 05:59 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Magic The Gathering Thread XXIII: Modern is Dead, Long Live Modern
There's a few more hyper-efficient white removal spells, they're just narrower. Blazing Hope, Chained to the Rocks, Dispatch, Reciprocate, and possibly Time to Reflect. (I do admit black has the broadest removal, though). I just named the two best examples. And I did miss discard, which black is absolutely the best at. Black is also approximately equal with white in terms of mass removal (boardwipes/wraths/whatever you wanna call them)
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2018-04-17, 06:01 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Jun 2010
Re: Magic The Gathering Thread XXIII: Modern is Dead, Long Live Modern
As far the removal bit goes, I think a lot of a color’s identity has to with how it is used in practice. Swords and Path are among the most played cards in white (if not the most played). The argument that if a player runs into White and they start expecting path/swords, cheap removal with a drawback is probably part of White’s identity. It might not be designed with such in mind, but we also don’t think of the game and the colors in terms of design. We think mostly of them in terms of play.
There are also a lot of other effects on white that remove with drawback such as Oblation or Council’s Judgment (although the latter has no drawback outside of multiplayer).
That said, Black gets cheap and efficient creature removal, going all the way back to good ol’ Terror and up to today’s Fatal Push. The difference between these is the drawback that white has.Former Owner of GiTP's fanciest Bloodbowl Team: The Fancy Lads
The League's Self-Proclaimed Perennial Favorites and Season III Champions!
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2018-04-17, 06:45 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Jun 2010
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- Denmark
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Re: Magic The Gathering Thread XXIII: Modern is Dead, Long Live Modern
Chained to the Rocks is the only one that gets even within the vicinity.
The problem is all of them have conditions, Path and Swords don't, they just have downsides.
You didn't name the two best examples, you named the two examples.
That's not how the color wheel works.
There are also a lot of other effects on white that remove with drawback such as Oblation or Council’s Judgment (although the latter has no drawback outside of multiplayer).
Council's Judgment is great, but it's also different since it was made for a multiplayer set.
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2018-04-17, 07:38 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Jun 2010
Re: Magic The Gathering Thread XXIII: Modern is Dead, Long Live Modern
It's arguable. Ultimately, the players playing the game determine the game's identity as it exists mechanically. If the designers make a whole bunch of cards with mechanic A and a handful involving mechanic B in a certain color, all those folks playing the game will remember the cards that get to the table.
As far as design goes, I think you are correct, but that view also ought to consider how play impacts iterative design. Consider the original cycle of 1 mana for a 3 thing. Dark Ritual shows that fast mana was originally conceived to be a part of Black, but it has since been largely phased out of the game or color-shifted to Red (consider the more recent Seething Song or Pyretic Ritual). The color pie isn't just something that exists as an ideal out there. It continually interacts with the world through the medium of play and the perception players have through play.
Also, Black has about the same level of removal efficiency compared to white (just without the drawbacks). Dark Banishing, Hero's Downfall, and Murder all cost 3. Cheaper effects are more limited (like disfigure or doomblade), or are a non-targeted edict effect. Black just doesn't have the same downsides and usually gets to stay at instant speed.Former Owner of GiTP's fanciest Bloodbowl Team: The Fancy Lads
The League's Self-Proclaimed Perennial Favorites and Season III Champions!
Current Owner and Manager of Rampant Professionalism
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2018-04-18, 09:56 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Dec 2015
Re: Magic The Gathering Thread XXIII: Modern is Dead, Long Live Modern
The thing is, Swords is old enough that it shouldn't be considered representative and Path is considered to be a mistake. It really only matters for setting expectations for new sets and if you like to design your own cards, but Maro has said that we probably won't see the likes of Path and Swords again, as long as he has a say in the matter.
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2018-04-18, 11:39 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Jul 2005
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- WI, USA
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2018-04-19, 02:24 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Jun 2010
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- Denmark
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Re: Magic The Gathering Thread XXIII: Modern is Dead, Long Live Modern
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2018-04-20, 10:56 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Oct 2005
Re: Magic The Gathering Thread XXIII: Modern is Dead, Long Live Modern
Just came back from my first pre-release! I only played one round, as it's late and I'm playing again in the morning, but I went 2-0 with Boros aggro. Kwende, Pride of Femeref + Warlord's Fury does some good work; I swung for 22.
Thanks to Veera for the avatar.
I keep my stories in a blog. You should read them.
5E Sorcerous Origin: Arcanist
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2018-04-20, 01:22 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Jun 2010
Re: Magic The Gathering Thread XXIII: Modern is Dead, Long Live Modern
RW tends to do pretty well in sealed in my experience (unless your pool really sucks). I remember that in almost every draft and sealed event I did for Battle for Zendikar I played RW and did pretty well. Those colors tend to have your solid commons and uncommons that work fine enough without a lot of extra support to make them strong (passing the vanilla test is a big deal).
Former Owner of GiTP's fanciest Bloodbowl Team: The Fancy Lads
The League's Self-Proclaimed Perennial Favorites and Season III Champions!
Current Owner and Manager of Rampant Professionalism
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2018-04-21, 09:04 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Oct 2005
Re: Magic The Gathering Thread XXIII: Modern is Dead, Long Live Modern
My second prerelease also went well, going 3-1 with Abzan tokens/legends. On Serra's Wings is a very good card. I would probably have done better without splashing red for Kazarov, though.
I've gotten the list for my Esper control deck down to 60 cards, now I'm working out my sideboard plan. I have one for control, but I'm not sure about aggro. I definitely want Authority of the Consuls, Lyra and probably The Scarab God, but I'm not sure what to take out for them. Disallows, maybe?Thanks to Veera for the avatar.
I keep my stories in a blog. You should read them.
5E Sorcerous Origin: Arcanist
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2018-04-21, 12:21 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Jul 2013
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Re: Magic The Gathering Thread XXIII: Modern is Dead, Long Live Modern
Yeah, I was at a prerelease last night and On Serra's Wings was such a great bomb in the limited environment. Especially since it felt like there was less flying than I am used to from drafting in other sets.
I went 2-3 or 3-2 or maybe 3-3 with my white/green tokens deck. (Midnight pre-release, went 5 or 6 rounds, is all fuzzy)
I think everyone I played against had white as one of their colors, except maybe the last guy. I just remember I went 2-1 vs him grinding him down in game 2 and 3 after the first game he got a turn 4 lamp genie dude. (the one you can pay 4 and tap an artifact instead of paying his cost)
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2018-04-21, 01:09 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Jan 2010
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Re: Magic The Gathering Thread XXIII: Modern is Dead, Long Live Modern
I am not sure why this surprises anyone. Angelic Destiny was the most overpowered card in M12 for a reason, Gift of Orzhova was the one card in Gatecrash that could compete with Madcap Skills, Aerial Responder was one of the better cards of Kaladesh, and being able to stick it on a large body in a slower format will win games. This is completely as expected.
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2018-04-21, 03:14 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Oct 2012
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- Boston, MA
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Re: Magic The Gathering Thread XXIII: Modern is Dead, Long Live Modern
After a few years' absence, I'm thinking of getting back into Standard. Looking at Dominaria, I like the idea of running this...
Spoiler2 Adeliz, the Cinder Wind
3 Firefist Adept
4 Ghitu Chronicler
4 Ghitu Journeymage
4 Ghitu Lavarunner
3 Pyromantic Pilgrim
4 Fervent Strike
4 Run Amok
4 Shivan Fire
4 Warlord's Fury
4 Wizard's Lightning
4 Highland Lake
14 Mountain
2 Sulfur Falls
But I'm not sure what to do for a sideboard. I'm thinking of using the sideboard for more burn, since I can see how the main deck is lighter on it than it could be (I personally don't find straight burn all that much fun, but I can see removal being an issue). Suggestions?
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2018-04-21, 06:39 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Oct 2005
Re: Magic The Gathering Thread XXIII: Modern is Dead, Long Live Modern
I think you're running too many high cost cards in what probably wants to be a very aggressive deck. Chronicler and Firefist in particular are just too expensive for what they do. If you want to stick 100% to Dominaria you might have to use them, but if you're okay branching out you could do something like this:
Spoiler: The Wind And The Ash It Carries4x Adeliz, the Cinder Wind
4x Soul-Scar Mage
4x Ghitu Lavarunner
4x Siren Stormtamer
4x Spellweaver Eternal
4x Warlord's Fury
4x Crash Through
4x Wizard's Lightning
4x Lightning Strike
4x Renegade Tactics
4x Spirebluff Canal
4x Sulfur Falls
7x Mountain
5x Island
Not sure about the sideboard at the moment, but Spell Pierce is a shoo-in, and Nimble Obstructionist could be good too. The Flame of Keld might be good if you find yourself emptying your hand a lot, but I suspect there's enough cantrips to get you to 20 with a few cards left in your hand.Last edited by Dhavaer; 2018-04-21 at 06:49 PM.
Thanks to Veera for the avatar.
I keep my stories in a blog. You should read them.
5E Sorcerous Origin: Arcanist
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2018-04-21, 07:23 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Oct 2012
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- Boston, MA
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Re: Magic The Gathering Thread XXIII: Modern is Dead, Long Live Modern
...Well, here I was trying to come up with a cool name for the deck, and you go and do that. *grumble, grumble*
I wasn't super happy about the cost on Firefist or Chronicler's kick, either. I do like the idea of sticking to Dominaria as much as possible, so as to get more longevity before things cycle out, but I'm really fine with anything besides Kaladesh. Because I'm too much of a Vorthos for my own good, I'd also like to avoid Soul-scar and Spellweaver, since they clash with the flavor I have in mind. Going by that, I come up with this...
Spoiler: Reach Heaven Through Violence4 Adeliz, the Cinder Wind
4 Earthshaker Khenra
4 Ghitu Lavarunner
4 Pyromantic Pilgrim
4 Siren Stormtamer
4 Crash Through
4 Fervent Strike
4 Lightning Strike
4 Warlord's Fury
4 Wizard's Lightning
4 Highland Lake
4 Island
8 Mountain
4 Sulfur Falls
Earthshaker is something I was looking at anyway, since I see it coming highly recommended in RDW, and I feel like that plus Crash Through should cover Renegade Tactics' niche well enough.
Still not sure about sideboard, but Spell Pierce and Obstructionist do look good, and the extra Blue gives me more to play around with in terms of control (which I'm about as unenthusiastic about as straight burn, but if it works...). I'll look around some more. Planning on doing the draft next weekend, so hopefully that'll give me a chance to scope things out.
Edit: How about this?
Spoiler: Sideboard3 Nimble Obstructionist
4 Shivan Fire
4 Spell Pierce
4 Wizard's RetortLast edited by Amaril; 2018-04-21 at 07:36 PM.
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2018-04-22, 01:00 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Aug 2012
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Re: Magic The Gathering Thread XXIII: Modern is Dead, Long Live Modern
I enjoyed the Dominaria prerelease--only downside is that I thought it could have used something to give it a bit more speed. It didn't feel like games really started until turn 4. I went 3-1 on blue fliers (a tried and true limited strategy) splashing red for some burn and Verix Bladewing. I actually ran 2 copies of the 8/8 leviathan--had a good time.
Coach and Owner of Hellbug's Heroes, Sneak Kings, Sultans of Slaughter, and Commercial Cast-Offs. Season II and III runner-up. Season IV league champion. Season VII division champion.
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2018-04-22, 01:11 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Oct 2005
Re: Magic The Gathering Thread XXIII: Modern is Dead, Long Live Modern
Thanks to Veera for the avatar.
I keep my stories in a blog. You should read them.
5E Sorcerous Origin: Arcanist
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2018-04-22, 01:14 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Mar 2009
Re: Magic The Gathering Thread XXIII: Modern is Dead, Long Live Modern
Doing a two-headed giant prerelease tomorrow, any advice?
Team Name: Mister Mind Bullets and The Great Devourer (he plays Thousand Sons in Warhammer, I play Tyranids)
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2018-04-22, 01:41 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Oct 2005
Re: Magic The Gathering Thread XXIII: Modern is Dead, Long Live Modern
What's the flavour you have in mind? Without Soul-Scar and Spellweaver you lose a lot of the instant/sorcery synergy. Maybe you'd be better off going a bit bigger and heavier in blue, playing Naru and Naban?
If you want to stick with the aggro plan, there's probably not enough blue sources to support Retort. Negate and Essence Scatter are your counters of choice, I think. Magma Spray is generally going to be a better sideboard card than Shivan Fire too, as the exile clause may be relevant.
Earthshaker Khenra isn't a Wizard, so there's no synergy with Adeliz. If you need a 2-drop, maybe Burning-Fist Minotaur?Thanks to Veera for the avatar.
I keep my stories in a blog. You should read them.
5E Sorcerous Origin: Arcanist
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2018-04-22, 10:09 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Nov 2005
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- Canada
Re: Magic The Gathering Thread XXIII: Modern is Dead, Long Live Modern
Did two Prereleases. Did okay. Managed to pull a bunch of cards that will be going into my various EDH decks.
One question, I've dipped into standard for the first time by buying the Second Sun control deck. Obviously Sealed Away is an upgrade from Dominaria, but I have no experience with Standard and not sure what else I should do to the deck. I was debating making it a cycling deck but was wondering if there were other suggestions. I did get a set of Glacial Fortresses to upgrade the manabase, but I otherwise want to keep the upgrades on the inexpensive side.
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2018-04-22, 11:14 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Oct 2012
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Re: Magic The Gathering Thread XXIII: Modern is Dead, Long Live Modern
Someone who doesn't want anything to do with Bolas, for one. I would rather like to stick to aggro--played enough blue in the past that I want to try something different for a bit.
Do you really think the wizard synergy is more valuable than the block bypass? I'm a little anxious about not being able to get attacks through--it's not like I'm playing goblins, I probably can't count on drowning them in numbers alone, and Adeliz and the Stormtamers are all too easy to get rid of.
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2018-04-22, 03:33 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Oct 2005
Re: Magic The Gathering Thread XXIII: Modern is Dead, Long Live Modern
Why is Soul-Scar too Bolas and not Earthshaker? Earthshaker has an explicitly Bolas-related ability, Soul-Scar is just some Amonkheti dude.
A one-off conditional 'can't block' isn't worth much on its own. You're unlikely to get to the point where you can Eternalise it and still be in with a shot at winning. Renegade Tactics at least cantrips and has some synergy with Adeliz and Lavarunner. Your best weapon against blockers is probably bluffing combat tricks, or a burn spell when you have Warlord's Fury up. I've mostly found standard to be a fairly blocking-light format at the moment, although that may change in Dominaria.Thanks to Veera for the avatar.
I keep my stories in a blog. You should read them.
5E Sorcerous Origin: Arcanist
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2018-04-22, 04:21 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Oct 2012
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Re: Magic The Gathering Thread XXIII: Modern is Dead, Long Live Modern
Spoiler: Image
Soul-scar is a man with a fanatical-looking light in his eyes and a snarl of rage on his face, wielding a brand in the shape of Bolas' symbol, and powers that seem to be about inflicting permanent, painful harm on enemies. Looks pretty evil to me.
Spoiler: Image
By contrast, the impression I get from Earthshaker is of a warrior born into Amonkheti society, raised according to its values and living by them because it's what they know, but not fanatically dedicated to them. I'm given to understand many Amonkheti joined the Gatewatch against Bolas once they learned the truth about their religion, and Earthshaker could easily follow that path. If I were planning on Eternalizing them, it'd be different, but I wouldn't, so...
(Not saying I feel super attached to using them, I'm just talking about fluff now.)
Fair enough. I might bend my no-Kaladesh restriction for Renegade Tactics.
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2018-04-22, 09:38 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Dec 2008
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Re: Magic The Gathering Thread XXIII: Modern is Dead, Long Live Modern
I have to disagree with you. Yes, target “can’t block this turn” is not worth a card, and eternalise is pretty much ignorable for this deck. You seem to be ignoring the fact that it’s on a 2 power hastey dude. Creating a pemernat threat makes all the difference.
Don’t. Renegade Tactics actually isn’t worth the mana to cast. With an aggro deck you don’t really want any cards that don’t create an on board threat, or deals direct damage to your opponent’s creatures. Renegade tactics does not do this.
Edit: I’d actually probably put Tactics ahead of Crash Through. I think there’s more sitiuations where getting rid of their best blocker is better than trampling over for like an extra 2 damage. If you want trample I’d maybe look into something like Invigorated Rampage (although that is Kaladeshian) or maybe Brute strength.Last edited by Androgeus; 2018-04-22 at 10:18 PM.
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2018-04-22, 10:25 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Dec 2012
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- Shreveport, Louisiana, US
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Re: Magic The Gathering Thread XXIII: Modern is Dead, Long Live Modern
not sure if I asked...
What is the best aggro deck color combo? I bet it is either mono red or something with red in it.
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2018-04-22, 10:26 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Jun 2010
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- Lima, Peru
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Re: Magic The Gathering Thread XXIII: Modern is Dead, Long Live Modern
They are all contestants for the trials, except Earthshaker won. His reward is to get coated in lazothep and revived as Bolas' zombie.
Soul-scar isn't holding 'Bolas' symbol', he is holding the icon of the God-Pharaoh, around whom the whole of Amonkhet's society is built. Same as the lands with his horns in them, etc.
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2018-04-22, 10:36 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Dec 2008
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- Carlisle, Englund
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Re: Magic The Gathering Thread XXIII: Modern is Dead, Long Live Modern
"Three blokes walk into a pub. One of them is a little bit stupid, and the whole scene unfolds with a tedious inevitability." - Bill Bailey
Androgeus' 3 step guide to Doctor Who speculation:
Spoiler- Pick a random character
- State that person is The Rani
- goto 1