A spellcasters worst nightmare

[Melcar]

Hello...

I’m running a game, where I have a very cocky wizard and I’m hoping you guys will help me come up with a challenge for this dude!

I need to find some anti- Spellcasting monsters. I need them to exist in Faerûn, meaning that it should be part of the FR line of books. I need them to be either 3.0 or 3.5 rules. CR should preferable be non-epic, or as low CR as possible and in no way must it be above CR 27.

I hope you guys will help me. Thanks

[Pilo]

Golems, golems on rampage. (CR min: 7 for standard MM golems)

Lychanthrope too, as they will raise the CR of the spellcaster without giving him/her any spellcasting abilities.

[Hyena]

Easy. Golem - any of them. And anti-magic field, just to be sure.

[marcielle]

The worst thing you can do to a spellcaster is another spellcaster.

[kabreras]

The worst thing you can do to a spellcaster is another spellcaster.

That !
Definitly that !

[TuggyNE]

I came in here with full certainty that this would be a discussion of monks and their overpowered spellcaster-kicking ways. Imagine my relief!

Now, on to the topic. I suggest a counterspelling/dispel-focused caster with one or two archer companions who ready a manyshot action to disrupt casting; the caster ensures that things like wind wall or friendly fire don't block the archers.

However, be careful to avoid going overboard with this; if you're trying to "teach that jerk a lesson" or something, it will probably end badly, but if you're just trying to make things closer to challenging, you should do OK.

[Scorponok]

I find a few low level (like, level 4 and above) fighters optimized for archery can create havoc with spellcasters, if they don't have a Protection From Arrows or Wind Wall prepared. Even with a DEX 16, they could have +8 to attack with feats and rapid shot their arrows for 1d8+1d8 per round. Add in magic arrows, a composite bow for STR damage, and a surprise round, and you have great attack and ok damage at long ranges. Great for low level wizards for sure but if you're talking CR27 as the highest, then as others have said, Golems are creatures spellcasters have very little answers for. Archer Golems?

[Emperor Tippy]

Maximized Awakened Shadesteel Golem given 19 levels of Factotum and 1 of Mindbender (it's CR 20 or 21) along with the feat Persistent Emanation: Selective (feat from Shining South) Antimagic Field. Add on Combat Reflexes, Deflect Arrows, Improved Unarmed Strike, Exceptional Deflection, and Infinite Deflection.

Give it the thirty or so Craft Contingent spells that its HD let it have and the items that it gets.

Watch your party weep in horror.

Its worse when you give it Improved Spell Capacity enough times to get it a one per day 10th so that it can cast multiple 9th level spells per day.

Maximized Awakened Shadesteel Golem Psion 20 with a Persistent Emanation: Selective spell AMF is also positively nasty.

Hell, the same base but use Kung Fu Genius Cobra Strike Monk 14/ Factotum 8 with all of its other feats (besides the Permanent Emanation) on Font of Inspiration can be incredibly nasty.

[Emperor Tippy]

I came in here with full certainty that this would be a discussion of monks and their overpowered spellcaster-kicking ways. Imagine my relief!

Maximized Awakened Shadesteel Golem Monk 19/Swordsage 1 with Infinite Deflection, Exceptional Deflection, Permanent Emanation: Selective AMF, and Self Concealment taken 5 times.

Watch it slaughter your party and laugh.

[ikosaeder]

Spellcasters nightmares:
Spell resistance
Saving throws
Grapple
Sneak attacks
Confined spaces

So some suggestions:
Drows (Spell resistance, poisoned equipment vs bad fortitude) add class levels to adjust CR
Ghosts (draining touch ) CR depend on base creature (drow perhaps)
Golems (as suggested)
Glabrezu (Improved Grab, Spell resistance)

If you know the spell list, you can try to use creatures that are protected from his strength's.

[ps377]

However, be careful to avoid going overboard with this; if you're trying to "teach that jerk a lesson" or something, it will probably end badly, but if you're just trying to make things closer to challenging, you should do OK.

That's very very right.. You cant create plot where all the other player can do at least something, but your caster can do nothing. That would be unfair. But you can have him do something, a caster should do, that would rend him unable to do any other cocky actions.

Maybe have a caster as an opponent and your caster should only counter or dispel his spells (that's a scenario you should plot so he wont just go full dmg on his opponent, but forced him to just counter spells (e.g. to save the party from a fireball) and dispel spells (buffs maybe) to make his party able to harm their opponent.

Another way, i think, to make a challenge for him, is to have more encounters per day (a caster have a limited number of spells per day and especially a wiz has too low). The normal encounters per day i think its 3. Maybe increase them a little, or, if you have less than 3 encounters per day, you should try just 3. Even at level 20, a wiz has only 4 spells per day per spell level (+bonus). I don't think he would have all his (let's say) 6 (with bonuses) 3rd level spells to be fireballs.. And the limited number of spells together with the number of encounters per day are balancing the game between casters and non-casters.

That's what i can think now..

[Mr Beer]

Beholders have anti-magic and multiple attacks. Beholders plus golems is unkind but funny.

[GreenSerpent]

A Nishruu could be dangerous to those who weren't expecting it (Lost Empires of Faerun). They feed on magic and can even disable artifacts.

(quoted from their Absorb Magic ability:

"Artifacts do not operate while in contact with a nishruu and for 1 round thereafter")

[Eldariel]

Dragons with access to epic feats (Extraordinary Deflection & al.), spellcasting (including solid anti-magic effects like Greater Dispel Magic, Disjunction, shaped Anti-Magic Field, etc.) and such. They tend to be the best. Magic must defeat magic. Doesn't matter how immune to everything you are, you still lose to Gated monsters and can't catch Teleporting Wizard unless you can Teleport yourself.

[Alleran]

A Nishruu (Monsters of Faerun) or Hakeashar (Lost Empires of Faerun?) might be what you're looking for.

EDIT: Damn ninjas.

[Arcanist]

Maximized Awakened Shadesteel Golem Monk 19/Swordsage 1 with Infinite Deflection, Exceptional Deflection, Permanent Emanation: Selective AMF, and Self Concealment taken 5 times.

Watch it slaughter your party and laugh.

How is it taking Self Concealment 5 times? Better yet, how is it taking those other feats? I thought monsters with over 21HD could only take make their feats after 21st and after HD be epic feats? Is it a Greater Advanced (Huge) Shadesteel Golem?

EDIT: Derp, you're adding class levels.

[Khedrac]

There's the method from the comic. I managed to do it as a PC - Arcane Heirophant with the feat to share spells a up to 30' "shared" (i.e. on companion only) and Anti Magic Field with my Dire Puma companion familiar who then went and attacked (with Improved Grab when the Bite hit) the 'Big Bad' wizard we were facing. The rogue standing next to him got very happy indeed.

[Emperor Tippy]

How is it taking Self Concealment 5 times? Better yet, how is it taking those other feats? I thought monsters with over 21HD could only take make their feats after 21st and after HD be epic feats? Is it a Greater Advanced (Huge) Shadesteel Golem?

EDIT: Derp, you're adding class levels.

The glory of non associated class levels. In the case of a Shadesteel Golem, 18 to make it CR 20. The one you quoted is CR 21.5 and has 38 HD (and thus 12 feats from HD).

Incidentally it also has a perfect flight speed of 90 ft (120 with Epic speed, 150 with permanent Cloud Wings, doubled with epic Boots of Swiftness). Pick up the Improved Flyby Attack line as well (Adroit Flyby Attack is cheaper feat wise if your perfect fly speed can make up for needing the Hover feat as a prerequisite) and Great Flyby Attack.

Use a Craft Contingent (or scroll, you can easily make the UMD check) Superior Invisibility at the start of combat along with a Craft Contingent Greater Ironguard.

Now laugh super hard at the party. You are immune to all metal weapons, all magic that can't operate inside an AMF, all ranged attacks, and can't be detected in virtually any way.

[Kazyan]

Tippy, how do your players counter things like that, assuming you actually do them to the party?

[Shaynythyryas]

Psionics with the "Psionics are different" setting.

[Emperor Tippy]

Tippy, how do your players counter things like that, assuming you actually do them to the party?

At ECL 20 and before they get epic feats and capabilities of their own?

Foresight to act in the surprise round, celerity if you loose initiative (triggers Craft Contingent Favor of the Marty to negate daze), might be blocked by Permanent Emanation: Temporal Repair if within the range of that (in which case a Craft Contingent Resilient Sphere targeted on the PC is triggered), if able to act cast Time Stop (cheaper to put the Celerity on Craft Contingent than it is Time Stop, by a lot), cast a barred variant Force Cage around the Golem, activate a Weirdstone outside it (barred forcecage not blocking line of effect), cast a Sculped AMF that covers the force cage (no longer an emanation so it stays there), use PAO or similar spells (like wall of stone) to make a depression that the Forcecage+Golem is in, fill the depression with non magical acid. If it's immune to acid then use fire. If immune to that then you start to have problems. Start filling the cage with rubble and stone/iron to force the Golem near the edge and then have your melee type go and start jabbing it through the bars until it dies.

Another possibility if you just want containment is to cover the bottom and sides of the forcecage with walls of stone or the like and then just fill it with Quintessence (instantaneous so AMF does nothing) before completing the box, moving it all into an extradimensional space, and then dumping it in storage somewhere.

There you go.

[ArcaneGlyph]

Rogues with capes of the montebank, anklets of transportation and other dimensional hops that will let them pop in, nail him and pop out.

[Eldariel]

You could also just Gate in something strong enough to deal with it. 19 Contingent Celerities (one Favor of the Martyr) tied to enemy using Celerity pretty much guarantees acting first and since it can't Teleport, sealing it away forever would be fairly trivial. Actually destroying it isn't even necessary; who cares if it exists if it can't do anything. There's also the Brute Force-solution of going through the AMF with Invoke Magic, Initiate of Mystra or powerful enough Disjunctions.

Detection through Mindsight, True Sight (both depend on how they're ruled to work, but one or the other should work), Arcane Sight, epic Spot-checks or such; there are some options that defeat Superior Invisibility.


Now, a bunch of them used in conjunction with a few casters could be quite nasty since the casters can use them to gain their actions.

Rogues with capes of the montebank, anklets of transportation and other dimensional hops that will let them pop in, nail him and pop out.

3rd level spell by the name of Anticipate Teleport from Spell Compendium makes just about any kind of Teleport-bys useless (Wish might work but anything less than that won't).

[Emperor Tippy]

You could also just Gate in something strong enough to deal with it.

Well yes, but that is cheating.

19 Contingent Celerities (one Favor of the Martyr) tied to enemy using Celerity pretty much guarantees acting first

Except Fisty McSmashYourFace has 38 such contingencies.

and since it can't Teleport, sealing it away forever would be fairly trivial.

Who said it can't teleport? The Shadow Jaunt line gives it short range teleportation, Monk gives it Abundant Step, and numerous items allow teleportation (I tend to give mine a Ring of Three Wishes).

Actually destroying it isn't even necessary; who cares if it exists if it can't do anything. There's also the Brute Force-solution of going through the AMF with Invoke Magic, Initiate of Mystra or powerful enough Disjunctions.

Invoke only gets you 4th level spells and it still has immunity to any SR: Yes spell and Infinite+Exceptional Deflection, Disjunction (assuming you get lucky) will only drop the AMF for a round as it can be put back up as a free action by the golem.

Detection through Mindsight,

Works.

True Sight (both depend on how they're ruled to work, but one or the other should work), Arcane Sight,

Doesn't work thanks to a Ring of Sequester (or if the DM wants to be a penny pincher a Third Eye Conceal or just a once per day trip through a Mind Blank trap)

epic Spot-checks or such; there are some options that defeat Superior Invisibility.

Yep, but few of them work particularly great. Mindsight is the one really good one.

Now, a bunch of them used in conjunction with a few casters could be quite nasty since the casters can use them to gain their actions.

That's why they are all Ice Assassins produced by the Roboforge (items as well). 14,400 per day to engage your enemies. Name your target, pay Interplanar Asassins Unlimited a million GP and they will send them one after the other until your enemy is dead or you cancel the contract at a rate of 1 to 10 per day.

What? You think just because the players want to rest that they get to avoid random encounters?

Use Vow of Poverty versions (Chaos Shuffled of course) and no items except the 1 charge Ring of Wish (to get them to the target) and you don't even have to worry about the party getting rich.

3rd level spell by the name of Anticipate Teleport from Spell Compendium makes just about any kind of Teleport-bys useless (Wish might work but anything less than that won't).

Yep.

Granted, my preferred approach is to come in from the ethereal plane under Mindblank and then use a Craft Contingent Greater Blink to engage. Or a Persistent Greater Blink for greater fun. That bypasses Mindsight and every other detection or warning spell/method in the game (Mindblank blocking True Seeing and See Invisible) and it's blocked by Anticipate Teleport.

[BowStreetRunner]

However, be careful to avoid going overboard Tippy with this...

Just in case you are seriously thinking about employing any of Tippy's suggestions in your game, please make sure that either your players are all experienced optimizers, or that all of their medical insurance policies include mental health coverage and that you have a well-trained group of trauma counselors on hand.

[Eldariel]

Except Fisty McSmashYourFace has 38 such contingencies.

Of course, but that wasn't specified yet and contingencies are being spent elsewhere. Still, it's true; usually such application of Craft Contingent Spell leads to the higher HD act first (which makes HD-boosting like Inspire Greatness, Awaken-loops and company all the more enticing). Though some types of anti-magic effects can make it difficult to trigger Crafted Contingencies at all times.

Who said it can't teleport? The Shadow Jaunt line gives it short range teleportation, Monk gives it Abundant Step, and numerous items allow teleportation (I tend to give mine a Ring of Three Wishes).

Well, I was assuming an AMF had been deployed; Shadow Jaunt requires Line of Effect so it's useless without magic vs. a solid Forcecage.

Invoke only gets you 4th level spells and it still has immunity to any SR: Yes spell and Infinite+Exceptional Deflection, Disjunction (assuming you get lucky) will only drop the AMF for a round as it can be put back up as a free action by the golem.

Well, with Sanctum Spell you can get 5ths. I'm sure there are others too. There's also only a limit on the spell level, not any metamagic applied. And one round is all that's needed, certainly; you can just chain enough actions together with any combination of Arcane Fusioned Celerities, Time Stops, Temporal Accelerations, Schisms, Shapechange abilities (Dual Actions probably the most useful here but since you can take as many turns as you feel like I guess you can use any number of forms).

We can easily pump CL to the point where it's at least 50/50 and then use a barrage of Disjunctions, or an Incantatrix can apply Metamagic Effect to reshape the AMF (using Sculpt Spell) to make it non-covering (e.g. 10' cubes).

I'm not saying it's not a solid defense, I'm just saying if a caster party actually gets to act, there certainly an array of offense at their disposal that can be useful, and bringing up a few options.

Granted, my preferred approach is to come in from the ethereal plane under Mindblank and then use a Craft Contingent Greater Blink to engage. Or a Persistent Greater Blink for greater fun. That bypasses Mindsight and every other detection or warning spell/method in the game (Mindblank blocking True Seeing and See Invisible) and it's blocked by Anticipate Teleport.

That's a good one. There are areas on non-material planes where the Ethereal Plane is not coexistent, which would make it inaccessible, and a few blocks that lock away the entire Ethereal Plane. Ghost Trap for instance is a pretty solid persistable buff for making few hundred feet of Ethereal Plane inaccessible around you, but it's of course probably not as commonly deployed as simple damage immunity like Delay Death or Regen/Favor or whatever. Aside from that, yeah, that solves most of your problems.

[Lord Vukodlak]

I designed a SpellFire Golem who instead of being flat out immune to magic would absorb any spell directed at it much like a rod of absorption. It also had high spell resistance for area attacks. To add insult to injury its slams hit with a greater dispelling and any buff dispelled would also be absorbed. It can absorb up to its strength score in spell levels.

What can it do with these absorbed spells, heal it self as a swift action (5hp/ per spell level) Hurl a bolt of spellfire 4d6+1d6 per absorbed spell level(max the golem's hit dice) also a swift action. Oh and I almost forgot they can see magical auras, have minimal intelligence and ranks in spellcraft allowing for a limited ability for strategy. The first time my party fought one it tore them in half largely because they were all heavily buffed so it kept absorbing spell energy to heal it self.

A spell caster lives and dies by his buffs the absolute worst thing you can do to him is a creature that not only dispels his buffs but uses that same energy to empower it self.

Now its a homebrew monster but is inspired by spell fire so it fit into faerun.

[Telonius]

Hello...

I’m running a game, where I have a very cocky wizard and I’m hoping you guys will help me come up with a challenge for this dude!

I need to find some anti- Spellcasting monsters. I need them to exist in Faerûn, meaning that it should be part of the FR line of books. I need them to be either 3.0 or 3.5 rules. CR should preferable be non-epic, or as low CR as possible and in no way must it be above CR 27.

I hope you guys will help me. Thanks

Okay, cocky wizard. Lots of good advice in the thread for doing a total curb-stomp of him. But I'd really caution against that - it might only encourage him to start an arms race. You'll always win, since you're the DM; but it's really not a situation you want to get into. I'd suggest that you throw something at him that really gives him the feeling of being in mortal peril, but he's still able to get away by the skin of his teeth (preferably, only because his team-mates were helping him out).

In order to do that, you'll really need to tailor the encounter to his style. What sorts of tactics is he routinely employing? What buffs does he always have up? And (very importantly) what level is he?

[Keld Denar]

On thing I've realized from playing in a high-ish level game as a controller wizard is that multiple foes with some sort of 1/day evasion ability who like to spread out are very difficult. Sure, a single ogre can be Glitterdusted and hacked apart. Half a dozen flying angels that can turn ethereal 1/day for a round with wounding bows makes for a MUCH harder encounter. You can't just Solid Fog them all and deal with them 1-2 at a time. If you blast one of them with a MM'd Orb of Fire, you still have more to deal with. They are too high up to Evard's, plus the etherealness. Too spread out to easily Glitterdust more than 1 per spell. It was a HARD encounter as a decently optimized God style Conjourer, and I've been in a lot that were similarly difficult.

Spread the foes out. Keep them off the ground. Give them some sort of minor evasion ability a limited number of times per day just to soak up resources. Do 2/3 of these things and you'll find your spellcaster is expending a large amount of resources just to do his "job". I've fought foes with 1/day Wings of Cover which is very annoying, and others with 1/day Dim Door. Outsiders with Greater Teleport at will are great for this.

Then just introduce an Armageddon Clock. Make him deal with encounters with a half-empty spell list because if he stops to rest and reset his spells, a Doomy Doom of Doomalicious Doom^TM will occur. Occasionally punish the caster for trying to compete on a 5 min work day. Build into the adventure the need to Teleport frequently so a portion of high level slots are expended just on running errands.

[intothenight]

If you want completely ridiculous ideas that most likely aren't going to fit in Faerûn 100%, you could try one of the weirdest joke enemies we ever had to fight. The team of evil fighters who wielded... Vile Staple Guns. On successful pins, they could staple a PC's mouth shut or staple their arms to their sides. Our poor caster was only able to fight with stilled and silenced spells, while the rest of us kicked and headbutted our way to victory. Memorable encounter, but very unbalanced enemies (really high CMB and initiative, but really low HP). I don't think the campaign kept going for much longer.

In case you were wondering, Vile Staples can only be removed by a Vile Staple Remover. Holding it bestows a negative level unless you are evil. And the staples had annoyingly high AC. We all agreed that staples would not be allowed at the table ever again.

I really doubt that helped, but who knows? Maybe there's a good idea in there somewhere if you adapt the living crap out of it. And avoid staples.