[3.5] The Stuffy Doll Vs the Playground (V.1 ~ V.28)

[Lapak]

I believe this ends the reign of Stuffy Doll.

I've only been vaguely following this, but I have to say: using its own eternal-destruction clause against it to break the Doomsday cycle it has been doing is beautifully elegant.

[Kansaschaser]

V.17

I need to add 2 levels of Squire of Legend, Spell Mastery (Ice Assassin), Uncanny Forethought, and Psionics to by previous build.

Round1 -- Manifest Time Regression

Round0 --

Standard:Use SuGAF loop to gain N Standard Actions (Celerity).

S1: Supernatural Spell and Uncanny Forethought for an Ice Assassin
S2: Direct Stuffy Jr. to target Stuffy Sr. with its Stuffy Doll ability.
S3: Grant Stuffy Jr. an additional use of Stuffy Doll
S4: Direct Stuffy Jr. to target itself with its Stuffy Doll ability.
S5: Supernatural Spell: Hide From Undead

Round1 -- Disavow any allegiance to Stuffy Jr. "I was just using you!!!"

Round2 -- Problem Solved

Bonus: Since the last time someone used Ice Assassin on Stuffy Doll, you added the following
I believe this ends the reign of Stuffy Doll.

Wow, I applaude you sir. That's quite impressive.

I was working on a build that could actually do enough damage to kill the Stuffy Doll in one round, but then he added Regeneration and it destroyed my build.

[dextercorvia]

I've only been vaguely following this, but I have to say: using its own eternal-destruction clause against it to break the Doomsday cycle it has been doing is beautifully elegant.

Wow, I applaude you sir. That's quite impressive.

I was working on a build that could actually do enough damage to kill the Stuffy Doll in one round, but then he added Regeneration and it destroyed my build.

Thank you.

I should probably cut out the near infinite loop. I will replace it with a Twin GAF containing Twin Celerityx2. That gives me 8 standard actions, which is more than I need to finish the job.

[Arcanist]

V.17

I need to add 2 levels of Squire of Legend, Spell Mastery (Ice Assassin), Uncanny Forethought, and Psionics to by previous build.

Round1 -- Manifest Time Regression

Round0 --

Standard:Use SuGAF loop to gain N Standard Actions (Celerity). Use Supernatural Twin GAF containing Twin Celerityx2 (and suitable metamagic mitigation) to gain 8 Standard Actions .

S1: Supernatural Spell and Uncanny Forethought for an Ice Assassin
S2: Direct Stuffy Jr. to target Stuffy Sr. with its Stuffy Doll ability.
S3: Grant Stuffy Jr. an additional use of Stuffy Doll
S4: Direct Stuffy Jr. to target itself with its Stuffy Doll ability.
S5: Supernatural Spell: Hide From Undead

Round1 -- Disavow any allegiance to Stuffy Jr. "I was just using you!!!"

Round2 -- Problem Solved

Bonus: Since the last time someone used Ice Assassin on Stuffy Doll, you added the following.

1. Very Clever, It's not like nobodies tried that.
2. Ice Assassin or Simulacrum duplicates of the Stuffy Doll kill you no matter what and if unable to they simply self-destruct.
3. I'm curious how you're gaining an additional use of Stuffy Doll.
4. Do you know the DC for a Bluff Check against reality to tell it that you didn't just cast a spell?

I believe this ends the reign of Stuffy Doll.

I do like the idea behind it though

[dextercorvia]

1. Very Clever, It's not like nobodies tried that.
2. Ice Assassin or Simulacrum duplicates of the Stuffy Doll kill you no matter what and if unable to they simply self-destruct.
3. I'm curious how you're gaining an additional use of Stuffy Doll.
4. Do you know the DC for a Bluff Check against reality to tell it that you didn't just cast a spell?



I do like the idea behind it though

1. I stand on the shoulders of giants.

2.

Simulacrums and Ice Assassins based on the Stuffy Doll always turn on their creators and kill them and once they've completed the task,

I missed the 'and' in this clause. I thought they just turned on me once they had completed their job. In this case, I need to cast Hide from Undead before creating the Ice Assassin. It has no choice but to obey me (nothing you wrote said that it would no longer obey me, or stop trying to kill its doppelganger, just that it would seek to kill me). But, since it can't find me to complete the assignment you gave it, it will continue with its original programming. So, it will use Stuffy Doll against Stuffy Sr. and itself when I give it the telepathic command to do so.

3.I used one of the Squire of Legend (Reikhardt) abilities to give it an extra use of the ability.

4.

This curse also extends to any Cohorts, followers or allies that it might have (Even Simulacrums and Ice Assassins under the victims control). This explains why many empires have seemingly vanished overnight.

No Bluff check required -- it doesn't go both ways. I am not a Cohort, follower, or an Ice Assassin or Simulacrum under its control.

I considered it my ally when it was harming Stuffy Sr. -- that allowed me to grant it an extra use of its ability. Since you have altered its programming to also desire my death, there is no way that it considers me its ally.

When I ordered it to kill itself (especially since it wishes me dead) I stopped considering (and treating it like) an ally. There is no defined game mechanic for becoming or removing ally status, and so we default to what the word means.

If it would make you feel better, I can have some poor Squire of Legend follower give it an extra use of its ability. That way, I can never be considered its ally.

[Arcanist]

1. I stand on the shoulders of giants..

It's not wise to stand on the shoulders of toppled giants.

2.I missed the 'and' in this clause. I thought they just turned on me once they had completed their job. In this case, I need to cast Hide from Undead before creating the Ice Assassin. It has no choice but to obey me (nothing you wrote said that it would no longer obey me, or stop trying to kill its doppelganger, just that it would seek to kill me). But, since it can't find me to complete the assignment you gave it, it will continue with its original programming. So, it will use Stuffy Doll against Stuffy Sr. and itself when I give it the telepathic command to do so..

It's a retroactive assumption. If it cannot kill you then it simply doesn't. It kills itself, because it has nothing else to do assuming that you do not exist.

3.I used one of the Squire of Legend (Reikhardt) abilities to give it an extra use of the ability..

Cool, hadn't thought of using that actually

4.No Bluff check required -- it doesn't go both ways. I am not a Cohort, follower, or an Ice Assassin or Simulacrum under its control.

When I ordered it to kill itself (especially since it wishes me dead) I stopped considering (and treating it like) an ally. There is no defined game mechanic for becoming or removing ally status, and so we default to what the word means.

If it would make you feel better, I can have some poor Squire of Legend follower give it an extra use of its ability. That way, I can never be considered its ally.

My only question for this is if you created the Ice Assassin, by default you are it's ally. D&D is very vague on "Ally" and "Enemy" (since, as you stated there is no game mechanic, leaving it up for DM or player interpretation) which is very... annoying in this set up. By the logic you're using (to summarize) "Anything that is threatening me in anyway and does not help me is my enemy" then just about everything in the multiverse is your enemy and you have no allies since theoretically anything can kill you if the proper circumstances are present.

I've no complaints about Squire of Legend

I considered it my ally when it was harming Stuffy Sr. -- that allowed me to grant it an extra use of its ability. Since you have altered its programming to also desire my death, there is no way that it considers me its ally.

This is one of the things that bothers me. Effectively you are saying who is your ally when and why.

It's like one of the things the Moon Children say in Majora's Mask

Your friends... What kind of... people are they? I wonder... Do these people... think of you... as a friend?

Find a simpler way to explain it, because I'm missing something

[dextercorvia]

2. Retroactive assumptions are about the one thing that should be off limits here. You did not write the ability to override the wording on Ice Assassin (just to supplement it) therefore it shouldn't. Still, I am a fair man.

I use telepathy and bluff to convince it that I am Stuffy Doll, and killing Stuffy Sr. is the only way to kill me. With no skill ranks in Sense Motive (mindless undead) and Wis1, that can't be hard to accomplish. That has the added benefit that once it thinks it has killed me (by your own words) it will kill itself without me needing to direct it further.

4.If you kill a zombie, does a necromancer bleed? I will use a Squire of Legend follower to grant it an extra use of the ability. Just creating it is not enough to be considered its ally. You changed its programing to seek my demise, and I am seeking its demise. That is about as far from ally as you can get.

[olentu]

In D&D ally is defined as a creature friendly to you. In most cases, references to "allies" include yourself.

[Arcanist]

In D&D ally is defined as a creature friendly to you. In most cases, references to "allies" include yourself.

White Raven Tactics for infinite actions? Wonderful!

2. Retroactive assumptions are about the one thing that should be off limits here. You did not write the ability to override the wording on Ice Assassin (just to supplement it) therefore it shouldn't. Still, I am a fair man.

I use telepathy and bluff to convince it that I am Stuffy Doll, and killing Stuffy Sr. is the only way to kill me. With no skill ranks in Sense Motive (mindless undead) and Wis1, that can't be hard to accomplish. That has the added benefit that once it thinks it has killed me (by your own words) it will kill itself without me needing to direct it further.

4.If you kill a zombie, does a necromancer bleed? I will use a Squire of Legend follower to grant it an extra use of the ability. Just creating it is not enough to be considered its ally. You changed its programing to seek my demise, and I am seeking its demise. That is about as far from ally as you can get.

For all intensive purposes (and from a slowly developing apathy) I concede.

This game is over and has been ended by dextercorvia. Congratulations.

[Kansaschaser]

For all intensive purposes (and from a slowly developing apathy) I concede.

This game is over and has been ended by dextercorvia. Congratulations.

Three cheers for dextercorvia!

The multiverse is safe from the stuffy doll.

[ryu]

Good work. This thread was getting a bit crowded. One might even say it had little breathing room... What word am I looking for? Oh stuffy! Must make all the horrible puns.

[ericgrau]

Aww and I was just about to make an attempt to figure out how to travel back in time to lock away an easier stuffy doll without killing him so he couldn't resurrect, and end the cycle that way.

[Arcanist]

Aww and I was just about to make an attempt to figure out how to travel back in time to lock away an easier stuffy doll without killing him so he couldn't resurrect, and end the cycle that way.

I also have regrets as well but I'm not a sore loser so eh

[dextercorvia]

I also have regrets as well but I'm not a sore loser so eh

I'm not sure why you think you lost. You created interesting and thought provoking challenges that encouraged an optimization community to work together and play off of one another's ideas. We flexed our muscles, but I know I learned some new things, and I doubt I'm the only one.

Writing something that can challenge RAW abuses without resorting to pure fiat is not an easy thing. This kind of thread should be encouraged.

You sir, are a winner in my book. Three cheers for Arcanist!

[TuggyNE]

I'm not sure why you think you lost. You created interesting and thought provoking challenges that encouraged an optimization community to work together and play off of one another's ideas. We flexed our muscles, but I know I learned some new things, and I doubt I'm the only one.

Writing something that can challenge RAW abuses without resorting to pure fiat is not an easy thing. This kind of thread that should be encouraged.

You sir, are a winner in my book. Three cheers for Arcanist!

Seconded. Hip, hip, hooray!

[ericgrau]

Fun times.

[Arcanist]

You sir, are a winner in my book. Three cheers for Arcanist!

Seconded. Hip, hip, hooray!

HMMMM... Idk if I want to run another Stuffy Doll Challenge starting at V.1 all over again... Well if the mods close this thread or a few weeks pass and this thread falls into ruin then I'll gladly do it again or hell, someone else can do it

[Kansaschaser]

HMMMM... Idk if I want to run another Stuffy Doll Challenge starting at V.1 all over again... Well if the mods close this thread or a few weeks pass and this thread falls into ruin then I'll gladly do it again or hell, someone else can do it

Next time, don't give the Stuffy Doll the ability to destroy the targets soul because you know someone's going to copy that ability and use it against the doll.

Give it the ability to "hold" the soul in abayance for 1,000 years. During this time the person cannot be returned to life by any means (including Wish and Miracle). Once the 1,000 years has passed, then the soul is released.

Having 1,000 years pass normally prevents any form of resurrection/reincarnation unless you have a ridiculously high spellcaster level doing the resurrection.

[Arcanist]

Next time, don't give the Stuffy Doll the ability to destroy the targets soul because you know someone's going to copy that ability and use it against the doll.

Give it the ability to "hold" the soul in abayance for 1,000 years. During this time the person cannot be returned to life by any means (including Wish and Miracle). Once the 1,000 years has passed, then the soul is released.

Having 1,000 years pass normally prevents any form of resurrection/reincarnation unless you have a ridiculously high spellcaster level doing the resurrection.

Hmm... Might try that next time

[Kelb_Panthera]

This thread is handily proving the old addage, "If it has stats, it can be killed," isn't it.

[Arcanist]

This thread is handily proving the old addage, "If it has stats, it can be killed," isn't it.

Haha, quite right I suppose I made some modifications to the last variant of Stuffy Doll to make him harder to counter, but eh

[ben-zayb]

Wow, can't believe I noticed this thread just today...

Mad props to dextercorvia, and arcanist, and of course to everyone that has contributed in this thread! You guys are so awesome with stuff like this, I'm so happy to be a part of the GitP community.

Looking forward for the next installment. Please make it happen!

[Arcanist]

Wow, can't believe I noticed this thread just today...

Mad props to dextercorvia, and arcanist, and of course to everyone that has contributed in this thread! You guys are so awesome with stuff like this, I'm so happy to be a part of the GitP community.

Looking forward for the next installment. Please make it happen!

V.18 is ready to go. If someone is so bold as to perform the Ritual of Bonds Beyond Time (just ask for it and it's good) then perhaps the Hall shall spit forth the next incarnation of Stuffy Doll.

[rockdeworld]

Well nature does abhor a vacuum...

However, I can't help but think that it could have been done differently, i.e. without the Undead subtype. If I made a challenge of this type, would anyone be interested in it?

[Arcanist]

Well nature does abhor a vacuum...

However, I can't help but think that it could have been done differently, i.e. without the Undead subtype. If I made a challenge of this type, would anyone be interested in it?

I welcome you to start up your own Stuffy Doll (or Omnidroid) Challenge

Since nobody seems interested in facing Stuffy Doll V.18

[rockdeworld]

Well, how about this:

Spoiler

Show

The Box

Size/Type: Tiny Object
HP: 1,000,000,000
Armor Class: 5 (+2 size, -5 Dex, -2 unnamed), touch 5, Flat-Footed 5
Special Qualities: The Automatic Button, Karma, Strip, Hall of Origins, Anathematic Secrecy, Spell Immunity, Hardness 100, Break Immunity, Immunity to Wish, Reality Revision, Miracle, Bend Reality, Limited Wish, Alter Reality and Vile Damage, Elder Evil Immunities, Planar Rend, Freedom from Reality, Self-Repairing
Saves: Fort: +∞ Ref: +∞ Will: +∞ (Automatically Succeeds on a saving throw regardless of circumstance)
Environment: Hall of Origins [50 miles from the Spire on the Outlands]
Challenge Rating: ∞
Treasure: Hall of Origins (Magical Location)

Nature abhors a vacuum. With the Stuffy Doll destroyed, someone decided to recreate its death-dealing ability in the form of a small box resting in the middle of the Hall of Origins. Unlike the version with a button, this one is self-activating, and never stops.

The Automatic Button (Ex)
Once per day, The Box can declare one target. No matter where that creature is in the Multiverse it will die. If the creature manages to return to life somehow it will die again immediately. Regardless of The Box's condition, nothing short of complete destruction will free the targeted creature from this curse. Once this curse is placed upon a creature the target has 2 rounds to respond to it before it dies. The subject is automatically aware of being cursed.

This curse also extends to any Cohorts, followers or allies that it might have (Even Simulacrums and Ice Assassins under the victims control). This explains why many empires have seemingly vanished overnight.

Karma (Ex)
The Box is a punishment tool and as a result it shares its pain with a creature that it has cursed. When The Box uses its Curse upon a creature a link is created between the inside of the The Box and the target's soul. In essence, the creature takes any damage that The Box takes with an additional 20 points of damage. For example: Milee is targeted by The Box, Milee attacks The Box with a heightened Orb of Sound dealing 23 sonic damage. In response, Milee takes 43 damage due to Karma.

The Damage dealt by Karma is Divine damage and bypasses Regeneration.

Strip (Ex)
The Box will eventually end all life in the Multiverse, one soul at a time. It is programmed to remove its target's defenses in order to make sure the target dies. The victim is subject to a Disjunction Spell and then in the exact same moment is subject to a Greater Dispel Magic. This ability activates each round whenever an action is possible (on both The Box's and the Victims turn).

Hall of Origins (Ex)
The Temple that houses the Monolith that is known as The Box houses a cruel secret. The Hall and all the creatures and contents are immune to all Divinations and Clairsentience effects, spells and powers for as long as it remains in the Hall. Moreover the interior of the Hall (approximately a 100' circle, 100' high), contains an antimagic field.

Planar Rend (Ex)
The Box creates a 10 mile radius aura around it that prevents planar travel (Including those replicated by a Wish, Reality Revision, Miracle, Limited Wish, Bend Reality, and Alter Reality). Any Gates or planar travels attempts immediately leads the caster/manifester to the City of Sigil. In addition to this Supernatural effects are neutralized entirely when used against creatures or objects within this aura.

Freedom From Reality (Ex)
The Box is free from realities touch and as such nothing can lay there hands upon it. The Box automatically succeeds on any grapple check made to resist a grapple attempt, as well as on grapple checks or Escape Artist checks made to escape a grapple or a pin.

Anathematic Secrecy (Ex)
This malefic property shrouds an elder evil from discovery by divination spells of a divine origin. Any divine spell of the divination school automatically fails when used to ascertain information about an elder evil. Divination spells that are also arcane function normally if they are cast by a nondivine spellcaster. This ability is always active.

Self-Repairing (Ex)
The Box repairs itself at the rate of 100,000,000 HP/round. The Box is immune to effects that produce incurable or bleeding wounds, such as mummy rot, a sword with the wounding special ability, or a clay golem’s cursed wound ability.

It's not a creature, but has stats. Unfair?

[Jack_Simth]

... OK, this thread has been begging to be Godwinned for a long time now....

Spoiler

Show

Cleric-10/Dweomerkeeper-10.
Supernatural Spell(Miracle(Simulacrum)) to get a copy of a 40th level character who did the full pun-pun ascension, minus the hit dice increase, at level 18 - resulting in me having a fully ascended pun-pun.
The pun-pun clone then, knowing with it's infinite knowledge checks that it is doomed if it doesn't act, uses the Greater Arcane Fusion / Sanctum Spell / Celerity loop to gain infinite actions, and it's infinite reach to scour the multiverse for a Sphere of Annihilation, which it then picks up (void disciple ability to avoid the drawbacks of touching a Sphere), and manuevers with it's infinite reach and infinite actions through various naturally-occurring portals, until the point at which Pun-Pun is in range to throw the Sphere into the box, taking 11 on the attack roll thanks to the Aura of Perfect Order from the Tome of Battle: Book of Nine Swords.

Cube is not immune to a Sphere of Annihilation, and nothing about the spire negates artifacts, so cube is gone (and cannot be brought back).

[rockdeworld]

Well, I think that works. On a side note, that's probably the coolest use of Pun-Pun I've seen.

And naturally, Pun-Pun can just give himself "The Box is destroyed" as an ability, no matter what The Box can do. The only counter I can imagine is immunity to Spheres of Annihilation and Ex, Su, and Spell-like abilities. But that's not very elegant.

Arcanist, does that beat your Stuffy Doll too?

[TuggyNE]

Well, I think that works. On a side note, that's probably the coolest use of Pun-Pun I've seen.

With ice assassin in use, that's quite literal.

[One Step Two]

I wouldn't mind facing the next incarnation of the stuffy doll.