Overwatch: Boop!

[Togath]

Heh~
It was kind of fun trying her on the map. With so many little paths to take, it's easy to get behind the enemy to flank them, disable health packs, and weaken active-heavy characters like Reinhardt, Bastion, and Zarya!~

[Morty]

There are few feelings of being utterly doomed as deep as the one you encounter when you see Widowmaker, Hanzo, Junkrat and Torbjorn in your team on attack.

[Togath]

The Junkrat doesn't really seem a negative.

[The_Jackal]

The Junkrat doesn't really seem a negative.

He's one of those heroes that gets worse the better the opposition. Even by the time you're in Gold, he's got a low pick rate and a mediocre win rate.

[Morty]

It's not that he's bad, at least on the level I play at. He's just a cherry on top of the cake that is having the other three on attack.

[cobaltstarfire]

There are few feelings of being utterly doomed as deep as the one you encounter when you see Widowmaker, Hanzo, Junkrat and Torbjorn in your team on attack.

Did someone eventually complain and get met with a "lol it's only quick play" ?

(I'm hoping that it wasn't competitive, cause that would be even more frustrating)

[Starwulf]

Speaking of "lol, it's quick play", had a guy tonight that was ticking off our entire team, was being ultra serious, and bitching everyone out for the tiniest mistakes, and then totally went off at the end of the game on us, half of us ended up muting him, and one of our teammates reported him. I mean, you should always to the best of your ability, and make smart character choices relative to the map you're on(ie: two snipers on an attack/payload map isn't very smart), but quick play isn't competitive, and sometimes people want to play with characters they aren't familiar with, or just are having an off-night, or just aren't that good, period. Going off on someone because you lost is pretty stupid(honestly, even in competitive, getting ticked off at your teammates because you lost is just as dumb, but slightly more forgivable, you really shouldn't join competitive until you have at least a little experience under your belt. I'm 59 and just now starting to consider giving it a whirl, but I doubt I'll seriously play it until next season when I have a fair amount more experience).

[cobaltstarfire]

I've never seen someone using "lol quickplay" as an excuse for being new or experimenting, it's always someone who is usually fairly good, who is just using quickplay as target practice, and who ignores the objective.

Honestly that "serious" guy would have probably earned a mute in competitive too. I'm not interested in listening to or playing with someone who does nothing but winge and provides little of strategic use over the comms.

[Morty]

Did someone eventually complain and get met with a "lol it's only quick play" ?

(I'm hoping that it wasn't competitive, cause that would be even more frustrating)

Nope. But I don't use mic, anyway.

[cobaltstarfire]

Who said anything about them using a mic to convey that message?

[Togath]

Kind fun highlight from today~
Turns out Hanzo is better than I expected on Low Gravity maps.

[Pendulous]

Welp, guess I'll practice more on Orisa, now that Roadhog got whined out of usefulness.

[Mutazoia]

Kind fun highlight from today~
Turns out Hanzo is better than I expected on Low Gravity maps.

It's not that Hanzo is better....it's just that everybody's who is airborne might as well be standing still. Although Hanzo's inta-kill arrows don't hurt matters.

Welp, guess I'll practice more on Orisa, now that Roadhog got whined out of usefulness.

Playing as Symetria yesterday, I got hooked by Roadhog 3 or 4 times, and survived his shotgun to the face each time. It definitely felt like he'd been nerfed all to hell....

[Peebles]

Playing as Symetria yesterday, I got hooked by Roadhog 3 or 4 times, and survived his shotgun to the face each time. It definitely felt like he'd been nerfed all to hell....

I noticed that last night too, hooked as Tracer and Mercy and survived both times, I even came out on top with Mercy against the poor Roadhog when his combo failed. I tried out Roadhog myself, and he feels like a sitting duck a little bit, the hooks only really good for the messing up your opponents positioning now, or using it's minor contact damage to finish off a fleeing enemy whilst you reload. He's certainly not too scary to play against anymore, at least at the fairly low Gold level I'm currently playing at.

[Mutazoia]

I noticed that last night too, hooked as Tracer and Mercy and survived both times, I even came out on top with Mercy against the poor Roadhog when his combo failed. I tried out Roadhog myself, and he feels like a sitting duck a little bit, the hooks only really good for the messing up your opponents positioning now, or using it's minor contact damage to finish off a fleeing enemy whilst you reload. He's certainly not too scary to play against anymore, at least at the fairly low Gold level I'm currently playing at.

I hate when dev's nerf characters in games. How hard is it, really, to just learn a character and learn/develop strategies to counter him/her? But, nope! Some one who can barely play, and only enjoys a game if his favorite character is the best option across the board, whines about his Hanzo getting killed by Roadhog's hook-shot, or Bastion's narrow shot spread, and everybody else has to play with a nerf football.

[The_Jackal]

I hate when dev's nerf characters in games. How hard is it, really, to just learn a character and learn/develop strategies to counter him/her? But, nope! Some one who can barely play, and only enjoys a game if his favorite character is the best option across the board, whines about his Hanzo getting killed by Roadhog's hook-shot, or Bastion's narrow shot spread, and everybody else has to play with a nerf football.

Welcome to playing McCree since, like, a year ago.

In all seriousness, the Roadhog nerf is big, but does not make him useless at all. He's got basically the same DPS as before, but he now can't waddle off by himself to solo the enemy team's back-line, to reliably kill targets with the hook he now needs to stay with his team. Also, he can still combo down 200 health heroes. His scrap gun damage tops out at 150 now, plus 30 for a hook, plus 30 for a melee immediately after the scrap gun shot to finish them off. That's 210. Also, his fire rate increase gives him a different advantage: He can now 2-shot most enemies faster. If you didn't kill an enemy with a single scrapgun hit, and needed a second one to finish the target off (not an impossible condition), the follow-up shot used to take a full second to fire. Now it's 0.7 seconds. That gives opponents less time to react, and lets you win some fights that you previously may not have.

Ironically, while Roadhog's pick rate has dropped since the patch went live, his win rate has gone up. Also, unlike everyone's favorite throw pick, Junkrat, Roadhog's win rate goes up as the SR of the game goes up. So yeah, 'Hog might not be good at doing the thing he used to do, but he's actually better for the players who stuck with him.

[gomipile]

Ironically, while Roadhog's pick rate has dropped since the patch went live, his win rate has gone up.

Is there information on what maps he's getting used on in that data? Hypothetically, if most of those picks were on Ilios: Well, and maybe Nepal: Sanctum, then those wins might only be due to parts of his kit that didn't get changed. Another way to say it is: if his pick rate has gone down while his win rate has gone up, it might be that he just isn't getting picked as much when there isn't an environmental hazard to take advantage of.

[The_Jackal]

Is there information on what maps he's getting used on in that data? Hypothetically, if most of those picks were on Ilios: Well, and maybe Nepal: Sanctum, then those wins might only be due to parts of his kit that didn't get changed. Another way to say it is: if his pick rate has gone down while his win rate has gone up, it might be that he just isn't getting picked as much when there isn't an environmental hazard to take advantage of.

Actually, I have to issue a correction, anyway. His competitive win rate is down along with his pick rate, it's only quick play where his win rate spiked, I suspect exactly for the reason you suggest. It's possible that Roadhog will need more tweaking, and this is an overnerf, but I'd definitely like to see any future improvements to his kit to improve his durability in lieu of his one-shot capability.

[Togath]

Was was the nerf? I haven't been keeping track of patch notes.

[BRC]

Was was the nerf? I haven't been keeping track of patch notes.

Roadhog's scattergun got more ammo, but each shot now deals less damage.

This makes him a bit more capable as a brawler, but his Hook+Gun combo is no longer a one-hit kill against most foes.

[Togath]

Hmm... interesting. Does he fire any faster? Or is there still the "oh fish!" moment if you miss a shot?

[chainer1216]

Hmm... interesting. Does he fire any faster? Or is there still the "oh fish!" moment if you miss a shot?

33% less damage, 30% rate of fire increase, 1 more ammo, 15% reduced head hitbox are the exact changes.

[Pendulous]

Welcome to playing McCree since, like, a year ago.

In all seriousness, the Roadhog nerf is big, but does not make him useless at all. He's got basically the same DPS as before, but he now can't waddle off by himself to solo the enemy team's back-line, to reliably kill targets with the hook he now needs to stay with his team. Also, he can still combo down 200 health heroes. His scrap gun damage tops out at 150 now, plus 30 for a hook, plus 30 for a melee immediately after the scrap gun shot to finish them off. That's 210. Also, his fire rate increase gives him a different advantage: He can now 2-shot most enemies faster. If you didn't kill an enemy with a single scrapgun hit, and needed a second one to finish the target off (not an impossible condition), the follow-up shot used to take a full second to fire. Now it's 0.7 seconds. That gives opponents less time to react, and lets you win some fights that you previously may not have.

Ironically, while Roadhog's pick rate has dropped since the patch went live, his win rate has gone up. Also, unlike everyone's favorite throw pick, Junkrat, Roadhog's win rate goes up as the SR of the game goes up. So yeah, 'Hog might not be good at doing the thing he used to do, but he's actually better for the players who stuck with him.

His dps was decreased by about 10%.

Here's the problem. Roadhog has two very, VERY specific shot ranges he has to be in. Avoiding those ranges normally is quite easy if you're familiar with him at all. Increasing hsi fire rate and decreasing his damage means nothing when he has to time his shots very specifically while in those ranges anyway, so you're never actually shooting that fast, unless you're loading into a shield, in which case, blah who cares. So while his shot speed increased, it really means nothing. His hook is designed to allow him a way to get enemies into ONE of those attack ranges easily.

I'm a bad player, and I know that. Before the patch, I had no problems with Roadhog. Yes, I got hooked and killed. I also got sniped, BS Hanzo-hits-you-in-the-leg-and-it-counts-as-a-headshot, pinned, and whatever else. But I dodged the hook almost every time I knew it was coming (a.k.a. actually looking at Hog). After that, he's a big target who has trouble dealing a lot of damage if you know where to stand.

And he's not even a tank. People say "oh, now he has to stay with the group". But he's not a tank. he has no alternative health, has no shields, and has no mobility. He's a non-moving, giant target who has to stop and wait for his hook to maybe hit. By then, he's dead.

[Mutazoia]

His dps was decreased by about 10%.

Here's the problem. Roadhog has two very, VERY specific shot ranges he has to be in. Avoiding those ranges normally is quite easy if you're familiar with him at all. Increasing hsi fire rate and decreasing his damage means nothing when he has to time his shots very specifically while in those ranges anyway, so you're never actually shooting that fast, unless you're loading into a shield, in which case, blah who cares. So while his shot speed increased, it really means nothing. His hook is designed to allow him a way to get enemies into ONE of those attack ranges easily.

I'm a bad player, and I know that. Before the patch, I had no problems with Roadhog. Yes, I got hooked and killed. I also got sniped, BS Hanzo-hits-you-in-the-leg-and-it-counts-as-a-headshot, pinned, and whatever else. But I dodged the hook almost every time I knew it was coming (a.k.a. actually looking at Hog). After that, he's a big target who has trouble dealing a lot of damage if you know where to stand.

And he's not even a tank. People say "oh, now he has to stay with the group". But he's not a tank. he has no alternative health, has no shields, and has no mobility. He's a non-moving, giant target who has to stop and wait for his hook to maybe hit. By then, he's dead.

Yes, Blizz really mis-classed the old boy. He should be an offencive hero, not a tank.

[Peebles]

Poor Roadhog. Not that I ever use him but still. He can keep Genji and Widowmaker company while me and Soldier get better acquainted.

Did they buff Zenyatta recently? I hadn't used him for a while, but in the last week or so I've been having real success with him, even in competitive. For whatever reason it feels like he hits like a sledgehammer now. He's still a pretty poor choice in a single healer set up, but as a healer/dps combo he can be quite scary.

I had a match last night where my Zenyatta held the Nepal sanctum point from Soldier, Ana, Junkrat and Widowmaker 4v1. Sure, they trickled in in pairs to make things a little easier, but I can't remember him ever being able to do that before. Just lucky head-shots possibly?

[Togath]

Kind of random lore pondering: Do you think Hammond might be who stole the Doomfists?

Also attempted recording a match... thoughts? Should I up the textures? My new recording setup seems to be able to handle in in a few short tests I did.
Also torn about framerate. On one hand, Overwatch comes with a 30 fps cap toggle, but I've seen a few 60fps videos...
...on the other hand, I'm not totally sure how stable my recordings would be at 60fps for this game(since my one recent attempt at recording at it in Overwatch happened while I was having internet issues), and while it might improve aiming reaction or something(which doesn't matter for a viewer), it also feels a little like it gives a bit of an uncanny valley effect to several characters... then again, maybe I'm just not used to it(though given how stretchy overwatch models can be when viewed in slow motion, it makes me wonder if that is the oddness I'm detecting).

In a shorter less wall of text way of sayin' stuff: I attempted to record some gameplay and would welcome feedback of any sort.

[Mutazoia]

Kind of random lore pondering: Do you think Hammond might be who stole the Doomfists?

Also attempted recording a match... thoughts? Should I up the textures? My new recording setup seems to be able to handle in in a few short tests I did.
Also torn about framerate. On one hand, Overwatch comes with a 30 fps cap toggle, but I've seen a few 60fps videos...
...on the other hand, I'm not totally sure how stable my recordings would be at 60fps for this game(since my one recent attempt at recording at it in Overwatch happened while I was having internet issues), and while it might improve aiming reaction or something(which doesn't matter for a viewer), it also feels a little like it gives a bit of an uncanny valley effect to several characters... then again, maybe I'm just not used to it(though given how stretchy overwatch models can be when viewed in slow motion, it makes me wonder if that is the oddness I'm detecting).

In a shorter less wall of text way of sayin' stuff: I attempted to record some gameplay and would welcome feedback of any sort.

Record at 30 fps. Most people won't really see much of a difference between 30 and 60 fps, and the smaller file size will be easier to stream on slower connections.

[Togath]

Not streaming, admittedly, but I am leaning towards 30fps. Means I can amp up other settings with less worry too.

[Mutazoia]

I must have rage-quit Overwatch a dozen times over the weekend, due to really bad team picks and/or no teamwork. At one point I was in a game in attack, on King's Row, and had 3 frikkin snipers on my team, and all 3 stayed in the window at the top of the spawn point (or just inside the front door, with no visibility) the entire game. Add a Genji that wouldn't move past the initial choke point, and tracer that kept trying to death-charge the defending Orisa (who was backed by the entire defending team).... After a a couple of minutes of this, I pretty much said **** this for a game of soldiers, switched from Orisa to Sombra, and just ran around the choke to the objective. Pulled their entire team back to defend the objective, and not one of my team members took advantage and pushed up.....must have been munchkin weekend or something....

[The_Jackal]

I must have rage-quit Overwatch a dozen times over the weekend, due to really bad team picks and/or no teamwork. At one point I was in a game in attack, on King's Row, and had 3 frikkin snipers on my team, and all 3 stayed in the window at the top of the spawn point (or just inside the front door, with no visibility) the entire game. Add a Genji that wouldn't move past the initial choke point, and tracer that kept trying to death-charge the defending Orisa (who was backed by the entire defending team).... After a a couple of minutes of this, I pretty much said **** this for a game of soldiers, switched from Orisa to Sombra, and just ran around the choke to the objective. Pulled their entire team back to defend the objective, and not one of my team members took advantage and pushed up.....must have been munchkin weekend or something....

Yeah, I had a dumpster weekend too. I chalk it up to summer break. More dumb kids online who refuse to employ teamwork, strategy, or even rudimentary tactics. Just barge forward into death, then respawn to try again. Had some good sniper games where the ham-heads were on the other team, which was fun, but I saw little correlation between my quality of play and the outcome of my games. Then towards Sunday night, I had a stretch of crappy aim (I find that my aim suffers after exercise, like really badly).