Overwatch: Boop!

[Starwulf]

Yeah, I had a dumpster weekend too. I chalk it up to summer break. More dumb kids online who refuse to employ teamwork, strategy, or even rudimentary tactics. Just barge forward into death, then respawn to try again. Had some good sniper games where the ham-heads were on the other team, which was fun, but I saw little correlation between my quality of play and the outcome of my games. Then towards Sunday night, I had a stretch of crappy aim (I find that my aim suffers after exercise, like really badly).

I honestly had the exact opposite experience for the weekend. Friday night on mystery heroes I won 6 out of 7 matches(6 straight, lost the 1st one), and I was on fire for the entire night, play of the game twice, set new records for most eliminations in a game for myself and most damage done in a map and most healing.

Then Sunday night had a bit rougher of a start, I personally couldn't string two kills together no matter how hard I tried at first, didn't help that the game kept giving me McCree, Hanzo and Widowmaker over and over again(I am just not a sniper, which sucks, because when my buddy was first getting me into the game, Hanzo was the character I wanted to play the most, but yeah...no, I suck at sniping). 4 games in a row I lost, and my best performance was with my most hated character, Winston(I may not be good with the aforementioned 3, but I flat out hate Winston, damn dirty ape!) where I managed to clear the point for our team(Control point: Ilios, the one where the point is next to the cliff on the outskirts of the seaside villa).

Then came the following 4 games where the game was a bit nicer character selection wise, and I started playing better, and won all 4 in a row, virtually no contest, and I got to witness my first D.Va team clearing wipe. Was on Defend:Hanamura, and their entire team was coming in from the right entrance at our 2nd control point with 12 seconds to go. Our D.Va threw her mech into the middle and killed all of them, it was glorious!

[Morty]

I think I'm slowly getting better at playing McCree. It helps that his ult is less suicidal now. I'm also getting better at D.Va, particularly using her boosters to flank and get out of danger.

[Rising Phoenix]

I think I'm slowly getting better at playing McCree. It helps that his ult is less suicidal now. I'm also getting better at D.Va, particularly using her boosters to flank and get out of danger.

That is not D.Vas role. The best use of D.Va is to protect your team mates with defense matrix/. Is there a tracer annoying your supports- by flashing DM you can ensure that she deals zero damage for 10 seconds or more. Pharmercy in the sky? Eat those damage boosted rockets. Winston diving the enemy? Defence, matrix him while he kills the squishies.


Out of DM matrix? Time to body block. etc...

Now if there's a Winston who you cannot DM the best thing is to ram him away from his target and pummel his face.

[Togath]

So another snippit of Doomfist lore... sounds like he's the next hero?

[Silverraptor]

So another snippit of Doomfist lore... sounds like he's the next hero?

That's what it seems to be hinting at. We may get another bad guy soon, given that it seems Reaper busted him out of prison.

[The_Jackal]

That's what it seems to be hinting at. We may get another bad guy soon, given that it seems Reaper busted him out of prison.

Doomfist main. I'm calling it now. If the ultimate is a giant punch with huge knockback, I'll be a happy, happy camper.

[Landis963]

Doomfist main. I'm calling it now. If the ultimate is a giant punch with huge knockback, I'll be a happy, happy camper.

How about if "Punch with knockback" is his primary fire? (Nothing's leaked, that's just my preference) Like Reinhardt, but more focused.

[The_Jackal]

How about if "Punch with knockback" is his primary fire? (Nothing's leaked, that's just my preference) Like Reinhardt, but more focused.

Wow, that would take a game which has, in my opinion, already way too much instant environmental death, and make it profoundly worse. Unless you're talking about low-level Reinhardt knockback, which is only sufficient to dislodge someone's aim, and not at all what I have in mind. What I have in mind is this:

[Togath]

Today's "dang, I should play more Mei" highlight/PoG.
Did I really chip off that mush health with the blizzard+m1? Or did I get more help than I realized there?

[Landis963]

Wow, that would take a game which has, in my opinion, already way too much instant environmental death, and make it profoundly worse. Unless you're talking about low-level Reinhardt knockback, which is only sufficient to dislodge someone's aim, and not at all what I have in mind. What I have in mind is this:

Oh yeah, that's totally ulti material. And I was thinking the right level of knockback for Doomfist's hypothetical punching primary fire would be like a lower-powered version of Pharah's concussion rocket. Just enough to knock them out of range of a second hit.

[The_Jackal]

Today's "dang, I should play more Mei" highlight/PoG.
Did I really chip off that mush health with the blizzard+m1? Or did I get more help than I realized there?

Blizzard does about 100 damage, and Mei's primary fire does 45 DPS. I thought I heard a Widow shot during the clip, so maybe one of your teammates landed a shot or two.

[Togath]

Taking a look, I think the widow shot was from the attacking team... I did notice the assists from junkrat though!~
Looks like he used the stun to get off a sticky mine.

[The_Jackal]

Taking a look, I think the widow shot was from the attacking team... I did notice the assists from junkrat though!~
Looks like he used the stun to get off a sticky mine.

Ah. Well, the answer to 'I should play Mei more is': Play the Hero you enjoy, but don't one-trick, because sometimes you need to be the one who tanks or heals. Mei isn't meta just now, mostly, I suspect, because with Winston, Tracer and Genji being in the meta, she can find it hard to keep somone under her freeze gun. That said, I do think she can be of use with smart play. Much like how she fared well against triple tank, she can productively split LOS between dive Heroes and their supports. She can also cause dive Heroes to burn mobility skills to disengage, lest they get frozen solid before they assasinate your supports.

Obviously, she's going to fare best as a stall/objective clear, with her amazing ultimate, and if you can get consistent with her right click, you'll go a long way toward making her a real threat.

[Togath]

I think my best two heroes are probably Pharah and Winston currently, followed by either Junkrat or Sombra as a third.
I'm okayish with all of the healers, but not especially good with any, except maybe Mercy? Kind of hard to judge there.
For other characters... my worst is Zarya, followed by Widowmaker and then Roadhog in third-to-last-place.
Everyone else is pretty okay, though my McCrea play tends to depend on the enemy team.

Plus I've tied right-click abilities to Q for everyone but Genji(Genji's is tied to T while his melee is Q) and Reinhardt, which seems to help me with using alt fires for characters like Mei more easily.

[Silverraptor]

Confirmed. It's Doomfist.

[Silverraptor]

And here is a video containing all of his abilities in action. I'm already thinking of making him one of my mains.

[BRC]

Doomfist looks cool, although I'm worried about his staying power. He's a hypermobile character who wants to get into melee, but he doesn't reload all at once, and his abilities have decent cooldowns. I could see overeager doomfists running out of gas quite quickly. His HP+shield generation might be enough to keep him going.

He might end up a Roadhog-style assassination character. Only he goes to the enemy instead of bringing them to him.

His Ult looks crazy, but it doesn't seem to be a killer the same way Reaper or Phara's ults are.

[The_Jackal]

Doomfist looks cool, although I'm worried about his staying power. He's a hypermobile character who wants to get into melee, but he doesn't reload all at once, and his abilities have decent cooldowns. I could see overeager doomfists running out of gas quite quickly. His HP+shield generation might be enough to keep him going.

He might end up a Roadhog-style assassination character. Only he goes to the enemy instead of bringing them to him.

His Ult looks crazy, but it doesn't seem to be a killer the same way Reaper or Phara's ults are.

I think he's going to be very good. He's a dive Hero with sustain in lieu of disengage ability, so he's not in the same vein as your usual crowd of flankers, who dive and retreat, he's going to jump in and wreck stuff in a team fight, knocking people around and building shields to keep him upright while finishing out the fight. I think he's going to have a lot of similarity to Reaper, only with a bit more mobility. It will be interesting to see what flank routes and tricks the pros will come up with to exploit his uppercut and seismic slam, as those will be the abilities he may use to overcome map geometry. That said, he's definitely not a tank, he'll need someone else to come in and initiate.

As for his Ultimate, it's got a stun component, and it's going to be much harder to avoid than, say Reinhardt's Earthshatter. I assume that a barrier will block the knockdown, but since he can place the reticle behind a barrier, it's going to make Dive stronger. We'll see.

[Rising Phoenix]

And here I was hoping that he'd be an answer to counter dive, not to further enable it... At least he's a bit like a pseudotank which is something we don't have another outside of mei.

Oh well, he should at least be easier to take out then tracer and genji as zen...I have about 50-50 to win 1v1 these flankers now...and about a 60% chance to kill pharmacy on my own as zen now...

[The_Jackal]

And here I was hoping that he'd be an answer to counter dive, not to further enable it... At least he's a bit like a pseudotank which is something we don't have another outside of mei.

Oh well, he should at least be easier to take out then tracer and genji as zen...I have about 50-50 to win 1v1 these flankers now...and about a 60% chance to kill pharmacy on my own as zen now...

I watched some Seagull play with him on PTR today, and some of it confirms my earlier assumptions. He's actually more mobile than I thought he'd be, so I make him out to be kind of half Reaper, Half Genji. His passive is pretty non-exciting. It's a win more mechanic, and not much of one. The only thing that's worth noting is that using his ultimate also charges his passive, so you can land a big ult, you're going to a) wipe somone off the board, and b) charge up a nice meaty shield. I'm kind of curious to learn how his passive interacts witth healing. If it continues to maintain your shield (not make it last forever, but repairs shield points like your health bar got longer), that could make a nice Tandem with Zen or Lucio. One thing to know is that his charge/punch can REALLY send you flying, so there's definitely potential to flank with that.

Another interesting point is his left click a.k.a, his knuckle-shotgun has no reload, it just automatically earns charges (like Tracer's Blink). On the one hand, that's bad, because you can't take a moment to reload. On the other hand, it's nice, because you don't need to use any time to reload. I like the range on it currently. It's pretty decent damage, maybe lower total damage than Torb's right click, but with marginally better reach. It's good for having a button to press while your other abilities come off cooldown, and also to finish off enemies who are low on health and are trying to get away.

I think he's going to raise the profile of Pharah-Mercy even more, especially at low SR, and will also bolster adoption of Sombra. Sombra really is the answer to flankers and dive. Denying health kits is a lot more disruptive to flankers, and hacking can leave divers vulnerable to being surrounded and killed. I also think McCree may benefit from his introduction too, because he's a good close-ranged enforcer who can flash/fan Doomfist out of his rhythm. Of course, I still think McCree's flashbang needs a bit of love, either in the form of a slightly longer stun, or shorter cooldown, or negation of target momentum, or something. We'll see.

[Rising Phoenix]

Stuff I agree with.

Pharmacy is a problem. Though in diamond at least discord and a single hitscan that can land shots really mitigates her as an issue.

I think that the dive meta is more of a problem now as it has made the defence heroes obsolete. Mei can be really good against the dive tanks, but considering that most of the team is WITH their dive tanks she cannot do much which is unfortunate.

Likewise torb can be good, but a coordinated effort usually takes care of that.

Orisa+ Rein+ Torn can also be very good against dive. But you can easily counter that by playing pharam...or bringing out an attack bastion.

[The_Jackal]

Pharmacy is a problem. Though in diamond at least discord and a single hitscan that can land shots really mitigates her as an issue.

Yeah, I've been putting practice in on Widow specifically for shutting down Pharah, with middling success. She just bobs so unpredictably.

I think that the dive meta is more of a problem now as it has made the defence heroes obsolete. Mei can be really good against the dive tanks, but considering that most of the team is WITH their dive tanks she cannot do much which is unfortunate.

Mei's kit is really built around her wall, which makes her good for splitting teams in a choke, but not so great for countering dive comps.

Likewise torb can be good, but a coordinated effort usually takes care of that.

Torb is good versus uncoordinated teams, I haven't seen him do very well versus ones that can execute. Torb's turret is good for Area denial on your turret, it is true, but the turret is still very vulnerable, and can be neutralized with good positioning on most maps. I think the best counter-dive Heroes are actually D.va and Winston, who are, ironically, dive heroes themselves. What do I mean? Well, they have the facility to put down effects that can protect your supports and DPS for a time, and buy time for your own team to clean house. That's actually one thing Doomfist might accomplish: Deliver strong damage that ignores shields and matrix, and use knockback effects to disrupt the flow of a Dive comp.

Orisa+ Rein+ Torn can also be very good against dive. But you can easily counter that by playing pharam...or bringing out an attack bastion.

Orisa can peel. I'm not so sure about Rein. Tracer runs circles around him, it's honestly impossible to survive Tracer in open ground when you're Reinhardt. Also, don't sell Roadhog short. He doesn't have the one-shot flanker potential, but his scrap gun can still wreck barriers, and he can rip D.va out of position, or stop a Tracer or Genji cold. He will probably get some buffs (i'm hoping to his ammunition well, so he's got more sustain), and may be the piece that can pull apart the current meta.

Here's the thing: While I agree that composition is important, I think that Jeff Kaplan is right: The pro meta isn't the game. The bast majority of competitive play, and the game needs to be fun for everyone, or there won't be a pro scene.

In unrelated news, I got my first Sombra back-cap tonight. Feels good, man.

[Mouse@GBN]

Off-topic: Can I please have a match with doomfist? Please?

[Geno9999]

I'm kind of curious to learn how his passive interacts witth healing. If it continues to maintain your shield (not make it last forever, but repairs shield points like your health bar got longer), that could make a nice Tandem with Zen or Lucio.

It behaves more like the temporary shields you get from Lucio's Sound Barrier, except decays slower. So that means that while healing won't recharge or stop the shields from decaying, the healing will be protected by the shields.

That aside I've been practicing with Winston a little bit when I can't play with Doomfist (well, a lot since 1 hero limit,) and... I am getting confused everytime I kill the enemy Doomfist. Are they diving too hard? Is my tickle gun damage too much for them?

[Spore]

I love that out thread is named "Boop" which insinuates a small soft touch of the face. Yet the newest hero now is someone who would do ANYTHING but that.

[gomipile]

Jeff Kaplan wrote a long post in a forum thread about the meta and balance.
https://us.battle.net/forums/en/overwatch/topic/20757706588?page=2#post-24

One thing he said was "I know the desire – and mine too – is that during every match of Overwatch all 25 heroes are viable at any time. "

I, for one, don't desire precisely that as the definition for every hero to be viable. I have a different definition.

I'd like every hero to be able to be successfully mained (not necessarily one-tricked) in every bracket from bronze to top 500. By that I mean that a competent player of any SR can at least maintain their SR in their current bracket for the entire season while keeping their favorite hero at the top of their current season hours played list for the entire season, no matter what their favorite hero is.

[The_Jackal]

Jeff Kaplan wrote a long post in a forum thread about the meta and balance.
https://us.battle.net/forums/en/over...page=2#post-24

One thing he said was "I know the desire – and mine too – is that during every match of Overwatch all 25 heroes are viable at any time. "

I, for one, don't desire precisely that as the definition for every hero to be viable. I have a different definition.

I'd like every hero to be able to be successfully mained (not necessarily one-tricked) in every bracket from bronze to top 500. By that I mean that a competent player of any SR can at least maintain their SR in their current bracket for the entire season while keeping their favorite hero at the top of their current season hours played list for the entire season, no matter what their favorite hero is.

Really, 'viable' is a lexical minefield. The truth is, there's always going to be stronger and weaker compositions, and there's always going to be a metagame. Part of the reason for that is that certain Heroes and combinations are incredibly unfun and static. So, you need a Hero like Junkrat to counter cheese, to keep the game from being dominated by it. Junkrat is never, EVER going to be a dominant Hero in top-tier play, he's in the lineup to neutralize camping tactics.

[Morty]

This was a fun game. It started with four offence characters, me as Winston and a Hanzo. No one switched to a healer throughout the whole game. One of my teammates suggested it, but then added they're doing well as Genji. We still put up a good fight, Quick Play being what it is. And this time, someone did say "it's just quick play".

[NeoVid]

Huh. Turns out early testing by pro players has Doomfist pegged as an anti-dive character. With the loss of Roadhog as a counter to Winston and DVa, it turns out Doomy can cover Hog's old spot as a defender. He can straight beat down DVa without having to think about Matrix, and he's got more than one way to knock Winston right out of his shield bubble. He can stun/oneshot the squishier flankers, and Genji can't reflect his stun like he could with the hook. We could be seeing Doomfist+McCree as the core of anti-dive.

Though I still want Roadhog to be playable again.

[The_Jackal]

Really, 'viable' is a lexical minefield. The truth is, there's always going to be stronger and weaker compositions, and there's always going to be a metagame. Part of the reason for that is that certain Heroes and combinations are incredibly unfun and static. So, you need a Hero like Junkrat to counter cheese, to keep the game from being dominated by it. Junkrat is never, EVER going to be a dominant Hero in top-tier play, he's in the lineup to neutralize camping tactics.

I know I'm quoting myself, but I have run across a very incisive video from a top player who explains the fundamental problems with having a 'personal stats' system that players can game:



Effectively, this system is specifically designed to pad up SR representation of every Hero, even the ones that do really badly at high levels of play. That's why I'm skeptical of Gomipile's definition of 'viable'. Not because I don't agree with the sentiment (that you ought to be able to maintain a high SR with your favorite Hero, if you're dedicated and demonstrate skill), but because Blizzard has effectively put their thumb on the scale. In effect, you're not competing against other players, you're competing against other players who play your main.