My DM has killed my character 2x in the last 5 sessions

[mehs]

When I was level 3, I cast command undead on a zombie, not knowing that apparently all necromancy is illegal in the town I was in. At 7-8th level, we had just finished fighting a mature adult white dragon (cr 12) the previous day and had forced him to sign a magically binding contract of servitude. Then a high level ranger (I think 12-14) came with a group of 20 orcs one or two of which were also high level spellcasters. He came to take me prisoner. The rest of the party (mostly the GM PC) decided to not fight and just hand me over. I feel I need to say that we weren't even on the same plane of existence as when we were low level. After a kangaroo court my character was executed.

Then instead of going to the after life, Lucifer had snagged my soul and made me help him . Basically he said that apophis was breaking out of his prison and he wanted me to negotiate a treaty with the 2 fey courts. I went over there and it was going well, until the winter knight killed the (lesser) winter Queen and framed me. Then the winter and summer knight (both cr 22) chased me across 2 or 3 planes of existence. The Sumer knight (level 15 cleric nymph) even summoned a glabrezu on me with planar ally. The glabrezu summoned a vrock on me which I killed easily enough, and later when the glabrezu fought me I ran it off. Then I got the the home of an ally Lucifer told me to go to and fought the summer knight. I was a level 5 wizard rainbow servant 4, but the cleric had nothing to fight a flying invisible enemy while webbed. Somehow.
The winter knight had allied with me earlier and he tried the kill the summer knight (after I told him to take her prisoner) and he revealed to me that he had crucified a friend I made earlier. I ran off (Lucifer plane shifted me) and healed the friend (she was almost dead but not all dead) and I ran off the winter knight (4 allips surrounding him).

Then I rode off of the GM PC's grandmother (the ally Lucifer told me about and an ancient red dragon) and busted the rest of the party out of slavery. We then had a nice base(the gold mine the others were enslaved at) I wanted to set up, but GM PC insisted on going back to the material plane (where we were wanted criminals) and he immediately picked up a quest to stop some vampires in London. Just to repeat, we had almost no equipment and he wanted to go hunting vampires in a major city (should also point out the setting of the campaign is modern day earth). I spent 3 days shopping for equipment and summoning outsiders then another 2 days summoning outsiders to guard home base and scout for vampires (final tally was 9 courses, 7 mustevals, 4 equinals, and 4 hound archons). The party got attacked by a vampire about day 2 but it wasn't the only vampire so we were still hired. Then we were in a hotel room, we got a knock on the door and there was a guy wearing a full Victorian age get up and a guy Fawkes mask. I looked at him with variety of divinations but got no result, then I dispel magic which kind of got a result, then I cut the the chase and did halt undead which worked. There was a fight (4 vampire wolves showed up next round and freed him from halt undead) and eventually GM PC and other player decided to hear what he had to say and let him go. The he came back in the middle of the night and kidnapped me and vampirised me. Even when he took the gag off and I tried to cast teleport, it auto failed because he just put the gag back on (I don't know how that works). And I want to remind you, I was surrounded by 24 outsiders and was glowing like the sun (greater luminous armor) when he kidnapped me.

As it is now, me letting the vampire go made the god I worship (Anubis) not like me anymore and I have lost my 4 levels of rainbow servant except for the caster level. The GM doesn't even allow retraining so those are just 4 empty levels now.

Both times it is because the GM PC is telling me to not fight the enemy and it almost directly leads to the guy I am told to not fight killing me.

Other partially related grevence is that I am only level 9 still. The glabrezu gave half xp because he ran away and I didn't get any from the knights I beat slash made to run away (which were cr 22). Even then, the GM is making 2 different math errors (and knows it) so that I am still level 9 instead of level 10.


Gggaaaaaahhhhhhhhhhh

[ATHATH]

Have you talked with your DM about this?

[EldritchWeaver]

Have you talked with your DM about this?

I agree. The OP describes what might be a DM who likes to railroad and is a jerk. Not sure how he managed to survive enemies with a CR more than twice his own level, but forcing the OP into situations, where he is being punished with no way to rectify the situation, is not a sign of good DM. Find out, why the DM acts like this and be prepared that the reasons might be bad enough that leaving the group is the better choice.

[mehs]

should note that the GM is horrible about making actual challenges against a wizard. the vrock, glabrezu, summer knight, and winter knight fights were each on separate days. I knew about them with a couple days of in game warning (saw the summer knight summoned the glabrezu). And I am a wizard. There were no other fights or encounters. Mostly I just scribed some pertinent scrolls, adjusted my daily spell selection accordingly, and such. Oh and the dragon? we had a month of in game warning about that one as we were a going dragon hunting.

Because of this he is arguing I am over powered. I honestly did not know that the nymph cleric couldn't do anything against a flying invisible enemy pot shotting enervations. That surprised me.

[Demidos]

Honestly, it sounds like you have far more system mastery than your own DM. Your DM doesn't know the standard counters to the various techniques you are using, and is ramping up the NPCs to try to give you a challenge, only to be frustrated and railroad you when he cannot present your character with a significant threat.

I base this on that....

• Given what you described, it sounds like you are using the interpretation of rainbow servant that has full casting (since text trumps table), are using powerful spells like web, fly, luminous armor, and planar binding to their full effect, and can easily deal with threats far above your CR.
• On the other hand, your DM is not only obviously railroading, but sends threats far above your CR that are still incapable of subduing you or even causing you too much effort. Based on some shameful early memories from my own DMing days, this sounds entirely familiar....

Now, it's up to you how you want to handle this, but the options that come to mind are...

• Show him the forums, the standard lists of equipment, the relevant spells at each level, and let him learn how to present you with threats. I find this unlikely to work, simply because there is so much work going into system mastery in D&D that it becomes a labor of years, and not really feasible to force someone to learn.
• Ramp down your character's power level. This is probably the easiest fix to introduce, since it only depends on you. Play some limited character like a wild-shape ranger, binder, or incarnate, and turn your system mastery to making them a useful party member rather than allowing yourself the frankly insane power of a wizard. This way your DM feels like he is doing a good job at challenging you, while still preserving your ability to play. If he continues railroading, perhaps there is a different issue at work.
• Offer to DM. This means that you have the chance to demonstrate how to properly use different characters at different levels. Offer to show the players the character sheets once they defeat a given foe if they want to scavenge the builds to learn new tricks. This improves everyone's system mastery. A good option, imho.
• Quit the game. Maybe not a fun option, but if there is an adversarial relationship between you (as suggested by the xp mismanagement comment) then maybe it's for the best. If you want to continue the game, however, try to have an honest talk about what's going wrong in the game, and you may have to play something more easy to manage if he cannot deal with your ideas. Try to be patient, not everyone is good at optimization.

[RazorChain]

Jeez, you newbies. Just listen to the DM PC and do what he tells you

[mehs]

Listening to the DM PC is what is getting me killed both times though? The vampire who killed me the 2nd time even lampshaded it that I shouldn't have listened to the other people and should've continued trying to kill the vampire.

[EldritchWeaver]

Text in blue is meant sarcastically.

[mehs]

oh ok. what other color codes are there or is that deviating from topic too much?

[dethkruzer]

I'll be frank, your DM sounds like an adversarial, incompetent dickwaffle. If a high-level nymph cleric cannot wipe a floor with a ECL 9 wizard, then either that nymph has taken a vow of poverty and/or is an idiot. All I see is a bunch of mismanagement, railroading, and egregious amounts of DM fiat. Let me guess, the DMPC is a Mary Sue/Gary Stu?

[DeTess]

oh ok. what other color codes are there or is that deviating from topic too much?

Blue is the only official one as far as I know, but there are rumors of a purple color used to indicate something being suggested is (Lawful) evil.

[Kaerou]

I'll be frank, your DM sounds like an adversarial, incompetent dickwaffle. If a high-level nymph cleric cannot wipe a floor with a ECL 9 wizard, then either that nymph has taken a vow of poverty and/or is an idiot. All I see is a bunch of mismanagement, railroading, and egregious amounts of DM fiat. Let me guess, the DMPC is a Mary Sue/Gary Stu?

This.

Its called CoD-zilla for a reason. Clerics have plenty of options to deal with both invisibility and flying.

It sounds like your GM can't handle what sounds like 3rd ed / pathfinder spellcasters. I always found spellcasters the easiest to deal with in my games but apparently he keeps letting you prepare.

My advice is to talk with him and dont rant about it and be prepared to switch characters.

What you mentioned sounds like no fun for you or your party who are apparently sat twiddling their thumbs while you get all these solo adventures?

[dethkruzer]

Also, what is up with basically depowering OPs rainbow servant levels? Based on what OP said, can you really interpret that as anything other than the DM punishing a player for his own inability to create a challenge without breaking several rules?

[War_lord]

Leave the game, poor DMing can be corrected, malevolent DMing cannot. At some point this DM decided it was all your fault, I doubt anything you do will change that.

[Prince Gimli]

I second the people suggesting that you talk to the DM about this.

I get the feeling that he feels he's in way over his head, and may be getting insecure/nervous about that fact. A combination of being nervous, and being confused are probably what lead to these rather...desperate measures you describe. "Oh help what do I do - I'll just take his rainbow servant casting away!" Something like that I imagine happening there.

So I'd reccommend gently (and a bit firmly, if necessary) talking to him about it, explain how you feel, and possibly offer him help with all the mechanics. For example, you can ask him what he is trying to do with a certain encounter, and help him design one. If he says "I want to make an encounter with a dragon/demons/orcs/whatever", you could help him design an encounter appropriate for your party. Or whatever else it is he needs/wants help with.

Furthermore, if he is willing to learn, there are plenty of resources out there with advice for new DMs, both on the internet, and of course books like the DMG and DMG 2.

And maybe he'd have an easier time, and enjoy it more, to DM for lower level characters, so he can learn the ropes at a gentler pace

EDIT: In response to the idea of malevolence, if it turns out he is not willing to learn, and is just simply choosing to be a jerk, then yes, I would consider leaving the game as well. But I'd still reccommend talking to him about it first, and see how that goes :).

[mehs]

Near the beginning, we fought some cultist who were wearing amulets of what at first were 50 uses of command undead per day. After I burst out laughing after saying are you sure about that a few times, they were changed to once per day enervation. At level 4. Recently they were changed to 3 uses of enervation period (at level 9) after I mentioned that I wasn't keeping track of usages since I had combined 5 which according to pricing formulas, makes it at will. Well, makes it have the same cost of an at will item and therefore I can and did make it into an at will item.


That should give you all an idea of what I'm working with.


He has also gotten really passive aggressiveness about posting "dm is always right" and "story is more important" memes.

Oh and clarification, he took the class features like the wings, domain access, wings, and detect chaos slash evil away. I still have the caster levels

[DeTess]

Near the beginning, we fought some cultist who were wearing amulets of what at first were 50 uses of command undead per day. After I burst out laughing after saying are you sure about that a few times, they were changed to once per day enervation. At level 4. Recently they were changed to 3 uses of enervation period (at level 9) after I mentioned that I wasn't keeping track of usages since I had combined 5 which according to pricing formulas, makes it at will. Well, makes it have the same cost of an at will item and therefore I can and did make it into an at will item.


That should give you all an idea of what I'm working with.

I can understand if he got angry about this if you did the combining without asking him. Those price-lists are guidelines, after all, and subject to DM fiat. I'm not saying that your DM is in the right with the rest that he's done, but actions like these aren't making things any easier for him.

Edit: based on this, it seems like you're working with a very inexperienced DM. I suggest you follow the suggestions about talking to him and helping him. If you instead continue trying to wring every bit of power out of the rules without helping the DM understand the game better, then both you and him will continue to have a bad time.

[Geddy2112]

When I was level 3, I cast command undead on a zombie, not knowing that apparently all necromancy is illegal in the town I was in.

Not exactly blaming you for this, but most civilized worlds and settings frown on necromancy as it is inherently evil and totally messed up. It is pretty much common knowledge/fair to assume that necromancy is illegal in more places than it is legal. I will throw your DM a bone here; playing stupid games generally wins you stupid prizes.

The rest of the party (mostly the GM PC) decided to not fight and just hand me over...GM PC's grandmother (the ally Lucifer told me about and an ancient red dragon)...GM PC insisted on going back to the material plane (where we were wanted criminals) and he immediately picked up a quest... GM PC is telling me to not fight the enemy and it almost directly leads to the guy I am told to not fight killing me.

Here is the problem. 99% of the time, a GMPC is a red flag for an awful game/DM. The GMPC is the star, and runs the game, you are along for the ride. Being a wizard and killing powerful creatures and being a wizard is making it worse, so the DM is fiat limiting your power and having their Marty Stu(their grandmother is a red dragon, and convinently an ally of yours. Marty Stu confirmed) railroad the game.

Unless the party needs a 3rd/4th member, there is no excuse for a DMPC, and even then the DMPC has to be used very carefully or things like this happen. Leave the game.

[mehs]

We only have 2 players aside from GM PC, though we do each have 2 characters ( my other character was forcibly and almost literally put on a bus after he got sick and tired after apophis cultists kept on attacking us up the the point of the avatar of apophis coming into our apartment office and summoning 2 black dragons. He burnt their hq down a bit by accident and killed enough to level quite a bit. To 10. We were level 5. At that point we were using gestalts and mythic tiers from pathfinder (I had read that 2 tiers roughly equaled 1 level but I didn't know the rule of thumb that you should only be able to take a tier every other level) that one was my fault and he got nerfed. He then did it again without the tiers. He got nerfed again. He then got put on a bus. (Invisible rogue against a bunch of wizards using fireball). He is now a bard and I haven't gotten to play him for a couple months. We are no longer using gestalts.


Oh and he now has 2 gm PC's. The other one is a wizard. And get this, the zombie I used command undead on? It was his. the side quest was to apprehend him and he tried to run away using zombie to cover his retreat. I cast the spell then critiqued the reanimation and decomposition. we then hid the guy when the cops (who would later kangaroo court me) came busting through the windows (when they were the ones who posted the bounty for him). We later decapped the zombie, I cast sentry skull on the skull and he lived in the fridge for a bit. We named him boris. The guy, who was an assassin for the apophis cult is a NG necromancer. Peer pressure so says the GM.

I will now gripe how he gets to do that and be NG but being made into a vampire auto makes me evil.

[Deophaun]

There is no such thing as a DMPC; there are only bags of XP and loot pinatas.

[dethkruzer]

that one was my fault and he got nerfed. He then did it again without the tiers. He got nerfed again. He then got put on a bus. (Invisible rogue against a bunch of wizards using fireball). He is now a bard and I haven't gotten to play him for a couple months. We are no longer using gestalts.

This is till within the same game?

[Geddy2112]

Well, part of your problem is not enough players. Go recruit some coworkers/classmates/friends/family/roommates/random idiots to join your group. You can put a really positive spin on it to your DM for retiring the DMPC's

"Hey, I know running a game and controlling 2 characters on top of everything else is super hard, and I know a party of two is too small so you wanted us to have friends. Now that we have Joe Blow and Jane Lane joining our group, you don't have to run DMPC's and work as hard, taking a load off your shoulders" or something like that.

As best I understand is that you were supposed to attack/apprehend the DMPC, so you tried to, and died? Sounds pretty bad, but you were screwed from the beginning on that one. A white necromancer I understand, and being undead is inherently evil, but again, sounds pretty bad. I would really probably just leave the game or DM yourself(find some more mooks).

No gaming is better than bad gaming, and even with more players, a lot of these problems would probably persist.

[Mastikator]

He came to take me prisoner. The rest of the party (mostly the GM PC) decided to not fight and just hand me over. I feel I need to say that we weren't even on the same plane of existence as when we were low level. After a kangaroo court my character was executed.

This sounds like straight up bullying, I have no idea why your DM thinks this kind of behavior is even remotely acceptable. It's not. It's so far over the line you can't even see the line. You should demand a sincere apology from your DM to be honest.

Though if I were you I'd take the DM aside and ask him if he wants me to quit the group. Anything less than a "nononono please this is a misunderstanding" would be interpreted as a "yes but I'm too much of a spineless coward to say it"

Gggaaaaaahhhhhhhhhhh

Agreed.

[Velaryon]

This definitely sounds like a case of an inexperienced DM using increasingly ham-fisted attempts to try and rein in a PC whose power he cannot handle. Between the presence of GMPC's, multiple nerfs and stripping abilities away from the character, killing by fiat, etc., they are definitely not someone with a strong mastery of the system, and likely not a lot of experience as a DM either.

As others have suggested, you've got to talk to the DM about the issues you're having. You might suggest tactics that can be used to combat your character fairly, or show them a few optimization tricks they can use, or ask for feedback on what you may be doing as a player that they're having trouble with.

Blue is the only official one as far as I know, but there are rumors of a purple color used to indicate something being suggested is (Lawful) evil.

Blue text is not official - I cannot find it, but The Giant has expressly said that using blue text to indicate sarcasm is purely voluntary and should not be treated as a rule or even something people are strongly encouraged to do. The only one that may be official is moderators posting in red while acting in their official capacity.

[mehs]

I have repeatedly tried to tell him that if he keeps on doing one encounter per in game day, I will continue to wipe the floor with whatever he sends at me because I can then afford to go high burn. Even this was soundly denied.

What happened with the npc that later became the second gmpc was we were suppose to capture him but I level 1 suggestion spell (spell that just causes a thought in someone's mind, will save to realize it is a spell) ed him to come back and talk. a bit after that the men in black came bursting in and arrested everyone. Mostly thinking that we would be arrested if we were found to be connected to him (even though we were on a bounty to capture him set by the men in black. seriously they subcontracted it to bounty hunters then decided to bust in and do it themselves), I covered for him and he lived at our place for a while.

I checked and he actually posted fewer passive aggressive "dm is always right" memes than I thought. they just stuck out in my mind and he reused some a few times.

Oh and with the bard rogue (bard now) that was put on a bus, he is level 11, is my other character's brother, knows that he died, and is about to go on a roaring rampage of revenge which should be unnecessary if either the rest of the party manage a decent plan or my plan works.

[Arbane]

Blue is the only official one as far as I know, but there are rumors of a purple color used to indicate something being suggested is (Lawful) evil.

Well, basically, purple text indicates QUALITY Gming advice. (Specifically, bad quality.)

OP: This game you're in sounds hilarious from the outside, and (I'm willing to bet) immensely frustrating from the inside. The three best bits of advice have already been given:

a: Talk to your GM.
b: If they just hate you/your character, RUN AWAY.
c: If they're just unable to deal with your character, play another one, and try to rope in some more players.

Offer to GM, maybe?

[War_lord]

This definitely sounds like a case of an inexperienced DM using increasingly ham-fisted attempts to try and rein in a PC whose power he cannot handle. Between the presence of GMPC's, multiple nerfs and stripping abilities away from the character, killing by fiat, etc., they are definitely not someone with a strong mastery of the system, and likely not a lot of experience as a DM either.

As others have suggested, you've got to talk to the DM about the issues you're having. You might suggest tactics that can be used to combat your character fairly, or show them a few optimization tricks they can use, or ask for feedback on what you may be doing as a player that they're having trouble with.

See, the reason I disagree with this advice, and why my advice was to quit the game, is that it's not really a problem with experience. An inexperienced DM makes mistakes, an inexperienced DM has trouble with encounter design.

An inexperienced DM doesn't make the entire game revolve around their DMPC (never mind two), an inexperienced DM doesn't autokill players, an inexperienced DM doesn't spend large amounts of table time trying to humiliate one player for supposedly bringing an OP character. An jerk does that, and a person being a jerk is usually beyond changing with some simple advice. This person isn't (just) a bad DM, they're a toxic personality.

[RazorChain]

We only have 2 players aside from GM PC, though we do each have 2 characters ( my other character was forcibly and almost literally put on a bus after he got sick and tired after apophis cultists kept on attacking us up the the point of the avatar of apophis coming into our apartment office and summoning 2 black dragons. He burnt their hq down a bit by accident and killed enough to level quite a bit. To 10. We were level 5.

Damn....that was a big office if 2 black dragons fit in it. I gather they were small ones?

OP: This game you're in sounds hilarious from the outside, and (I'm willing to bet) immensely frustrating from the inside. The three best bits of advice have already been given:

Oh yes I'm having a lot of fun with what happens in that game....sounds like a bunch of 13 year olds with penchant for mythology

[mehs]

Young CR 7 I believe. The office was/is basically a studio apartment, I think 100 by 40 feet. similar.

[RazorChain]

Young CR 7 I believe. The office was/is basically a studio apartment, I think 100 by 40 feet. similar.

a 4000 square feet studio apartment, the rent must have been absurd. I would have changed it into a regular flat, much better value if you have multiple rooms