LGBT people in the playground

[Kaelaroth]

@SMEE: At 6'2'', I feel your pain. Lousy above average height...

Yeah, but that grants you so many advantages. With the right clothes and make-up, you can look imperious, imposing, divine, intimidating... height grants many things small folk can only dream of. Hopefully I'll get up to at least 6 foot...

I've been having urges to try out make-up. I don't want to go crazy, or plaster myself in face paint, just to experiment, especially with eyeshadow (mainly kohl). I'm also planning to experiment with dyeing my hair at some point in the near future. I'm not trying to be perceived as a woman, I'd just like to see how I'd look, and refresh myself a bit. Can anyone suggest good ways to start? Or is this the wrong thread for this?

[V.Z.]

Well, I've told my friend about my pansexuality. I was nervous like never before, but it looks like there was no reason to be afraid. He, (as actually expected), told me he wasn't uncomfortable with it and was glad to have me as his friend. I am feeling so incredibly relieved right now! I've told a friend, he was cool with it, nothing has changed between us. I feel so, strengthened. This is to me one of my greatest victories and I think it'll greatly help me in telling it to other people close to me.

I want to say again to him: Thank you so much for being such an awesome and understanding friend! You're the best! *hugs* And I also want to thank everyone here who has supported me. I couldn't have done it with out you! Thank you, everyone, from the bottom of my heart! *hugs everyone*

[VeisuItaTyhjyys]

Clothes do in fact make the man. In fact, I had this argument before in the context of Fable. Which is to say that if you're wearing something dark and gloomy, you're one way, and if you're wearing something bright and cheery, you're personality may change. If only slightly. I mean, take the most gothic kid you know, put him in a Polo Shirt and khakis, and he will seem somewhat different. Uncomfortable. You know?

Why? The cut or feel of the gothic clothes and the polo shirt don't differ too much, that should make no difference in self-perception, right? Wrong, because part of how you perceive yourself is how you feel others perceive you.

Actually, I find polo shirts straight-up uncomfortable to wear precisely because of the way they are cut. They're effectively a collared tee-shirt, and something about that is wholly bothersome. The sleeves should be long or there should be buttons. The hideous chaimera of two garments that form a polo shirt was not a good hybridization, in my opinion.
I'm also quite glad you picked by far the easiest group to stereoytpe incorrectly on preference of dress and ran with it to try and make your point. Like trousers like brain!

I've been having urges to try out make-up. I don't want to go crazy, or plaster myself in face paint, just to experiment, especially with eyeshadow (mainly kohl). I'm also planning to experiment with dyeing my hair at some point in the near future. I'm not trying to be perceived as a woman, I'd just like to see how I'd look, and refresh myself a bit. Can anyone suggest good ways to start? Or is this the wrong thread for this?

That depends on what look you want. There's the Siouxsie Sioux/Nina Hagen/Cleopatra style of ornate, varicoloured designs that extend beyond the actual eyelids for a very glamorous appearance, the more minute application around the edge of the eyelids (where eyelashes are), or a one-colour fill of the eyelids which will look sort of like skeleton make up and, indeed, appear to thin the face. Cover-up is never a bad way to learn to wear make-up as a teenager, as it is applied to small areas and used mostly to cover up blemishes rather than create a specific appearance.
In terms of hair-dye, depends on the colour. Buying cheap dye usually isn't a very good idea. Doing it yourself is pretty easy (though you might have blue or red or whatever hands for a few days until you get used to doing it more carefully), so I wouldn't reccomend going so far as to pay a professional. Rinse-out dyes to see what your hair would look like might be good if you aren't sure, due to their transient nature.

Congratulations, V.Z., I'm glad to hear everything went well.

[Rex Idiotarum]

Actually, I find polo shirts straight-up uncomfortable to wear precisely because of the way they are cut. They're effectively a collared tee-shirt, and something about that is wholly bothersome. The sleeves should be long or there should be buttons. The hideous chaimera of two garments that form a polo shirt was not a good hybridization, in my opinion.
I'm also quite glad you picked by far the easiest group to stereoytpe incorrectly on preference of dress and ran with it to try and make your point. Like trousers like brain!

Traded in for spandex!

*Sigh* Completely took the wrong point about this: I was stating that if I gave you two sets of clothing that are the same cut and type, but one would look good in a country club with it pastel colored shirt and it's beige pants versus, again, same cut, feel exactly the same, but look different, with a picture of G.I.R. on it all back, withe red trim on it, you would choose the second one, right? Other's would choose the first one, right? I picked two opposing stereotypical groups, that do, in fact, exist, Goth and Prep. You are in no way going to tell me that you're friends will not look at you any differently if you showed up tomorrow(or next school day, or next time you see them) dressed in clothes of opposing clique stereotype?
*Is still in arguer mode*

[VeisuItaTyhjyys]

However, Catalyst, premier Darkwave poet and one of the centres of the west coast Goth scene, wears quite a bit of colour. Nick Cave, a goth icon, primarily wears business suits, but is featured in pastel green and Star Trek uniform yellow in "Do you love me". Siouxsie Sioux dresses often in pastels and metallics. Andrew Eldritch, um, didn't wear a shirt back when the Sisters of Mercy were big, he just wore a leather jacket and big aviator sunglasses and a silver staff. All right, let's, uh, skip that one. I don't think that support's anyone's point.
Anyway, I wasn't challenging your assertion, I agree with you. I'm just tired of the "goths wear black" thing. Less by its invalidity, since a lot do, than by how it's the go-to clothing stereotype. It's cliche, more than anything else.

The polo shirt comment was a mostly facetious remark about how polo shirts are almost disturbing for me to wear.

[Serpentine]

Nick Cave, a goth icon,

He is? Huh. And here was I just thinking he was depressing... Love ya Nicky ;)

[VeisuItaTyhjyys]

He wrote a love letter on a nearly abandoned subway train in his own heroin-addled blood. You can't out-goth that unless you're drinking absinthe and faiting a divan while doing what he was. And it's hard to get divans on even abandoned subway trains.
I've tried.

[Serpentine]

Huh. His cool quota has just doubled.

[Rex Idiotarum]

Okay, and for me, Guy Clothes = Polo Shirt. I just seem forced to wear them for the uniform of society. Will I be fired for violating that uniform?

[Atreyu the Masked LLama]

I've been having urges to try out make-up. I don't want to go crazy, or plaster myself in face paint, just to experiment, especially with eyeshadow (mainly kohl). I'm also planning to experiment with dyeing my hair at some point in the near future. I'm not trying to be perceived as a woman, I'd just like to see how I'd look, and refresh myself a bit. Can anyone suggest good ways to start? Or is this the wrong thread for this?

No, but I thought if I quoted this, it might draw the attention of those who could possibly help you.

The best advice I could give is "Buy cheap, get cheap" which may not be a bad idea for the beginner. You don't want to buy really expensive "Lasts 8 hours" make-up until you're sure you want it to be around for 8 hours.

^Regina P. Idiotoriam, you need to spend less time hypnotizing yourself and more time writing your Nanomo book thingy. Look how far behind you are.

[Rex Idiotarum]

Hit a snag with the story, found a cure, a gaming group. I'll run them through my Zombies Ate My Teacher campaign.

[AmberVael]

I've not been doing so well in NaNo myself... >>

Anywho.
So my mother broke her little promise that she would tell me before talking to my dad about all of this.
So he knows everything now. We haven't talked about it, and frankly I'm not going to go talk to him about it any time soon. He'll likely confront me sooner or later though.
Wheee...

[QueenOfMemnoch]

Aww, Vael, I'm sorry about that.
I hope everything works itself out for you <3

So, I've been gone all weekend, missed a bunch, and came back to have a lot of reading. It was great to catch up. I misses this thread over the weekend
Lex-Kat, thank you for your story. Its given me a lot to think about <3
And, to everyone else ::hugs::

[Kaelaroth]

I've not been doing so well in NaNo myself... >>

Anywho.
So my mother broke her little promise that she would tell me before talking to my dad about all of this.
So he knows everything now. We haven't talked about it, and frankly I'm not going to go talk to him about it any time soon. He'll likely confront me sooner or later though.
Wheee...

Oh god. I hope it goes OK. Just remember to breathe deeply!

[Rex Idiotarum]

I've come across a realization. It is right. I figured I might've been just joking, but I was just wading in the rivers of De Nile. The more I think about it, the more I realize that it's true. That the way my pant fit, the way my shirt fits, feels like it's out of place. That in men's 30x32, I feel like I am cross-dressing... it doesn't feel right. It doesn't feel like my metaperception and my self perception are not the same. Am I a boy? I don't think so... I seem to be thinking of myself as a girl. When I imagine myself, I just don't seem like a boy.

And that's when anxiety struck, while at work to the point where I felt like I could cry. I have to tell my parents. God, I can barely speak to them about my everyday stuff, how do I tell them this? What if my Mom already knows? She's smart, I wouldn't doubt her on that end, what if she doesn't? Is my subtle hinting enough? What about my dad? Would he know? How will he react? What can I do? I've contemplated running away before, could this give me an excuse to? No. That's the coward's way out. For the first time in a long time, I just don't know what to do.

I'm trembling: I haven't felt like this in years. My mind can't figure out a way out and is panicking. I'm drowning. I'm suffocating. I'm held at gunpoint. I'm at work when I realized this, and just want to go home, and curl up into a ball.

[SMEE]

* hugs Vael and Rex *

I'll post some advice to both of you late in the night. I'm at work right now and I don't have enough free time to elaborate my post.

You two can contact me via MSN later today if you want. I've been through it already.

[PhoeKun]

Rex... *hugs*

The most important thing for you to do right now is recognize that the step you're about to take is a very difficult one - it isn't something you can necessarily figure a way "out" of, because it's not a quick step, but a very slow and gradual one.

You need to give yourself some time. Ease yourself (and your parents) into this: just keep gradually dropping hints while you give yourself time to think. As soon as you stop feeling trapped, you should start to see the proverbial light at the end of the tunnel...

I need to get to class right now, but I'll be back to try and be a little more specific. I can't be as much help as SMEE, but I do know what you're going through. Hang in there for now. You too, Vael.

[Rex Idiotarum]

Well, I realized that there are thousands of signs for this, and I have a feeling that they already know. If saying I wanted to be a Lesbian and wearing hose wasn't enough...

But no, I know the sooner I do this, the faster I'll be able to be comfortable with life, and the better off I'll be. I'll do what I do when I'm on a Roller Coaster, or when I'm underwater, hold my breath, jump right in, and hope to hell that if the water's too cold, I can make it out alive.

[Terumitsu]

Rex, If I ever do happen to meet you off of this board... I would ask you to go clothes shopping with me. Which is a lot as I don't often do that with anyone...

And in anycase, You have me to talk to at least... I know you have my msn and stuff. Hell, I had it easy with coming to terms with myself.

But there was mention of the posibility of becoming fully functioning? I want to wait for the exact science to come out but that just made me happy... Yay fulfilment of my dreams!

And just cause this needs to be said and will never get old cause it is true: SMEE, you're freaking amazing... And don't let anyone say otherwise. I just have to give you kudos (Eat it before it melts.) for having all your stuff and still taking the time out to be supportive to everyone here. It would be easy enough to just say you have issues with whatever and whatnot but you have that extra bit of effort that just makes it worth speaking out like this... And I should know... I was once rather introverted... kinda am still... But not as bad.

[V.Z.]

And just cause this needs to be said and will never get old cause it is true: SMEE, you're freaking amazing... And don't let anyone say otherwise. I just have to give you kudos (Eat it before it melts.) for having all your stuff and still taking the time out to be supportive to everyone here. It would be easy enough to just say you have issues with whatever and whatnot but you have that extra bit of effort that just makes it worth speaking out like this...

Amen to that! Terumitsu has put that perfectly into words and no less but major admiration from here as well, SMEE. You rock! I wish I could help others like you can. I kinda suck at it, especially compared to you and some other people I know, especially due to my lack of experience (sorry if I sounded whiney there). I do what I feel I can though, and my hug stand's always open, for all of you. So... *hugs Vael and Rex* Lots of strength.

[Ceska]

Let me just say I support all of you guys (I think I've said that before though), you rock. SMEE, you show a strength I wouldn't have believed existed anymore. I don't know if I could see as a role-model, but I definitely see you as one of the strongest persons I had the chance to talk to at least indirectly.

Vael, I know what you go through is hard, but I believe your parents will stay loyal to you in the end and will love you in the end. I just have to, I am too much of a pessimist in life as it is.

Rex, try to keep it slow. I know it might be hard for you, but right now you just have to be strong. From the few times I talked to you, you are a great person, if a bit direct. I hope your parents acknowledge this and respect you for who you are.

---------------------------

But I've actually come here to tell a bit of my own story. Well, I've come out to my mother today. If you can call it coming out. I simply sat down, told her that I do not feel male most of the time but rather change in how I perceive me, in a neither, an either and a both regularly. That I react to both similarly. Well, we talked about this for a while, she said she didn't quite understand it, but accepted it.

Then I told her I was bi. She didn't believe me at first. Well, she did, but she told me that since I never really tried I wouldn't really know. We then proceeded to talk about how much your sexuality is based on sexual acts and how much you already do know about it beforehand, because, well, I simply never got that far with any person. I never had the feeling I needed to touch a person in any other than an amicable way. I then tried to describe it with the Kinsley scale as probably 2X (thanks for posting this one Phoe).

She later told me she was confused from the whole talk and wanted me to just say if I'm bi or not. So I answered "I'm bi, I feel more drawn to females than males in general but actually don't care at all, I feel neither male nor female as my gender." She then thanked me to say it openly and told a few anecdotes.

I'm really happy I have such great, smart, accepting and loving parents, though my father is more snarky than witty most of the time and I don't feel like he has the need to know, and it just came up with my mother.

Well, actually the whole thing started this morning when we somehow came to speak of old times and mum said she and my father were called into Kindergarten when I was five because I apparently only played female roles. No matter what role it was, I was exclusively female. I then simply remarked that I don't feel like I have a gender most of the time either, but we didn't proceed to talk about it until this evening.

And well, since it's already 23:20, I want to get over this and have a two-hours test tomorrow morning I just want to end it with a quote of me when I was three years old that mum told me.

*While sitting in the back in a car my mother drives*
"Mum, can men drive cars too?"
"Of course they can dear, you drove with your father some times, didn't you?"
"Oh yeah, right."

Says a lot about the picture I had (and most of the time have) of men in society. For me women always had the strong, active and making part whereas men were somehow weak in comparison. Well, I haven't changed that much yet I think...

[SMEE]

Well, first... thanks for the compliments... I... wasn't expecting them...

Now, onto advice.

First, Vael:

Now that your father knows about it all, my bet is that he's just as confused as you are. So, watch him for a few days, behave as usual before him and study him.
You need to discover how comfortable (or uncomfortable) he's feeling about it. You'll need to prepare yourself to deal with it when he confronts you.
It's mostly likely that he'll be confused and angered (at himself). Let him know that he didn't failed as a father, and that you love him so much.
He may have a hard time dealing and understanding it, so provide him information about the subject in small servings.
He may happily accept everything in a couple of days, but don't expect it to happen that fast.
He'll be ready to fully accept and support you in a few months.
Good luck.

Hugs, my friend.

Regina:
Now that you realized it, you should take it easy a little bit. You went through the dire mental breakdown today.
Given what you said, my bet is that your fathers already suspect of something (I'd inclined to belive they suspect you to be homossexual).
So, wait for a couple of days until you go through the thriving experience and start giving your parents more direct bits of information.
Wait a few days and call them for a serious conversation. Then, expose the facts to them.
Hugs for you too.

Beatrice.

[the.weasely.one]

Hi all,
New to GitP and as I was perusing the forums saw such a large and active LGBT poulation I was really surprised. (Not sure if it just surface surprise or realy deep down surprise, but either way I think it's great that so many of you are there for others who are going through al the mental/emotional/spiritual/familial bs that society has added on to just being a person.

Props to all !

Da Weasel

[PhoeKun]

Well, I realized that there are thousands of signs for this, and I have a feeling that they already know. If saying I wanted to be a Lesbian and wearing hose wasn't enough...

But no, I know the sooner I do this, the faster I'll be able to be comfortable with life, and the better off I'll be. I'll do what I do when I'm on a Roller Coaster, or when I'm underwater, hold my breath, jump right in, and hope to hell that if the water's too cold, I can make it out alive.

That's not really an attitude I could ever pull off, so my opinion may be a bit biased, but my advice to you is still to ease into this. Being in limbo sucks, I will grant you that. But it's not always the best idea to dive straight into things.

If nothing else, take a couple days to make sure you're calm and centered; the news won't be received well if you're close to a breakdown, yourself. Whenever you decide to do it, though, good luck.

By the way, do you prefer Rex or Regina? I don't know if it matters to you or not, but it occurred to me I should probably check...

Vael: I think SMEE's pretty well covered the best way to handle your situation. Just remember to be patient with both of your parents... they will come to accept and support you, given enough time. But, for right now... *hugs* I'm sorry things aren't going as well as they could be.

[Rex Idiotarum]

That's why I think I should do it now so that I can calm down, I don't care about the results, I just know that it'll be a lifechanging event. It's either she reacts poorly, and I spend my time at a friend's place until I get an apartment of my own, which I've been kinda hoping to happen, or she reacts well, and I can feel more free in my own home, not like I'm dodging around behind everyone's back.

Be the hardest thing in my life... but I can't live like this... I'd rather not just Hypnotize the nervousness out of the way... save that for everyone else.

[SMEE]

Then good luck, Regina. You may need it.

I doubt that they'll get you out of the house for it, though. You've given them enough reasons to suspect of something already.

So, go and tell her if that's the only thing that will help you calm down.

Hugs.

[PhoeKun]

If that's the case, then good luck. We'll all be here for e-hugs no matter how it turns out.

[Rex Idiotarum]

She... doesn't believe me... @#$%! I would've rather've been kicked out...

[PhoeKun]

She didn't believe you? How did the conversation go?

[Rex Idiotarum]

She refused to believe me because I never stole my sister's clothing or played with dolls in the nurturing way... She wants me to get tested before she'll believe me.

And she claims because I've never tried to wear a dress before. Just what I need, another reason for kids to kick my ass. But screw it. I don't need her opinion.