Let's Read: The Dungeons and Dragons 5e Monster Manual!

[Shining Wrath]

We'll get to hags soon, and there is for all hags a serious disconnect between the listed CR (2-5, upgraded for a coven) and the "role of the hag in society", taking society broadly. Basically, these gals are equivalent to crime bosses; they are not necessarily powerful in a stand-up fight, but they are very good at getting other people to fight for them, manipulation and deceit to obfuscate their enemies, and running rather than fighting to the death whenever possible. A hag is very non-dragonish; they will readily give up treasures to avoid combat. As arrogant as dragons, perhaps, but they take pride in their cunning, not their sheer might.

As such, then, a hag is a natural combat partner to any big dumb evil creature; and the hag will cheerfully sacrifice a formorian or an ogre or lesser fey in order to escape. In their hut that runs on skeletal dinosaur legs, or flies using 10,000 enslaved pixies tied to it like the balloons in Up, or slithers along the ground leaving a trail of slime like a slug - at a move speed of 80. They've been around for centuries, they accumulate a lot of good stuff.

[Regitnui]

We'll get to hags soon, and there is for all hags a serious disconnect between the listed CR (2-5, upgraded for a coven) and the "role of the hag in society", taking society broadly. Basically, these gals are equivalent to crime bosses; they are not necessarily powerful in a stand-up fight, but they are very good at getting other people to fight for them, manipulation and deceit to obfuscate their enemies, and running rather than fighting to the death whenever possible. A hag is very non-dragonish; they will readily give up treasures to avoid combat. As arrogant as dragons, perhaps, but they take pride in their cunning, not their sheer might.

As such, then, a hag is a natural combat partner to any big dumb evil creature; and the hag will cheerfully sacrifice a formorian or an ogre or lesser fey in order to escape. In their hut that runs on skeletal dinosaur legs, or flies using 10,000 enslaved pixies tied to it like the balloons in Up, or slithers along the ground leaving a trail of slime like a slug - at a move speed of 80. They've been around for centuries, they accumulate a lot of good stuff.

There's a good use for the cottage monster from CoS.

[JoeJ]

Fomorians occupy a weird place for me; on the one hand I want them to be powerful enough for mid-to-high level play (which they are) and on the other I want them to be weak enough to be legitimately subservient to Hags and other powerful Fey creatures and I'd like to include them in lower level play as a "big strong Fey".

The main thing that bothers me about fomorians is their name. Like titans, the fomorians of myth are the elder gods that were overthrown by the current gods. The weakest of them should be CR 30+, if it's even possible for non-divine beings to fight them at all. The "fomorians" in the MM are great as evil fey giants, but they should have been called something else.

[Spellbreaker26]

The main thing that bothers me about fomorians is their name. Like titans, the fomorians of myth are the elder gods that were overthrown by the current gods. The weakest of them should be CR 30+, if it's even possible for non-divine beings to fight them at all. The "fomorians" in the MM are great as evil fey giants, but they should have been called something else.

I have to disagree with you there. Only Balor (the Celtic Balor, not the off-brand Balrog) is really titan material; his followers have a much less clear power level.

Not to mention titans are CR 23 in this edition.

[Mith]

You can also rule that the Formorians have lost a lot of power to the ages as well.

So back in your setting's Golden Age, the Formorians were truly something to behold. But now, they are a broken people.

[Shining Wrath]

You can also rule that the Formorians have lost a lot of power to the ages as well.

So back in your setting's Golden Age, the Formorians were truly something to behold. But now, they are a broken people.

Which raises the question of who took a bunch of CR lots creatures and broke them? Titania? Mab? Both, in concert? Corellon Laretheon?

It's not easy to take on a bunch of people with Titanic power and turn them into misshapen wretches.

I'm also going to repeat the idea that Hags lead creatures that could take them in a straight-up fight, because they are clever scheming manipulative fey. They don't get into straight-up fights.

[Envyus]

The Formorians being weaker then they used to be is a stated fact about them.

But yeah even if they were entirely based on their namesake they would not be CR 30 plus. The CR maxes out at 30 with lesser gods and as was stated the Formorians lost to the gods. Combined with the fact that only Balor was stated as being super powerful and he was killed by Lugh

[JoeJ]

CR 30+ is probably just my prejudice showing, since I'm of the deities-don't-have-stats school. Still, the fomorians described in the MM are pretty clearly not the fomorians of Irish myth. (Equally, the empyreans in the MM are not the titans of Greek myth.)

[georgie_leech]

(Equally, the empyreans in the MM are not the titans of Greek myth.)

I'll say. The titans of Greek Myths most definitely weren't the children of the gods. They were their parents.

[Spellbreaker26]

CR 30+ is probably just my prejudice showing, since I'm of the deities-don't-have-stats school. Still, the fomorians described in the MM are pretty clearly not the fomorians of Irish myth. (Equally, the empyreans in the MM are not the titans of Greek myth.)

Either way, the mythical Fomorians are not as dangerous as the mythical Titans. Balor's their king and he only has a giant eye cannon to his name; he got taken down by a slingshot.

[Forum Explorer]

Either way, the mythical Fomorians are not as dangerous as the mythical Titans. Balor's their king and he only has a giant eye cannon to his name; he got taken down by a slingshot.

Hey, being taken down by a slingshot is a respectable way for any giant or evil overlord to go. It's why halflings are so feared.

[Ronnocius]

The main thing that bothers me about fomorians is their name. Like titans, the fomorians of myth are the elder gods that were overthrown by the current gods. The weakest of them should be CR 30+, if it's even possible for non-divine beings to fight them at all. The "fomorians" in the MM are great as evil fey giants, but they should have been called something else.

By the same logic, shouldn't "medusas" be called gorgons and "gorgons" called...something else?

[Regitnui]

By the same logic, shouldn't "medusas" be called gorgons and "gorgons" called...something else?

Armour-plated bulls with a breath weapon.

Seriously though, we're playing a game where most of the classic monsters were made up from poorly-made children's toys and coopted from a children's dictionary of world mythology. Let's not get into the habit of "this is not like its RL inspiration therefore it sucks". That ruins pretty much every player race, let alone monsters.

[JoeJ]

By the same logic, shouldn't "medusas" be called gorgons and "gorgons" called...something else?

Yes they should. And all but one of them should be unkillable.

I've never liked D&D's policy of turning unique monsters into a whole species. Except for minotaurs, that is. For some reason, I do like the idea of a minotaur race. (Maybe the original one had offspring before it was killed.)

[Regitnui]

Yes they should. And all but one of them should be unkillable.

I've never liked D&D's policy of turning unique monsters into a whole species. Except for minotaurs, that is. For some reason, I do like the idea of a minotaur race. (Maybe the original one had offspring before it was killed.)

Well, the original myth did have young women sent as tribute, along with the young men Theseus disguised himself among.

[EvilAnagram]

Well, the original myth did have young women sent as tribute, along with the young men Theseus disguised himself among.

Or maybe Neptune's bull just had a lot of squeezes on the side.

[tsuyoshikentsu]

Galeb Duhr

I couldn't decide between a Geodude joke and "these guys rock!", so I'll just hop right in.

The galeb duhr have an odd pedigree: despite not making much of an impact on the game's various campaign settings, the galeb duhr have not only been in the game since AD&D1E but have actually appeared in every edition since. They're not given a lot of focus here, so let's examine what we have.

Art

Something about this piece just tickles my fancy. It's an earth elemental, so it's another humanoid rock guy, but the expression of sorts on its face does the trick for me. I have trouble with the scale, but at this point I've said that so many times that I feel like I don't even want to mention it any more.

Purpose and Tactics

Between the boulder-hiding ability, the fast downhill speed, the charge attack, and the lowish AC and HP, I'd put these guys squarely in the "ambush attacker" column. Their lack of a range attack hurts, though, leaving me not exactly sure when I'd want to use them.

The most notable thing they can do is summon up a couple more of themselves via animating boulders. It actuallyworks well for them: since they're at their best in round one, this effectively gives them two more of it while giving the players clear tactical choices. It's very reminiscent of the treant's similar ability, which I also like.

Fluff

The fluff actually puts me in mind of treants as well. Elemental guardians that animate the thing they look like? Yep, sounds about right. The stone sentry angle is kind of a nice touch, and makes a little more sense to me here than in the proper Elemental entry. Also worth mentioning is that these guys are sentient, having human-level mental stats--they'd make great NPCs in an Underdark or mountainous campaign.

Hooks

Deep in the Underdark, the party is lost and without allies. Then the rocks begin to talk to them.

Travelers along the Highland Road are claiming to have been robbed by "a sentient avalanche." ...What?

The galeb duhr and the treants of Livindale Forest have always gotten along well, but something has caused a rift. Both groups are almost unfathomably ancient, having seen generations of even elves come and go. How in the world do you mediate between walking rocks and talking trees?

Verdict

A rock-solid addition to the NPC line-up of any cave or mountain focused campaign.

[GorinichSerpant]

What if a giant threw a rock that was actually a Galeb Duhr at someone. The attack hits or misses and then everyone including the rock is confused when the Galeb Duhr starts talking.


Resist the urge to refer to name one Dwayne, Gorinich, resist the urge.

[tsuyoshikentsu]

HA! I love it!

[EvilAnagram]

I just picture a dwarf trying to excavate a little place of his own, but galeb duhr keep animating parts of his patio.

[Regitnui]

What if a giant threw a rock that was actually a Galeb Duhr at someone. The attack hits or misses and then everyone including the rock is confused when the Galeb Duhr starts talking.

"Oi, ye dumb galoot! I was sittin' there! Y'think y'kin jus' toss me brethren aroond li' we wouldna objec'?"

I can picture these guys also not being very fond of dwarves, since they're at least partially made up of precious minerals, and what do dwarves love? Perhaps these are why dwarves have druids; to bargain with the galeb duhr whenever a new mine needs to be opened, and to officially hand over tapped-out mines back to the boulders.

[tsuyoshikentsu]

Interesting twist: in 4E lore, galeb duhr were apparently corrupted dwarves. Because if there's one thing D&D needs, it's more underground-themed corrupted dwarves.

One thing this entry makes me realize, though? Five editions and like forty years into D&D, every single monster basically has a multiple choice past. By not putting ANY of it in the MM, it lets you use whatever backstory you want. As a setting builder, I really love that.

[GorinichSerpant]

"Oi, ye dumb galoot! I was sittin' there! Y'think y'kin jus' toss me brethren aroond li' we wouldna objec'?"

I can picture these guys also not being very fond of dwarves, since they're at least partially made up of precious minerals, and what do dwarves love? Perhaps these are why dwarves have druids; to bargain with the galeb duhr whenever a new mine needs to be opened, and to officially hand over tapped-out mines back to the boulders.

I like to imagine that the deal is sealed over a traditional drinking of a mug of ale on for the Dwarf and a refreshing cup of molten sulfur for the Galeb Duhr. I like to imagine that many a mystical and mundane dwarven deal must be sealed with a downed beverage.

On a related note, these guys are a decent enough fit for those who are just itching to subject their players to discworld trolls.

[Regitnui]

On a related note, these guys are a decent enough fit for those who are just itching to subject their players to discworld trolls.

Pretty much my reference for the idea...

[JackPhoenix]

The main thing that bothers me about fomorians is their name. Like titans, the fomorians of myth are the elder gods that were overthrown by the current gods. The weakest of them should be CR 30+, if it's even possible for non-divine beings to fight them at all. The "fomorians" in the MM are great as evil fey giants, but they should have been called something else.

Celtic gods in general weren't nearly as overpowered as, say, Greek gods. In D&D term, they would be more similar to high-level characters than CR 30 monsters. You can basically set deities from various mythologies at different power levels: at top, you have Christian and other monotheistic (or dualistic) gods, which are beyond the scale of anything in D&D and generally don't interract with mortals directly. Below them, there are Greek gods, which are too powerful to be challenged by mortals (though mortals can achieve some success through guile in Greek mythology, being demigods or favored by rival gods is common for heroes), but interract with them more freely. Those are still too powerful even for CR 30. Norse gods are weaker still, and more human-like. Them I can see fitting the CR 30 mark, they are more powerful than anything, but there are other beings that can threaten and kill them... depends how divine you feel the giants are in Norse mythology, even beings that mortals can help against. And various generations of Celtic gods (Fir Bolg, Tuatha Dé Danann, Fomorians) are the lowest tier... they are still powerful, but generally in the way greatest mortal heroes or most powerful mages are.

[Ronnocius]

Armour-plated bulls with a breath weapon.

Seriously though, we're playing a game where most of the classic monsters were made up from poorly-made children's toys and coopted from a children's dictionary of world mythology. Let's not get into the habit of "this is not like its RL inspiration therefore it sucks". That ruins pretty much every player race, let alone monsters.

I never said that those monsters were bad because they don't follow their real-life version. Please don't throw accusations at me like that

[Slayn82]

I like to imagine that the deal is sealed over a traditional drinking of a mug of ale on for the Dwarf and a refreshing cup of molten sulfur for the Galeb Duhr. I like to imagine that many a mystical and mundane dwarven deal must be sealed with a downed beverage.

On a related note, these guys are a decent enough fit for those who are just itching to subject their players to discworld trolls.

Frozen also has some Trolls that are pretty much Galeb Durs.

[Regitnui]

I never said that those monsters were bad because they don't follow their real-life version. Please don't throw accusations at me like that

I wasn't accusing anyone in particular. I was just warning people what is off a slippery slope; start insisting that medusas are "correctly" called gorgons, and you lose a name for the petrifying armour-bull. D&D is full of deviations like that, so picking them apart makes the game look awful patchy. Best to approach D&D on its terms rather than expect mythological accuracy from a game.

[Shining Wrath]

I, personally, insist that my orcs be black and white colored, since orc is obviously derived from orca. Don't put your silly fantasies into my realistic combat simulation!

[Sredni Vashtar]

I, personally, insist that my orcs be black and white colored, since orc is obviously derived from orca. Don't put your silly fantasies into my realistic combat simulation!

Actually "orca" is derived from Orcus, as is "orc." Do with this information what you may.