Sorcerer Feats...

[zephiros]

Alright, so I'm starting a new campaign tonight which starts at level 15, and I'm making a sorcerer for it. Now most of that (skills, ability advancement, spells, any equipment) I can fully do on my own. I would be capable of doing the feats myself as well, but the thing is I have a very poor general knowledge of feats, to the extent that if it's not in PHB1 I wouldn't be thinking to use it, and even then I might not pick the best ones.

I also forget how metamagic feats work >.< I remember it being something like you can gain through class advancement depending on class, and you can also trade out normal feats for them? But I'm not sure on that.

Basically if anyone could recommend a feat spread for a level 15 Sorcerer, that'd be wonderfully great. My character will, in all likelihood, be a human, so unless my math brain has entirely died, that's 7 altogether? Any help with that is much appreciated, I really need to buff up on my feat knowledge sometime, but for the moment, I'm still researching classes / races. Thanks again for any assistance.

[RMS Oceanic]

For sorcerors, you take Metamagic feats like any other feat. Remember that for Sorcerors, and other spontaneous casters, applying the metamagic feat extends the casting time to a full round action, meaning you get no benefit from the Quicken Spell feat.

If you are going to be a Metamagic dude, you can negate this penalty by taking Rapid Metamagic from Complete Mage, with a prerequisite of 12 ranks in Spellcraft.

[Cog]

If you are going to be a Metamagic dude, you can negate this penalty by taking Rapid Metamagic from Complete Mage, with a prerequisite of 12 ranks in Spellcraft.

There's also an alternate class feature in either Complete Arcane or Complete Mage that lets you trade out your familiar for the same ability.

[RMS Oceanic]

There's also an alternate class feature in either Complete Arcane or Complete Mage that lets you trade out your familiar for the same ability.

Yeah, but you can only do that 3+Int times a day. The feat makes it unlimited.

[Caphi]

Second Rapid Metamagic, and also Versatile Spellcaster from Races of the Dragon if you can use it. It lets you use two spell slots as a slot of one level higher.

[Kaww]

There's also an alternate class feature in either Complete Arcane or Complete Mage that lets you trade out your familiar for the same ability.

Since you (probably) will not go with lvl 15 sorcerer, this is a good choice that saves a feat. As you will be lvl 5 sorcerer lvl [insert level] [insert PrC] you don't lose anything important by giving up your pet cat Maurice.

As for feats try getting those that reduce mm spell level adjustment and apply them to your favored mm feat. Maybe some fun/good racial feats?

[Greenish]

I really need to buff up on my feat knowledge sometime, but for the moment, I'm still researching classes / races. Thanks again for any assistance.

Have you thought of being a kobold?

[zephiros]

Have you thought of being a kobold?

I'm sure there's something I'm missing there, apologies but I know nothing about Kobolds. At all. :P

And...yeah, I forgot if you use metamagic on a spell it takes a higher level spell slot doesn't it?

[Greenish]

I'm sure there's something I'm missing there, apologies but I know nothing about Kobolds. At all. :P

They've got access to the Greater Dragonic Rites, which increase their sorcerer level by one, and to Dragonwrought feat which changes their type to dragon and removes aging penalties (so you could start as a venerable dragonwrought kobold for +3 to all mental stats).

The dragon type qualifies them for a few kinds of cheese, too.

And...yeah, I forgot if you use metamagic on a spell it takes a higher level spell slot doesn't it?

Depending on the metamagic, it can up the slot from 0 to 6 levels.

[zephiros]

Your link for Greater Draconic Rites seems broken. :/

[Greenish]

Your link for Greater Draconic Rites seems broken. :/

Oops, should pay attention to what I'm copy-pasting. Should be fixed now.

[thompur]

Alertness, Toughness, Skill focus(Basket weaving) unless your DM is particularly sensitive to limburger.;-)

[freebiewitz]

basket weaving? There's actually a prestige class with a prerequisite for weaving. It's called the war weaver basically they can buff an entire party with one spell. It's a little more complicated then that though.

It's in the book of battle if you have that.

[RndmNumGen]

Dragonwrought feat which changes their type to dragon and removes aging penalties (so you could start as a venerable dragonwrought kobold for +3 to all mental stats).

+3? doesn't Venerable only give +1 to each mental stat?

[Urpriest]

+3? doesn't Venerable only give +1 to each mental stat?

Venerable+Old+Middle-aged. Each gives +1.

[Shade Kerrin]

+1, cumulative with the previous +1s for a total of +3

[sambo.]

my $0.02...

lvl 15? so that's six feats total + any bonus for race etc yuh?

Improved Initiative is always a good choice, especially for sorc's who dump dex.

i like Eschew Materials as a feat, never have to worry about being captured & stripped etc.

Spell Focus if there's a school of magic you use a lot.

Skill Focus, if there's a skill you really don't ever want to fail a check (concentration is a good one)

Heighten spell is always nice if you really need to bump up a spell DC.

silent/still spell for sneaky casting.

Arcane Thesis, if you want masses of metamagic cheese.

Quicken Spell: only if you're a metamagic specialist.

[Kalaska'Agathas]

You might also check out Solo's guide, along with "The Mailman", both of which should help you. Also, another 'Yea' vote for Rapid Metamagic.

[ericgrau]

Metamagic feats are great for sorcerers due to spontaneous metamagic. Some feats aren't nearly as feasible for wizards b/c they're so situational and you don't want to increase the spell level if you don't need to. Other more generally useful feats like empower are still useful to both classes.

[Boren]

I guess the first question I'd have to ask is what books are you allowed to draw from, or is your Dm, like me, take the 'I'll look at anything and decide on it' path?
I know a few really good books to look through but they are often not allowed
D20 - Ultimate Feats is an awesome book but a lot of DM don't allow it because its D20 not 100% official D&D

[zephiros]

I guess the first question I'd have to ask is what books are you allowed to draw from, or is your Dm, like me, take the 'I'll look at anything and decide on it' path?

Basically this, we usually pull from any 3.5 Sourcebooks, and sometimes from alternate campaign settings (usually Forgotten Realms, but others too). Can't see him saying no without looking at something though. As long as it's nothing too broken.

The question I was going to ask is:

In this sorcerer guide http://community.wizards.com/go/thre...r_help_wanted. it mentions that an Incantatrix can "even apply a metamagic effect without adjusting its spell level (assuming she makes the spellcraft check)"

I was wondering if anyone can tell me which Incantatrix ability that's a part of, cause I read through it briefly and didn't see anything of that sort :/

I did see all the other abilities that the guide mentions however, so I'm probably just too tired and missing it.




EDIT: I was also wondering if there are ANY ways, even obscure ones, to circumvent a Sorcerer's spells known limits, even for one additional spell known per level, or to make them know all cantrips like wizards or something.

[sambo.]

EDIT: I was also wondering if there are ANY ways, even obscure ones, to circumvent a Sorcerer's spells known limits, even for one additional spell known per level, or to make them know all cantrips like wizards or something.

spend feats on "Extra Spell" is the obvious one.

[herrhauptmann]

Play as an elf, then use the dark chaos shuffle to trade away all your free martial weapon proficiencies for more feats. (Embrace dark chaos to turn them into vile feats, shun the dark chaos to turn vile feats into normal ones)
Can be done in backstory as early as say level 8, by paying someone to cast both spells on you. (A requirement of the Cindy build)

[Marnath]

Since you (probably) will not go with lvl 15 sorcerer, this is a good choice that saves a feat. As you will be lvl 5 sorcerer lvl [insert level] [insert PrC] you don't lose anything important by giving up your pet cat Maurice.

We don't all optimize to the level that is seen on these boards. Some of us like to play things like straight sorceror, warmage(as WOTC intended, even) or monk.... And thats fine if the other players and DM are on board with it.

[zephiros]

We don't all optimize to the level that is seen on these boards. Some of us like to play things like straight sorceror, warmage(as WOTC intended, even) or monk.... And thats fine if the other players and DM are on board with it.

Yeah, I am intending to play it single-classed or with the Incantatrix maybe, if someone can help me with the above problem related to that. But mostly I'm playing Sorcerer for the sake of Sorcerer. The magic classes get powerful enough without total optimization through multiclassing and PrCs.

[Marnath]

Yeah, I am intending to play it single-classed or with the Incantatrix maybe, if someone can help me with the above problem related to that. But mostly I'm playing Sorcerer for the sake of Sorcerer. The magic classes get powerful enough without total optimization through multiclassing and PrCs.

I don't know how you feel about alternate class features, but my favorite thing is to take Battle Sorceror with a tougher race and use lots of touch range spells. Especially if you can use spells from Races of the Dragon. At highest levels you can be using a buffed warhammer that does 6d6 base damage a hit, and thats just when you're bored of blowing crap up.

[Eronai_Jantig]

Knowstones, they're from Dragon #333.

Cost: Spell Level Squared*1000gp+expensive material components or focus (if any)

To put it simply while you have them they let you cast the spells as if you knew them.

[zephiros]

Battle Sorcerer is a neat flavour but I tend to prefer pure casting. Besides, unless I'm absent-minded or WotC totally screwed up their balancing, shouldn't Battle Sorcerer have some magical drawback? (Not that I really care if it's "lose your familiar" or something like that, I never use familiars anyway).

Knowstones are more the type of thing I mean, investing feats in learning a single new spell just seems a waste of feats that could otherwise touch on metamagic. However, if anyone knows of items like knowstones that could make that knowledge innate...that'd be wonderful. (Yeah, I'm one of the people who prefers not to overly rely on magical items.)

Still wondering from before though, I can't find anywhere the part about Incantatrix being able to cast metamagic without adjusting the spell level if they pass a Spellcraft check...if anyone could point me at the right ability, or tell me that it is not in fact there? (Incantatrix is Player's Guide to Faerun if anyone doesn't know)

So far I'm considering between 3 different races: Whisper Gnome (sacrificing some other abilities to offset Cha Penalty), Kobold, or Illumian (recommended to me, haven't looked at it yet). Human is also always open if I decide none of that works but anyone who'd like to have their say as far as race is welcome to it.

But yeah, the Incantatrix thing is pretty important, cause if that's true, I'm definitely taking that class. :P




EDIT: Our DM is giving us available magical items to compensate for...well jumping in at level 15, as we expected he would. I might take a Cloak of Charisma, but he's willing to let me use an alternate cloak that I thought of. The normal one would grant a +6 to Charisma, the other a +4 to charisma and would give the sorcerer knowledge of all cantrips, as wizards have. My question is are there enough useful / good cantrips to warrant taking the latter, or is the +6 the better option?


Also, are there any options besides dragonwrought kobold (as far as race, not class) for ignoring age penalties, that would still be good for sorcerer?

[Ernir]

It's probably referring to the third level ability, metamagic effect.

Doesn't really work on instantaneous spells, though.

EDIT: Could be Cooperative Metamagic, too.

EDIT 2: Make sure you are looking at the "right" Incantatrix. The 3.5 version is in Player's Guide to Faerûn, the one available online and in (IIRC) Magic of Faerûn is different.

[Greenish]

Battle Sorcerer is a neat flavour but I tend to prefer pure casting. Besides, unless I'm absent-minded or WotC totally screwed up their balancing, shouldn't Battle Sorcerer have some magical drawback?

It loses on both spells per day and the ever-precious spells known. It's a downgrade.

That said, I don't know why you're set on straight sorcerer. 19 dead levels, how boring is that?