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2012-12-09, 11:14 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Dec 2011
Re: "Wait, that didn't work right" - the Dysfunctional Rules Collection
I think negative energy is still considered "damage," even if it heals the target. Arguably, you could say that you could deal negative healing if you read it your way, which would mean you could damage someone with positive energy (who would normally not be damaged by it).
(To make that a bit clearer, I mean that if you touch an undead and deal 5 damage as healing, you dealt the undead "-5" damage; thus, your next turn you can heal someone for -5 health).
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2012-12-09, 11:17 PM (ISO 8601)
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- May 2012
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- The Algol System
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Re: "Wait, that didn't work right" - the Dysfunctional Rules Collection
Avatar by FinnLassie
A few odds and ends.
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2012-12-09, 11:57 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Jan 2012
Re: "Wait, that didn't work right" - the Dysfunctional Rules Collection
My Homebrew: found here.
When you Absolutely, Positively, Gotta Drop some Huge rocks, Accept NO Substitutes
PM Me if you would like a table from my homebrew reconstructed.
Drow avatar @ myself
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2012-12-09, 11:58 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Nov 2010
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2012-12-10, 12:08 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Mar 2008
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- NYC
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Re: "Wait, that didn't work right" - the Dysfunctional Rules Collection
You are (presumably) a being made of flesh. If someone were to hit you over the head with a ham, would that heal you? Why should hitting a fire being with fire heal it? If anything, the new flame would consume the being's fuel faster and be actively detrimental to it.
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2012-12-10, 12:09 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Dec 2008
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- Malsheem, Nessus
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Re: "Wait, that didn't work right" - the Dysfunctional Rules Collection
Water types probably shouldn't be healed by cold; freezing or evaporating a creature made of water are both fairly effective, and if anything creatures of pure water should heal from acid (they dilute it and use it to increase their mass) and immune to electricity (because absolutely pure water wouldn't conduct it). What would work better would be water elementals healing by immersing themselves in larger bodies of water or walking into a fog cloud, earth elementals healing while underground, and so forth.
But I agree with your general point. It's kind of lopsided that everything in the multiverse is powered by positive energy except undead, when it should really be that living creatures on the Prime are powered by positive energy, elemental creatures are powered by their respective elements, and outsiders are powered by their respective alignment energies. I realize that they did it the way they did because they wanted cure X wounds to work on everything and figuring out how water elementals heal from water is too much effort, but a more consistent setup would have been nice.
Originally Posted by Flickerdart
It's very thematic for elemental creatures to heal from their own element (see: elemental-themed boss fights ), and I'd prefer something like that to being able to throw fire elementals into a volcano with no ill effects--you wanna talk about a fuel source, that should put it out real fast.
On a related note, I now want to whip up some rules for various elements interacting like that. If you hit a water elemental with a cold spell, it would slow down but have an armored shell and hit like a truck, if you hit a cold elemental with fire damage it releases steam for concealment and minor damage, and so forth. Could be interesting for an "omnimental"-type monster that shifts between types of elementals based on how it's attacked....Last edited by PairO'Dice Lost; 2012-12-10 at 12:14 AM.
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2012-12-10, 12:23 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Jan 2012
Re: "Wait, that didn't work right" - the Dysfunctional Rules Collection
Ive actually considered starting a rewrite of 3.5, although i feel i should first get a better handle on Vancian and Psionic casting.
Primarily i would fix:
Casting
Item Crafting
Handling of concepts
Invent this foreign concept called Pants
Your concept is also actually Called a Wierd, not an Elemental. they form on the Demi-planes of Concordanence or as constructs
Edit: Oh, a rules Dysfunction: Pants, they dont actually existLast edited by toapat; 2012-12-10 at 12:26 AM.
My Homebrew: found here.
When you Absolutely, Positively, Gotta Drop some Huge rocks, Accept NO Substitutes
PM Me if you would like a table from my homebrew reconstructed.
Drow avatar @ myself
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2012-12-10, 12:36 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Mar 2011
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Re: "Wait, that didn't work right" - the Dysfunctional Rules Collection
There are so many 3.X rewrites floating around, either partial or complete. Every 3.X fan and their uncle has rewritten large sections of it.
Edit: Oh, a rules Dysfunction: Pants, they dont actually existJude P.
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2012-12-10, 12:45 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Dec 2008
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- Malsheem, Nessus
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Re: "Wait, that didn't work right" - the Dysfunctional Rules Collection
D&D has several versions of elemental weirds, many ways of generating demiplanes, and the Singers of Concordance, but I can't think of any omnimental weirds native to demiplanes of concordance. Elaborate, please?
Edit: Oh, a rules Dysfunction: Pants, they dont actually exist
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2012-12-10, 12:56 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Jan 2012
Re: "Wait, that didn't work right" - the Dysfunctional Rules Collection
The demi-elemental planes of
ConcordanceOpposition would be the opposed elemental planes. Elementals from these planes actually would have the type of Wierd, not elemental. the only one of the three planes i can name would be the plane of Concordanant Opposition (the other 2 are never named in 3.5 material, and Con-Op is from DDO so how canon that is is upto the reader), where Possitive and Negative meet.
Mineral, Magma, Prismatic, and Dust elementals are not wierds though, despite arrising from planes created from the convergence of 2 superplanes, as they are not from opposed planes.
Unless the A&EG says that pants are part of Fancy Clothes or Simple Clothes, then they dont exist. Pictures dont count.Last edited by toapat; 2012-12-10 at 12:56 AM.
My Homebrew: found here.
When you Absolutely, Positively, Gotta Drop some Huge rocks, Accept NO Substitutes
PM Me if you would like a table from my homebrew reconstructed.
Drow avatar @ myself
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2012-12-10, 01:21 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Dec 2008
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- Malsheem, Nessus
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Re: "Wait, that didn't work right" - the Dysfunctional Rules Collection
Ah, there's the confusion. The plane with the canonical title of the Concordant Opposition is the Outlands, and refers to opposition of Good/Evil and Law/Chaos, not the elements, and it sounds like the DDO version of weirds is also nonstandard. In D&D canon, two-element mixtures form para-elemental planes (Magma, Smoke, Ice, and Ooze), element/energy mixtures form quasi-elemental planes (Lightning/Mineral/Radiant/Steam for positive energy + air/earth/fire/water and Vacuum/Dust/Ash/Salt for negative energy), and the opposing elemental and energy planes don't ever combine.
Unless the A&EG says that pants are part of Fancy Clothes or Simple Clothes, then they dont exist. Pictures dont count.
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2012-12-10, 01:31 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Jan 2012
Re: "Wait, that didn't work right" - the Dysfunctional Rules Collection
actually, the definition of Wierds is from MTG (where they are actually elemental constructs of fire and ice). Wierds would be downright impossible to kill if they were in DDO because of how little of the mitigation we get in the game. the Undead fire elementals in Necropolis 4 are bad enough in that game already, as are the Darthbolds in Enter the Kobold.
Last edited by toapat; 2012-12-10 at 01:31 AM.
My Homebrew: found here.
When you Absolutely, Positively, Gotta Drop some Huge rocks, Accept NO Substitutes
PM Me if you would like a table from my homebrew reconstructed.
Drow avatar @ myself
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2012-12-10, 04:30 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Oct 2009
Re: "Wait, that didn't work right" - the Dysfunctional Rules Collection
Magical pants do exist! They're just japanese. The beginning of OA's magic item chapter has the listing for types of items which includes a note about using hakama in place of a cloak. Hakama are those big, flowing pants that samurai wear.
Bonus points: hakama of charisma is a pair of pants that make you more attractive to others.I am not seaweed. That's a B.
Praise I've received A quick outline on building a homebrew campaign
Avatar by Tiffanie Lirle
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2012-12-10, 08:43 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Sep 2011
Re: "Wait, that didn't work right" - the Dysfunctional Rules Collection
Affliction (BoED) specifies that it does extra damage against evil undead, except that it's Fort negates, so undead are immune to it.
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2012-12-11, 01:53 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Dec 2011
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- Wisconsin, USA
Re: "Wait, that didn't work right" - the Dysfunctional Rules Collection
I don't know if anyone's brought it up yet, but what about knowledge skills? They're trained only, which means, for example, someone without ranks in knowledge (nature) wouldn't know what a wolf is, or the ocean, and someone without ranks in knowledge (history) wouldn't know about anything that ever happened that they hadn't directly experienced. Sure, for knowledge (arcana), (the planes), etc, it makes sense (the average joe doesn't know what type of outsiders reside in limbo or ancient arcane secrets) but things like local, history, nature, architecture, geography, etc, being trained only makes zero sense.
Originally Posted by inuyashaOriginally Posted by Jormengand
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2012-12-11, 04:27 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Jan 2012
Re: "Wait, that didn't work right" - the Dysfunctional Rules Collection
This has been covered before but I'm not sure if this thread or not.
Knowledge can be used DC 10 or less untrained. That might not get you detailed information but since your average 5 year old can tell you the difference between a wolf and an elephant, its pretty fair to say the DC to identify a particular Genus is fairly low, unless you have animals who are a lot alike. Think "that's an elephant" "African or Asian?" "I don't know."
Likewise, lack of knowledge local doesn't prevent you from finding the market place in the town you grew up in.
This also covers the kind of common knowledge you'd expect to be floating around. People know things like Angels live in Celestia, Devils come from Hell, but would be rather light on details about specific residents. They may even have trouble with the difference between Devils and Demons for that matter. Though most peasants would easily make the leap to assuming that fire does not work on the minions of Hell.
The DC 10+hitdice checks are for specific and useful knowledge about a particular creature, things like its special powers and specific identification, or even knowledge of typical tactics. That is specialized learning that is in a different category than "Holy ****! A Dragon! RUN!"A man once asked me the difference between Ignorance and Apathy. I told him, "I don't know, and I don't care"
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2012-12-11, 05:47 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Jun 2011
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Re: "Wait, that didn't work right" - the Dysfunctional Rules Collection
Pretty sure it's been brought up before, and in fact a whole thread spun off just for Knowledge checks to identify creatures.
Projects: Homebrew, Gentlemen's Agreement, DMPCs, Forbidden Knowledge safety, and Top Ten Worst. Also, Quotes and RACSD are good.
Anyone knows blue is for sarcas'ing in · "Take 10 SAN damage from Dark Orchid" · Use of gray may indicate nitpicking · Green is sincerity
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2012-12-11, 06:27 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Dec 2011
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- Wisconsin, USA
Re: "Wait, that didn't work right" - the Dysfunctional Rules Collection
Ah, thanks. Was that eratta'd, homebrewed, or am I simply terrible at reading?
Originally Posted by inuyashaOriginally Posted by Jormengand
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2012-12-11, 09:02 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Jun 2011
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Re: "Wait, that didn't work right" - the Dysfunctional Rules Collection
Projects: Homebrew, Gentlemen's Agreement, DMPCs, Forbidden Knowledge safety, and Top Ten Worst. Also, Quotes and RACSD are good.
Anyone knows blue is for sarcas'ing in · "Take 10 SAN damage from Dark Orchid" · Use of gray may indicate nitpicking · Green is sincerity
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2012-12-11, 09:31 PM (ISO 8601)
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- May 2006
Re: "Wait, that didn't work right" - the Dysfunctional Rules Collection
Of course, by the time I finish this post, it will already be obsolete. C'est la vie.
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2012-12-11, 09:36 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Mar 2011
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Re: "Wait, that didn't work right" - the Dysfunctional Rules Collection
But it's just common sense in that case. Isn't it?
(Random copy/paste fail: The other day at my Intro Neurobio class's review session I was the only one who'd noticed that one problem on the practice exam had one answer repeated twice, and due to its poor wording, technically both of those and one of the others were all right.)Jude P.
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2012-12-12, 04:24 AM (ISO 8601)
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- May 2010
Re: "Wait, that didn't work right" - the Dysfunctional Rules Collection
Imagine if all real-world conversations were like internet D&D conversations...
Protip: DnD is an incredibly social game played by some of the most socially inept people on the planet - Lev
I read this somewhere and I stick to it: "I would rather play a bad system with my friends than a great system with nobody". - Trevlac
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2012-12-12, 01:49 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Dec 2012
Re: "Wait, that didn't work right" - the Dysfunctional Rules Collection
Prismatic Golems are incorporeal constructs. Think about that for a second.
Kolyarut Avatar by Potatocubed.
Awards
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2012-12-12, 02:24 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Nov 2012
Re: "Wait, that didn't work right" - the Dysfunctional Rules Collection
Ignore the save portion, you can make a valid argument that since the spell identifies undead as a valid target within its description that the spell ignores the Fort save rule of undead.
Half to two thirds of the spell is useless against undead since it deals ability damage. Undead are immune to strength and dexterity damage and they lack a constitution score and thus immune to it. Many undead also lack an intelligence score so they are immune to the intelligence damage. Of course, you could make the same argument line for why the damage applies as for why the spell applies.Last edited by Talderas; 2012-12-12 at 02:25 PM.
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2012-12-12, 07:44 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Jun 2011
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Re: "Wait, that didn't work right" - the Dysfunctional Rules Collection
... what about it? I'm not seeing the strange.
(In fact, sometime I'd like to homebrew an incorporeal immobile mindless construct that acts as a teleporting turret defense. Has Str -, Dex -, Con -, Int -. Mostly because I find the idea of a creature with all eligible ability scores nulls to be funny.)Projects: Homebrew, Gentlemen's Agreement, DMPCs, Forbidden Knowledge safety, and Top Ten Worst. Also, Quotes and RACSD are good.
Anyone knows blue is for sarcas'ing in · "Take 10 SAN damage from Dark Orchid" · Use of gray may indicate nitpicking · Green is sincerity
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2012-12-12, 08:56 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jan 2012
Re: "Wait, that didn't work right" - the Dysfunctional Rules Collection
My Homebrew: found here.
When you Absolutely, Positively, Gotta Drop some Huge rocks, Accept NO Substitutes
PM Me if you would like a table from my homebrew reconstructed.
Drow avatar @ myself
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2012-12-12, 08:59 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Mar 2011
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2012-12-12, 10:15 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Jan 2012
Re: "Wait, that didn't work right" - the Dysfunctional Rules Collection
My Homebrew: found here.
When you Absolutely, Positively, Gotta Drop some Huge rocks, Accept NO Substitutes
PM Me if you would like a table from my homebrew reconstructed.
Drow avatar @ myself
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2012-12-12, 10:18 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Mar 2011
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2012-12-13, 02:05 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Jun 2011
- Gender
Re: "Wait, that didn't work right" - the Dysfunctional Rules Collection
Projects: Homebrew, Gentlemen's Agreement, DMPCs, Forbidden Knowledge safety, and Top Ten Worst. Also, Quotes and RACSD are good.
Anyone knows blue is for sarcas'ing in · "Take 10 SAN damage from Dark Orchid" · Use of gray may indicate nitpicking · Green is sincerity