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2012-03-20, 07:19 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: LGBTAitP - Part 22: The Best There Is
I feel for you, being a cisgendered white straight male myself. Why do they have issues with other people advocating for them? Granted, my main problem , being in Texas, will probably be people assuming I am gay because I advocate for LGBT and I can say the word 'gay" without saying something hateful or mean in the same sentence(I am not exaggerating much here). Thankfully, most my friends either are mildly in favor of LGBT rights and such, or just plain don't care what other people do, because it's their business, not his or her business.
Originally Posted by Kuulvheysoon
Online gaming stuff
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2012-03-20, 07:44 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: LGBTAitP - Part 22: The Best There Is
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Avatar by Rain Dragon
Wish building characters for D&D 3.5 was simpler? Try HeroForge Anew! An Excel-based, highly automated character builder. v7.4 now out!
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2012-03-20, 07:47 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: LGBTAitP - Part 22: The Best There Is
Sadly, as was shown by the experiences of our current favorite blogger, being Trans or Gay or Feminist, or any such label or identity, does not automatically make one not an idiot, flaming or otherwise, or do anything about the seeds of hatred that may dwell within a person's heart.
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2012-03-20, 08:41 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: LGBTAitP - Part 22: The Best There Is
Well if it's all the same, my best friend made me promise to have sex with a woman at least once, just to make sure. But I'd probably have to be a threeway so A I can get it up, and B *sings song*
God d*mn it! I hate it when that kind of stuff happens! But at least he got out unharmed, not to say anything about the words they said.
Well I was thinking the same way... I thought it was cute how he stood up for his Mizz Mitchell. (again with semi-making fun of Shiro, well it's probably just jealousy... *Darren Criss song starts*)
In other news, Matt Bomer was my fourth celebrity crush, but when I found out he was gay, he went up a place due to my d'aw-ing, behind D Criss and NPH. I wonder if I should invoke rule 34... Or 61 (46 in the 47 rules version), you know, if you like that stuff.
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2012-03-20, 09:38 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: LGBTAitP - Part 22: The Best There Is
Last edited by Mutant Sheep; 2012-03-20 at 11:10 PM. Reason: Wow, I typo alot. :smallredface:
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2012-03-21, 12:29 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: LGBTAitP - Part 22: The Best There Is
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2012-03-21, 01:49 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: LGBTAitP - Part 22: The Best There Is
Chrono Trigger! <3
Also, I don't think I've said hi yet, so, uhmm... Hi!
You should make it~
Heh, I sometimes have to do a double-take in public and a make sure I refer to myself in the "proper" way. >.>
It was sorta odd for me; I figured out my gender stuff mostly through talking with a genderqueer friend; me identifying as a girl sorta felt like a "betrayal" or something I shouldn't, as opposed to being genderqueer. (I thought this way; she's been super supportive all through and helped me get over those feelings.)
Thank you.
It's problematic, yes. I feel it's sorta vilifying; in a "this is a problem we have, but we can't help it" sorta way. The what's and why someone is queer should have nothing to do with acceptance. People have agency over their own lives; nothing queer folk do harms anyone; thus there is no reason not to accept them and treat them equally.
While bigotry against white, cisgender, etc... isn't institutionalized on levels like sexism, homophobia and such; but that doesn't mean you can't be hateful towards these groups... :/
I think that's a problem with minorities in general; because they were discriminated against they think they can't engage is -isms.
(I've seen trans-bigotry, ace-bigotry coming from LGB, biphobia, trans supremacists, etc... )
I like having you around in the thread though. :c
And I'm really sorry about the whole argument last time...
Ugh, that's horrible. :/Last edited by Astrella; 2012-03-21 at 02:30 AM.
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2012-03-21, 02:21 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: LGBTAitP - Part 22: The Best There Is
Avatar by CoffeeIncluded
Oooh, and that's a bad miss.
“Don't exercise your freedom of speech until you have exercised your freedom of thought.”
― Tim Fargo
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2012-03-21, 02:43 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: LGBTAitP - Part 22: The Best There Is
I was never too fond of that "testing" thing - it sort of makes sense if you're questioning, but it's not like you can't tell whether you're attracted to someone just because they're wearing pants.
Honestly, I think you should take the promise back if you feel you'd be uncomfortable with it. I almost want to say you should even if you're okay with it, just because he made you promise it (I mean, that's so rude!). :/
If you are comfortable with it, though, there (hopefully) shouldn't be any harm in it. Even if the experiment proves what you already know, it could still be pretty awesome.
Yes I should...
I haven't actually had much trouble compartmentalizing (that may just be because I don't talk much in boymode), but I do have to go to great lengths to act like people who call me a girl aren't accidentally flattering me.
It was sorta odd for me; I figured out my gender stuff mostly through talking with a genderqueer friend; me identifying as a girl sorta felt like a "betrayal" or something I shouldn't. (I thought this way; she's been super supportive all through and helped me get over those feelings.)
(Sorry about that, I've been having trouble figuring out something else lately. :Shrug:)
Anyway, could you be so kind as to send some *hugs* to your friend from me? It's good to know you have someone to help you.
It's problematic, yes. I feel it's sorta vilifying; in a "this is a problem we have, but we can't help it" sorta way. The what's and why someone is queer should have nothing to do with acceptance. People have agency over their own lives; nothing queer folk do harms anyone; thus there is no reason not to accept them and treat them equally.
Besides, I prefer the line "we're here, we're queer - get over it!".
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2012-03-21, 02:57 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: LGBTAitP - Part 22: The Best There Is
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2012-03-21, 04:00 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: LGBTAitP - Part 22: The Best There Is
I think the general up-itself-ness of the queer community online is one of the reasons to avoid bits of it. Being LGBTQAwhatever does not mean that you can't be petty, shallow, stupid and attention-seeking, and it certainly isn't a total morality embargo.
I've seen a lot of the behaviour Musashi ranted about, and yeah, it is a bit endemic in places. Shame, really.Everything I say is 100% TRUTH*
*may contain traces of lie
Loki avatar by Dr.Bath.
(I totally ship him and Curly. But shhh, it's a secret.)
Formerly known as Aziraphale.
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2012-03-21, 04:06 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: LGBTAitP - Part 22: The Best There Is
It's sorta awkward sometimes because I second-guess myself doubly sometimes. I used to get bullied for being "girly" in mannerisms but they're starting to shine through again a bit which makes me self-conscious as to not draw overly attention. (Likely me overreaction, but.. )
Well; I meant more in a "identifying as a girl means I'm holding onto gender stereotypes and the like; I should be genderqueer" sorta way.
I'm lucky that I have a pretty supportive group of online friends.
-----
And at least it made me realize why I like Mulan so much. Reflection is a song that just rings so true.
Also, essential linky with regards to people being asses.Last edited by Astrella; 2012-03-21 at 04:10 AM.
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2012-03-21, 04:15 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: LGBTAitP - Part 22: The Best There Is
(eh, me too )You think that's a bit like demi-sexuals with what wiki says to be secondary sexual attraction, or just part of the idealization process?
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Ouch. It's weird, last I heard, anything anti-white was being called reverse racism like it's completely different. I love the way you censored it, although...what's that one about Polly's biscuits? *is dumbLast edited by squidbreath; 2012-03-21 at 04:40 AM.
░Avatar altered from sensate's░
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2012-03-21, 04:35 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: LGBTAitP - Part 22: The Best There Is
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2012-03-21, 05:08 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: LGBTAitP - Part 22: The Best There Is
Thanks for letting me rant last night, everyone. That's an issue I'm seeing more and more, and obviously, it's not something I can discuss at these places. Beside, I'm only lurking in these comms, in part because I know I will eventually say something that angers/offends people without even realizing it.
Feh. I keep ranting about egocentric issues instead of contributing to the conversation. I'm glad I at least managed to stay semi-coherent and civil. Too many censored words too, and I struggled not to write more swears I'd have to censor anyway. I swear like I use proper punctuation, it's terrible!
Aww. Thank you very much. *hugs*
Don't worry about it. It's mostly forgotten, and that was not even the kind of situation I was ranting about. That one was an exceptional discussion that allowed everyone to give their opinion, even though it got heated. I'm talking about casual displays of hate that disallow all feedback due to some weird kind of logical loop.
"Polly wants a cracker!"
SpoilerIn those same places, I learnt cracker was a derogatory term for white people, probably in reference to the cracking of whips of slave owners, something like that... I didn't see a definitive explanation beside "it's directed at white people".
@ Lil Shiro: I'm really glad he didn't get in trouble, he got lucky there. I know school enjoys punishing victim as much, if no more than the bullies.
Yeah, you're lucky to have each other.Originally Posted by on Dwarf Fortress succession gamesOriginally Posted by Dwarf Fortress 0.40.01 bugs
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2012-03-21, 05:09 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: LGBTAitP - Part 22: The Best There Is
That's ridiculous. The only way that's even halfway a legitimate thought is if one subscribes to a deeply flawed belief that everyone should be (or is) genderqueer. Which is just as bad and wrong as saying that everyone is bi and in varying degrees and states of denial which is just as wrong as denying that homosexuality exists like some homophobes do.
Indeed, if one is that uncertain, then one should just own up to being Questioning, really. Don't most people just know it, in a sort of know it in their bones kind of way except for people who are Questioning and those people who seem to permanently be in a state of flux on multiple fronts?
It's the sort of promise one shouldn't make, one shouldn't ask of someone else, and is largely meaningless and should not be tried to be called in and one should laugh in the face of anyone who tries to do so. Preferably rudely before giving them a lesson in basic ethics.
Fortunately genitalia and gonads don't have feelings or awareness themselves.
Or else we'd be in a lot worse shape than we already are.
Indeed... At times I catch myself imagining the hypothetical storms of excrement that will go down once science figures it out, and just what people who will refuse to acknowledge it will say instead.
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2012-03-21, 05:33 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: LGBTAitP - Part 22: The Best There Is
Well it was more a "I was born a boy; I don't know what being a girl is like; but I know I'm not a boy; gaaah; why is this so confusing; I don't have a right to claim I'm a girl; maybe I'm genderqueer?; but I just want to be seen as a girl, not genderqueer; why is this so confusingggg...." and couple that with a bunch of suppressed feeling surfacing.
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2012-03-21, 06:14 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: LGBTAitP - Part 22: The Best There Is
SpoilerIf I remember correctly, it did refer to the cracking of whips, but ones being used by cattle herders. Not entirely sure how it got to be a slur from that origin, unless herding cows was seen as a bad thing, but language is wonky. Though I got... Three hours of sleep, I think?... so that could be me misremembering, and it's also possible that that particular derivation is a regionalism.
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2012-03-21, 06:16 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: LGBTAitP - Part 22: The Best There Is
On the general topic of Musashi's rant:
SpoilerCome talk about my thesis on privilege, erasure, representation, etc. in queer studies.
Share your ideas, feelings, experiences, questions, thoughts, concerns, baked goods, etc.
i'll start out by explaining my thesis topic and showing some of what i've done so far. for a sneak peak, you can go to one of my thesis blogs, which is: [snip]
then we will spend the rest of the time talking about queer studies as an academic discipline, accessibility of the texts, whitewashing of queerness, and more
it will be a great time for sure
snacks as always
maybe ace credit, maybe not, let me know if you're into that
also, this event is only open to individuals that identify as l,g,b,t,(or)q as my thesis is solely about queer perspectives & experiences
ps please invite your friends!!
See that bolded bit?
Clearly somebody has failed to understand the point of her own thesis. Preaching to the choir is rather pointless, so the only reason to write something like that is to spread awareness to other, more privileged groups. Intentionally excluding them kind of defeats the purpose.
If you want to change the culture of privilege, power, and difference (book title), don't exclude the people who need to learn about their own privilege, and definitely don't alienate those people who realise their privilege and are trying to work with you to create equality.
So, who wants to bet I won't be allowed in because asexual doesn't count as queer?
Edit: I just realised she didn't even give a time or place, so my last question is kind of moot.
Also:
I love this site.Last edited by noparlpf; 2012-03-21 at 06:19 AM.
Jude P.
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2012-03-21, 06:35 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: LGBTAitP - Part 22: The Best There Is
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2012-03-21, 06:38 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: LGBTAitP - Part 22: The Best There Is
Indeed. Preaching to the choir like that only means that when she actually has to defend her thesis for reals (unless you've got some kind of insanely disproportionate faculty ratios going on) she's not going to have a leg to stand on.
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2012-03-21, 07:03 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: LGBTAitP - Part 22: The Best There Is
Haha; "Only queer faculty can judge my thesis!"
Jude P.
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2012-03-21, 07:03 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: LGBTAitP - Part 22: The Best There Is
Spoiler
Well, no one wants to educate the ignorant/oblivious. Sure, no one should had to educate someone who offended them, and one should educate oneself. That would happen in a world that approaches perfection better than ours.
However? Discussions are getting inane and insane (this last word, by the way, is also offensive in some circles) because of this principle.Spoiler"[Use of a bad word in an ignorant but innocent context]"
"Did you seriously say that? You [insult]"
"Wait, what? What did I say?"
"You used [bad word]! It's bad! That's terrible!"
"Really? I'm sorry, I had no idea, it's always been used in a neutral way where I live! How is it bad? Where does it come from?"
"We're not here to educate you! Educate yourself! You [something]-centrist [insult]!"
"Why are you mad at me?"
"You're using the tone argument now? [Link to Derailing for Dummies]"
"Could you please not use [something]-ist insults at me at least?"
"[something]-ism doesn't exist, you idiot!"
"I'm sorry you were offended... by the way, if you're insulting someone just because they are [something they did not choose], that's technically -ist..."
"No, you're just sorry you got caught and that we dared being offended at the obvious insults you threw at us. By the way, you're now banned because you're too thick to understand anything! Goodbye, [insult]!"
In short, no one actually learns anything, and everyone pats each others on the back for driving away decent people who made the mistake of not knowing everything there is to know.
What you're describing here is the same, only without the aggressiveness. Hardly better.
SpoilerThanks!
Yeah.
Another "funny" side effect to the phenomenon I described is that certain definitions are considered wrong by these people, generally those that end with -ism or -phobia. The justification for that is that dictionaries are written by white straight cismales, and their definitions tainted by their point of view.
Alright, but then, do I really have to check Internet for the "proper" definitions? How can I know for sure the websites I'm checking for research aren't biased too? (That question never came up, but I'm fairly certain the answer would be "if it's written by an oppressed minority, then it can't be biased, silly!".)
And while some words are obviously bad and should not be used, there are many others who don't look offensive at first glance. Ideally, research should be made before using these, that I agree on. But we're reaching a point where MANY words have bad connotations. Should we research every single word we want to sue? Where, if dictionaries are unreliable?Originally Posted by on Dwarf Fortress succession gamesOriginally Posted by Dwarf Fortress 0.40.01 bugs
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2012-03-21, 07:16 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: LGBTAitP - Part 22: The Best There Is
Exactly. Just because half a dozen people in one place on the internet consider "cookie" to be a bad word doesn't mean anybody else has any way of knowing that. Yes, it would be nice if people knew things on their own. On the other hand, schools and teachers exist because it doesn't work that way. And nobody learns everything in school. When somebody doesn't know something that you think they should know, and they're expressing interest in learning, yeah, teaching them is the right thing to do, whether you "ought" to have to or not.
And you want inane? In my Gender Studies class, we frequently had a couple of people shouting the same things back and forth at each other, getting louder each time.Jude P.
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2012-03-21, 07:51 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: LGBTAitP - Part 22: The Best There Is
Darn tootin'. These days, I almost want to cringe in horror when someone identifies themselves as part of a gay subculture (such as being a "bear") just because of the rep that sort of thing has earned. Yet at the same time, I know I'm also selling those non-arrogant people short by doing that.
Just because she's not satisfactorily sure of her orientation doesn't mean you aren't too. The whole promise you had to make to your friend seems kind of insulting, because really, why should she care so much to have you make that promise? The fact that it would need to be a three-way for you to even "get it up" should say enough by itself.
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2012-03-21, 07:52 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: LGBTAitP - Part 22: The Best There Is
Jaysus, ye've been going fast since I left. Lucky Nope is around to say what we think!
Also, I just suggested Asta to make the new thread because I like the idea of passing the thread-making around so I picked a person I hadn't seen make one. Trisc works just as well.
Also also, first post, I would again like to point out that it was Qaera who made the dictionary and me who added it to the first post. Obviously it's not a huge big deal, but just to say.
I had a similar situation come up yesterday; the LGBT Officer on the student union committee of my college apparently has to be L, G, B or T. I was unable to discern if other letters "counted", but apparently A for Ally doesn't. I can understand, in both these cases, wanting to keep the focus on the people who are most important to the thing and also often overlooked, but I think it would do equally well and be more justifiable and less exclusionary to include allies and just say that people who are espouse intolerant beliefs about LGBT+ people aren't allowed. After all, I don't think many non-LGBT+ people would run for LGBT Officer anyway. I do wonder if I would count, with my heteronormative relationship. Would I have to "prove" I'm bi? (A straight person can just claim to be bi, I suppose. How would you stop them from getting in?! )
Cheerfairy, Kenderwoman and Geologist by Succubus, Feminist Geomancer by Astrella, Kender Wizard by me
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2012-03-21, 07:55 AM (ISO 8601)
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2012-03-21, 08:03 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: LGBTAitP - Part 22: The Best There Is
This sort of attitude pisses me off. If I lived anywhere close to you I would attend this (I'm allowed to since my letter is in her list) and give her a piece of my mind and point out the blatant -ism going on here (Not sure which -ism it is but it is one (Sexism? Sexuality-ism?))
"Elephant trunks should be used for elephant things only. Nothing else."
Thank you Geomancer for the Death avatar.
My lets plays:
Alien vs Predator: marine chapter - Completed
Singularity - Canceled
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2012-03-21, 08:14 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: LGBTAitP - Part 22: The Best There Is
Just changed my name on Facebook, MSN and Skype. This is a scary thing.
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2012-03-21, 08:21 AM (ISO 8601)
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Re: LGBTAitP - Part 22: The Best There Is
Avatar by CoffeeIncluded
Oooh, and that's a bad miss.
“Don't exercise your freedom of speech until you have exercised your freedom of thought.”
― Tim Fargo