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2012-08-16, 03:15 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Dec 2009
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- Birmingham, AL
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2012-08-16, 03:16 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jan 2007
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Re: OOTS #860 - The Discussion Thread
Oh, ok. Wanted to make sure it was just that, and nothing relevant had actually been said. Gloating about a mistake before one realizes it IS a mistake is entirely immaterial. Of COURSE V would gloat about it then, he very clearly wasn't thinking things through.
If he had actually gloated about it to Haley or Roy or -anyone once he came to his senses- then that would actually go to prove what Kish is apparently trying to prove. However, as I recall, he has maintained a shamed silence as to the entire affair.Official Incense Aroma Specialist for the Vaarsuvius Fan Club!
English isn't my primary language, so please let me know if something I'm saying doesn't make sense!Continuation of ThePhantasm's awesometacular post
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2012-08-16, 03:40 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Oct 2010
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Re: OOTS #860 - The Discussion Thread
Ding ding ding! We have a winner:
A language-dependent spell uses intelligible language as a medium for communication. If the target cannot understand or cannot hear what the caster of a language-dependant spell says the spell fails.Plague Doctor by Crimmy
Ext. Sig (Handbooks/Creations)
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2012-08-16, 04:43 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Nov 2004
Re: OOTS #860 - The Discussion Thread
Orth Plays: Currently Baldur's Gate II
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2012-08-16, 05:01 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jan 2008
Re: Did Nale hear Sabine say she loves him forever?
This. The way the text is displayed is analogous to sound effects (splorch) and background noise (rumble), so it probably came out like a whisper/echo, not understood by anyone. I doubt Tarquin would be focussing on the whispers from an unseen succi when the party is under attack.
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2012-08-16, 05:03 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Oct 2010
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Re: Did Nale hear Sabine say she loves him forever?
It's possible, if Nale thinks back on the event later when he gets a more quiet moment, that he could puzzle out what her lips were saying.
But perhaps I'm being a bit too charitable. After all, I can't wait for the entire LG to kick the bucket.Plague Doctor by Crimmy
Ext. Sig (Handbooks/Creations)
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2012-08-16, 05:36 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Mar 2010
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- Lake Wobegon
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Re: OOTS #860 - The Discussion Thread
Will this do?
Here's V, standing in front of Inky, wearing one of her very very few [satisfied?] smiles, explaining that she "vanquished the dragon." Should you doubt that she is gloating here, compare her gloating to Roy and Miko about her previous accomplishments in dragon-slaying. Note also that she said this line after losing Haerta due to Inky's shock to her mental system.
Oh, and Kish? Next time find your own citations.Last edited by zimmerwald1915; 2012-08-16 at 05:39 PM.
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2012-08-16, 05:46 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Mar 2008
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Re: OOTS #860 - The Discussion Thread
I don't hate V. I just think that her value to the party has declined drastically from the moment s/he/it ran away at Azure City. The feedback loop of his mental problems interfering with her performance, which increases its mental problems, has about rendered all of the above useless...and absent.
Last edited by stsasser; 2012-08-16 at 05:47 PM.
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2012-08-16, 06:43 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Jan 2007
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Re: OOTS #860 - The Discussion Thread
Uuuuh... no? That is VERY much not "after he came to his senses." He didn't truly consider the gravity of his actions until about here, and even then it is unclear whether V is forlorn over casting familicide itself, or in blowing his chance to end Xykon by not approaching the problem intelligently.
Actually, let me talk a bit over familicide itself. I think most everyone agrees that Familicide is a terrible, terrible spell and would still be so even if it did nothing BUT kill Black Dragons.
However, a lot of people are taking that and applying it against V incorrectly. V lives in OOTSland, a land where Goblins are farmed for XP by PC races, where kobalds can and will be slaughtered with nothing but a bounty on their head, and where Dragons are "color coded for your convenience!" to let you know if you can kill them or not. Even snapping a demon's neck while helpless and imprisoned doesn't get so much as a bat of the eye from a Paladin-jailer because, hey, its a demon
The world of OOTS is very explicitly set up to follow and subvert D&D conventions and I hope and expect V to slowly come to realize how incorrect these conventions are... however what I -don't- accept is this bizarre hatred of V for following the rules and conventions of the whole bloody setting.
Yes, V was wrong. No, I don't think V realizes that killing only Dragons would still have been wrong, and no I don't think it is reasonable to expect V to realize that.
To parallel with the real world slightly... there are a number of cultures that do a number of things which I disagree with, and I will be very vocal in my disagreeance. However, I don't consider everyone in that culture evil hideous people for behaving in a way which their culture has taught them is ok, I consider them human beings. I will disagree and try and rationally tell them why I think they're wrong, but I won't condemn them for acting exactly as they have been trained to act every moment of their life up until that point.Official Incense Aroma Specialist for the Vaarsuvius Fan Club!
English isn't my primary language, so please let me know if something I'm saying doesn't make sense!Continuation of ThePhantasm's awesometacular post
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2012-08-16, 06:54 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jul 2009
Re: OOTS #860 - The Discussion Thread
I hope the other mummies weren't destroyed by the Holy Word, but rather fell in another pit and on top of V, either crushing or mummy rotting the prick.
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2012-08-16, 09:21 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Apr 2012
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- Hey, look! Squirrels!
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Re: OOTS #860 - The Discussion Thread
Last edited by Emperordaniel; 2012-08-16 at 09:22 PM.
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2012-08-16, 10:03 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Jan 2012
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2012-08-16, 10:04 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Sep 2006
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- Michigan
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Re: Did Nale hear Sabine say she loves him forever?
The kobold goes first.
I would be a procrastinator, but I keep putting it off.
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2012-08-16, 10:12 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Jan 2012
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2012-08-17, 01:35 AM (ISO 8601)
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- May 2009
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- Seattle
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Re: OOTS #860 - The Discussion Thread
Rumor has it the next Kickstarter Stretch Goal was going to be new, numbered smilies for facilitating intractable forum debates, e.g. "HateVaarsuviusReasonNumber17", "MikoMorallyJustifiedReason6".
Then instead of typing these repetitious arguments, one could merely select the appropriate image from the exhaustive catalog of already-discussed points. The savings in server traffic alone would have morally justified it!
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2012-08-17, 01:43 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Oct 2007
Re: OOTS #860 - The Discussion Thread
It's interesting that the linked page shows her passing up a bow with the seeking enchantment, which would have negated the miss chance from the smoke, with the reasoning that "she has a feat that can do most of that already."
I wonder what that feat is and if it doesn't work against smoke.
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2012-08-17, 02:10 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Feb 2007
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- Manchester, UK
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2012-08-17, 11:00 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Jun 2004
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Re: OOTS #860 - The Discussion Thread
There is also a fair chance that the mummies will be vaporized by traps a little further down the corridor. These seem to be unintelligent undead, so without Malack to instruct them, a single trap could destroy each in turn, without the mummies bothering to learn from the annihilation of their comrade immediately before them.
I owe Peelee 5 Quatloos. But I am going double or nothing that Durkon will be casting 8th level spells at the big finale.
I bet Goblin_Priest 5 quatloos that Xykon does not know RC has the phylactery at this point in the tale (#1139).
Using my Bardic skills I see the fate of Belkar...so close!
Using my Bardic skills I see the fate of goblinkind!
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2012-08-17, 11:05 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Jun 2004
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Re: OOTS #860 - The Discussion Thread
I owe Peelee 5 Quatloos. But I am going double or nothing that Durkon will be casting 8th level spells at the big finale.
I bet Goblin_Priest 5 quatloos that Xykon does not know RC has the phylactery at this point in the tale (#1139).
Using my Bardic skills I see the fate of Belkar...so close!
Using my Bardic skills I see the fate of goblinkind!
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2012-08-17, 11:06 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jun 2004
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Re: OOTS #860 - The Discussion Thread
The usual ruling would be that if the Suggestion is not understood by the target, the target does not comply. And it is one single suggestion, limited to a sentence or two. Nale already tried to make his suggestion, and further input to Belkar is irrelevant.
This is an area where the Giant sometimes bends the rules, which is okay because it is a topic that is (A) funny, and (B) often accidentally (or on purpose) misplayed at the table.I owe Peelee 5 Quatloos. But I am going double or nothing that Durkon will be casting 8th level spells at the big finale.
I bet Goblin_Priest 5 quatloos that Xykon does not know RC has the phylactery at this point in the tale (#1139).
Using my Bardic skills I see the fate of Belkar...so close!
Using my Bardic skills I see the fate of goblinkind!
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2012-08-17, 11:27 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Dec 2009
Re: Did Nale hear Sabine say she loves him forever?
Anyone else a bit creeped out by that line? From a mortal it would be an expression of devotion but from a fiend it sounds more like a euphemism for what is going to happen to his soul when it inevitably winds up in the lower planes...
This is the same couple who saw betraying and ritually sacrificing someone as a romantic evening, after all
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2012-08-17, 11:42 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Aug 2011
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- Germany
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Re: OOTS #860 - The Discussion Thread
The shift in perspective is kinda awesome! In any earlier confrontation we as the Order preparing for stuff (or not) and then getting surprised / ambushed by the enemy. Now we see the "enemy" in the Order's place and they are doing the ambushing.
It feels pretty unusual, but as I suddenly feel sorry for Sabine and Nale after I pretty much despised them every time they showed themselves before.. It works very good.Playing Magic? Interested in trading? Try Pucatrade!
Trading cards for pucapoints, which you can use to have people send you cards. Just shoot me a message if you got questions.
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2012-08-17, 01:46 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Oct 2010
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Re: OOTS #860 - The Discussion Thread
Plague Doctor by Crimmy
Ext. Sig (Handbooks/Creations)
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2012-08-17, 02:53 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Jan 2007
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Re: OOTS #860 - The Discussion Thread
Official Incense Aroma Specialist for the Vaarsuvius Fan Club!
English isn't my primary language, so please let me know if something I'm saying doesn't make sense!Continuation of ThePhantasm's awesometacular post
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2012-08-17, 03:01 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jan 2012
Re: OOTS #860 - The Discussion Thread
Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but the way I read the SRD description of Suggestion is that the caster gets only one shot to make the suggestion understood, but if it is understood then the victim may spend the entire duration of the spell behaving as suggested. I don't think the duration (1hr/lvl) allows new suggestions later.
On the other hand, Nale clearly disagrees with me, as he repeats the command to Belkar.
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2012-08-17, 03:20 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Aug 2011
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- Germany
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Playing Magic? Interested in trading? Try Pucatrade!
Trading cards for pucapoints, which you can use to have people send you cards. Just shoot me a message if you got questions.
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2012-08-17, 06:59 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Jan 2007
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Re: OOTS #860 - The Discussion Thread
No it isn't. Rich doesn't let the rules bind him, but he doesn't outright violate them either. In the entire comic, he only ever breaks the rules when he:
A) Forgets about the specifics and doesn't look them up
B) Runs into an extremely specific and small rule which he doesn't end up following as it is somewhat counter-intuitive.
This is neither scenario.Official Incense Aroma Specialist for the Vaarsuvius Fan Club!
English isn't my primary language, so please let me know if something I'm saying doesn't make sense!Continuation of ThePhantasm's awesometacular post
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2012-08-18, 12:18 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- May 2008
Re: OOTS #860 - The Discussion Thread
C) Breaks the rules/inserts house rules to make the comic funny.
Exhibit A: http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0352.html, and the following panel, http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0353.html
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2012-08-18, 12:28 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Aug 2011
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- Germany
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Re: OOTS #860 - The Discussion Thread
Playing Magic? Interested in trading? Try Pucatrade!
Trading cards for pucapoints, which you can use to have people send you cards. Just shoot me a message if you got questions.
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2012-08-18, 01:17 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jul 2009
Re: OOTS #860 - The Discussion Thread
Having Belkar's eyes turn spiral-y and glow with Nale's magic aura yet having it turn out the spell simply didn't work at all would violate the comic's internal logic (that altered eyes equals an enchantment spell was successfully cast and affected the target). I think the comic's own internal logic and consistency is more important than the game rules.
Of course, the comic's internal logic can always be violated for the sake of comedy.