Girl Genius XIII: "Gott's Leedle Feesh in Trousers!"

[Mando Knight]

Other possibilities:

1.) Evolution of art style. The new design is a retcon of the old.
2.) Different breeds of Queens for different circumstances. More active/aggressive ones for locations further away from the Other's power base, more sedentary ones for maximum wasp production. Training the mega-weasels against the more aggressive version is natural.

[Landis963]

No glass dome, I'll grant you, along with the apparent lack of Hive engine and lubricant. However, the limbs are exactly the same, and the "portholes" could just the ports where the cables attach (doesn't explain the one in its mouth, but that could be a breathing mask during gestation or something). My guess is that it's a fake hive queen built by Klaus during the experiments that led to Vg's betrayal and Agatha's escape, which I believe was your thought as well. The hive engine could just as well have been broken in the crash. Of course, the fact that it was able to crawl out is a testament to Klaus' ability to make things durable, or The Other's advancement of her design.
EDIT: of course, it could be a retcon in order to facilitate dynamic scenes. What do the books say on the subject?

[BRC]

Or, this is a more Mature Queen. The other queen had just been activated, maybe this is what happens if it's been running a while.

[Gez]

Or it could just be that they aren't mass-produced products out of an assembly line. Furthermore, the glass sphere is for storage and transportation, a sort of stasis chamber. The one on the airship did not have had much reason to go around and explore, but this one here right now is in a burning airship that might explode, so it would give her good reasons to get out of her bubble and find some other place to hide.

[dextercorvia]

This is a Virgin Queen. The other is what one looks like who has been attached to a hive engine. Queen Bees and Ants have an ambulatory phase before mating -- Presumably so does the slaver wasp queen (or whatever mad science takes the place of mating).

[HandofShadows]

Presumably so does the slaver wasp queen (or whatever mad science takes the place of mating).

Five gallons of Brain Bleach needed in this thread right away! We will need more shortly!

[BRC]

Five gallons of Brain Bleach needed in this thread right away! We will need more shortly!

*Smacks HandofShadows with an Amnesia Pie*
That should do.
Personally, my guess is Art Evolution, eventually justified as a different type of Wasp Queen. Though the idea of a more aggressive Warrior-queen vs a more sedentiary "Breeder" Queen makes sense to me.

Or, maybe this is what happens when a Queen gets separated from it's engine. People refer to "Hive Engines", not "Queens", making me think they are two different things. Maybe it works like this

A Hive Engine provides the materials, serving as a spawning ground for Wasps. The Engine produces Warrior Wasps. The Queen defends the engine and produces the more specialized Slaver Wasps. Eventually, either because the Engine is destroyed or it runs out of wasp-stuff, the Queen can detach itself from the engine and become a frontline combatant.

[ShinyCap]

"Everything Making vit de Perfect Sense" for next thread title!

[petersohn]

"Everything Making vit de Perfect Sense" for next thread title!

The next thread is a little bit away, I think.

[Landis963]

"Everything Making vit de Perfect Sense" for next thread title!

Keep the idea on a sticky note or something though, it's pretty good.

[ShinyCap]

The next thread is a little bit away, I think.

I'm pretty sure this isn't the first time someone's suggested a title in the middle of the thread. It'll probably get forgotten by New Thread Time, but I thought it was worth saying anyway.

[Traab]

*Smacks HandofShadows with an Amnesia Pie*
That should do.
Personally, my guess is Art Evolution, eventually justified as a different type of Wasp Queen. Though the idea of a more aggressive Warrior-queen vs a more sedentiary "Breeder" Queen makes sense to me.

Or, maybe this is what happens when a Queen gets separated from it's engine. People refer to "Hive Engines", not "Queens", making me think they are two different things. Maybe it works like this

A Hive Engine provides the materials, serving as a spawning ground for Wasps. The Engine produces Warrior Wasps. The Queen defends the engine and produces the more specialized Slaver Wasps. Eventually, either because the Engine is destroyed or it runs out of wasp-stuff, the Queen can detach itself from the engine and become a frontline combatant.

Or it could be like the xenomorphs. The Alien queens could either sit there and be breeders, farting out alien eggs, or they could detach themselves from the egg sack, and go out slaughtering.

[petersohn]

I'm pretty sure this isn't the first time someone's suggested a title in the middle of the thread. It'll probably get forgotten by New Thread Time, but I thought it was worth saying anyway.

This title was also suggested around like page 40. Well, 10 is just 1/4th of that.

[Old Curmudgeon]

Nothing's wrong with the monster. Weighed down as he is, Tarvek has probably been assessed as a "sure thing" in the meal department. However, since General Kristian was one of the individuals that Tarvek made his "Run!" suggestion to, I expect there'll be a jäger intervention. Poor Jordi may not get to bake his bug pie after all. Then again, given jäger cameradie, maybe the victors will ask him to do the cooking.

The conscience weasel is cute but we now have some more information that would indicate that the scene of Agatha repairing the jägers may not be one for the squeamish. Jordi has indicated that he can heal broken bones and shoulder joints, so any jäger sent to Mama's to wait for a Heterodyne is obviously in worse shape than Higgs was after he was shot (by his own side after meeting the nesting goose and before he could make his report). Coupled with Dimo's remark to Lars "I iz not dead. Anything else can be fixed.", it paints a grim picture.

Does anyone else find the jägers a bit off as products of evil Heterodyne sparks? As far as we know, every jäger was personally selected by whoever was the current Heterodyne. Most of the jägers we've meet so far have been sentimental romantics with rather bubbly personalities. More than a few of them are smart, educated and seem to be excellent judges of character on rather short acquaintance. While there might be some reason an evil spark would want lackeys like that (Maybe it just makes for a more pleasant day if you're not surrounded by a bunch of grumps), it doesn't feel very evil. Come to that, aside from their ferocity in battle and questionable taste in food, it's a little difficult to see how they got their apparent bad reputation in Zum and the rest of Europe. Unless it's simply the case that other sparks lackeys couldn't take a teddy bear from a toddler and therefore never successfully conquered/sacked anything (which doesn't seem to be the case). The jägers seem like fairly decent sorts as conquerors go.

Oh, and as for the observation of a possible difference in dialect, it may actually be a difference in language. Beetleburg, Mechanicsburg and the original Castle Wulfenbach were all in the Balkans. I could also see them as formerly part of the Austro-Hungarian Empire or equivalent. Most of the jägers sound rather German (or Austrian) but I find it hard not to think of Jenka’s speech as sounding Slavic (think Natasha Fatale from the old Rocky cartoons). Given Mechanicsburg’s position (at the bend of the Olt River, a little further east than modern Cisnadie, Romania), it’s not unreasonable to assume that there are Slavic speakers in the area.

[hajo]

As far as we know, every jäger was personally selected by whoever was the current Heterodyne.

Normal people choose to become a jaeger, by their own free will.

[Gez]

Normal people choose to become a jaeger, by their own free will.

That's not incompatible with them also being handpicked by the Heterodynes.

Either some soldiers volunteer for Jägerification and the Heterodyne choose some of these volunteers; or an invitation is extended to some soldiers by the Heterodyne and then they can accept or decline. It's also possible that both mechanisms exist simultaneously.

[factotum]

Coupled with Dimo's remark to Lars "I iz not dead. Anything else can be fixed.", it paints a grim picture.

I think that's mainly bravado on Dimo's part--I don't see any sign he's been able to "fix" his missing arm yet, although the fact he survived such an injury without any treatment shows how tough Jaegers are in any case.

[endoperez]

I think that's mainly bravado on Dimo's part--I don't see any sign he's been able to "fix" his missing arm yet, although the fact he survived such an injury without any treatment shows how tough Jaegers are in any case.

It can be fixed by a spark, and a Jäger will only let a Heterodyne to do the fixing.

[Ailurus]

Hmmm, now we need Snoz or Franz to show up and smack that thing around. Either that, or a fight between all the generals and it - that would be pretty cool too.

[Qwertystop]

I KNEW it wasn't supposed to be moving around!

[petersohn]

On the next page, Agatha will appear and blast the wasp with her death ray.

Or possibly the generals will intervene.

[Grey_Wolf_c]

Most of the jägers we've meet so far have been sentimental romantics with rather bubbly personalities. More than a few of them are smart, educated and seem to be excellent judges of character on rather short acquaintance. While there might be some reason an evil spark would want lackeys like that (Maybe it just makes for a more pleasant day if you're not surrounded by a bunch of grumps), it doesn't feel very evil.

I suspect that the Jaegers reflect the personality of their master. Their last master was the boys, and thus they adopted their sunny, trusting disposition. But they keep hoping that their new master will turn out to be one of the "fun" ones, which they define as "those willing to lead us in bloody conquest". I suspect that in those circumstances, bloodlust would quickly set in to the jaegerkin, and you would definitely not want to be on the opposite side of them.

But yes, they clearly enjoy what they do, which goes a long way to explain why they are happy most of the time: from their perspective, why wouldn't they be happy?

Grey Wolf

[eee]

This is a Virgin Queen.

I dub her, 'Elizabeth'!!!

Nothing's wrong with the monster. Weighed down as he is, Tarvek has probably been assessed as a "sure thing" in the meal department.

It might also be the weasels. The weasels REALLY hate Wasps; it's possible Wasps feel the same way about the weasels. And Tarvek's got a half dozen or so of them on him, SCREEing at her non-stop. That might be like waving a flag at a bull...

However, since General Kristian was one of the individuals that Tarvek made his "Run!" suggestion to, I expect there'll be a jäger intervention. Poor Jordi may not get to bake his bug pie after all. Then again, given jäger cameradie, maybe the victors will ask him to do the cooking.

I would assume all the Generals are at hand or nearby. Elizabeth may be about to meet her matches.

Does anyone else find the jägers a bit off as products of evil Heterodyne sparks? As far as we know, every jäger was personally selected by whoever was the current Heterodyne. Most of the jägers we've meet so far have been sentimental romantics with rather bubbly personalities. More than a few of them are smart, educated and seem to be excellent judges of character on rather short acquaintance. While there might be some reason an evil spark would want lackeys like that (Maybe it just makes for a more pleasant day if you're not surrounded by a bunch of grumps), it doesn't feel very evil. Come to that, aside from their ferocity in battle and questionable taste in food, it's a little difficult to see how they got their apparent bad reputation in Zum and the rest of Europe. Unless it's simply the case that other sparks lackeys couldn't take a teddy bear from a toddler and therefore never successfully conquered/sacked anything (which doesn't seem to be the case). The jägers seem like fairly decent sorts as conquerors go.

The bad feelings towards the Jagers might be holdovers from the feelings towards the Heterodynes, who after all WERE crazy mad dog conquerers, raiders, and general trouble-makers. As to the Jagers and their oddly pleasant natures, natural attrition might account for some of this. Really bad, crazy, or vicious Jagers would wind up getting in fights with other Jagers, being first in line to take on the unstoppable enemy monsters, or would just plain lose it after hundreds of years and have to be put down. What we are looking at may be the ones who survived due to personality more than physical ability. Also, don't forget, the Jagers have been through several decades of civilizing experience lately. The Boys may not have been every fond of them, but they apparently kept the Jager Corps on a short enough leash that many of them took up knitting to pass the time. And while Klaus put them to work, he wouldn't have liked having psychopathic Jagers running around damaging his empire building - DuPree was probably bad enough - and really bad Jagers may have had 'accidents'. Or been out and out shot. And a lot of the Jagers we've met are officers, generals, or exceptional ones like the Boyz; these may be the cream of the crop, and we just haven't encountered the dregs yet. Except for Vole.

[Calemyr]

Heterodynes, as they have been described thus far, aren't your standard sort of evil. They are painted as a "fun" evil. They seemed to love to fight and cause trouble, but were generally good to their own men. The Jaegers are probably a pretty good approximation of what they were like - amoral rather than immoral, always looking for the next big enemy to test themselves against, and more practical than they are given credit for. After all, why worry about conquest when you can scare them enough to just give you the tribute without all the civic management?

Jaegers are sweet and funny and likable to us, because we are placed on a side they are loyal to. An enemy would have a different opinion view altogether, where they are implacable killing machines that know no fear, admit no pain, and indeed only get more energetic the stronger their opposition is. To someone on the other side of the battle lines, they're probably far scarier than bugs or revenents, because the Other's agents have no free will. The Jaegers will hunt you down, butcher your town, arrange your bodies in compromising positions, and walk away laughing about how today was a 'goot day'. And they will do this not because they were ordered to, but because they were asked to.

[Spamotron]

Well, most of the other Sparks were out to Conquer Europa the Heterodynes were Raiders. From the local peasant's perspective life didn't change much if they were conquered (unless their town had the misfortune of being in the way of a Doomsday Weapon of course). The new spark would want to hold and defend your town as part of his empire different constructs enforcing the new bosses will different preferences for tribute but other than that day to day life moved on.

But the Heterodynes were different. As soon as they were done pillaging they would leave. Leaving all defenses shattered all leadership dead and your town easy pickings for the vultures. Even if the Heterodynes and Jaegers were somewhat honorable and restricted their rampage to the Spark in charge and the Spark's military and left the civilians alone. Afterwards horrible things would happen from less honorable opportunists.

[petersohn]

Were the Heterodynes honorable? do we know anything about this? All we know is that they were loved by their own people, and feared by everyone else.

[Grey_Wolf_c]

Were the Heterodynes honorable? do we know anything about this? All we know is that they were loved by their own people, and feared by everyone else.

Probably not, but that wasn't Spamotron's point. As he said, "Even if the Heterodynes and Jaegers were somewhat honorable" the consequences of their actions would still mean they would be hated all across Europe. If they weren't honorable, that'd just be another reason to hate them.

Edit: I say "Probably not" because, for one thing, honorable behaviour is in the eye of the beholder. Honorable Japanese behaviour can be bizarre to European standards and vice versa. But even taking that into account, everything we have heard is that they were cut-throats, pirates, thieves and backstabbers* even amongst themselves, and that was the qualities they admired. Honor, no matter how you define it, was probably low on their list of priorities.

Grey Wolf

*lit. "the most depraved, unstable, crazed maniacs in the world!" If Von Mekkan is to be believed

[Icedaemon]

Perhaps the 'nesting' queens are covered in nutritious gunk which allows them to focus completely on wasp production. Removed from the substance, they are more warrior like. Other differences can be accounted for this being a different model.

[HandofShadows]

Kinda odd though Jorgi who seems to be an officer and as violent as any other Jaeger seems quite capable of sacrificing himself so that Tarvek could get out. That is not the attitude of total monsters. So they do seem to have some sort of standards. Though, I doubt few people would be able to apreaciate them.

[Grey_Wolf_c]

Kinda odd though Jorgi who seems to be an officer and as violent as any other Jaeger seems quite capable of sacrificing himself so that Tarvek could get out.

Errr... no, that's not what I got from that scene. Jorgi just seemed to assume that there was no way Tarvek could take him along (what with Tarvek being already laden down). Jorgi didn't think he'd help keep Tarvek alive by staying behind, only that there was no other way. It's more a "you're not good enough to carry us all out" than "if you leave me behind, the rest might make it", if you will.

Edit: In fact, talking about monsters, I find Jorgi's complete indifference to his own death quite inhuman.

Grey Wolf