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Thread: Rules Questions
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2007-07-25, 07:01 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Apr 2007
Re: Rules Questions
Yes, on your next turn you can exit the room and explore another. You don't have to fight the dragon again.
I misspoke in that sentence. Actually, the "employee exit" turned up on the 3rd floor, and the description says it has a ladder going down (which would mean to Xykon's floor). So how does that work?
And while we're at it: there can be only one found staircase, and there's the "employee exit", and I read in this thread there's another card giving a staircase. So there can be 3 staircases on the same floor? What happens if it's the last floor before Xykon?
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2007-07-26, 09:58 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jul 2007
Re: Rules Questions
Thanks, that helps a lot.
I remembered another question: If I get help from other players for the top monster and win, then decide to fight the next one, does the help still stay, or do I have to ask again?
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2007-07-26, 12:36 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Nov 2005
- Location
- Houston, TX
- Gender
Re: Rules Questions
Owner of APE Games.
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2007-08-02, 11:40 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Aug 2007
- Location
- Argentina
- Gender
Re: Rules Questions
If some one plays the Screw This card that breaks a weapon shtick on the Greenhilt sword, then roy would not be able to benefit from the great cleave shtick rigth...that shtick only works with the green hilt sword?
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2007-08-03, 07:31 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Aug 2006
Re: Rules Questions
Yes, great cleave only works on the greenhilt sword.
Do not be afraid to joust a giant just because some people insist on believing in windmills.
FOSS Moonbase Commander remake @ http://code.google.com/p/tether
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2007-08-07, 10:31 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Aug 2003
- Location
- Philadelphia, PA
- Gender
Re: Roy Shtick questions
Roy is correct. Because he may flip the card at any time, he may even flip it between the time he is asked to assist and the time that he gives his answer. Once the card is flipped, the text regarding not being allowed to refuse is no longer in play, and Roy can do what he wants. The "penalty" here is that now Roy must rest before he can regain the benefit of Fearless Leader--and Roy is not a character who needs to rest very often.
No; one Loot card per player, and only a flat +2 bonus is gained.
Yes.
No. As per the FAQ, an NPC can't make the decision to accept or not accept anything but the "standard contract" for Loot: "Player gives Loot with Drool Factor X, NPC gives +2X bonus." Anything that deviates from that can't be used with an NPC unless specifically stated so on the card text.
Yes.
It is fairly powerful, but remember this: If Durkon refuses, Roy has lost that Loot for no gain. In the "standard contract", if the player refuses, the player battling keeps the Loot, no harm, no foul. So Roy is opening himself up to Durkon partly screwing him by refusing. If Roy takes to constantly discarding other people's Loot, he's going to end up with no one accepting his offers anymore, and soon he won't have much of a Loot stash.
Yes, Roy loses the card for no benefit.
Meat Shield (and cards like it) protect only against the first Wound suffered. Extra Wounds are, indeed, considered an "other result" in this case.
Correct. Great Cleavage only works with the Greenhilt Sword shtick, so that anythign that denies Roy the usage of the Greenhilt Sword makes Great Cleavage useless.Ignore that! I didn't go and read the Great Cleavage card!
Actual answer: Incorrect. Great Cleavage is NOT like Sneak Attack or Leaping Attack: it does not specify any single Battle Shtick that must be used in order to gain the bonus. If the Greenhilt Sword gets broken, you are free to whip out the Bag of Tricks or your bare hands and keep going.Rich Burlew
Now Available: 2023 OOTS Holiday Ornament plus a big pile of new t-shirt designs (that you can also get on mugs and stuff)!
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2007-08-07, 10:42 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Aug 2003
- Location
- Philadelphia, PA
- Gender
Re: Rules Questions
All of them. The only things that would keep you in that room would be a special effect, such as if the monster that beat you had the Paralyze ability (and even then, you would just lose a turn, not fight the monster again).
In all three instances, you may move from that room to any other room on either side, explored or unexplored, unless the room text or some other effect specifically prevents it. Winning or losing a battle does not impede your movement ability in any way.
Employee Exit creates a set of stairs; these stairs persist for the rest of the game (until the dungeon collapses, at least). Once the Employee Exit stairs go onto the board, however, no one can search for additional stairs while on the 3rd floor, because you are not allowed to search for stairs if there is already a set of stairs leading down--regardless of how those stairs came to be there.
So, to answer your question, he can indeed flee through the stairs created by Employee Exit should he be defeated in Xykon's Lair, as with any other set of stairs.
Also, note that simply because the stairs to Xykon's Lair are created does NOT mean that a player is automatically allowed to use them; each player must still have the required number of Shticks and Loot to enter the lair.Rich Burlew
Now Available: 2023 OOTS Holiday Ornament plus a big pile of new t-shirt designs (that you can also get on mugs and stuff)!
~~You can also support The Order of the Stick and the GITP forum at Patreon.~~
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2007-08-07, 10:53 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Aug 2003
- Location
- Philadelphia, PA
- Gender
Re: Rules Questions
Neither. You perform one attack roll, and compare it to the highest Defense value that you targeted. If you beat that, you defeat ALL the Monsters targeted. If you don't beat that, you don't defeat anyone.
If ANY of the Monsters targeted have Range sufficient to reach you, you lose one Wound should you fail to win (or tie) the battle. In addition, any special effects of any Monsters that you targeted will come into play, such as Deadly or Thief.
Yes; these issues are dealt with in the FAQ.
Yes, you can Defend using an Area Effect Shtick, if the shtick has a value for Defense. This would happen if you walk into a room of Monsters, or if you are attacked at Range by a Monster via the "Ambush!" Screw This! card.
Yes, if you are battling at Range 0. (You can never "keep fighting" when battling at Range > 0.) Once you use an AES, though, you're done.Rich Burlew
Now Available: 2023 OOTS Holiday Ornament plus a big pile of new t-shirt designs (that you can also get on mugs and stuff)!
~~You can also support The Order of the Stick and the GITP forum at Patreon.~~
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2007-08-07, 11:14 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Aug 2003
- Location
- Philadelphia, PA
- Gender
Re: Rules Questions
When it is his turn again, he does not stand up and play immediately passes to the next person. This is his missed turn. When play returns to him again, he stands up and gains the benefit of resting (because he rested before the trap went off). He may then move as normal.
If you attack him at any time when his playing piece is on its side--whether because he is resting or missing a turn--you still get the same +4 Attack.
Yes. Think of it as teamwork on the part of the Monsters.
Yes, if the Thing had not had sufficient Range, then Bloodlust would not have come into play at all. Because the Thing did have the Range, Bloodlust converted the draw into a win for the Monsters.
This:
The only time you draw new Battle Hand cards is when you are called on to play a monster and cannot (or when a shtick or Screw This! allows you to, such as Durkon's W.W.T.D? shtick).Rich Burlew
Now Available: 2023 OOTS Holiday Ornament plus a big pile of new t-shirt designs (that you can also get on mugs and stuff)!
~~You can also support The Order of the Stick and the GITP forum at Patreon.~~
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2007-08-07, 11:17 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Aug 2003
- Location
- Philadelphia, PA
- Gender
Re: Rules Questions
Hmmmm...I'm going to have to strongly disagree with you, Kevin. Nothing on the card limits its usage to Greenhilt Sword. Considering that we have many cards that specifically DO limite their usage to one Battle Shtick, I think Roy can cleave with his bare hands if he wants.
Also, I realize this means I have to edit one of my responses above...Rich Burlew
Now Available: 2023 OOTS Holiday Ornament plus a big pile of new t-shirt designs (that you can also get on mugs and stuff)!
~~You can also support The Order of the Stick and the GITP forum at Patreon.~~
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2007-08-07, 03:10 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Aug 2006
Re: Rules Questions
In regards to the issue of whether or not roy can use great cleavage with something besides the greenhilt sword, apegamer already ruled previously in this thread that great cleavage only works with the greenhilt sword. This is what I was basing my answer to Hebelios' question on. http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showt...ge#post2830075
Yes by literal interpretation of the rules great cleavage will work with anything however the spirit of the schtick seems like it should only work with the sword (also this helps block the 'invincible roy' scenario that sometimes occurs on large stacks). While I know you are the final word on the rules, for the sake of moderator unity I would ask you discuss this with him and come back with a final answer on this (might be a good idea for the answer to go into the FAQ too since it has come up multiple times).Last edited by donkyhotay; 2007-08-08 at 03:40 PM.
Do not be afraid to joust a giant just because some people insist on believing in windmills.
FOSS Moonbase Commander remake @ http://code.google.com/p/tether
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2007-08-15, 03:55 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jul 2005
- Location
- Central Illinois (GMT -6)
Re: Rules Questions
A question came up last night regarding the "Ghost of Dorukan" card in the Xykon's Lair deck in conjunction with Elan's Poorly-Planned Illusion schtick. The wording on the "Ghost of Dorukan" card specifies that the boon is granted to the player who "kills the last monster in the room." In this case, Elan had killed the first monster he faced out of four in the room with a different battle schtick, but then used Poorly-Planned Illusion to move the rest of the monsters to another room.
While it seems to me to make sense that Elan get the boon, the wording on the card would imply otherwise. Should the card say "defeats" instead of "kills"? Does the Ghost stay put until a new battle in the room is triggered and the new "last" monster in the room is actually killed? Or is there some other interpretation I'm missing? Elan DID kill a monster, but at the time he killed it, it wasn't the last one in the room. The last monster in the room wasn't killed, but moved to a different room. Thanks in advance!Penny for your thoughts? Are you sure you're not pricing yourself out of the market? Most people give them to me free whether I want them or not.
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2007-08-15, 04:36 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jun 2006
- Location
- Around town
- Gender
Re: Rules Questions
Beating a card using the illusion is considered "defeating the monster". So yes, winning those battles and revoming the monsters from that particular room should get you the extra shtick.
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2007-08-16, 12:05 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jul 2005
- Location
- Central Illinois (GMT -6)
Re: Rules Questions
Except the Ghost of Dorukan specifically says "kills", NOT "defeats". Hence the conundrum.
Penny for your thoughts? Are you sure you're not pricing yourself out of the market? Most people give them to me free whether I want them or not.
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2007-08-16, 01:33 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jun 2007
Re: Rules Questions
If I defeat Xykon, can I use him both for drawing schticks and also for his 2 * Level bragging points?
Can I use "I Forgot They Could Do That" to negate a special monster ability that is granted to a monster from a room? For example, a monster in the Earth Dungeon becomes Impervious. Can I use IFTCDT to render the monster non-Impervious? If I can, and if the monster is normally Impervious on its own, do I need two cards to negate the ability from each of two sources, or just one card to negate the one ability?
Even if IFTCDT can be used for room-based abilities such as above, I'd assume that it can only be used to negate abilities that some monsters have naturally and which are included in the list at the end of the rulebook. So it couldn't be used to negate effects on monsters from the Summoning Room or the Employee Lounge, for example. Correct?
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2007-08-19, 05:22 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Sep 2005
- Location
- Sydney
- Gender
Re: Rules Questions
Dun dun dun! with Ranged Attacks:
Say I have 2 Leaping Attacks, and try to make a Ranged Attack at Range 2 (my maximum). Then, someone uses Dun dun dun! to flip one of my Leaping Attacks. My range is reduced to 1, and I can no longer reach the foe. What happens?
Come to that, what happens when your only Ranged Shtick is flipped when doing a Ranged Attack?People pay thousands of dollars for diamonds, even though diamonds do nothing but look pretty.
A video game suit of armor looks pretty and protects you from video game orcs.
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2007-08-19, 07:11 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Nov 2005
- Location
- Houston, TX
- Gender
Re: Rules Questions
Yes.
Yes, the room says that the monster gains the ability, and IFTCDT removes the ability from the monster. If the monster already has the ability, then the room doesn't really give the ability again, so removing it a second time is not necessary.
Yes, that's right.Owner of APE Games.
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2007-08-19, 07:13 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Nov 2005
- Location
- Houston, TX
- Gender
Re: Rules Questions
Owner of APE Games.
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2007-08-27, 07:44 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Aug 2007
Re: Rules Questions
Hi.. Great game by the way captures the comic well..
A couple questions that came up...
1: A conformation on if Roy can use great cleave with bag of tricks etc..
2: Can Belkar use halfling rage after the dice is rolled to change a loss into a win?
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2007-08-27, 09:48 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Nov 2005
- Location
- Houston, TX
- Gender
Re: Rules Questions
Owner of APE Games.
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2007-08-31, 11:23 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Aug 2006
Do not be afraid to joust a giant just because some people insist on believing in windmills.
FOSS Moonbase Commander remake @ http://code.google.com/p/tether
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2007-09-10, 01:02 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Dec 2005
- Location
Re: Rules Questions
Some questions.
1) Say that I am standing in a room with a single monster in it and some Loot. Another player plays Surprise! and makes that monster attack me. I win the battle and kill the monster. Do I get to pick up two Loot from the room as a bonus for clearing the last monster inside, or does nothing of the sort happen because it is not my turn? Is the answer any different if I was also the person who played the Surprise! card?
2) Regarding Roy's Fearless Leader: How does the "no refusing" part work when assisting in PvP battles? Assuming both players ask for his assistance, can he choose which one to assist without flipping the Fearless Leader, or must he immediately give assistance to the first player to ask him?
3) The following questions regard both "Creative Motivation" and "Scream Like A Little Girl":
- They cannot be used multiple times for one player, but can they be used combined with normal assistance from the same player? If not, can they be combined with each other? For example, Roy asks Haley for help with some drooled over Loot. He still wants more help, but has no Haley-heads, so he throws a way a Loot to ask Haley for more assistance with Creative Motivation. He also uses SLaLG on her so that he could get even more assistance. Is any of this illegal?
- When they are used, do/can they also trigger other assistance-related Shticks and events (such as Fearless Leader, Bard Song, Buff Spell, Double Cross, No I In Team, Eternal Gratitude)? In the cases of Double Cross and Eternal Gratitude, how is the Loot handled?
- I imagine that those cards still can't allow players to assist both battling players in a PvP battle. Is this correct?
- Regarding only SLaLG, if Roy is one of its targets and doesn't want to assist, then he doesn't need to flip Fearless Leader, since he was not really invited; the card specifies only that he may not refuse requests. Correct?
- Regarding only Creative Motivation, if an initial offer is refused, can Roy try to make another offer to the same player by throwing another card? If a player refused an offer and changed his mind later for some reason (like seeing that Roy is doing well enough without him), can he then choose to accept the offer, against Roy's will? If not, can he do it with Roy's will, without Roy having to throw away another card?
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2007-09-24, 10:13 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jul 2007
Re: Rules Questions
Apologies for any typos or bad grammar, but English isn't my native language...
Might be a reason why I didn't understand that battle size thing clearly.
Imagine the following situation:
Roy goes into a room at 3rd floor. A new battle is triggered, the battle size is 3, players populate the room with 3 monsters. Unfortunately Roy is not able to kill the first monster, but the two other ones die from his mighty Greenhilt sword.
However, on his next turn Roy decides to leave this room behind and move into a safer area on 2nd floor since he is not experienced enough to battle the remaining monster (in his opinion).
Durkon, closely behind Roy, decides to move into the room Roy was in before. The room still contains 1 monster (the remaining one Roy wasn't able to kill).
Now my question:
Since the room is on 3rd floor, but there is only 1 monster remaining in the room, is this considered as a "new" battle (Durkon came in)? If yes, that would mean the room was populated with another 2 monsters up to battle size 3 again.
Or am I totally wrong and if there is a room with monsters that weren't all killed in an earlier battle, players have to battle only the remaining monsters when moving into that room?
2nd solution makes sense to me...how do you think about that?
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2007-09-24, 01:06 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jan 2007
- Location
- Bethlehem, PA
- Gender
Re: Rules Questions
You pick up two Loot from the room regardless of whose turn it is, if you are the one who cleared it. Whose turn it is when Surprise! was played is not relevant, nor does it matter if you played Surprise! on yourself. However, if you played Surprise! on yourself during your turn, you would not be eligible to pick up any further loot on that turn.
- They cannot be used multiple times for one player, but can they be used combined with normal assistance from the same player? If not, can they be combined with each other? For example, Roy asks Haley for help with some drooled over Loot. He still wants more help, but has no Haley-heads, so he throws a way a Loot to ask Haley for more assistance with Creative Motivation. He also uses SLaLG on her so that he could get even more assistance. Is any of this illegal?
- When they are used, do/can they also trigger other assistance-related Shticks and events (such as Fearless Leader, Bard Song, Buff Spell, Double Cross, No I In Team, Eternal Gratitude)? In the cases of Double Cross and Eternal Gratitude, how is the Loot handled?
- I imagine that those cards still can't allow players to assist both battling players in a PvP battle. Is this correct?
- Regarding only SLaLG, if Roy is one of its targets and doesn't want to assist, then he doesn't need to flip Fearless Leader, since he was not really invited; the card specifies only that he may not refuse requests. Correct?
- Regarding only Creative Motivation, if an initial offer is refused, can Roy try to make another offer to the same player by throwing another card? If a player refused an offer and changed his mind later for some reason (like seeing that Roy is doing well enough without him), can he then choose to accept the offer, against Roy's will? If not, can he do it with Roy's will, without Roy having to throw away another card?
The room is not considered cleared until the last monster in it is defeated. Therefore, no new battle will be triggered, and no additional Battle Deck cards may be played unless a specific card states otherwise. Durkon (and any other players, including Roy) will only battle the one remaining monster until it's defeated. Should it be defeated, any player moving into the room on a subsequent turn when no other players were present would trigger a new battle.Proud, small, slightly stinky member of the fan club.
Clang, clang, clang goes the trolley / Ring, ring, ring goes the bell.Git away from me, ye daft fool!
Barky! You came back!
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2007-09-27, 11:03 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jun 2007
Re: Rules Questions
Fighteer answered your main question, but I'll point out that this situation can't happen quite as you describe it. Monsters are fought in the same order that they are played into a room; you don't stack them bottom-up as they are played in and then fight the stack top-down/last-to-first. So Roy has to defeat the first monster before he has the option of battling any others. If he fails to defeat the first monster, he has to stop battling for that turn.
What he could do, though, is defeat the first two, and leave the last one (by losing, or drawing, or choosing not to continue fighting), and then your question is meaningful. (The authoritative answer is on page 10 of the rulebook, under "Triggering a new battle".)
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2007-09-27, 02:22 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jul 2007
Re: Rules Questions
Thanks for reading my post that carefully
I knew there was something we made wrong when playing this game for the first time...possibly a reason why our "short game" with 3 people didn't come to an end this evening after playing for ~5 hours...
I wasn't sure about the fact that if you don't defeat the top monster in a room, you must not battle the other monsters below in the stack. Now it's clear to me.
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2007-09-30, 01:15 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Oct 2006
- Gender
Re: Rules Questions
Heck, even after playing the game a dozen times, our group cannot get through a "short game" in 5 hours... ok, we could if we could eliminate all out-of-game distractions (goofing off, phone calls, comparisons of who's work week sucked most, etc.) and put a 2-minute time-limit on turns.... we might get done in say 4 hours 45 minutes ;)
Last edited by Lord Greywarden; 2007-09-30 at 01:17 AM.
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2007-09-30, 07:18 AM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Sep 2007
Re: Rules Questions
I've got some questions for you:
1) Which one of the following can change the result of a battle after the dice are rolled: Buff Spell (assuming V is helping you), I Forgot They Could Do That (to cancel assist ability), Forgotten Bonus and Get Angry.
2) Is it possible to use FTCDT after you lose in a battle to cancel abilities that can effect you? (like paralyze, thief and bloodlust and so on)
3) Can Belkar perform a leaping attack through a Dark room? (assuming the dark room is between the room that contains Belkar and the room which contains the player or monster that Belkar wants to attack).
4) The only monster in the Xykon Deck with no XP or treasure is the "Guard monster", which is one of the toughest monsters in the game. Is it supposed to be this way or it is just a misprint?
Thanks in advence, Xardas.
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2007-10-01, 03:44 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jun 2007
Re: Rules Questions
Forgotten Bonus is the only one that can be used after the die roll.
2) Is it possible to use FTCDT after you lose in a battle to cancel abilities that can effect you? (like paralyze, thief and bloodlust and so on)
3) Can Belkar perform a leaping attack through a Dark room? (assuming the dark room is between the room that contains Belkar and the room which contains the player or monster that Belkar wants to attack).
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2007-10-14, 09:53 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Nov 2005
- Location
- Houston, TX
- Gender
Re: Rules Questions
Right.
Roy may only provide assistance to one of the players, and PVP specifies an order that the players ask for assistance. If he chooses to flip the shtick when the first player asks, then it's not available for the second player.
Right - both can be used targeting the same player.
Creative Motivation and SLaLG say that the player 'assists', and the shticks you mentions say 'when assisting', so yes, they count.
Right.
SLaLG says that Roy 'may assist' the player. He doesn't need to, but if he DOES assist, then Fearless Leader comes into play, since that card says 'when assisting.'
Yes, Roy can keep scrapping his loot if he thinks that asking nicely will help with future attempts.
A player cannot 'change his mind later', in either direction.
Originally Posted by PhischiOwner of APE Games.